Trotwood Madison LB Mike McCray chose Michigan today over Oklahoma and Tennessee. OSU never offered and wanted to see him come to camp. It is the 14th commitment for Michigan's class, which will likely hold 22 players.
Not a huge loss here as OSU likes Courtney Love and Alex Anzalone more and I think both will be Buckeyes. They also have a good shot with Jaylon Smith and are in it for Ben Gedeon, although 2 is the likely number IMO. Michigan has a nice class and this is a good get for them but with 14 spots filled and at least another linebacker, if not two set to be added, they are only looking at 6-7 more spots to add players.
Personally I think TSUN needs to add some playmakers on offense with those spots. They don't really have any yet and if I was a UM fan, my concerns would lie there.
That being said, for those worrying that Hoke is out recruiting Meyer, yes he has more players right now, but when OSU's class is done at 20 and Michigan's class is done at 22, we will see which class has come out on top. Both will be top 5 in the nation I am sure.
I've been hearing from an avid UM connection that Gedeon is close to verballing to Michigan. Any truth?
Let's not forget Michigan supposedly leads for Levenberry, too.
With the loss of schollies we have to slow play some of these guys which makes sense. Good pickup by Michigan and I wouldn't bet against them landing Gedeon as well. If Leavenberry commits as expected, this is a hell of a LB class for Michigan. I feel like they are replicating Alabama with the last 2 classes. Huge emphasis on D, O-Line, and a solid Pro-Style QB. Alabama did not have a true 5* playmaker in my opinion on offense last year other than Trent Richardson, but with that D and O-Line they were dominant. I am anxious to see how this entire recruiting year plays out!
Agreed PHX. Sucks we couldn't get some work done on the Trotwood line, but with the sanctions we need the absolute best. Kid would have been a lock under Tress, but with the success of (DAMN)Shazier, I'm excited for last years haul and any combo of Smith/Anzalone/Love. Meyer's track record is enough for me not to question his methods, I'm sure we'll be smiling in a little less than a year.
I do not think we are missing out here. Yes he has an OSU alum dad but there are much bigger fish to fry. Good luck to him. The large one has another Ohio prize to banter about, good for him too.
Interesting. Thanks Alex.
Which LB offers are committable?
I'm totally happy with a LB haul which includes Love, Anzalone and Smith with also the possible addition of Gedeon or (if we offer) Kibrough who favors us now even without an offer.
Some of the recruits have reported we are only taking two LBers.
Good get for Michigan and I hope the kid does well. I don't think either team is out performing the other. Both classes are going to be great and should have some real talent for the next 4 years. This will be a helluva battle come November.
I know this kid would have liked to have been a buckeye but only so many players can be taken by either team. 2012 OSU raked in a bunch of talented LBs. Our loss is Michigan's gain. Michigan is not picking up our scraps, although we are shooting for higher ranked talent. Michigan is taking advantage like they should. Surprised other B1G teams, cough cough Bulemia cough cough, are not in the mix for such high end talent. I guess it will be UM and OSU again at the top!
I bet the scUM fans are rejoicing over this....I suppose that's the reason I have this sickness in my stomach. I have NO doubts that Urban knows what he's doing (and granted we did take A LOT of LB's this past year) but letting a kid go to scUM from a supposed "pipeline" school, I guess I'm sort of shocked. And honestly, I watched Urban's speech to the Ohio High School Athletic Coaches Association (or whatever it was) and he said they are going to rely on the high school coaches opinion of the players A LOT. Makes me wonder if the coach from Trotwood made Meyer shy away? Just a opinion of course and nothing suggests this, but i just find it curious after hearing everything he (Urban) had to say about how he'll pick his recruits and who he will rely on.
My guess is we end up with Love and Anzalone. I am currently convinced that Smith will go to ND.
I think TSUN recruiting class is pretty good, but it is nice to realize they only have 6-8 spots left in their class, while we have 10-15 spots left. It is only March and I am very pleased with the recruits we have picked up, especially shoring up the secondary. I think the time between the Spring game and Friday night lights is when we will get the "bulk" of our recruits.
Our class will end up being in the 24-25 range......expect some attrition somewhere. Always tends to happen
I said last week that Mccray will commit to us, we will see if you guys offer him late and he becomes a buckeye. Will not be surprised if he is a buckeye if you guys strike out on some guys.
Michigan certainly having a good class, there's no way to dispute that. Hopefully ours will be as good or better and the rivalry returns to being the best in college football. It is certainly set up to be.
It's rather simple: Michigan is recruiting who they need and who they think will fit in their system and OSU is doing the same.
Good point Rat MFan! If you ask MSU and Wisky fans, Meyer enjoys nothing more than steal recruits near the end!
Seriously, I don't think Meyer would swoop in and take him. LB is not a pressing need. Urban is concentrating on bringing in the speed he wants on offense. I would be more impressed with the development of the current LBs. Shazier should flourish and I am intrigued by Perkins speed. Will just have to go after some LBs in 2014.
I understand Urban is installing his own system, but i'm still surprised he didn't go after the top LB from the state and the #44th ranked player in the nation. As a Michigan fan, I am super excited about this pick up.
Meyer is going after other LBs that he likes more. With the LB haul we just had, he's in a position to be picky. With the scholarship reductions, he's in the position where he must be picky. I imagine that McCray knew exactly where he stood with OSU.
I'm sure when the staff evaluates film they don't really care about their rankings from Rivals, etc. Optimistic Pessimist said it well.
I remember McCray's dad; he was pretty much the only decent defensive player we had in Cooper's first season.
You can't make an offer this early to everyone. Looks like a case where the kid felt he had to jump on a chance to commit to a quality program before space filled up, in case a Buckeye offer never materialized.
The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.
Wish him well! It's too bad he couldn't have been patient, as you never know what could have happened this summer. I like Urban's approach of not filling up with prospects before they even play a down their senior year.. A LOT of things can happen between now and then, and to be bound to a kid you aren't sure of at this point seems less preferable.. Not specifically knocking McCray, but just something to consider..
EDIT: To claify, when I say "bound," I mean bound by their word. As in, even if they underpreform they still have a spot. Now, for most coaches, this type of integrity is taken seriously.. Now, Nick Saban on the other hand..
I have no idea about McCray - I won't follow 2013 recruiting closely until next winter. But, strictly in terms of numbers, Michigan can easily get into a numbers bind.
Like Ohio State, Michigan probably has a lot of offers out there. I guess some of those aren't really "commitable," whatever that means, but many of them are. As the window of opportunity appears to tighten (which is maybe how McCray perceived things), some of the more marginal guys will jump to verbally commit early in the process. Then, Michigan might have to tell some of them, "ugghhh . . . that offer isn't really committable" and so forth. Before they know it, the Michigan staff loses flexibility and possibly control of the process.
Basically, there are pros and cons to having 14 verbals in ealry March. If your staff isn't that strong at closing (JT and perhaps Hoke), then the pros probably outweigh the cons. But I'll take my chances with Urbz next January and February, when they'll know even more about the prospects.
I am sure Urban will try to fill up this class as much as possible but anothr thought is that since this year OSU will probably be 4 schollies under 85, maybe Urban will slow play and be satisfied to be 4 schollies under again next year. Then in 2014 he could load up knowing he only has to lose 1 more. We could go up to 84 in 2014 and with the past couple of classes could be looking at 30 or som recruits needed. Then he could load up on instate talent and still go after the big fish nationwide.
Just a thought!
Bucknasty you're thinking is not followed by many top programs. I find it hard to believe that not a lot of programs are turning down top 50 talent in the nation because of them being "prospects". Cut and paste the top 150 players in the nation from whichever site you choose and check them out once fall comes and again during winter. Yes there will be some change, but for the most part the list are pretty solid and unless of an injury they usually don't fall out far from top 150. And even if they do, you have 10 more that didn't.
To all the TSUN posters on here, one question on the TSUN boards are their regular Buckeye fans on those boards as well? I am just wondering (no disrepect) I am all for civilized debate with fans from opposing schools.
This class is too good to bank schollies, at least in my humblest of opinions.
Itsmichiganferg: you might be right, but I'd need to see the evidence to be convinced. Show "snapshots" of past recruiting rankings, comparing 11 or 10 months prior to correspoding rankings on NLOID, preferably using 4 or 5 years worth of data.
You're the one making the point, so perhaps you might do the work to support that point, rather than asking others to prove your point for you? That is, if you're trying to be persuasive . . .
Personally, I'm skeptical: some kids experience significant growth - physically and in terms of maturity, skillsets, etc. - between their Jr. and Sr. years. Heck, some "diamonds in the rough" will take up fball relatively late (maybe they previously concentrated on bball), while others have serious injuries during the Sr. years. Obviously, too, it's another year of evaluation.
Not saying you're wrong. I'm just not convinced you've actually looked into this question.
Doug funnie, yes there is Buckeye posters. I wasn't trying to say anything negative in my posts. I was just stating that there is a reason these kids are ranked so highly. No coach is slowing down its commitments because they are worried about then being just prospects. Otherwise they wouldn't even offer them if they didn't want them to commit. OSU probably has at least 10 offers out there right now, just like all the top programs. Waiting for them to commit to their school.
@ItsMichiganFerg.... Thats cool I was just curious if their were Bucks fans on the boards. I didn't take your post as negative.
Gotta give credit to Jabba the Hoke for landing these Ohio kids. scUM knows it won't be very good without top notch out-of-state prospects and they have gotten several in this class. Even though most don't have OSU offers doesn't mean they aren't any good or OSU wouldn't want them. scUM's class is the most impressive class in the nation right now. I think McCray will be a very good player as will most of the kids Hoke has lured away from Ohio but there is a reason why they weren't offered by OSU in the first place. Remember that scUM had the #1 class early last year as well and Urban swooped in and topped it in three months. I expect by Feb 2013 Urban will have an equal if not better class. When the dust settles both OSU and scUM will have very impressive (top 5) classes and it's up to the respective coaching staffs to get the most out of every one.
So was it just the speed thing and that he didn't want to camp at Ohio State the reason he didn't get a Buckeye offer?
Burrows tweeted ---
Cam Burrows @CB2ERA
Got a surprise for @MJM92013 tomorrow
(MJM92013 being McCray)
Wonder what the surprise is?
Lol well I do not think it is an offer from you guys unless Urban Meyer is letting commits make formal offers.
I would guess he decorated something of Mccrays with a bunch of Buckeye stuff. Locker, car, house etc. lol
Again, quote me on this, I will not be shocked or hurt if Mccray ends up a Buckeye because I almost expect it. Really do not trust this commitment.
Cam and Mike are friends (assumed since they play on the same team) so I'm sure its just going to be a little razzing or prank like Rational said...nothing to count down for or eagerly await I'm sure
"Love my State, hate the football"
I can't see it being an offer because I read an article where McCray said on his visit that he was basically ignored. So must be some prank.
Don't most people see Mccray as being a DE in college? I kind of thought that was the reason we weren't recruiting. Though still don't understand why we let a kid go that is ranked #44 in the country....In Urban I trust!
To me, if McCray weren't from Ohio or his dad weren't an alum, we wouldn't know of or care about this signing. Fact is, he's a guy Michigan wanted and in a class where Ohio State is taking 2 LB's, he was about 5th on the list of guys they are interested in, possibly lower. It's not to say McCray won't go to Michigan and be a great player in their system, he's just not what Urban wants for his defense.
Just like if Ohio had a great pocket passing, QB that was a big guy with a big arm, but not mobile, Urban would pass on him for a Braxton Miller type of QB. It's not that the other guy wouldn't be great, he just wouldn't be great at Ohio State.
I think his recruitment of a prospect like Marcus is a pefect example. Could he have had a higher rated LB from somewhere else? Sure, but Marcus was a 3 star who Meyer had to have. He wanted to sign that kid badly, and he went out and got him. So he wasn't in the top 100 or maybe even 200, doesn't matter. Meyer needed the guy for his system and got him.
Michigan seems to be doing the same thing this year that they did last year: loading up on recruits early and often. Kudos to them for getting so many quality guys to commit to them so early. Regardless of what people say, they really are doing a great job bringing guys in. I wonder though, like Alex, about their lack of offensive playmakers thus far in their class.
Loved the post btalbert. Thanks for the perspective
Meyer seems to want linebackers that have the speed and explosiveness to attack the quarterback and get sideline to sideline. I am assuming, from the recruits he has been going after, that our defense is going to be more of an attacking style than it was under Tressel, where we didn't blitz much and just sat back in a zone. McCray would have been the perfect type of LB under the previous defensive style because he is very good in coverage and is good at reading and reacting. He does NOT fit into an attacking style defense at all, though, which is probably why he was not offered. You can't just offer kids because they are ranked high by the recruiting services.
few thoughts from a UM fan....22 is considered the minimum we take, probably more. Certainly skill players are very much needed and will account for 3+ of the remaining spots.
Assuming we only take 8 more, I would guess those 8 would be as follows......1 RB, most UM fans expect that to be Issac or D Smith, many would like both.....2 WR, we really want Treadwell, Onwualu seems a good possibility too among others....1 TE, this is much debated, a lot of fans dont understand why we'd take a 3rd TE but it seems that we want one, seems like that place could be filled by either Matuska or Orndorff.....1-2 DL, we seem very strong with Poggi but of course everyone wants him so we'll see...1-2 LBs, we seem to be very close on Gedeon and we suppossedly lead on Levenberry, O'Daniel is a possibility......1 CB, sounds like we are going to take Conley
If additional spots were to open up over 22, I would guess they would go first to the 2nd DL or LB (see above), then probably best player available, possibly a safety or another corner, perhaps another RB (if somehow we were able to get 2 really good ones like Issac and Smith, or maybe if we were to throw one to Braylon's little bro), or believe it or not if we have a spot left and a big timer wants it, another OL, an OT to be exact.
Nice post Ccdevi. Thanks for the perspective.
@CC: 22 is probably the max we'll take. This is going to be a smaller class, even with attrition. The speculation is somewhere from 16-22 members.
@RECRUITBUCK, CC was talking about how many scUM might take. He is a scUM fan. We (Buckeyes) would need to have taksan attrition to take 22. We might get there but I'd hate to see that many guys leave under almost any circumstances.
Also, to counter at what someone said about the lack of playmakers up there. I been following recruiting for a long time now and the reoccuring theme is the skill players who are very talented rarely announce this early in the process. You guys ever notice how it is the big uglies and the blue collared type football players who announce early. I think it is simple, they do not crave the attention of the skilled players. While some of the skill players carry out this prima donna aura around them. I think we get those guys late in the process. Of course, there are a few exceptions. But, for example Davonte Neal this past season or even Terrell Pryor a few years back extending past signing day. Stuff like that bothers me. Call me old fashioned lol it is why I love the guys in the trenches, they just go to work everyday.
The only reason I did not mention Jordan Diamond is because I understood his situation.........he had to wait to see if the check from Auburn cleared.
CCDEVI, I just read that Matuska has committed to ND.
Recruiting proves that Michigan would never be a winner without Ohio football players.
Tomorrow
"The Buckeyes haven't offered McCray a scholarship, and McCray says he'll stay committed to Michigan even if Urban Meyer comes calling. What an impressive early haul by Brady Hoke thus far."--ESPN
I don't always take names when I kick ass but when I do, they most often belong to a Wolverine.
Recruting proves that a lot of midwest teams will not be successful without players out of Pennsylvania and Ohio. They are two of the top 5 states in regards to high school football athletes. So, any coach with a pulse would want to go into those states.
Block...my pleasure
Bass....yeah just saw that about Matuska, not surprising, apparently he is a big ND fan, there was some thought he might go UM bc ND offered him for DE.
4dorr....I see this from time to time, while otherwise being obvious, it seems like people say it as a dig, I don't really understand that.
@RATIONAL - I would say Ohio/Pennsylvania are top six. As much as I love my home state, I think Florida, Texas and California are definitely the top three. Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Georgia are 4-6. This year I'd probably say Georgia, Ohio, Pennsylvania.
Dumb point, I know. Just had to add in one extra state. Out of curiosity, do you coach in Michigan?
In other news, Anzalone is now visiting Michigan this weekend.......Still think he is a lean towards you guys. But, seems like anything can happen once Hoke has you on campus. Interesting to see if yesterday's commitment of Mccray speeds up the process of some of the Linebackers, causing a domino effect. I just have a gut feeling about Levenberry commiting to us at the spring game.
@ Hodge: You are sure right about Georgia, it is a fast rising state and I would definitely throw it up there. I am more biased with the kids from Ohio and Pennsylvania because I believe they are tougher up here. As far as pure talent, no doubt Florida, California and Texas are up there. If I want to recruit blue collar tough guys (the trenches) I am going after the guys in the midwest.
I do coach here in Michigan, I am an offensive coordinator for a High School team in a suburb of Detroit. I would say we are a State Perennial Power, but we got some work to do to get back to the top. Been too long since we last won a state title.
Rational, I believe I also read that Anzalone is returning to tOSU later this month, so don't get your hopes up. ;-p
Bass: I really am not lol just saying anything can happen. I would be more than happy with the trio of Mccray, Gedeon and Levenberry. Like I said, I believe he is yours to lose with Penn State factoring in as a wild card.
@RATIONAL - Nice, gotta say I'm a little bit jealous of your location...only because (and this is the only thing I'll concede superiority to your state in) the choice beer selection available up there. Founder's, Bell's, Dark Horse, New Holland, Jolly Pumpkin...literally, thy cup runneth over.
And while I hold no hard feelings about Logan Tuey-Tillman, and will only be a little bitter if you get Isaac, I'll take it quite personally if y'all take Anzalone from us haha.
Hodge, you've mentioned MI microbrews before, and, once again, I'm thirsty...
I was hoping you'd catch that BASSPLAYER, I knew you'd appreciate it.
Hodge: Lol that is all? Come on man, Up North has a ton going for itself! I have driven to Ohio many times, in the fall it is beautiful, especially the turnpike. Other than that, I hate driving through there. I do enjoy Cedar Point!
You probably do not believe me, but I have no clue what any beer tastes like. Never had a sip of it in my life. I got turned off by it the first time I ever had a sniff of it lol. But yes, there are a ton of different choices in regards to your preffered adult beverage lol
That's a damn shame. Beer is the best beverage on earth.
I was always a liquor guy going through high school and college. I really could never tolerate the smell of beer. It was funny, I would take 6 or 7 shots of Patron, but wouldn't be able to handle a sip of beer.
But now, for personal reasons I have eliminated it all.
@RATIONAL - I jest, I jest. I've always wanted to hit up the Upper Penninsula. Haven't really been anywhere outside Detroit though, Buddy's Pizza in Dearborn is awesome, and I'd be remiss to not mention Jet's (my roommate is a manager at a Columbus location). Went to the auto show in like '02 I think--and that was awesome. Always wanted to see the Hotel Yorba, if only because I love the band that wrote the song about it.
I'll be up in Ann Arbor for the Spring Game, though. Should be fun.
"Beer is proof that God loves man." --Ben Franklin
Hodge: You have definitely been in my neck of the woods. I have had Buddys a bunch of times and it is great. You have to let me know when your up here again. I will treat you to some of the finest Mideast Food you will ever have. Promise you will not leave disappointed.
Do you have family up here?
Will do man, but can't say I have family there. My family's all in Tennessee, Florida, and Alabama. My uncle actually teaches economics at the University of Florida...God, that was fun when Meyer came home.
Oh I bet lol always fun to rub things in your family members face.
So, I know a few people have mentioned this in the past. And while I completely agree with the decision not to offer McCray, I know that one of Meyer's big goals was getting that pipeline to Trotwood a-going. Now, I know one guy isn't a big deal--but I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on this? I know Michigan has owned this pipeline for years, do you guys/gals think that Burrows is the start of something here, or an exception to the rule?
It depends, do you guys think Urban is emphasizing a school like Trotwood? If he is then it will still be there. But, I think some of the players that do not fit his scheme will end up at Michigan if they fit ours.
What happened to Glenville? Are there not top notch prospects there this year? They have been quiet.
I heard it was a goal of his to re-establish the Trotwood line. Case-in-point, 247 has Burrows as the #2 prospect in OH, and McCray at #8. Glenville has no rated prospects this year.
It is clear that he is just going to recruit what fits his system even if that allows some prospects to come up north. To be honest, that is what any coach should do. You want guys that fit your system. So if there is a guy at Trotwood that fits, I would assume he is going after him like hell.
I'm with you Hodge. I thought the new staff was trying to build the Trotwood pipeline and was shocked that McCray wasn't offered. It is what it is I guess.
I guess what worries me most is a player like Bam Bradley, where we wanted him and he didn't want to come to OSU. I mean, you're going to get that sometimes--regardless of location--but I wonder if it was related to Trotwood's perception of OSU under Tressel. Maybe I'm looking too much into this, and again I don't think McCray was worth an offer solely to keep the pipeline.
I don't think it is related to Trotwood's perception of OSU. Bradley was solid, like McCray is. But If OSU really really wants a Trotwood player (see Burrows, Cameron) they'll get him. After reading countless articles on McCray and OSU, I guess his big size and lack of closing speed made OSU project him as a DE (height, weight, closing speed), and OSU stocked up on high calliber DE's last year. This year, they're going after elite DE's (Bosa, Alquadin), so I guess that OSU didn't want to offer him since they saw him as something other than his current position. An elite DE>a LB who would be converted to DE and have to bulk 30-50 LBS.
Plus, with McCray, I heard the staff had questions about his lateral movement. I'm not too concerned about the Trotwood pipeline. The staff wanted Cam Burrows, and they got him. He fits their system and their needs.
As for Bradley, it almost seems like he was a 'tweener as well. Somewhere between a DB and LB in tOSU's system. I could be wrong.
Alex retweeted Cam this morning who, apparently, played tOSU's fight song, Carmen Ohio, and Hang on Sloopy in Mike McCray's car this morning. I just thought that was humorous.
@rational
I recall reading quite a few tidbits about Anzalone and Michigan having very high interest for one another (in some cases, that Michigan was the favorite). Now he seems to be a longshot at best and not in most conversations about potential LBs. Is this just because we are higher on the other four guys now, or did I miss something?
Those who stay will be CHAMPIONS!
~Bo Schembechler
I read the staff viewed McCray as a 'tweener' who wasn't big enough to play d-line and not fast enough for linebacker. Meyer has talked about building a 'pipeline' into Trotwood but you just don't need to 'reach' or take every single player from there to do it. Burrows was a must-get guy and elite talent who will fit perfectly at corner (or safety or wherever in the secondary).
Well I guess Anzalone is not visiting after all. The coaches told him that they were full at the position. I assume we have a silent commitment with Gedeon and that they feel very good about Levenberry.
I commend the Michigan coaches on laying it on him with the truth and not leading him on more than needed. I also find it very respectful to the current commits by telling Anzalone do not even waste your time. That will hold some merit with those guys. I guess it makes sense with the no visit policy from commmitments and that the coaches only hold their end of the bargain. How many SEC coaches do you think would do that??
I heard the same thing Rational. With Levenberry being their top priority and a really good chance at Gedeon or O'Daniel. I was really surprised to hear initially he was even visiting, with Michigan so high on those three and from the sound of it the mutual interest they have in Michigan.