Yahoo!: NFL Agents Gave $45k to Man Who Gave Benefits to 5 SEC Players

September 11, 2013 at 5:39p    by DJ Byrnes    
132 Comments
S-E-CHEAT S-E-CHEAT

Anybody here remember the good ol' days, when a handful of nickels could keep the jukebox playing all night and free and discounted tattoos were considered a legitimate college football scandal? Well, those days have clearly passed us by.

Enter Yahoo!'s Charles Robinson, who has previously dropped bombs on Miami and Syracuse (and yes even Ohio State). This time his target is former Alabama defensive end Luther Davis, who has ties to NFL agents, financial planners and most importantly: a bevy of SEC players, past and present:

A Yahoo Sports investigation found that Davis provided benefits to at least five players during their collegiate careers, including Crimson Tide offensive tackle D.J. Fluker, University of Tennessee defensive lineman Maurice Couch, Tennessee quarterback Tyler Bray, Mississippi State University wideout Chad Bumphis and Mississippi State defensive end Fletcher Cox. A sixth player – Crimson Tide safety Mark Barron – was also discussed in text message records obtained by Yahoo Sports, including an exchange following the 2011 season where Davis and Simms talk of attempting to recoup $8,000 from the player. At the time of the texts, Barron was a junior and preparing to leave Alabama as an early entry into the NFL draft. Text messages also reference Alabama defensive tackle Josh Chapman and Mississippi State cornerback Johnthan Banks.

Davis declined comment for this story.

And this is just what Yahoo! has enough evidence to take to the public. (It also confirms a wide-held belief outside the Southeast about the SEC and their perceived lack of scruples that went into harvesting seven straight BCS titles.) 

With the recent revelations in the Vanderbilt rape case, the academic fraud at North Carolina, and the raging dumpster fire in Stillwater, Oklahoma, the NCAA could have its hands full in the near future.  (We're still waiting for it to hand down punishment on Miami — perhaps that's why they let Johnny Manziel and his autograph cottage industry off with a half-game suspension against Rice?)


Yahoo!'s Dan Wetzel, who it must be said is one of the best writers covering college football, had a companion piece with Robinson's report. If you're thinking Alabama will be losing its titles retroactively any time soon: don't hold your breath. (And honestly, that might not be a bad thing.) 

Wetzel explains:

This is major college athletics. Not those public-relations commercials during the games with cinematography, soaring music and canned concepts propping up "amateurism" as anything more than a tax dodge. And this is the river of underground money that flows through major college football. It's everywhere. It's undeniable. It's uncontainable.

The more that truth is exposed, the better.

Powerful words there from Wetzel. Is anybody at the NCAA listening? Given their track record: not likely.


UPDATE (8:21 PM):  Nick Saban was asked about these reports and walked out of his press conference:


132 Comments

Comments

jeremytwoface's picture

Oh man...
 
Can't wait for Alabama to get suspended for the first half of the Georgia State game!!

The first man gets the ((((Oyster)))), the second man gets the shell.

DeepSouthBuckeye's picture

The sad thing is this comment is so true....

Loving all things Buckeye from SEC country in Alabama.
"How firm thy friendship....O-HI-O"

CincyOSU's picture

The difference between this case and all the other times the SEC got away unscathed (ie Manziel), is that there is now a paper trail rather than heresay. It's going to be VERY hard for the NCAA to not come down hard if all this info checks out.

Catch 5's picture

Come down hard on who? If this all comes out like it looks now, Bama appears to have played the 2013 BCSCG with an ineligible player. There is nothing suggesting that they knew about it, and in fact, Bama has been at the forefront of trying to dissuade this type behavior from agents (you may recall the famous "agents are pimps" comment Saban was criticized for). Perhaps they lose the crystal ball from last year, but it is possible they don't - the NCAA has shown a willingness to allow ineligible players to compete in bowl games recently.

Unless there is some tie to the coaches, administration, or boosters (not found by Yahoo) there is nothing they can do to the current team.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

Chief B1G Dump's picture

Why do you think Saban made that "agents are pimps" comment!?!?!?
He knew about it. Someone emailed him months prior and he knew all season. Quick, to the NCAA Battmobile to check Sabans email history!
I wouldnt mind if the NCAA torched the the whole SEC like General Sherman's march to the sea.
But for real...perhaps this is the beginning of the end for the SEC. Not because theyll Face major sanctions...but because like Pete Carroll.. Saban's seat is now going to be hot from the NCAA so this may be his chance to jump ship and go to the NFL.

AltaBuck's picture

LMFAO!

I have been known on occasion to howl at the moon. - Crash Davis

RedStorm45's picture

Bold prediction: Nothing will happen.

FitzBuck's picture

Except to Tennessee.  That QB is done and it will hurt them this season.  

Fitzbuck | Toledo - Ohio's right armpit | "A troll by any other name is still a troll".

cinserious's picture

Maybe its time we had a little talk with Jalen Hurd...

Life's daily struggle is choosing between saying F--ck-it, or soldiering on with your responsibilities.  

tennbuckeye19's picture

If you're referring to Tyler Bray, the UT QB from the Yahoo story, he's already gone and on the KC Chiefs roster now. 
 

RedStorm45's picture

Do you mean their DE?

Squirrel Master's picture

text messages that literally say players got paid is pretty damning evidence. This one is curious because it could effect some championships and a "power program" like Bama might get some bowl bans, or one! might being the operative word!
Even though its not to the level of what the OKST story says, this to me has a smoking gun and not just word of mouth.

I saw a UFO once.......it told me to have a goodyear!

BucksfanXC's picture

The NCAA won't do anything. And meanwhile there will be a ground swell of schools that team up and leave the NCAA. You'll have semi-pro ball within the next 5 yrs. Schools form a league that will have their own trophy and they will allow players to get paid by agents, sponsors or boosters.

“Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect.”  - Woody

DJ Byrnes's picture

I've been saying it's only a matter of time before the elite schools cut dead weight in the NCAA and move in their own direction. For me, this is the end game for Jim Delany and Mike Slive, and when it's done it will open up a world of opportunities for college sports.

This system is obviously broken, the NCAA can't enforce their own stupid rules. (How many cases would it have brought against schools without their media pinkertons?) 

Ohio State will have a chief's spot at the table, and for that we can all be thankful.

Californian by birth, Marionaire by the Grace of President Warren G. Harding.

One Bad Buckeye's picture

Not being condescending here DJ, I've posed this question before to others who call for the NCAA's head.  I'm not suggesting we keep status quo, but if not the NCAA, then who?  Someone has to govern the massive body of college athletics.

"I'm One Bad Buckeye, and I approve this message."

Poe McKnoe's picture

CFB headed by the Commissioner of CFB

BuckGnome's picture

Totally agree, DJ.  Ohio State football will do just fine in a world without the NCAA and its shamateurism policies and (non)enforcement.
Wetzel's piece killed it.

acBuckeye's picture

I don't necessarily disagree with you, DJ, but with paying players....... are you ready for the days when boosters try to outbid each other for recruits, then keep them on an unequal payroll for the entire time they're on campus? Is that what you want? B/c that's what will happen.

BuckGnome's picture

It's already happening.  Cam Newton, Reggie Bush, this list could go on forever.  I think it's fair to say that star college football players already receive a disproportionate number of the $500 handshakes etc. that are going on.

Idaho Helga's picture

I've said the same thing.  I don't know what will happen in the next couple of years to the NCAA but it's not going to look like it does today.  They are a national organization which keeps sitting on the whoopie cushion even though they know it's on the chair.  I see power conferences forming a BCS like alliance for football because it really is a follow the money thing which is very, very sad.   Clearly Div 1 should have been totally split with the BCS group and a handful of others demoting the Idaho's, MAC teams, etc to another level several years ago.
I for one, didn't have a big problem with what Saban said.  If Urban at the B1G media days would have said a bit less regarding suspensions or pointed out (like Saban did) that no one has a question about the HUGE upcoming game or their season?  What struck me was that Saban said twice he'd field questions about the game, but no one seemed prepared to ask one....thus the dead air.  Given that this scandal is less than 24 hours old, did they not think about what they were going to ask at the next days press conference?   He's not going to answer and you're an idiot for thinking you are going to badger him into one.  So move on.
 

chitown buckeye's picture

 
Been thinking the exactly this as well. There is absolutely no reason to stay committed to the NCAA. It will take a few of the large athletic departments to part ways with them and all will change. 

"I'm having a heart attack!"

40 Degrees North's picture

Nothing will happen here with the NCAA.
You want something to really happen, pass the information onto the IRS.

Deadly Nuts's picture


Oh, wait! It's the SEC... Nevermind, nothing to see here.

LEBRON

jedkat's picture

PAYROLL TIDE!!!  Amirite?!?

“The teams that don’t respect their coaches and don’t trust their coaches are the teams that go .500"
~Zach Boren

dja.ohio's picture

'Journalists' investigate and publish this stuff like it actually matters. None of this is surprising - Okie St., Manziel, SEC paying players, Miami, Tattoo-gate, UNC non-classes, etc. The story 'breaks' to much hype, and nothing much happens.

jfunk's picture

Every Ohio State fan:

Scotch: It may be too early to drink it, yes; but people it is never to early to think about it.

CincyOSU's picture

Interesting take from Dan Wetzel
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaaf--latest-college-scandals-again-reveal-folly-of-ncaa-rules-210822795.html
This is the same guy who said OSU was worse than the USC case and made OSU and Tressel out to be the worst thing in college football. My how the times have changed.

97Buckeye's picture

^ This! This right here.
This is what pisses me off so much about what will undoubtedly be a nothing outcome to this entire story. What happened here, and at Oklahoma State and with Johnny "Show Me The Money" Manziel is so ridiculously worse than what our boys did... and our entire football program was crucified in the media and by fans outside of Columbus.
And here with Wetzel, we have the perfect example. Media defending these cheaters. If the rules are crap, then change the rules! But UNTIL those rules are changed, abide by them or take the punishment when you get caught!
The double-standard just infuriates me to no end.

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

Wetzel is just using this as another excuse to grind his anti-NCAA ax. Nothing to see here.

Maestro's picture

Completely.  He did author a book called Death To The BCS after all.

vacuuming sucks

Buckeyeneer's picture

Wetzel is a hypocrite who likes nothing more than to sit on his high horse. I forgave him for all the garbage he wrote about Ohio State until he flipped positions and started arguing for the violators.

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

acBuckeye's picture

I wish I could upvote this a million times. Everyone talks about what a great writer Wetzel is, and he is. But I roll my eyes when I see his name b/c I remember all the garbage he spewed on us when Tatgate went down, and now he changes his stance when it involves other institutions. I will forever hold this against him........

NC_Buckeye's picture

Has Wetzel ever issued a retraction for all the bullshit he issued during the Tat-gate months.
No?... I thought as much. Fuck Wetzel. Like Buckeyeneer says, he's a hypocrite. I discount every thing he's written since he did the flip.

Buckeyeneer's picture

I have heard him interviewed on The Fan several times and I wonder why no radio hosts ever ask him about this. It doesn't even have to be a "gotcha" type question. Just simple ask, "After all the scandals that have come to light since Tat-gate, has your position changed on the the team/school/players involved." I would love to hear his response. At least that terrible reporter who called Pryor a terrorist and Manziel a modern day Rosa Parks, admitted she was wrong. Granted she had to be called out first, but at least she owned up.
It seems a little self serving in light of the fact that Wetzel was involved in exposing OSU's transgressions. Those were terribly important stories where wrongs must be righted and the valiant, intrepid reporter who broke the story must be heralded as a modern day Woodward and Bernstein. On the other hand, he did not break any of these most recent scandals, therefore they are not important or somehow don't matter.

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

tennbuckeye19's picture

Don't you just love how the narrative has changed since the OSU tat stuff? Now it's all about how players should be paid and the NCAA is corrupt and how the system is flawed whereas before with OSU it was about greedy athletes and coaches. The fact that Tressel lied makes things a little different, sure, but as far as the involvement of players, it's not so different, but somehow Manziel and these new 5 SEC guys are viewed as champions for a cause while OSU's tat-five were viewed as common criminals.

BuckGnome's picture

I totally understand your sentiment, ACBUCKEYE.   It's beyond frustrating as a Buckeye fan to watch as tOSU get put through the media meat grinder by Wetzel and just about everyone else in the national sports media, and then get hammered by the NCAA.   Our players were vilified for trading their own freaking possessions for some tats.
Fast forward three years, and major NCAA infractions are being exposed right and left that involve schools other than Ohio State.  Nobody expects the NCAA to do much, and the media, for their part, are directing their ire toward the NCAA and its outdated rule book instead of the schools and players involved.
I get it.  There seems to be a double standard and its infuriating.
However, I think its fair to say that, in the public and in the media, opinion is shifting dramatically against the NCAA and value of its illusion of amateurism it's desperately trying to preserve.  Views on this subject are evolving fast.
I'm willing to give Wetzel and others the benefit of the doubt on this subject.   As a reader of his, I'll afford him the room for his opinions evolve.  On this subject in particular, I know my view certainly has.

acBuckeye's picture

Good point BuckGnome. I'm not against the media bashing the NCAA..... the more the better. But like another poster said, the timing of the Tatgate stuff really sucked. It's possible that had that happened anytime after Penn State, the media may not have put our program through the ringer. We may have still gotten the same penalties, but the media wouldn't have spent so much time talking about it b/c they'd have been busy with Sandusky, Oregon, UNC, etc.
But the way things shook out for our Bucks, and then watching other programs commit much more serious violations get off basically scot-free, is, as you said, infuriating. But at least we're not USC.

Catch 5's picture

Well, Crap.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

causeicouldntgo43's picture

This is one Grey Box I can deal with........................

rihmds80's picture

Have we learned nothing from the Scam Newton case and the Johnny Moneybags fiasco? The $EC is so far in bed with the NCAA that absolutely NOTHING will happen. You can put Oregon in the same boat. On top of all that, just remember that the so called WWL in sports will create a narrative that this is "no big deal" and that it's high time we pay players. ESecPN will control and help write the outcome of all this and it will be "Move along, nothing to see here!"

twalsh's picture

I Will Say It Again! The sec Will Be The Death Of College Football As We Know It. I also see catch5 with his two cents, like alabama didn't buy the National Titles they have won, he'll also say that alabama don't oversign!! Crap. Take away all of the oversigning and paying players and the sec is back to the old days, and today most of the teams in the sec are overrated.
Go Bucks!! and the #1 Conference The B1G!!

Catch 5's picture

How did Bama buy championships? READ THE STORY. You have agents funneling money to players through a person with no current connection to the team. If it is as it appears, Fluker was ineligible and any games he played in should be forfeited - including the NC but if you are hoping for sanctions and bowl bans against the school you will be disappointed as there is no evidence that they had any knowledge of this and there was certainly no conspiracy to cover it up.
I've never claimed that Bama doesn't oversign - they certainly do. What I point out is that oversigning is not the problem you all think it is.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

BuckeyeSouth's picture

Now you know how Buckeyes fans feel, Catch.  The school gets referred to as O$U because players traded trinkets for tats.  If we "officially" didn't win the Sugar Bowl over Arkansas then Bama didn't "officially" win the NC.  Get used to it.

Embrace it.

Catch 5's picture

Oh, I'm old enough to remember the entire '93 season for Alabama that was forfeited because a player signed a napkin. I also remember the 21 wins that were vacated in 2009 (from previous seasons) because a couple players loaned some textbooks to some friends. There is also the '95 ruling where The Tide was given probation, a bowl ban, and the loss of 26 (later reduced to 17) scholarships; add to that the 2002 ruling where they once again faced probation, a two-year bowl ban, and another 15 scholarships lost.

I know well how ya'll feel. Despite the popular opinion, the NCAA has not been shy about punishing Alabama. The difference here, as I pointed out above (in my heavily-downvoted comment) is that the school has not been implemented in any wrongdoing. As such, no punishment beyond vacation of any wins (including the NC) with the ineligible player is warranted.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

Oh, I'm old enough to remember the entire '93 season for Alabama that was forfeited because a player signed a napkin.

...and for the $24K that Antonio Langham received....and for lying to the NCAA.

I also remember the 21 wins that were vacated in 2009 (from previous seasons) because a couple players loaned some textbooks to some friends.

$40,000 worth of text books.
Don't forget the $20K given to Kenny Smith in 1995. The $100K bribe to Albert Means' HS coach. The backdoor payments by boosters of more than $50K to Ronnie Cottrell.
Oh and taking poor Travis Carroll's free car away when he transferred to UF. For shame.
 
No need to let a little honesty get in the way of your rant.

Catch 5's picture

Yes, 40,000 in textbooks. Of course, that was spread out among 201 student athletes from 16 sports, only 8 of which were football players (that's an average of ~$200 per player, or ~$1,600 total for football players)

The penalties I mentioned in 95 were because of the Smith case.
The penalties I mentioned in 02 were from the Means, Carroll, and Cottrell case. I fail to see where anything you added hurts my point, which is that the NCAA is not afraid of going after the Tide - but thanks for the clarifications.

Btw, Cottrell was awarded $30 million in a defamation lawsuit against the NCAA over those allegations. That sum was thrown out by the judge and they just recently settled with him out of court so I don't know the final figure.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

Yes, 40,000 in textbooks. Of course, that was spread out among 201 student athletes from 16 sports, only 8 of which were football players (that's an average of ~$200 per player, or ~$1,600 total for football players)

There you go again...storytelling over facts.
179 of the athletes were inadvertent offenders, ie they didn't know they were receiving impermissible benefits. Of those 125 received less benefits of less than $100.
Now the other 22 athletes had full knowledge they were defrauding the system. The four worst offenders received benefits worth $3,947.19, $3,344.10, $3,061.38 and $2,714.62 respectively.
By pure happenstance those four were members of the football team.
So to recap...of the 8 football players involved, half of them were alone responsible for $13,000 worth of the violation (so roughly 1/3 of total amount went to 2% of the athletes).

As an aside from the Alabama math... it does take a special sort of gal to imply that violations by 201 athletes from 16 different sports are a mitigating factor. So kudos on that.
Regarding the infamous Cotrell lawsuit...aka when Logan Young convinced good 'ole Ronnie that he was being set up, then helped concoct a story about how Phil Fulmer, Roy Adams, the NCAA & The Great Pumpkin conspired against them poor god fearing boys of Alabama.
Of course it was all bull puckey (Arkansas is actually the school that reported Alabama) but I'm sure it was quite entertaining for the jurors in that Birmingham courtroom (no doubt Matthew McConaughey will shine as Tommy Gallion in the film adaptation).
But again I'm getting away from the real point...The lawsuit had nothing to do with the money that Cottrell received from Young. The defamation claim was strictly about Culpepper's testimony & the clerical error in the released report (Cottrell did not receive a 'show cause' penalty).
So let's just stop with the nonsense about 'a signed napkin' and 'some loaned textbooks' being the sources of Alabama's multiple infractions.

droessl's picture

Bravo! I hereby nominate you for the 11W debate team. 

Catch 5's picture

Thanks again for the education, but I still fail to see the point of it.  My point is that the NCAA has not backed away from punishing Bama, and you criticize me by pointing out what Bama did to earn that punishment.  

But again I'm getting away from the real point...

Yes.  Yes you are.
Look, we can argue about these former cases till we are blue in the face but it has nothing to do with my original comment beyond acknowledging that it happened (which is why I didn't go into details).  Despite how bad it looks for Fluker, there is nothing in this story that points to Saban and Alabama having anything to do with this.  This is a few agents who were funneling money to DJ under the table and without anyone's knowledge.  This is against the rules and unless something comes out that changes this story, any games he played in after receiving that money will (should) be vacated - including the championship.  That sucks, but it is right.  DJ comes from a very poor family so I can understand why it happened, and it sucks that a guy like that doesn't have a way to help his family a bit (within the rules) while he is in college, but those are the rules and he should be expected to follow them until better rules are established.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

Thanks again for the education, but I still fail to see the point of it.  My point is that the NCAA has not backed away from punishing Bama, and you criticize me by pointing out what Bama did to earn that punishment. 

No. I'm criticizing you for being misleading about the nature of what has repeatedly occurred at Alabama.
It's not a program that keeps getting in trouble over minor issues (napkins, 'loaned' textbooks). It's a program where every 4-5 years it comes out that there have been violations to the tune of tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Catch 5's picture

Ah. Fair enough I guess. My intent was not to mislead anyone -please note that I never said that Bama wasn't guilty of these infractions. Langham did in fact sign a "contract" with an agent on the back of a bar napkin. That is a rather defining fact in that case that makes it easy to reference if the discussion is not the particulars of the case but rather the fact that it occurred. Same with the other cases - I tried to reference just enough to remind people that Bama has been on the receiving end plenty of times. If you took offense and thought I was trying to mislead everyone I apologize and commend you for your diligence to the strict facts. I look forward to seeing you correct everyone here who lament OSU being punished for just a few discounted tattoos.
BTW, if you want to be factual, you need to lose the quotation marks around "loaned" as all the books had to be returned at the end of the semester. Also, the NCAA explicitly started that no money was given to the players. I wouldn't want you misleading anyone about that.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

EvanstonBuckeye's picture

No, no, you're real close, just keep diggin'...

Jeeves's picture

Fantastic post!

AeroBuckeye2001's picture

Are you seeing a pattern here?

The Ohio State University Class of 2001
BS Aero & Astronautical Engineering

acBuckeye's picture

If I recall, those squads weren't the best in the history of Bama football. With Bama being the juggernaut they are now, no way the NCAA touches them or any of the other money-makers from their precious $EC.

twalsh's picture

Again! I Don't Know Why 11W Let's You Post On This Ohio State Website? I Wasn't Talking To You, And I Didn't Reply To Your Post. alabama is going for their 3rd National Title in a row. How do you think they will get 3 in a row? I know, playing by the rules, not oversigning, solid recruiting, and of course taking care of their players. If esecpn wasn't married to the sec, your conference wouldn't be able to keep it's heads above water!
I'm proud of the B1G, and The Ohio State University.
 
Go Bucks!!

CALPOPPY's picture

I am confused why your statements are phrased as questions?
Maybe! Catch 5 is allowed to comment on 11W because he has something to add to the discussion. (I think I need a question mark there, too?)

I'm a hurtin' buckaroo.

twalsh's picture

Confused, you might be correct, then again you could go back and look at some of catch5 comments on past forms, before you cast any judgment on what I said.
Go Bucks!!

Catch 5's picture

Yes, please do.  If you find any instances where I violated the commenting policy, feel free to bring it to my and the mod's attention and I'll apologize and modify my commenting - but remember that neither disagreeing with you nor being a fan of another team are not violations - as much as you may like them to be.

Make their asses quit! - Nick Saban

Hovenaut's picture

I'm not keeping tab, but ever since Tatgate and what transpired at Penn State just what exactly has the NCAA done?

Miami still ongoing?

Nothing to see with UNC, Auburn, LSU?

A nice afternoon spent in College Station.

SI ready to tear the lid off Stillwater.

Now this.

I'm sure I'm leaving some other instances out, but it's clear (for some time now) the NCAA has exhausted any usefulness as a sanctioning body in collegiate athletics.

Too much money, too much media, too many high profile people, too much business.

Seems like every other week we're reading/hearing bombshell after bombshell. We know where this story likely goes.

Time to close up shop in Indianapolis.

twalsh's picture

Hovenanut, you know how to put it! But you forget that alabama was on probation for this same crap, and still won a National Title.
Go Bucks!!

Hovenaut's picture

Thanks TWalsh....looks like I forgot Oregon too, but I think it's clear the business of major college football is far and forever beyond the realm of the NCAA.

AJW_16's picture

Nothing will come of this because sentiment is changing. My friends, Tatgate happened two years too soon. The NCAA is now facing a backlash of criticism that amateurism is is a crock of shit (which I happen to agree with) from the media and some conference/school officials. Also, given that they can't seem to close the deal on the most open-and-shut case in CFB history (Da U) I seriously doubt they will come down with anything on these teams.
I like to think that Tress, Terrelle Pryor, and DeVier Posey each have a punching bag and an aluminum baseball bat in their basements with a picture of Mark Emmert's face taped on it.

"Sometimes you eat the bear and sometimes the bear eats you." 

cinserious's picture

Now that sentiment regarding the NCAA has changed, how about we get Posey and Pryor back for one more year. Let Tressel coach in college football again. How about we get back our Sugar bowl win over the SEC, and all the other wins the NCAA took from us in 2010. Lets get all our scholarships back we lost so we can keep pace with SEC oversigning. Can't get the 2012 bowl game back but how about paying OSU all the $$$ it lost from it.

Life's daily struggle is choosing between saying F--ck-it, or soldiering on with your responsibilities.  

NW Buckeye's picture

Yahoo!'s Dan Wetzel, who it must be said is one of the best writers covering college football,
I'm sorry, but I think that should be amended to one of the best debaters.  Undoubtedly, Wetzel is very talented, but all of his writings are simply hammering his viewpoint of the NCAA and college athletics.  He reports on everything that is wrong with athletics under the NCAA, and nothing that is good about it.  His constant drivel of doing away with amateurism in college athletics ignores any of the problems that could come along with it.  A good writer covering college football would point out the positives and negatives about any such movement.  His writing is very one sided and self serving.  He wants to be known as the man who brings down the NCAA. 
Please note, I am not defending the NCAA here.  They are very proficient in exposing their own weaknesses by the bumbling way they conduct business.  But, for anyone to think that simply doing away with the "amateurism rules" is going to solve all the problems of college sports is just naive at best.  There will be many problems to be solved once that happens, first and foremost the parity issue.  I realize we don't have true parity now, but that is not because of a lack of rules and regulations.  It is a much deeper issue than that, but opening up the flood gates like what Wetzel is proposing will only make it much worse.  The rich will get rich, the poor will get poorer.  

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

Nailed it.
People love to advocate for change, but they rarely show a realistic understanding of what the end result will actually look like.
"The Bowl System Sucks! We Need A True Playoff!"
So now we have the worst of both worlds.
"The NCAA Is Powerless! We Must Break Away!"
Which will entail giving the worst offenders more control over the process.

BuckeyeChief's picture

Awesome name...are you a lutefisk fan? Never tried it myself.

 

"Damn I miss El Guapo"

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

It's a fantastic adhesive...and it drives the mother of my kids crazy that I didn't spell it Lutfisk.
Seriously though, it's notorious reputation is mostly undeserved. When prepared properly it's not bad, although it is a bit bland.

AJW_16's picture

NW, although I disagree with your sentiment (I think that getting rid of amateurism would make things less complicated than having it), I absolutely agree with your assessment of Wetzel. It seems that the top pundits in college football make their living by unceasingly beating the drum for one topic (Wetzel with amateurism, Pat Forde with Biose State). All of their articles seem to be the same at times. Throw some nuance in there, gents! And I will admit that the whole amateurism thing is quite complicated, much more so than Wetzel makes it out.
Wetzel also has a tendency to talk out both sides of his mouth when it comes to amateurism and the OSU scandal. He is very quick to defend Manzeil and others but takes time to trash Tress et al. Ramzy actually called Wetzel out on Twitter last night for doing this - I would encourage you to take a look at it.

"Sometimes you eat the bear and sometimes the bear eats you." 

NW Buckeye's picture

AJ, I understand where you are coming from.  Please note that I did participate in the system as a student at OSU.  That may explain a little of my stance.  As a member of the football team I can tell you that we were proud of what our efforts contributed to the University overall and for the general funding of other sports.  At the time we participated there was a connection amongst all sports.  Some of the football players were a little smug, but most felt that all OSU athletes shared a bond that transcended each individual sport.  I don't know if that camaraderie is shared today, but I suspect that if it does exist the 'pay for play' model that is being bantered about will shred any connection that is realized today.  There are over 1500 scholarship student athletes at tOSU, and only 100 of them are from football and basketball.  How many of the other 1400 will be without scholarships if we go to a 'pay for play' model?  While I recognize that something has to be done with respect to the athletes in with the revenue generating sports, I wonder just how it will impact all the other sports.  
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post, and for so eloquently stating your position - an upvote for you my good sir!  Go Bucks!!

NC_Buckeye's picture

Parity will be an issue, yes. But I think the single biggest issue will be boosters if a new power conference regime is started.
We all know that cfb fans in the SEC states have the plantation mentality to college football. "If there are those amongst us who have the will and the money, why not buy the best amateur football players that money can buy." Followed by chants of S-E-C, S-E-C.
It will be just like the golden years of SMU football except on a much more profane scale.

NW Buckeye's picture

Exactly this.  We all know that there are $500 handshakes galore in the current system, but bringing it above board will only make it worse.  Like I said, the rich will get rich, the poor will get poorer.  What a quagmire college athletics has become. 

Deadly Nuts's picture

ESPN just put out a story... Everyone knows now.

LEBRON

GoBucksOSU's picture

My question is how does Yahoo (and SI about OK ST) even find out about these?

acBuckeye's picture

A "source" goes to them with info. They don't pick a school to suddenly go investigate, like they try to make you believe.

BuckeyeChief's picture

Here are my thoughts:

  1. Okie St is a midwest state.
  2. Alabama/ Tennessee/ Mississippi are southern states.
  3. Ohio is a Midwest/ Northern state.
  4. Miami and North Carolina are southern states.
  5. OSU got hammered.
  6. Miami and Carolina dd not.
  7. Okie St is going to get hammered.
  8. Alabama/ Tennessee/ Mississippi will not.

 

 

"Damn I miss El Guapo"

kalabuckzoo's picture

What ever happened to the South Carolina hotel scandal?  

cinserious's picture

Auburn and Texas A&M got off scott free in the South. USC got hammered.
Interesting to see what will come of Oregon though. Far from the South but the NCAA loves them to death. The coach bolted like Pete Carroll so you would think something's going down.

Life's daily struggle is choosing between saying F--ck-it, or soldiering on with your responsibilities.  

BuckeyeChief's picture

Another thought:
The SEC is like Hulk Hogan back in the 80s...everytime you think he's beat, he just sits straight up, rises, kicks ass and calls for fans to holler...watch...

 

"Damn I miss El Guapo"

Dr. House's picture

five moves of doom? crap

FitzBuck's picture

What I want to see is if ESPN has non stop coverage with daily speculation on how deep this went and how harsh the punishment should be.  Anything less than the coverage OSU, USC and so on shows a very clear cut bias.  You've set the bar on outrage ESPN.  

Fitzbuck | Toledo - Ohio's right armpit | "A troll by any other name is still a troll".

biggy84's picture

I want to see all espin employees shape public perception against their assets, the SEC. I want to see every jock, turned moralist, they have on staff call for the firing of every HC that was affected by this. I want espin to continually hammer home how despicable these actions are and send their finest investigative team to Tuscaloosa begging for anything to back up the title they had drawn up to fit their narrative. I want their ticker to continually read "breaking news" for 3 days with these horrific events. 
 
That's all i want....

CincyOSU's picture

Sigh..
Once again, ESPN did not dig up anything...that was the Dispatch, SI, Yahoo, etc. In fact, it was SI had that had the headline "how deep it went", not ESPN. ESPN reported(poorly) what other organizations dug up, they were not the ringleaders in regards to all the dirt uncovered within our program. For the life of me, I cannot understand how some on here can't accept this.
You can downvote me all you like, but the fact remains that Yahoo broke the story(after OSU had self reported), SI piled on with the Doerhman piece, then the Dispatch ran their little car story. Why is their no outrage towards these organizations?

biggy84's picture

Read again before you troll for espin. I never said espin uncovered the story. I just went on their website and they used the "everybody does it" excuse. Far different than they way your beloved reported my beloved tOSU.
 
 

CincyOSU's picture

Biggy - I wasn't responding to your post, I was responding to Fitz. Either way, you can call it "trolling" all you like, but last I checked posting facts wasn't trolling...unless you go against the hive.
Brutus - You think this is something that affects my life??? Ha, this is something that annoys me when I come to 11w. The reason I respond so much is I HATE how it makes our fan base look when we cry incessantly EVERY time ESPN posts an article about OSU. I may post the most about this, but there are MANY others who feel the same way as me.

Brutus's picture

Cincy, someday I'd love to sit down with you and figure out what makes you tick. For the life of me,  I cannot understand what compels you to respond to damn near every single mention of ESPN on this site.  You're not changing the hearts and minds. I'd be willing to bet people purposely mention ESPN just to elicit a response from you (just like boob gifs and Steen). Let it go my man.  

osu07asu10's picture

Careful what you say about ESPN around Cincy, otherwise you're going to start...

"They don't know what they don't know." - Coach Mick

CincyOSU's picture

Oh, I'm done responding for the day on this matter.
I'd rather follow what happens with this SEC situation.

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

You can downvote me all you like, but the fact remains that Yahoo broke the story(after OSU had self reported), SI piled on with the Doerhman piece, then the Dispatch ran their little car story. Why is their no outrage towards these organizations?

The difference is volume. People read the Dohrmann story once and then never looked at it again. SI also didn't spend the next year writing story after story about the violation or worse yet try to shoehorn mentioning it into every story...hey an article on Tiger Woods spending the weekend in Vegas, oh look there's a mention of Jim Tressell 'rigging' raffles.
The Dispatch of course focused more on the topic, but they also printed retractions or clarified incorrect claims when more information came to light.
ESPN had the story running every few minutes on the ticker for months. Every talking head expressed outrage loudly & often...over and over....again, for months. If you were watching a game between (insert any two teams here) at some point they would find a way to shoe horn in a completely unrelated rant regarding Ohio State. If you stopped by the ESPN home page, there was a negative story about Ohio State among the headlines every day for almost a year (and yes there was someone with too much time on their hands who took the time to track that).
Conversely while they covered stories about the issues at USC, you rarely saw anything more perfunctory coverage. It wasn't blasted 24-7 and the slant wasn't universally negative.
That is the reason that people have a hate for ESPN. Because it's coverage of the Ohio State story was decidedly different than of any previous or post NCAA violation.
Pryor & Co exchanging their memorabilia for tattoos & Jim Tressell  not speaking up when emailed about it received more constant and negative coverage on ESPN than what happened at Penn State. Think about that for a moment.

CincyOSU's picture

ESPN ran something "for months and months" because something new came out every other month. The initial suspensions, the SI piece, Tressel getting suspended, Tressel getting fired, the car thing, the memorabilia dealer issue, the no show jobs, the list goes on. These stories didn't all come out at once, and they weren't only covered by ESPN, as you make it sound. EVERY additional scandal piece that came out was also covered on EVERY other sports outlet. Just because ESPN has TV presence and multiple platforms(which means you will see the same story more often) does not mean they are out to get OSU. If SI, or CBS, had multiple platforms you would see the same kind of extended coverage. I have still yet to receive logical answer as to why the outlets that actually dug up all the stuff on OSU get a free pass, but ESPN bears the brunt of all the outrage because they reported what these other outlets uncovered?

(and yes there was someone with too much time on their hands who took the time to track that).

Let's see the proof of this...otherwise it's simply a case of what someone chooses to remember, ie confirmation bias. Part of the problem is the mass exaggeration that goes on with the ESPN hates us crew. "Every day for a year", "Every talking head". "If you were watching any game", "hey an article on Tiger Woods spending the weekend in Vegas, oh look there's a mention of Jim Tressell 'rigging' raffles", etc....without any real proof to back up what you are saying other than "well I know it happened that way".

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

You asked why people focus on ESPN and I explained it to you....simply because people were exposed to more of ESPN's coverage, nothing more. ESPN has been the dominant source of information for most people who follow college football.
If you are so keen to discuss logical fallacies, perhaps we should have a talk about your personal strawman argument that The Dispatch or SI 'get a pass'. Read through the recent threads here about the SI story on Oklahoma State. Care to make a wager on when those negative opinions of Greg Dohrmann were formed?

BME_Buckeye's picture


We innocent man. Roll Tide! 

Look closely, because the closer you think you are, the less you will actually see.

 

cinserious's picture

Looks like a typical 'Bama fan going " woooo, I'm scared the big-bad NCAA is going to hurt my program. Woooo, I'm so scared."  (chuckles)

Life's daily struggle is choosing between saying F--ck-it, or soldiering on with your responsibilities.  

Buckeyeneer's picture

Pretty funny comment from a Tide fan on another site:

If Bama loses their title(s) due to this, the date of 9/11 will forever be reme-.....crap.

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

97Buckeye's picture

Actually, it's not funny.

TNbuckeye91's picture

thsts a matter of opinion, my friend

Stinson's picture

No. Not funny.

"The height of human desire is what wins, whether it's on Normandy Beach or in Ohio Stadium." -Wayne Woodrow Hayes

40 Degrees North's picture

It is comments like this and that line of thinking that have soured me on sports, in particular college football, over the last few years.

Grayskullsession's picture

So.Easy(to).Cheat

"if irony were made of strawberries, we' d all be drinking a lot of smoothies right now."

Earle's picture

Surreptitiously Exchanging Cash

Italics are for emphasis.

jeremytwoface's picture

So so SO incredibly annoying when coaches walk out of press conferences. There are very few reasons where I feel like it's ok to do that. Being asked about something like this isn't one of those reasons.
 
Part of your responsibility as a coach is to talk to the media. You can't just make a statement and not expect to get any questions about it... and then just leave when people DO start asking about it.
 

The first man gets the ((((Oyster)))), the second man gets the shell.

tennbuckeye19's picture

I thought Jim Mora from UCLA walking out of his presser this week was fine. In case you missed it: He was addressing the fact that one of their players had been hit by a car and killed and one of the media guys was talking on his cell phone in the room and everyone could hear him, he told the media player to shut up and things escalated from there, ending with him walking out.

jeremytwoface's picture

Exactly.
This is one of those few occasions that I think it's ok.

The first man gets the ((((Oyster)))), the second man gets the shell.

40 Degrees North's picture

Mora did learn from one of the best when it comes to handling a press conference. 
That said, my condolences to the UCLA players family and the team.

Deadly Nuts's picture

What does he think he is going to be asked about, Deer Antler Spray?

LEBRON

gobucks96's picture

So wait getting money is now ok, but selling your stuff was the worst thing imaginable.. Wow. So much has changed in the last 24 months...

BuckeyeChief's picture

...like the name on the jersey?

 

"Damn I miss El Guapo"

gobucks96's picture

and the conference label on the side of it..

Smanpoint10's picture

To be fair, I would have gotten pretty mad like Saban did if everyone kept asking the same question I had already answered

Brutus's picture

So which B1G player who didn't make it in the NFL is doing this throughout the Midwest  right now?
Actually, I should probably remove the sarcasm font.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Luther Davis isn't the first to come up with this idea. Prostitution may be the oldest profession, but I'm guessing street agent is up there too. I find nothing surprising or reprehensible about this story.  Schools know it goes on everywhere and I'm sure they don't like it and try to prevent it, but I think more than anything, they strive for plausible deniability, which all of the schools mentioned above appear to have.  
Oh well.  More fuel for the NCAA's funeral pyre (crosses fingers).

rihmds80's picture

Between the Scam Newton case, Johnny Moneybags issue, the botched investigation at Da U, the ineptitude of the charges against Oregon, the dumpster fire that is the Oklahoma State case, and now the *Shocking* (sarcasm)  revelation about the $EC, all this, in my opinion, makes the Ohio State case look insignificant in the grand scheme of things!!! Further proving that the NCAA is a F#@KING JOKE!!!

KingsRite's picture

                                                                                                 

“I have yet to be in a game where luck was involved. Well-prepared players make plays. I have yet to be in a game where the most prepared team didn't win.” -Urban Meyer-

One Bad Buckeye's picture

Nick Saban's response should really put Bama fans at ease.....

"I'm One Bad Buckeye, and I approve this message."

Hovenaut's picture

Saban Eschews Calm?

Saban Engages Columnists?

Saban Expunges Championships?

Saban Expected C.O.D.?

I'm sorry, I can't help it.....

vitaminB's picture

I'm glad there appears to be an actual paper trail in this case.  I don't see how anyone can say that having former players deliver money to current players doesn't show a lack of institutional control.
I hope that this will provide Bama with another reason to band together this week and beat up on A&M.  They beat A&M and then later in the week decide to impose a one year post-season ban pending the rest of the investigation, and you've just killed two SEC birds with one stone.

CUBS's picture

Not sure if anyone else has heard about this but apparently they wont be cooperating with any NCAA violation and have written the piece just to expose the crap system of the NCAA. I do not have a link to this story but was told about it by a close friend last night over some beers. He read something on his phone and told us about it. I hope that thats not going to be the case because that would be a complete 180 from the way the media handled the OSU and USC cases; I think you'd have to seriously wonder how corrupt sports journalism is if they do not cooperate here.

AltaBuck's picture

Just an opinion
There is one thing that is consistent regarding the sports media: Their actions will always be based upon their own self interests ($$$$$). They will cooperate with the NCAA because that will keep the story alive, and possibly, for a long time.

I have been known on occasion to howl at the moon. - Crash Davis

Jeeves's picture

Given what has already been put out in the article and the images of the paper trail I don't see why their cooperation is even a necessity at this point.

BTBuckeye's picture

If Alabama fielded an ineligible player, doesn't that mean they have to forfeit their wins? Isn't that what the NCAA does in these cases?
FWIW, I don't even care if these kids get some black market $$$.

bigbadbuck's picture

would you turn in your cash cow?    What I'm saying here is why would they turn in part of the very conference they are in bed with?

CUBS's picture

The big question will be, Did Saban know? If he did then they will get slammed with probation, bowl ban, and he will get fired with perhaps a show-cause and itd be a long way back for him and Alabama. If he didn't, and Bama does somehow get into trouble, itll just be vacated wins, including the national title game he played in.

Maestro's picture

Bama will "forfeit" their titles, and still claim 17 or 20 or however many it's up to now.

vacuuming sucks

Idaho Helga's picture

I have to be honest, I don't care if they do that.  We still beat Arkansas.  This vacating stuff is kind of goofy.   Sort of like Wisconsin bragging they went to 3 straight Rose bowls when they didn't deserve to go last year.  It's hollow.

Maestro's picture

Agree that it's hollow, but it should happen.

vacuuming sucks

jeremytwoface's picture

I wonder how the serial down-voter picks his victims....

The first man gets the ((((Oyster)))), the second man gets the shell.

mh277907's picture

Males aged 18-32, alone, commenting at night while walking through the park.

buckeyebobcat

Idaho Helga's picture

...and all his neighbors when asked, say "He was a quiet guy, kinda kept to himself.  I had no idea that he was the serial downvoter!"

BuckeyeChief's picture

long day, just got home and saw "The Phantom Downvoter" has struck.
Oh, the humanity!

 

"Damn I miss El Guapo"

kalabuckzoo's picture

who seriously has the time to go through and downvote everyone in a thread?

CALPOPPY's picture

Don't know...but the passion and persistence is admirable. It would be good to find a way to guide that energy into something useful.

I'm a hurtin' buckaroo.

bigbadbuck's picture

who knows. Looks like someone missed their group therapy session this last week. To whom this is........get a life!