Former Tatgate Investigator: "Underlying Rules That Were Violated Are a Bit Silly"

By DJ Byrnes on June 4, 2014 at 11:44a
70 Comments

Tatgate — and Jim Tressel's FOIA-requestable cover-up — looks a lot different in the scheme of NCAA scandals in 2014 than it did in 2010.

Since then, the NCAA and media have gone under quite the transformation in how scandals are reported and enforced. (For a glaring example, look at the lack of penalty/media outrage for North Carolina's fictional classes for athletes).

Tim Nevis, a former NCAA investigator responsible for interrogating Jim Tressel and investigating "how deep it went" at Ohio State, has since underwent a similar change. (Although, to be fair, his views seem to align with those who are cutting his salary checks.)

Here's Nevis, now a lawyer for a firm that represents clients against the NCAA, in an interview with Cleveland.com's Doug Lesmeries:

"I think now that I am on this side and we have brought this lawsuit, maybe I realize a little bit more how sort of silly some of the underlying rules are," Nevius said. "At the time I remember having pause to think about that, but now it's even more stark, I guess I would say, that the rules that were the underlying rules that were violated by the student-athletes are a bit silly.

"Now at the same time the reason the case escalated to the point it escalated was because of Coach Tressel's knowledge of the violations and I think that's in a different category."

Yes, people do tend to forget ultimately Jim Tressel played a direct role in his downfall and some of the penalties brought upon Ohio State.

Nevis, however, disagrees with the widely-held assumption Jim Tressel lied to the NCAA:

 "[Tressel] was always very professional, and I think one of the misperceptions was that, and when people look back and talk about the case, they still make an error and say that Coach Tressel lied to the NCAA, and that is not accurate.

With the O'Bannon lawsuit heading to trial next week, perhaps, in the end, the "Tat Five" will be at the historical forefront in changing the debate on how student-athletes are compensated.

While it's hard to defend Jim Tressel knowingly playing ineligible players, it's even harder to indict the Tat Five for doing anything ethically wrong in the first place.

70 Comments

Comments

osugreg04's picture

Despite everything, I will still always love Tress #2002

+16 HS
InvertMyVeer's picture

#9-1

Football is complicated...

+4 HS
michbornbuckeye's picture

Lloyd carr sold his soul to the devil for that one win he did have

I have two favorite college teams
1. The Ohio State
2. And anyone that's playing Michigan

+4 HS
AndyVance's picture

I'll never fault Coach Tressel for what he did; the man has done too much good for our university and the communities in which he's coached for me to get all worked up about his desire to protect his guys.

+14 HS
Bolt's picture

I'll fault him for what he did to the extent that he made a mistake and I still love the guy. I don't think the national fake outrage should've been so violent toward him and I don't think it should've completely soiled his reputation. He did mess up and it ultimately cost him his job and that's no one's fault but his. As for everyone lining up to shove it in his/our face, those were/are the jackasses that had spent years lining up and salivating at the chance to do anything to take him and Ohio State down a peg because they couldn't stand him.

+8 HS
AndyVance's picture

I don't disagree with anything you said - I'll always love, respect and admire Jim Tressel.

For the holier-than-thou types who still get their knickers in a twist over Tatgate, I simply say that Coach did what he did because he thought it was in the best interest of his kids - trying to help them, rather than throwing them to the wolves. He was loyal to his players, to his own detriment in this case. Anyone who thinks he "lied to the NCAA" in an effort to win football games is deluded to the point of deserving ridicule.

+7 HS
andretolstoy's picture

So he "had knowledge" but "he didn't lie to the NCAA?"

Where was his crime? The delay?

+4 HS
OSUpawn's picture

He didn't notify the NCAA.  Played the players after he knew they broke the rules.  I think it was a little petty but not in their eyes.

I believe the SEC players put their pants on one leg at a time like we do.

+2 HS
hit_the_couch's picture

Don't take into consideration that he got notified in a random email form a lawyer breaking attorney-client privilege. This same lawyer has also been disciplined before for violating legal code (I won't call it ethics; there's no ethics in the law) and his license suspended for a year, I believe, for notifying Tressel.

I would have likely deleted the email myself and went on about my business.

And then I told her...i'm no weatherman, but tonight's forecast is calling for several inches!

+2 HS
Chief B1G Dump's picture

I would venture to guess that many coaches followed the Tressel witch hunt closely and changed their email policies.  I would bet a number of coaches now have a "buffer" and dont have their own email.  Some unpaid graduate assistant funnels all emails and only prints out ones the coach needs...otherwise the coach never knows about them.

Mafia type insulation.

+4 HS
BlueBayou's picture

I absolutely agree with this since it is even a common practice in the business world as well.

BED's picture

I didn't downvote you, but I'd like you to know that this:

I won't call it ethics; there's no ethics in the law

is an incredibly ignorant thing to say.  Most lawyers are highly ethical.  We self-enforce the ethics code, to the point of reporting the few bad others in the profession who give the vast vast majority of us a bad name.  Please don't make blanket statements like that which have no basis in reality.  Thanks.

/rant

The Ohio State University, College of Arts & Sciences, Class of 2006
The Ohio State University Moritz College of Law, Class of 2009

hit_the_couch's picture

Dear Mr. Bed,

That's not what i'm getting at/ talking about (Lawyers adhering to whatever is dictated in the legal code), but I appreciate your input. Maybe I worded it wrong. Anyway,your also one of them and would likely never get it either if I did take the time to explain what i'm talking about. I won't elaborate further; this isn't the place.

And then I told her...i'm no weatherman, but tonight's forecast is calling for several inches!

doodah_man's picture

Yea, I am not sure where the 

(I won't call it ethics; there's no ethics in the law) 

came from. I have been an attorney for 14 years and I would seriously beg to differ.

Jim "DooDah" Day
It is hard to play dirty against a man who picks you up.

+1 HS
Buckeyeneer's picture

Viva la Tressel!

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

+4 HS
Poison nuts's picture

What I always wondered was this: If Tressel doesn't play those guys, OSU loses that game for sure. Which would OSU fans be more upset about? ANOTHER Ohio State loss to the SEC & the never ending stream of narrative that would have come from it - or Tressel knowingly playing guys that got tattoos/cash for their own memorabilia & then being dodgy with the NCAA about what he knew. In hindsight it's easy to say the latter was worse, due to what happened & the whole "scandal" - but I submit just as many if not more people (within Buckeye Nation anyway) would have been equally if not more outraged that those players would have to sit for their seemingly minor & certainly less than criminal mistakes...and OSU would then lose a very winnable game. I understand the rules & will think til my dying day that what they (Tat-Five) did should not have been something that kept them from playing in the Sugar Bowl even if it was deemed as "illegal" by the NCAA.

Edit: I think people are misunderstanding my point, which is simple. In every way possible throughout "Tat-Gate", Tressel was in a no win situation be it with fans or NCAA or whatever.

"Do not pass me, just slow down - I can move right through you" Superchunk - Precision Auto.

+2 HS
BuckeyeGrl5's picture

If I'm not mistaken, Tatgate was known to the public prior to the Sugar Bowl, and the NCAA deemed the Tat 5 eligible to play in that game. 

"I love football.  I think its the most wonderful game in the world and I despise to lose" - Woody Hayes

+19 HS
RedStorm45's picture

Which we then vacated for some reason....*paging Gene Smith*

+5 HS
Poison nuts's picture

BuckeyeGrl5 - I know the details, trust me, but what I guess I'm saying is that Tressel was put in a lose lose proposition with the fans as soon as it became public. That's all. And I bet if those guys hadn't played - OSU fans would have been even more upset than if they had. It's all a guessing game as to what would have happened had they been benched, but regardless, JT couldn't have won in that scenario no matter what. See, had JT planned on saying "yes I knew what happened" to the NCAA, then he likely would have benched them prior to the Sugar Bowl game. Whether the NCAA deemed them eligible or not is not the issue I was raising. I often hear from righteous fans that he shouldn't have played them since it turned out later that he was aware of everything they were doing.

By the way, I am not inferring that he in any way cheated  or was trying to gain a competitive advantage through illegal conduct- not at all, because playing your best guys when no criminal acts have taken place is nothing like cheating...

"Do not pass me, just slow down - I can move right through you" Superchunk - Precision Auto.

+2 HS
I_Run_The_Dave's picture

The game that the players would have been suspended for was on 9/2/2010 against Marshal if JT had been forthcoming (or thought their actions were worthy of suspension).  I doubt fear of losing this game was the reason he chose not to suspend them.  But no one ever thinks about it in that way.

+2 HS
BlueBayou's picture

If you look at it that they only would have been suspended one game, I agree, but they ended up with multi-game suspensions, so had things come out when Tressel knew, then the NCAA may have suspended them for the first 3 to 4 games of the 2010 season (I think it was actually 5 for 2011 when they were handed out, but maybe they tacked on an extra game since they let them play the Sugar Bowl)  So the fear of losing a game in that span might be believable, but I don't think that was his motivation.  I don't think Tressel was trying to get a "competitive advantage" by playing ineligible players.  I think he just didn't know what to do with the situation given the circumstances.

I_Run_The_Dave's picture

Yeah, they all got 5 games in 2011.  Posey got an additional 5 games for what, $3?  This was all after the fact because of the scandal being already blown out of proportion.  Last season, Johnny Football got a whole half a game suspension for receiving money for signing autographs -- and we all know this was bogus.  If he actually did it (which they "never proved"), he deserved much worse, but if he did not, why not appeal and keep him playing?  The half-game was to call off the dogs of the NCAA because they knew if they dug deep enough they'd uncover something.

So if Tressel suspends them all for 1 game, is forthcoming on the NCAA form, this ends exactly then.  And JT knew all of this when they were not suspended and when he signed the form.  So once again, lets ask the question why?  If it wasn't to protect their safety amid an ongoing and confidential FBI investigation that got a lawyer disbarred for disclosing, then please, inform me.  If not, lets cut the man some slack and let this go.

BeijingBucks's picture

You forget OSU was the first case after the Chernobyl USC ruling. Public outcry back then was fierce as opposed to public fatigue for manziel. I don't think one game would have made ESPNs Cialis source go away. No way, no how. 

 

 

None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. ~ John Milton

Chief B1G Dump's picture

I guess you can call me a righteous fan.

I can honestly say, if I were in Tressel's shoes, I would have likely ignored the initial email.  At the very most, I would have asked some assistant to very slyly try to find out if there were any truth to it.  Coaches probably get 1000s of crazy ass fan emails.  But anyhow, my problem occurred when the cat was out of the bag and the whole deal was exposed prior to the Sugar Bowl.  The vultures were circling and the media frenzy had already begun - and the Tatgate players played in the bowl game anyhow.  I felt that was against everything Tressel had taught and preached.  No matter how dumb that rule was, it was broken and everybody knew about it.  This contradicted all of Tressels accountability speak, etc.  It just felt like Tress caved to the pressure (from the Sugar Bowl folks, ESPN/ABC, B1G, whomever) to play the big name, money making players.

I love the guy, grew up with him (I started at OSU when he was hired, was a student in 02), and will always hold him special.  I was then and always will be proud of how he cleaned up the program when he took over for Cooper, turned the tide and established dominance in the rivalry, and also owned the B1G and BCS for a solid decade.  I thought then and always will that the whole "scandal" was so ridiculously dumb and everybody with a brain knows that it happens at every school, even in the lower divisions.  My only knock on the whole situation was playing the players in the Sugar Bowl...I would have rather not played them and lost that game 100 to 0, I wouldnt have cared.  I just wish Tressel would have said what he said about trying to protect his players...but I would have liked him to also say something like he disagrees with black/white rules as this was a gray area, but the rules are the rules and they were broken - for those reasons, the players will not be making the trip for the Sugar Bowl.  I think that would have really stuck it to the very same folks creating their fake outrage - while also preserving everything Tress taught and stood for.

The whole thing obviously sucked...and I really cant decide if these idiots now saying they overreacted is good or bad.  There is no consistency with the enforcement of the rules and/or the penalties...and that is many folks problem with all of this, and the NCAA.

+2 HS
cdub4's picture

Tressel knew the guy who sent the email, he was an ex player. I don't know why you would ignore a tip from a former player. It was not from a crazy fan.

Besides, Tressel probably doesn't read his own emails all the time anyways, he may have an assistant do it.

+1 HS
Chief B1G Dump's picture

Because when he replied, it is on record proof that he received the information. Delete it/mark it unread/ignore it ...just don't get on the record acknowledging receipt of that information. I'm sure they get tons of emails about everything, they could have easily postured that better both before and after it was all out in the public, and insulated Tress from "receiving that information."  But that wasn't the point of my post. 

Also, Send a lower tier employee/assistant to find out, as I mentioned here. I also mentioned the assistant email "buffer" way up in the thread. 

 

Edit: I accidentally fat finger down voted you on my phone. But then I realized you can now change the vote back and forth but you can't just get rid of it. So I left you with an up vote...you're playing with house money. 

Poison nuts's picture

I hear you Chief & I'm glad you understood what I was getting at. I agree with almost all of what you said & BTW, "righteous fan" wasn't meant as a slight but rather a description of those like yourself who felt that it was important for Tressel to practice what he preached in that situation. My stepfather was of your mindset too - he didn't think they should have played.

My stance is that I feel as though people who think that they should have been benched would still have been pretty tough on JT if he hadn't played them - leading to a brutal beating. You say that you wouldn't mind & I believe that. I'm sure there are people like yourself that have standards that they adhere to & won't be swayed by a loss of a football game. But I also remember the narrative going on at the time with the whole "OSU can't beat the SEC" thing & it was so damn frustrating to hear it non stop (pretty much literally) that had the Buckeyes lost another one, people may have turned on JT & said "he should have played them, he wasn't forced to bench them." As an aside to all this, I also believe there to be some truth to the notion that he wanted to bench them initially but the Sugar Bowl people & TV people pushed for them to not be benched because of the millions of dollars at stake. Had they not played, people may have tuned out & created a monster ratings drop - thereby creating monster revenue loss.

Me, I'm glad they played based on principle alone. While I agree that rules are rules & dumb or not, rules were technically broken. But I also understand that there are shades of grey in the world. So while it's all up for debate as far as what would have been, since it all happened the way it happened, I feel for him on that issue...as well as a number of others. One thing we most definitely agree on -- the whole thing did indeed suck!

"Do not pass me, just slow down - I can move right through you" Superchunk - Precision Auto.

ghalephoto's picture

The only reason they got to play in that game was because of pressure put on by the Sugar Bowl and Delaney of the BigTen.  They pleaded and begged to the right people.  Saying the process had not played out so until it has, let em' play.  Which turned out to be another of Delaney's blunders in a career full of blunders.  How he still has this job is amazing and scary.

-1 HS
yrro's picture

Tress didn't lie any more than anyone else. He just got caught in it.

The shit going on in Miami and USC, but somehow Tressel is only one who was "lying."

+4 HS
buckeyedude's picture

In light of recent happenings, I believe they should reinstate the Sugar Bowl victory over Arkansas.

 

 

+20 HS
Bucksfan's picture

"they still make an error and say that Coach Tressel lied to the NCAA, and that is not accurate."

Wait a minute. WHAT?!  I thought that was the very crux of the show-cause penalty, the pressure for him to step down, the reason for the vacated wins, the bowl ban, the entire fucking lot of it!  That was everything!  And now the lawyer is saying that he didn't actually lie to anyone?

I have two words to say.  "FUCK. YOU."  He most certainly lied.  The NCAA asked him straight up if he was aware that these players took money for memorabilia.  He said no.  The email that surfaced later proved otherwise.

-3 HS
BuckeyeGrl5's picture

Do you know when he specifically said "no" when asked that question?  Just curious.  Because the press conference I saw, Tressel said "I did receive a tip".

"I love football.  I think its the most wonderful game in the world and I despise to lose" - Woody Hayes

+2 HS
RedStorm45's picture

It was on the NCAA tape that played non-stop on airwaves for at least a month.

+1 HS
Bucksfan's picture

Fine.  What I wrote wasn't exactly accurate.  What happened was that he signed an NCAA compliance form in September 2010 that said he had no knowledge of any violations by any of his players.  He did not indicate in any press conference that he received any information prior to the Cicero emails becoming public.  He supposedly told the University that he had received a tip, but again that didn't come out until afterwards.

+1 HS
hit_the_couch's picture

They also played tape of Tressel's interview telling the NCAA that he was tipped off about the players. I don't know how many interviews he did though.

And then I told her...i'm no weatherman, but tonight's forecast is calling for several inches!

BuckeyeGrl5's picture

Yeah the only tape I remember hearing had him saying he received a tip.  I could have very well missed something though. I haven't seen any facts that indicated the "lying" was more than lying by omission.   Also, I'm not saying that lying by omission means he did nothing wrong.  Just trying to show how the facts got so blown out of proportion with Tatgate.  Some people often say "tressel lied multiple times and actively covered up many violations!"  which I feel is inaccurate.

"I love football.  I think its the most wonderful game in the world and I despise to lose" - Woody Hayes

+3 HS
BlueBayou's picture

I don't think the interviews and the "lying by omission" are the most damning part for Tressel.  It definitely didn't help his situation, but I think the part that got him was that it was easily proven (emails) that he knew about his players' NCAA violations in April 2010 way before the season started and then signed and sent the required documentation to the NCAA prior to the start of the 2010 season that he wasn't aware of any NCAA violations by his players (documented lie).  All coaches are required to do this prior to the season.  So the argument I guess is that he knowlingly lied at that point and starting with the first game in 2010 he knowlingly played 5 ineligible players up until the Sugar Bowl in which they were made eligible by the NCAA's decision (decision made without full story?  Maybe why they forfeited the Sugar Bowl too?)  If I remember correctly, when the players were made eligible for the bowl game, wasn't Tressel not in agreement with that decision?  I seem to remember him stating he thought they shouldn't have been eligible.

The part I can't remember though is how did it come out that Tressel knew about the violations before the University was aware?  Was that found through a freedom of information request or did an employee find it and report it?

I honestly think Tressel got shafted through the whole thing.  Did he make mistakes?  Certainly, but I don't think there was any bad intent or attempt to win based on playing ineligible players.  If his motivation was based on not wanting to interfere with an ongoing investigation, he really needed to consult with the athletic department / University's legal team.  They could have provided him with the proper guidance of what his obligations were.  Hindsight is 20/20 though.

I_Run_The_Dave's picture

I agree that he shouldn't have signed the form indicating that he had no knowledge, when he did in fact have "a tip".  However, what we do not know is whether or not he had informed the university and whether or not they forced him to sign the form in this way.  Regardless, why would he not suspend them for Marshall unless he thought their safety was at risk?  This is the question no one asks.

trigg03's picture

That's contingent on whether or not he believed this attorney over his players whom he questioned & they assured Tress there was no truth to it. If I'm in his situation I would dismiss the whole notion as well.

pcg396's picture

Please.  Nevins is a lawyer; he dances to the tune his employer is p[l]aying.  Nothing new here,  DJB, except off-season empty space.  Get back to us when you can confirm Tressel's second miracle.

Scottsdale Buckeye

+2 HS
RedStorm45's picture

You can hate the rules, but they still must be followed if you're going to be an NCAA player or coach.  I can think a 55 mph speed limit is dumb, but if I go 70+ (and get caught, hint hint) then there will be consequences.  I agree it's dumb that those five got suspended (and even more ridiculous Pryor was suspended in the NFL), but they agreed to play in the NCAA and there are rules that have to be followed to stay eligible.

Of course...NOW the media doesn't care - Bama players getting paid, Auburn players saying they're getting paid cash, Manziel's autographs for ca$h, etc. etc.  The media 180 on this subject in such a short period of time is astounding.

+6 HS
Rogabone's picture

Will always appreciate and miss the Vest

Fall on the sword

 

"Who is that madman?" the new arrival asked St. Peter.

"That's God," St. Peter replied. "But he thinks he's Woody Hayes."

+14 HS
@osu.fbu's picture

I never figured out how Tressel was the only coach considered to have lied to the NCAA.  For example:  Rich Rodriguez at UM was implicated in running an offseason program that knowingly exceeded NCAA limits.  The program was punished lightly but Rodriguez got off Scot-free.    Did Rodriguez not sign the same pre-season compliance form that ultimately did Tressel in?  Shouldn't Rodriguez have also been given a similar punishment for lying about the compliance of his program?  

 

+3 HS
THEOSUfan's picture

Let me get this on the record first: I love Jim Tressel.  I think he is a great man: "great" because of what he has accomplished and the integrity with how he accomplished it; and a "man" - as such, prone to mistakes, errors, and sins like all of us.

But where he lied to the NCAA is when he signed statements submitted to the NCAA in August and prior to the bowl that he had reported all known violations of NCAA violations involving his team to the NCAA.  He attested that he had reported all known violations, but the fact is that he knew about the Tatgate issues in, I believe based on the email he received, April of that year.  So, signing your name to, what basically is an affidavit, that you have reported all you know, when you haven't really reported all you know is a form of dishonesty or lying.  We can talk about circumstances and mitigating factors that take away or lessen any sinister motives for doing that, but that does not change the fact that he was not forthcoming, and he attested to something that he knew was not true.

People like to excuse him by saying he was just protecting his players, or was falling on his sword, but he had another option.  He could have revealed the situation to Ohio State lawyers, and asked them to handle it in a way that protected him, his players, and the school.  Not doing that was his big mistake, and I'm sure he wishes he had done that now, but he didn't, and so he is left to deal with what we could term "inconvenient facts".

All that said, acting like this is on a par with the great crimes and deceptions in American sports is ridiculous, but the excesses of JT's critics do not do away with the reality of what he did and failed to do.

 

 

Ill_Buckeye's picture

I may be in the minority here but I've always believed tressel did what most people would do. He was given the tip about a federal investigation, and was told something to the effect of that the info was confidential. It seemed to me he was trying to keep his kids out of a seedy situation, and handle it with them internally while not compromising said investigation. Doesn't the confidentiality of a federal investigation trump the rules of a "non-profit" organization?

Obviously doing this was self-serving for the interest of the football team. But I always thought the confidential nature of the case was the bigger reason for staying quiet with the knowledge of it. I felt the transcripts from tressel's testimony in the NCAA investigation stated this. Once it came into the public sphere, and after the NCAA granted sugar bowl eligibility it felt to me like "ok, lets talk about this now".

I may be totally off-base here, but this factor of it has always driven me a bit crazy

 

+8 HS
Ahh Saturday's picture

At this point all the arguments about JT and Tatgate are old.  Any Buckeye who spent even an hour on any CFB web site in the summer of '11 already knows them all.  At this late date what I find interesting about the scandal is how it looks more and more like what behavior analysts would call an extinction burst from the NCAA, a flurry of activity before finally giving up. 

+3 HS
Poison nuts's picture

+1

 

"Do not pass me, just slow down - I can move right through you" Superchunk - Precision Auto.

IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

Why didn't you speak up 3 years ago, Mr. Nevis? I've never thought anyone did anything wrong. Not saying that as a homer. Saying that from someone with enough common sense to know that equating selling personal belongings for financial gain with a crime is the most asinine thing in the world. Coach Tressel did not lie, he withheld information and was protecting his kids. If we tarred and feathered everyone who was guilty of that there'd be a LOT of people walking around looking like a chicken.

What has always angered and confused me about Tatgate is the level of bile that was flung back into Coach Tressel and his players. Judging from it you'd thought they had raped and murdered someone. Silly indeed.

 

"Sherman ran an option play right through the south" - Greatest Civil War analogy EVER.

+2 HS
CincyOSU's picture

Coach Tressel did not lie, he withheld information

Umm, isn't that the same thing? I think most people believe(at least now) that the whole scandal was rather silly, but that doesn't change the facts..players broke (silly)rules, Tressel (lied)withheld info, and the nation overreacted.

-2 HS
BroJim's picture

We will never know all the details about "TatGate" but I agree with DJ, Jimmy T did play a direct role.

On another note, sometime not being honest when the opportunity presents itself is lying. In my opinion, it was a little out of character especially coming from someone who always spoke about integrity. 

That being said I love Tress and I think the sanctions handed down by the NCAA were far too harsh. 

I season my simple food with hunger

daveyt11's picture

Like someone said earlier in a diifferent post, TATGATE wouldn't have been that big a deal now had they just self imposed a bowl ban when it was quite clear the 2011 season was gonna be a minor bowl at best. Midway we were 3-3, If Gene Smith self imposes we would likely have skated similarly to the U of Miami. Not sure what Gene Smith was thinking. Cost OSU a legit shot in 2012.  

buckeyedude's picture

~~Former Tatgate Investigator: "Underlying Rules That Were Violated Are a Bit Silly"

Considering the shit that's happened at A&M, North Carolina, Auburn, and Miami, just to name a few, I agree 100% with Former Tatgate Investigator.

I also have no interest in debating, yet again for the millionth time(RME), Jim Tressel and "what did he know and when did he know it?"

 

 

 

+1 HS
Buckeye Knight's picture

"Silly" is quite the understatement.  Saban gets away with whatever he likes (thanks Mark Emmert), Auburn pays cash for Cam Newton (not to mention all the other SEC players posting pics of themselves online with larges amounts of "new found" cash), NC has fake classes, South Carolina has coaches, players, and recruits get caught in a ~$60k scandal and only lost a few schollies, Johhny Dbag signs hundreds of footballs for money on video and still gets off scott free, Miami has a billionaire come clean with up to $500 million in extra benefits to players and the NCAA drops the ball, but OSU got dragged through the mud in the media, had a bowl ban during an undefeated season, and Tress gets fired.  The NCAA is about as bad as it gets outside of Washington DC.

+4 HS
TheBadOwl's picture

Our program is in a better place now.

The Tat5 are all gone.

Tressel is enjoying life in academia.

The public now agrees that the tatgate rules were stupid anyways.

Personally, I'm over Tatgate. I don't really care if other schools get away with stuff. It's in the past, and we have Urban now.

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

+3 HS
Hovenaut's picture

Amen.

The universe tends to unfold as it should.

I cannot wait for this season.

buckeyedude's picture

Obviously, Ohio State and the B1G are held to a higher standard then the rest of CFB and especially the SEC. I understand you're "over it" Bad Owl, and so am I. But the NCAA applied a different standard to OSU and that game(Sugar Bowl) should count in the record books, IMHO. They, the NCAA, should right this wrong. Gene Smith should be making some noise on this matter. 

 

 

-1 HS
TheBadOwl's picture

We all saw Ohio State beat Arkansas. Anyone who pulls the whole "Oh that game never happened" card will get laughed out of the room, even by other fanbases.

And you know what? If the B1G is truly held to a higher standard than the SEC, so be it. I'd rather be held to a high standard and win with integrity anyways. Not that the B1G doesn't have corruption, either.

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

+2 HS
D-Day0043's picture

I think the media just wanted to tear down a guy with a wholesome image to the point it became a witch hunt. Tress was under enormous pressure to win from the criticism of getting blown out in two championship games. He was just trying to protect his kids, and I don't know if I wouldn't have done the same thing myself.

 My biggest problem with all of it was that the kids and coaches that didn't have any part in it had to pay the penalty. 

I am D-Day0043 and I approve this message.

+2 HS
Buckeye Knight's picture

"My biggest problem with all of it was that the kids and coaches that didn't have any part in it had to pay the penalty."

 

NCAA-style justice.

+1 HS
BukFan's picture

Some players were paid for hours they never worked.   They did something wrong!  Right?

-4 HS
D-Day0043's picture

Ohio State players trade personal possessions for tattoos and E$PN says they are the scum of the earth. An $EC player takes money to come play for a school or sells their autograph for money, E$PN says players should get paid. Hypocrisy....

I am D-Day0043 and I approve this message.

RocknRollover's picture

To hell with it!  Let's just shove it in the face of the NCAA, ESPN, and all the naysayers and hire Tressel back when Urban calls it quits. lol

+2 HS
PoKeY21's picture

I was always under the assumption that Tres had to make the choice between impedeing an NCAA investigation or impedeing a federal prosecution. When he was told about the federal case I thought he was told in confidence and not to tell anyone or risk being indicted himself. Then the NCAA came around after that and said we need to know everything you knew and when. That put Tres into a position where he either had to side with the NCAA or with the Feds. 

When my time on earth is gone, and my activities here are passed, I want they bury me upside down, and my critics can kiss my ass - Robert Knight

+1 HS
BlueBayou's picture

The first time he was asked to keep it a secret was two weeks after he was first told about it.  Nothing is ever mentioned about him being indicted personally, it seems like the request was made because the lawyer was violating attorney-client confidentiality by telling Tres.  The lawyer was later disbarred after the scandal broke and his role was revealed. 

PoKeY21's picture

Ya Tres got stuck with a random email and not knowing if it was true or not to two weeks later being thrown all the info at once and not knowing how to handle it. If siding with the lawyers over the ncaa was his biggest crime then so be it, a 5 year show cause is ridiculous punishment for it. Tres could have just thought that because it was a federal case it had no baring on the NCAA so he kept quiet the entire time. It might not have been until after all of the player suspensions that it set in he too commuted a violation. Either or if he didn't know or if he knew exactly what he was doing a 5 year death sentence from coaching was extreme.

When my time on earth is gone, and my activities here are passed, I want they bury me upside down, and my critics can kiss my ass - Robert Knight

Poison nuts's picture

On another note, I believe Raekwon earns Freshman of the Year awards. Please get here soon football!

"Do not pass me, just slow down - I can move right through you" Superchunk - Precision Auto.

Shangheyed's picture

I could care less what anyone says about JT or Woody... I have my own opinions about the two men.... AND I AM RIGHT.

+1 HS
nickel beer's picture

I cannot even remember the timeline for all of that tatgate stuff.  I think, one half of the problem was JT covering for TP at the expense of everyone else and the other half was JT lying to his employer, but now I don't even remember the dm order of things or the things themselves.  And I'm not sure I care to.  Glad he's doing what he's doing.  YSU has it right.  The ncaa is a joke.

The top five teams in our conference can play anywhere.