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Krenzel was a terrible qb

BlockO's picture
June 5, 2014 at 9:26pm
163 Comments

Watching the 2002 game against michigan on BTN and I cannot believe that team won a national title. The defense, jenkins, and clarett were great but the passing game sucked. Wondering if tp or braxton would have won a title with that team. I think so! Any thoughts?

kareemabduljacobb's picture

Krenzel, although not flashy was a great QB.  Sure he didn't put up big time stats, but he got W's and was a great game manager...and was clutch when we needed him to be.

+34 HS
rosycheeks's picture

Get out of here. No, seriously, get out of here.

+52 HS
Buckeye80's picture

Seriously?  Only 7 helmet stickers for this?  Maybe only 7 of us know what it is........

Well played sir, well played.

 

+4 HS
MordenoftheSith's picture

Yep, I will freely admit that I have no clue what that is.  Please explain so I can join in the fun.

If you only knew the POWER of the Dark Side.

+6 HS
gumtape's picture

Don't feed the trolls.

just another psycho, irrational, delusional Ohio St fan

+9 HS
sb97's picture

Krezel was also the MVP in our last national title win.  Just sayin....

+30 HS
Baroclinicity's picture

Stop.  It. 

He was a leader.  That was enough.

When you're holding a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

+15 HS
BlockO's picture

I know I may get downvoted but I don't see how he is great. He was a good game manager I'll give you that, but he could not throw. I know someone is going to bring up "holy buckeye" but the truth be told the passing game sucked so bad that the defense was not expecting it. However, I will give you that it was a great play. His passes were almost as bad as bauserman.

"faith seeking understanding” (fides quaerens intellectum)

-10 HS
Chief B1G Dump's picture

The guy went 14-0 and won a national title for the team you are allegedly a fan of...12 years ago. What else would you like him to do for you?

This may be the most terrible thread I have ever seen on this site. 

+32 HS
CGroverL's picture

He was NOT the greatest passer....but he was the best leader there could be and he always new where the first down marker was if he had to tuck it and run...which means that he made great decisions on top of being the one man in the huddle that everyone trusted...even if he was from Michigan. Speaking of tucking it and running the ball....the Buckeyes' leading rusher in the title game was NOT Maurice Clarett. Ohio State's leading rusher was Craig Krenzel. The guy made the right decisions, led the team, and became the leading rusher if that's it what it took to win the game. Playing quarterback, contrary to popular belief, is not necessarily about throwing perfect 20 yard out patterns...it's about winning games. If it was all about being the greatest passer, Terry Bradshaw would not be listed as a great quarterback. He was great at winning games and even better at winning big games. WIN THE GAME...THAT IS WHAT PLAYING QUARTERBACK IS ALL ABOUT!!!!! Craig Krenzel won the biggest game of his career against a team that has been called "college football's greatest team in history" along with leading his Buckeyes to being the first team EVER with a 14-0 record.

Krenzel was and still is the man. Thanks to Craig Krenzel for being a great and clutch quarterback for our Buckeyes along with being a great student carrying an INCREDIBLE class load as well. You are what we wish EVERY BUCKEYE was like.

Sorry to put everyone on the spot but please try to give Craig Krenzel some love by following me with a Big "O-H-I-O"

O-H.....

"I hope they're last in everything"

Thanks, Urb!

+2 HS
CC's picture

He is great because he took a team that went 7-5 to 14-0 and beat Michigan and Miami, both of whom seemed unbeatable in those years.

I have a feeling you are not old enough to remember those games first hand.

+21 HS
allinosu's picture

I ran into that on another thread.

+1 HS
Crumb's picture

No Buckeye QB ever had passes anywhere near as bad as Bauserbomb, not even Bellisari, the fact that you mention him in the same breath as Krenzel shows how little you know.

"The only good thing about it is winning the d*** thing" - Urban Meyer on The Game The War

+27 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Nuff said - Joe Joe Joe Joe.........

 

+14 HS
chemicalwaste's picture

I love this every time I see it, but that chart has more attempts than he had in that game.

+1 HS
NH-IO's picture

It includes his warm-up throws.

+6 HS
chemicalwaste's picture

He should have been better with that much practice.

+1 HS
CGroverL's picture

AWESOME CHART!!!! Too funny!

"I hope they're last in everything"

Thanks, Urb!

1967Buck's picture

Did you bump your head or something? BlockO, he won it all and gave us so much joy. He lead the team to the promise land!! Holy Buckeye!! Enough!!

+4 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Funny how you said he was a good game manager yet your headline you said he was a terrible QB - Which one was he           a terrible QB or a good game manager b/c you can not have both???????????????????

+11 HS
luckynutz's picture

Keep in mind tress sent in a play to get the tight end deep enough to get the first down. Krenzel made the choice to take the home run shot to jenkins on holy buckeye. That season rested on that decision...one he made on his own. How many other qbs have the stones to make that choice? Try to get the 3 yards and a fresh set of downs...or wing it and go for it all knowing if it falls incomplete its all over?

His arm may not have been the strongest. His stats might not stack up with former greats. And he may not have been the kind of athlete we have been accustomed to recently. But the dude had an uncanny ability to make the right throw. At the right time. To the right guy. And also wasnt afraid to pull it down and do it himself. When a play was needed, he made sure it was made. Whether it be an 8 yard scramble on 3 and 7. Or changing a play at the line in an all or nothing situation...krenzel did it. And thats what matters most. Krenzel also had a winning record against TSUN. And made it possiblenfot his team to take down rhe juggernaut that was the Shapiro payrolled Miami Hurricanes in glendale. Sometimes it doesnt take big numbers to be remembered fondly and loved. All it takes is the stones to get it done any way possible. Which is what he did. Cant believe this is even a discussion.

+8 HS
buckeyedude's picture

I for one am glad that Tressel pulled Krenzel out of the horrible state up north. Not knocking Braxton, but if he were in that situation, I think he's running it. Maybe he makes it, maybe he doesn't.

 

 

+1 HS
luckynutz's picture

Thats just it...of the qbs we have seen since, im convinced only 1 other would make that throw. And thats troy smith. Boeckman wouldnt. Pryor wouldnt. And neither would braxton. Krenzel was a blue collar qb. Tough, gutsy and not afraid of what ifs. I wouldnt call him a game manager...he was a gamer. Never saw a situation he wasnt ready for. And when your qb shows that kind of resolve, everyone falla in line. That is what krenzel had...the belief that no odds were too great to overcome.

daveyt11's picture

It was actually Cooper that recruited him and signed him, ironically a columnist here in cleveland joked that maybe he will change the luck against UM seein that he was from there and all, and he did and it still is working.

+2 HS
buckeyedude's picture

I thought it was Cooper. Thanks for the correction, Davey. Either way, Krenzel is a GREAT BUCKEYE, IMHO.

 

 

+1 HS
CALPOPPY's picture

First, you stated he was a terrible QB. That's different than "not great".

Second, he actually played in the NFL. He wasn't Bauserman bad. Bauserman had a more lively arm but it was also...lively.

I'm a hurtin' buckaroo.

+5 HS
CC's picture

I've seen thousands of posts at 11w, this is the dumbest including the avatar change post.

+13 HS
buckeyedude's picture

you better take that back(the avatar change)....

 

 

+5 HS
osu407's picture

Football has changed drastically since 2002. I'll leave it at that. 

+3 HS
toad1204's picture

And that's about all I have to say about that.

Nothing like dancing on the field in 02... 

+34 HS
cjmgobucks's picture

I screamed at the TV in incredulous disbelief as he stepped up in the pocket and went for it all on 4th down...  What was he thinking??!!  He wasn't.  He was just oozing confidence and knew what it took to win...  I would take Craig Krenzel as my starting QB any day.... He is one...Holy Buckeye....!!

"When I look in the mirror, I want to take a swing at me."

Wayne Woodrow Hayes

+9 HS
Buckeyeneer's picture

I was in the car and listening to it on the radio and I damn near drove off the road do to the celebration that went on in my car.

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

+2 HS
Hovenaut's picture

I nearly spilt my beer.

Then I cried.

Would've been inconsolable had I lost that beer...

+2 HS
jamesrbrown322's picture

 12 Years later, and it's still a thing of beauty!

 

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

+5 HS
cplunk's picture

I say this everytime I see Holy Buckeye- Lydell Ross never had the career many folks hoped he would, but he saved our National title season. If he doesn't pick up the rusher who beats the left guard, Krenzel is sacked and there is no Holy Buckeye and no National Title.

 

+7 HS
BuckeyeNationforLife's picture

He got it done, and for that he is great.

+8 HS
BlockO's picture

I'm really not trolling I promise....I just don't see what everyone else sees. I am grateful for the natty but I honestly think that with jenkins, gamble and the other players they had on offense it should have been more efficient.

"faith seeking understanding” (fides quaerens intellectum)

-10 HS
MacG91's picture

Go watch the 2004 Fiesta Bowl game vs. Kansas state and tell me he can't throw.. he lit it up in that game. 

Mac..yeah

+19 HS
Seattle Linga's picture
+6 HS
LABuckeye's picture

I watched every single game that season. I could be wrong, but I seem to recall thinking at the time that Tressel's conservatism was the reason our passing offense sucked so badly, and the reason we came back so many times was that he was forced to open the playbook in our many close games and allow the skill players to do their thing. Regardless, he was a primary architect of what is probably my happiest night as a Buckeye fan.

+15 HS
edr4225's picture

 

lets go bucks!!

+8 HS
jaxbuckeye's picture

No disrespect, and everyone is entitled to their opinion, but anyone that doesn't think Krenzel was a good QB leads me to question their knowledge of the game or if they ever played. The skill positions are the ones you look for gaudy stats from. QB is about being a leader and managing the team.   You can find successful QBs that don't have great stats but you will never find one that isn't a great leader. 

+5 HS
1967Buck's picture

Well spoken Jax. Well spoken indeed, Peace.

+3 HS
buckskin's picture

I saw the title of this post and thought I was on Mgo for a second. I cannot fathom any buckeye fan calling Krenzel terrible. Football is about way more than statistics.

+8 HS
buckeyedude's picture

I agree Buckskin. The title of this article alone almost ruins my Happy Friday.

 

 

buckskin's picture

Come on Bassdropper, stop posting topics using the name BlockO.

+18 HS
buckskin's picture

Great Shawshank gif. Double bonus because of the Mansfield prison connection.

+5 HS
buckskin's picture

BlockO actually scored lower than Billy Madison with this comment.

+10 HS
blocko330's picture

Think I need to change my name to avoid any confusion!

“Things may come to those who wait, but only the things left by those who hustle.”

- TruthTeller

+9 HS
Iwearmocs's picture

Krenzel was the perfect tresselball QB.  Smart, Limited mistakes, made plays when he needed too, was just athletic enough to get the job done.  That gameplan against Miami was fantastic; and it was possible b/c he could run well enough to catch their defense off guard.  I'd take Troy Smith over him, but not TP, and I won't compare Braxton to him b/c the offenses are so different.

+11 HS
Hovenaut's picture

Krenzel was the right guy, at the right time, for the right team.

And he has a ring to prove it.

+30 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Mega +1's for you HOV

+3 HS
BrewstersMillions's picture

I don't think anyone will put Craig Krenzel in the pantheon of Ohio State Quarterbacks and this pains me to say because I'm not this kind of guy when it comes to civilian type statistics but Krenzel seemed to always find a way to do something that helped his team win. I'm reminded of the bootleg in Madison, Holy Buckeye, taking vicious hit after vicious hit against Miami while finding a way to gain a few yards (and making a handful of really big time throws). Bad QB in comparison to guys who put up with great numbers? Fine. Guy who seemed to make a play when needed-more so than most.

I don't like the fact that his championship ring should separate him from other OSU signal callers because football is a team sport in the purest sense of the word so a guy who has a title isn't necessarily better than one who doesn't. I don't ever think I thought "If OSU needs a throw, Craig WILL make it" the way I felt about Troy or thought "third and long, no problem" the way I did with Pryor but it sure seemed that more often times than not, Craig found a way to make something happen-sometimes in dire situations.

As for the original poster commenting about Clarret and the defense-congratulations on pointing out how a historically good defense and world class running back were great. It isn't Krenzel's fault those assets were at his disposal.

Do I come off as arrogant? Shame on me, I was hoping it would more obvious.

+11 HS
Furious George 27's picture

I'd say he's a great leader, excellent game manager which for them being a power run team with a great defense is all you needed. The role that he played made him a great QB, but physically he has said it himself he is not that great. That was all around the most talented team OSU had in a long time. I think the missed opportunities we have had since has been because we have not have had as good of a D since 2002. 

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

+4 HS
Buckeye Knight's picture

That 2002 D was sick. Watch that NCG and those boys were FLYING around.

+1 HS
Deadly Nuts's picture

Two words.... Holy Buckeye.

TP and Braxton would've ran.

LEBRON

+4 HS
BrewstersMillions's picture

Well in fairness, they probably would have gotten the first on a broken play.

Do I come off as arrogant? Shame on me, I was hoping it would more obvious.

+5 HS
HolyBuckeye1093's picture

What about 4th and 14?

+2 HS
MacG91's picture

I love Troy Smith but he put up all the great numbers, won a Heisman but couldn't achieve the ultimate goal. Krenzel may have not been flashy but he did what he had to, to get the job done. I would take Krenzel every day of the week as my quarterback, smartest quarterback to every wear the scarlet and grey. 

Mac..yeah

+1 HS
hit_the_couch's picture

Troy Smith wasn't the team. Plus, they were lucky to get there with something like 9 new starters on D, a horrible game vs Illinois and a damn near slip up vs scUM. The '05 team, minus a couple coaching mistakes, likely had a better shot than the '06.

And then I told her...i'm no weatherman, but tonight's forecast is calling for several inches!

-1 HS
Son of Sevenless's picture

And Krenzel had other clutch throws besides Holy Buckeye. I recall a 4th and 14 completion in overtime of the NCG that saved the season. Can't make a bigger throw than that. He also was successful running the ball in that game, seemed to surprise the Canes.

+4 HS
irishfury's picture

Krenzel brought me my fav season I have witnessed as an OSU fan and for that he is great.  

+4 HS
WhySoSerious's picture

What a joke.. 

Rare&Uncommon

Like the ball in the stands, we balls out

+3 HS
AndyVance's picture

And here's another thing: I absolutely detest the term "game manager" the way it is used today, because it is used basically the same way someone says "bless your heart" when they've just said you had an ugly haircut or a really stupid idea. Guess what: the quarterback is supposed to manage the friggin' game! He's supposed to make the reads, make the right call, and put the ball where it needs to go. Payton Manning? Game manager. Tom Brady? Game manager. Don't give me this crap that someone isn't a great quarterback because they're "just a game manager."

+14 HS
BrewstersMillions's picture

Its like talking about intangibles. Its something you don't understand or can't prove\disprove so it becomes your reason for why someone is good or bad.

Do I come off as arrogant? Shame on me, I was hoping it would more obvious.

+2 HS
gumtape's picture

The other thing that I dont't like when talking about quarterbacks is "it" factor. Merrill hoge just about had a stroke on the air when a radio host said he liked manziel because he had a lot of it.

just another psycho, irrational, delusional Ohio St fan

+1 HS
Gametime's picture

Andy V, I agree with your take on a "game manager" being an important aspect of being a great QB, but I think you said it yourself with that last bit: Craig Krenzel WAS "just a game manager".

Managing the game, whether that's check downs, line of scrimmage audibles, and making the right/clutch play, Krenzel was excellent at that. Notice how when watching old games they would always talk about how "heady" he was, or how "great of a leader." Now I know normally those are cookie cutter commentaries for "white QBs" but in Craig's case it was true - the guy had the toughness, the will, the leadership, & the game manager skills to be a successful QB, but he was by no means a great or even good QB.

Tom Brady & Peyton Manning are some of the best game managers in the history of professional football, but they also had the arm talent & accuracy to be great/elite QBs also. Krenzel for all he excelled at, didn't have that.

...I too dream in color and in rhyme
So I guess I'm one of a kind in a full house
Cause whenever I open my heart, my soul or my mouth
A touch of God rains out...

+2 HS
AndyVance's picture

Fair point, GameTime, but where we usually hear the "game manager" epithet thrown around is in describing a more prototypical pro-style QB in the college ranks, contrasting them with an "it factor" QB like Johnny "Money Badger" Manziel or Braxton Miller. Those guys are phenomenal athletes who get themselves out of trouble with raw athletic talent.

Yes, Brady and Manning are special kinds of talents, but if Manning wasn't the smartest guy in the game, would his great arm alone mark him as one of the greatest quarterbacks in the history of the game? I contend that it's his "game management" and leadership mentality that put him in that upper echelon, not just his physical gifts. (Contrast that with Terrelle Pryor, who has unbridled physical talent, but is no Peyton Manning when it comes to football intelligence as further illustration of my point.)

+2 HS
Gametime's picture

I can't disagree with that either. Guys like Peyton, Tom, & Drew it's their preparation that takes them to the next level. The way these guys watch film and break down teams enables them to dominate from a game plan standpoint. 

...I too dream in color and in rhyme
So I guess I'm one of a kind in a full house
Cause whenever I open my heart, my soul or my mouth
A touch of God rains out...

+2 HS
buckeyedude's picture

This is why I have high hopes for a kid like Stephen Collier, Andy. Many people don't seem to be real high on him, but he has a good head on his shoulders(like Krenzel), seems pretty smart(like Krenzel), and has pretty good size(like Krenzel-who(m) I met in person, and let me tell you, he is a BIG BOY). Everybody wants the Terrelle Pryors or the Torrance Gibson's on their team, but sometimes it's better to have a QB that is smart and can sling the ball a bit, rather than a conceited young man with freakish potential. (I'm not going to apologize for that last comment)

I'm happy with the QBs that we have(Barrett/Jones/Collier) and the recruits we have lined up(Clark and Burrow). I won't lose an ounce of sleep if we don't land Gibson, which in my opinion, don't think we're going to get anyway. Personally, I think before all is said in done, Danny Clark is going to be a 5* before he graduates from HS.

 

 

+4 HS
cplunk's picture

I'm with you- I have a good feeling about Stephen Collier. 

+1 HS
ShowThemOhiosHere's picture

Craig Krenzel wasn't a guy that was going to go out and throw for 300+ yards and 4+ TDs every week.  With that defense and running game in 2002, he didn't have to be that guy.  He basically had to be efficient, not make the big mistake, and make a few throws at times when they were needed.  And that's what Craig did...always came up with a play when it was needed.  His role as our QB was basically "don't lose us the game".  And he didn't...his play won us the game 95% of the time, even if it wasn't always pretty.  He may not have had the throwing talents of Troy Smith, or the running ability of Terrelle Pryor, or the excitement of Braxton Miller, but he did one thing that two of those guys never did, and the third guy only has one more season to do - and that's win a national championship.  You can point to great defense and Maurice Clarett, but replace Krenzel with anyone else on the roster at QB, and OSU probably goes 10-3.

Class of 2010.

-1 HS
Gametime's picture

I respect Krenzel, but I can't say replace him with anyone else and they go 10-3...I think '10 Pyror or 06' Smith could've won a national title with that 02' Defense & Mo C in the run game. 

...I too dream in color and in rhyme
So I guess I'm one of a kind in a full house
Cause whenever I open my heart, my soul or my mouth
A touch of God rains out...

+3 HS
Buckeyeneer's picture

This thread made a Dumb and Dumber quote pop into my head:

http://www.hark.com/clips/cqpjccxfxj-mouth-shut

"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes

THE Ohio State University

+3 HS
aliosu1122's picture

This post is really ridiculous. First, running the ball and great defense were the ways to win a NC 10-12 years ago. Like the NFL, the  "light it up offense" is really more or a recent phenomenon. Tress probably held the passing game back to some extent, but Craig & Co always came through. Always. He may not have been flashy, but he was consiatent , accurate and clutch. I will take those traits in a QB any day of the week. And, the 2002-03 Buckeyes wouldn't have rings without him. 

+6 HS
Silver Bullet 10's picture

Good QB 

Mediocre passer

Incredible Buckeye and football player

+3 HS
bodast67's picture

I think anyone who saw the N/C game recognized that Krenzel was not on his passing game that night (7-21 122 yards-2 int.). It didn't help that his receivers were not getting open or dropping passes. You must also recognize that Miami's Defense will go down as one of the best ever that season with such names as Vilma, Antrel Rolle, Sean Taylor (RIP) Vince Wilfork and others...

Having said that, he was the leading rusher from both teams with 81 yards on 19 attempts and 2 td's, averaging 4.3 yards per carry. Clarrett only had 47 yards with a 2.0 YPC average. Krenzel was the MVP at the Fiesta Bowl 2 years in a row.  His QB rating for that season was 140.9 which is nothing to sneeze at.

The point is, he did it on the ground when the passing game shut down, and made the clutch throw at the end when we needed it. 

 

 

 

     " I hope when I die, I die laughing"...                

+5 HS
sivaDavis's picture

 

"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes

+15 HS
Go1Bucks's picture

Krenzel IS a Buckeye who won a National title.

'Nuff said.

Go Bucks!

+4 HS
NoVA Buckeye's picture

He was good enough.

I'll leave it at that.

The offseason begins when your season ends. Even then there are no days off.

+3 HS
NYCBuckeye's picture

Krenzel was the perfect QB for that system - did not make mistakes, made plays when it mattered (4th and 14 vs Miami, Holy Buckeye, etc) and was an integral part of an unforgettable team.

With that said, under Krenzel, the offenses were anemic (put down your pitchforks - Krenzel was a great representation of OSU football and embodied everything Tresselball could be when executed correctly). This could be due to conservative play calling, or simply the coaches acknowledging the limits of Krenzel's abilities, or having a defense that alleviated the pressure on the offense to be overly aggressive.

Interestingly, Braxton gets a terribly unfair shake from a sizable portion of the fan base who clamor for a "pass first, run 2nd QB." All the while, he's been the best player on two of the best offenses, statistically speaking, in OSU's history (not to mention the 2 B1G POY awards...). That Braxton has 1 (ONE!) game in his career with multiple INTs (2), and also has a knack for making huge plays makes one wonder the possibilities of putting that 02 defense (or most of the Tressel-era defenses, for that matter) with last year's team (Sigh). 

+2 HS
yrro's picture

Krenzel was hamstrung pretty badly by the lack of a competent running back in the '03 season.

You watch the Tressel offenses, and when we had an upper-classman quarterback and a competent running back, they were solid. They weren't going to light things up, but they moved the ball, protected the ball, and scored a very reasonable number of points.

It really seems to be like the difference between the competent coaches and the great ones are whether their years with inexperienced players are bad or mediocre. Under Tress, defense was plug and play but offense required juniors and seniors. So far Meyer is having the opposite situation.

ScarletGrayFire's picture

Interesting SI article about Krenzel here:  http://sportsillustrated.ca/vault/article/magazine/MAG1029307/2/index.htm

"[His high school coach] took [Krenzel's 4-minute highlight] video to Central Michigan assistant Tom Kearly, who watched one minute and told Copacia, "Coach, he can play for us right now and play four years." Satisfied, Copacia sent the tape to 30 colleges and gave a copy to Brian Krenzel, who showed it to Duke assistant and former NFL guard Joe DeLamielleure. "He was one of the best high school players I'd ever seen," DeLamielleure says. "He was hitting players in the chest, and they were dropping everything. I remember saying, 'He'll go to Texas or Colorado or Michigan or somewhere like that.' " Quoted from the above-linked article.

I always thought the above quote was interesting, and suggests that the offensive scheme in those early Tressel years limited Krenzel's development as a passer.  But when the money was on the table - nuff said.

+1 HS
yrro's picture

I think Krenzel has said on the radio that Tressel's QB coaching could make him second-guess himself a little too much, worrying about interceptions. Wonder how much that worry went away on when it was an all or nothing situation.

cdub4's picture

Krenzel was not terrible or great. He was above average. People throw around the words great and terrible way too much. I do think I have seen other OSU quarterbacks in my lifetime who could have led that team to a NC.

+6 HS
bigtenspeed's picture

Krenzel started the 2001 win over scUM which was the start of much better times. Beating them again in 02 was so important because (in my life) previously we'd lost everytime we had a NC chance on the line. Anyone who remembers the 90's will always appreciate that!

In 02, I remember noticing how he never seemed to panic and came throuh late in some close games. Remember his winning td against UC, the first down against Illinois, holy buckeye, 4th and 14 conversion to Jenkins in the Fiesta Bowl?

+2 HS
allinosu's picture

When a play had to be made the entire year Krenzel did it. I have not seen Braxton do that as of yet. Apples and oranges on this one. Krenzel was the right fit for that team and most important tough enough. We don't know if some of those hits Krenzel took would have sidelined Braxton.

Furious George 27's picture

Miller did it against Wisky and lead his team to a comeback against Purdue his freshman year before losing in OT because of a missed XP. Miller has done it, that 6-7 season was so bad you tend to rather forget about it all together. I guess we should look at it this way, what would this 2002 team look like had Smith, Miller and even TP were the QBs? The D was nasty and perhaps there wouldn't have been so many close games with the athletic ability those QBs possessed that forced defenses to respect it.

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

+3 HS
allinosu's picture

In those years we focused on defense with little risk on offense. It's was reversed the last two years and that's why I said apples and oranges. Krensel did a lot of damage when the pocket broke down and he was on the run. When he absolutely needed a throw he did it and we won it all. When Krenzel needed a yard he got it. If I were a betting man I'd be all in krenzel getting that yard against MSU. My guess is with those other QB's we would have won some games more handily but each would have dropped one.

-1 HS
Furious George 27's picture

Your offense is dictated on what you can do based on the players around you. I don't believe that OSU was holding back on offense because they were all in on D. I think they held back because they didn't have a gun slinger QB or a great running QB, but they did have a smart QB and one that would keep you in position to win. You cannot really  say that Smith, Miller or TP would lose a game because they never played on teams with such a great D. All of those players produced more offensively and had equally as good if not better rushing attack when they played.

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

-1 HS
allinosu's picture

We are talking about tressels second year when punting was a good option. This team had his finger prints all over it and yes I can say they would've dropped one because that's what real history has shown and not the ify world you live in. By the way Smith and TP had very good defenses behind them. They all had better offensive players around them. Miami had just as good as defense as we had in the championship game. We were completely outmatched by their defense but Krenzel made play after play to win a championship. Where are their rings. For your info Krenzel was a very good running QB and that running gave us a NC.

BlockO's picture

I don't know.... on the documentary of the 2002 season, even Krenzel himself said that Gamble could have been a monster on Offense if utilized better. We also had Jenkins and good tight ends. I believe that the Buckeyes had more talent on Offense the we give them credit for. It was very much under utilized group of players. Btw...my point is not that Krenzel sucks but to say he has been very overrated. I used sucks as an effect. I appreciate all he did for the bucks that season but realize that other qb would have put up some very good numbers with what the had that year. Tp, Troy, braxton, boekman (spelling?) Hoying, germaine, and schlitzer probable would have won it all. Js

"faith seeking understanding” (fides quaerens intellectum)

-2 HS
Hovenaut's picture

Not to pile on, but you stated he was terrible, not overrated.

I don't think any sensible Ohio State, or football fan altogether, had Krenzel "overrated".

It is worth mentioning he was drafted to the NFL ('04, 5th round, da Bears)...so he wasn't that terrible.

+2 HS
Furious George 27's picture

I get what you are saying in that his numbers were not great in the grand scheme of things as in, its kind of surprising that a NCG QB only had 2K passing with 14TDs and 7Ints in 13 games. He was a smart QB, was not going to put you in position to lose. Too many people want to say that there is no way anyone else could have done what he did, but what he did was not spectacular by any means save for some crucial plays. I do not think you are wrong in saying that if we had a D like in 2002 and with Mlller, Smith etc that they too could have won. That D is what made it possible to do what they did there were a lot of games where OSU did not hit 20 points. We would be shining a crystal trophy if we had that last season

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

allinosu's picture

Each of the QB you named laid an egg along the way. Now you want to put them on that team that went undefeated. To what end? Krenzel made the plays that needed to be made. I'll take that over better stats with an L in other column like the others. I remember each of those QB having better talent around them on offense. Krenzel gave his all every game especially against a more talented Miami and for that effort we can brag about a national championship.

+1 HS
Furious George 27's picture

What the hell are you talking about? The fact is that OSU has not had a D as good as the 2002 team, something that both Smith and TP never had. So no, you cannot say for a fact they would have lost a game with that D, because Krenzel lost several games w/out it the next season.  BTW Krenzel was not a good running QB, he had a great game but overall he was not a good running QB. Had he been such a great running QB he wouldn't have rushed for under 300 in 14 games. You seem to want to make people better than what they are based on 1 game and not on a whole body of work. He was an excellent game manager and a leader who made plays but was not asked to throw it or run it all over the field because he simply was not that player. Even he says that his physical ability was not great. I am sorry that you want to put blinders on and make believe that he was the greatest OSU QB to live, but he wasn't. He just has achieved more than better QBs have at OSU. The NCG game was a total team effort and the reason why TP and Smith do not have rings is because the entire team did not come out to play, although you would rather lay the blame on one person right.

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

allinosu's picture

tWhat world did you grow up in. SI had an article with a picture of him running down the field commenting on his ability.(Winning ugly). He picked up numerous first downs escaping the pocket. I NEVER SAID HE WAS OUR BEST QB. I said he got the job done and made the plays that needed to be made for us to go undefeated. The win over Cinn is a good example of sure determination and winning with his legs If he was so bad why did he end up in the NFL and most of the others did not. I guess the defense with AJ hawk, bobby carpender, Malcolm Jenkins, James Laurinaitis, Cameron Haywood were not good. 11 of TP's teammates ended up in the NFL so it's crap about not having good players around them. I watched TP do wonderful things but also not so wonderful as for us to go undefeated. Krenzel's whole body of work was he got the job done for 14 games and he has the ring to prove it.

Furious George 27's picture

Great job at naming NFL players that people played with.... But that does not change the fact that those players did not produce a defense as good as the 2002 defense, lets also remember who that DC was was before you start trying to claim that all these defenses were the same or just as good. And I just proved that w/out that same D the next season Krenzel dropped some games. Trust me I appreciate all that Krenzel has done and he was a smart player and his running ability was based on knowing when and when not to run. My issue with you is that you act as if no other QB could have won a title with that D. For all those late game heroics you speak of you seem to fail to realize that had OSU had a very predictable and enimic offense when the run game was shut down that they did not put teams away. Call me crazy the QB is the leader of the offense and they didn't play top 10 Defenses all year so its fair to say that besides some late drives he wasn't leading that offense up and down the field all game. To which my point was had a QB such as TP, Miller or Smith had been QB that season with that D I think its fair to say they could have done more where we didn't need as much late game heroics. Krenzel was clutch but his stats prove that the offense was very limited. The 3 QBs I mentioned accounted for much more offensive production you plug those #'s in with with that 2002 D and you try and tell me how they wouldn't win a title. Because so far you have said what they haven't done with other teams and have not contemplated what they could do on the 2002 team.

Yeah, well…that’s just like, your opinion, man.

allinosu's picture

The things you think you proved is all in your head. Their is no way you know TP or Braxton wouldn't have lost those games. The 2002 defense was not as unbeatable as you claim. Michigan controlled them most of the game. We had a hard time getting the ball back. The main problem with the offense was Clarett being hurt. The other running backs were constantly missing the holes. Just because he had no 300 games like now the way offense is run today does not mean wasn't a good runner. The other QB's did not go undefeated and trying to put them on other teams and saying IF ONLY is plain sad.TP needed to worry about his own Wisky game when we were #1 instead of trying to fix Krenzel's and Troy almost blew Illinois who you write off as nothing. You know the two QB"S didn't exactly play top ten defense either on a weekly basis. The issue I have with you is you play IFy as though it is fact. I give you facts and you are still with the BS. Let us get the facts straight the article said he was a terrible QB not that great of a passer and you were defending that issue.

BuckWylde's picture

Krenzel was a man of destiny, on a team of destiny. My first reaction to this post was that "Block O" should be renamed Block Head, but as I read the comments of my fellow Buck-a-holics it became increasingly clear that Block is simply a victim of E-SPIN's hyper-analytic, Sports Science reasoning. IMO Krenzel's greatness is similar to Aaron Craft's greatness on the hardwood; both are game-smart and heart driven winners. Measurables don't begin to tell the story of why these guys prevail against bigger, faster, stronger opponents whose mechanics are picture perfect, . . . they just do. I'm just happy that a bus filled with future NFL stars had Craig Krenzel at the wheel as they drove through Wolverines, Boilermakers, and Hurricanes to get that crystal football for the Buckeye trophy case. 

 

  

BuckWylde

+1 HS
Bugsyk's picture

Scott McMullen, is that you?

+10 HS
sivaDavis's picture

Krenzel puts out his national champ ring for you to kiss before you can leave his presence. 

"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes

+3 HS
1MechEng's picture

I think the OP should have added some stats to pad his argument. For example Krenzel's NC campaign:

2002 - 14 games, 148/249 (59.4% completion), 2110 yds. passing, 12 TD's / 7 INT's, 150.7 yds/game avg., 8.5 yds/pass attempt., 140.9 QB rating

The stat line shows that he completed just less than 60% of his passes, had a 2:1 TD/INT ratio, and didn't pass much per game due to the strong running game.

For comparison, let's look at the "best" year from other prominent OSU QB's of the last 20 years who started for the whole season (this excludes Bauserman, etc.):

Braxton Miller (2013) -

12 games, 162/255 (63.5% completion), 2094 yds., 8.2 yds/pass attempt, 174.5 yds./game, 24 TD's / 7 INT's, 158.1 QB rating

As you can see, Miller had a better completion percentage, more yds./game, and a much better TD/INT ratio.

Joe Germaine (1998) -

12 games, 230/384 (59.9% completion), 3330 yds, 8.7 yds/attempt, 277.5 yds./game, 25 TD's / 7 INT's, 150.6 QB rating

Again, almost a 4:1 TD/INT ratio like Brax, and the yds/game and total yds. are far superior.

Kirk Herbstreit (1992) -

12 games, 155/264 (58.7% completion), 1904 yds., 158.7 yds./game, 7.2 yds./pass attempt, 4 TD's / 6 INT's, 119.7 QB rating

Herbie's stats aren't that good when you look at the numbers.

Terrelle Pryor (2010) -

13 games, 210/323 (65.0% completion), 2772 yds., 8.6 yds./pass attempt, 213.2 yds./game, 27 TD's / 11 INT's, 157.9 QB rating

TP was superior in every way, although he had a couple of more INT's than Germaine or Brax.

Troy Smith (2006) -

13 games, 203/311 (65.3% completion), 2542 yds., 8.2 yds./pass attempt, 195.5 yds./game, 30 TD's / 6 INT's,  161.9 QB rating

Troy's Heisman campaign featured a 5:1 TD/INT ratio and a 65%+ completion percentage.

So, based on the numbers of the above QB's, Krenzel was not bad, but clearly not in the same statistical echelon as TP, Troy, or Joe. What has been mentioned is what isn't in the stat lines - heart and determination, and performance under pressure. These commodities made Krenzel much more valuable than his mediocre stats.

 

 

 

 

+11 HS
LouBuck35's picture

Thanks for the statistics.  Although his numbers, as compared to other recent Buckeye QBs, aren't great - the OP stated he was a terrible quarterback.  Stats and more importantly, my eyeballs, tell me that isn't true.

I want a fall Saturday in Ohio Stadium..

+3 HS
AndyVance's picture

Lou has it right - CK's stat line may not have rivaled sensationally good quarterbacks such as Miller, Pryor or Smith, but the OP said he was "terrible," which is demonstrably false in almost every conceivable way. Then again, a thread titled "Craig Krenzel was the third- or fourth-best OSU quarterback of the past 15 years" probably wouldn't have generated much conversation...

+2 HS
buckguyfan1's picture

How I will always remember him...

 

+25 HS
toad1204's picture

My old roommate has him on his shoulders in that pic. 

Nothing like dancing on the field in 02... 

+4 HS
brglr14's picture

im guessing the guy who started this thread isn't in that crowd.

 

I dont know karate but i do know crazy and i'm not afraid to use it.
                           

+3 HS
gbdawg's picture

BLOCKO=BLOCKHEAD

Squirrel Master's picture

Lead the team in rushing yards when Miami made his offensive line look like swiss cheese.

peace out!

I saw a UFO once.......it told me to have a goodyear!

+4 HS
buckeyedude's picture

"yeah, well, ya know, that's just like, uh, your opinion, man."

 

 

+8 HS
IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

I think BlockO redefined the phrase "kicking the bees nest" with this little gem. Wow.

To the best of my memory, Krenzel was the greatest Buckeye leader I have ever seen. Watch the 2002 Illinois game. Still gives me goosebumps.

"Sherman ran an option play right through the south" - Greatest Civil War analogy EVER.

+2 HS
YTOWNBUCKI's picture

I wasn't going to comment on this but now I feel obligated.  To even say bringing up Holy Buckeye is not a legit argument is crazy.  That play will go down in Buckeye history as possibly the most important EVER.  Sorry players just don't make plays like that. 

With the running game being primary offense, Krenzel really only threw when they really had to.  Your 3rd and long situations, things like that.  I don't care who you are, no one throws at their normal percentage in those situations.  The guy started some games in NFL and actually did ok. 

+2 HS
Bugsyk's picture

In addition, Clarrett was injured for 3 games that year.  Krenzel lead the team despite Lydell "Diana" Ross and Creaky knee Mo Hall.

+1 HS
Oldschoolbuck's picture

Were you just trying to stir the pot, BlockO? I mean, you don't seriously believe what you wrote, do you? Yeah, Krenzel was never going to be confused for Dan Marino (or even Troy Smith), but c'mon, man! The guy was a winner - no ifs, ands or buts about it! I'm not really sure anyone that dons the S&G and starts under center is a "terrible" QB (including Joe Bauserbomb!)... Wow! Just wow!

+2 HS
Otown Buckeye's picture

4th and 14

"because we couldn't go for three"

+3 HS
blueinsconsin's picture

When he was on the Bears I asked him to sign my Michigan hat and he said, "Noway in hell will I sign that hat." and walked away...But then David Terrell didn't sign it either...

Not here to troll...Go Blue

+1 HS
buckeyedude's picture

See, man! Craig may have been born and raised in Sterling Heights, but he is ALL BUCKEYE! Thanks Bl*e! You just made me like him even more!

 

 

+1 HS
blueinsconsin's picture

When he was on the Bears I asked him to sign my Michigan hat and he said, "Noway in hell will I sign that hat." and walked away...But then David Terrell didn't sign it either...

Not here to troll...Go Blue

+2 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Where is BLOCK O to defend his logic or lack there of? - Please tell me because I will put out an APB if I need to:

 

+4 HS
buckeyedude's picture

He's the one guy downvoting everybody on this thread. LOL.

 

 

+2 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Sounds about right

+2 HS
ohiowhitesnake's picture

for a minute I thought I logged into Mgoblog.

+4 HS
Buckeyebrowny919's picture

Sometimes I wish you could still vote on forum topics...

To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice the gift - Steve Prefontaine

+4 HS
jamesrbrown322's picture

In the pantheon of OSU QBs, 24-2, two Fiesta Bowl wins and MVPs, almost 4,500 yards passing, 33 total TDs, 11-2 against top 25 teams, and National Championship (the FIRST EVER 14-0 season in D-IA!) in 2 years as a starter is actually pretty damn amazing!

 

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

+4 HS
AndyVance's picture

To quote Cousin Eddie, BINGO.

 

jamesrbrown322's picture

Speaking of terrible, look at that stable of RBs in 2003...

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

THEOSUfan's picture

Here's where Krenzel has my respect in spades: his brainy and humble personality belied how tough he was.  Just take a look at the hits he took against Miami.  4-5 times in that game I thought they had knocked him out.... not the game, but OUT!  He took hard hits almost every game, and according to Brandon Joe, he never came out of a game, let alone missed a game.

We've had some QB's since Craig (no names please) who have been more gifted, but who also might have been able to learn something about toughness from him.

 

 

brglr14's picture

im for free speech and all. but...................when the moderators of this wonderful site see a heading like this one there should be a chuckle followed by a ummmmmmm............................................no. bye bye.

I dont know karate but i do know crazy and i'm not afraid to use it.
                           

-1 HS
DoubleB's picture

Oh I dunno... while the premise is clearly waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off base the trip down 2002 memory lane has been awesome.

I was tired of trying to work my way around the back, so I just ran him over.
-Joey Bosa

allinosu's picture

Hell, let's not stop here, Rex Kern wasn't that great either. The hell with them being beloved Buckeyes with a national championship under their belt. Insane

+2 HS
TheShookster's picture

Krenzel was a terrible QB, says the guy who probably never played football in his life. 

MichaelJ721984's picture

Lay off the sauce bro.

Brutus' Left Nut's picture

Krenzel wasn't terrible.  Was he the best/most talented QB Tressell had?  No.  But he was reliable, clutch, coachable, durable and had no off the field issues.  He is similar to Trent Dilfer - not born with the best skills but won a championship by managing the game and letting the great talent around him takeover.  That's not as easy as it sounds.

Could Troy Smith have won a championship with that team?  Probably.  Could Terrell Pryor?  Possibly  The funny thing is, in terms of pure talent: Pryor > Smith > Krenzel...but that isn't all that matters.

Brutus' Left Nut's picture

Here' a different way to look at it - what odds would you need to bet on OSU to replay UMiami with the same players except Troy Smith instead of Krenzel?  TP?  Braxton?

No matter what QB you sub in, I think UMiami is still the heavy favorite.  Krenzel was part of an amazing effort to take down goliath.

+1 HS
cplunk's picture

Here is a list of every Buckeye QB that has led his team to a National Championship in the last fifty years:

Rex Kern

Craig Krenzel

You can evaluate all you want on accuracy, athletic prowess, arm strength, intangibles, shiftiness, leadership, and any other thing you pick. For me it is simple- Win. And that's pretty much how I'd sum up Krenzel if I had to describe him in one word. All he did was win. Ask Michigan. Ask arguably the greatest team in college football history, the Miami Hurricanes. 

If you are looking for the "best" QB in Ohio State history for my money it is Troy Smith. But if you're looking for who has been a "great" quarterback, great means championships. 

+2 HS
OSU_1992_UFM's picture

Staff question: How many downvotes are we allowed to give this fella? Put me down for -2110 (for every yard Krenzel threw for in 2002)

UFM_Renewal

-2 HS
GOOMBAY's picture

I know someone is going to bring up "holy buckeye" but

Um. Yes. Yes we will. And there's nothing that would follow "but" that would be persuasive.

He was a good game manager I'll give you that

Just need to replace "good" with "National Championship-winning" to tighten up that point.

+1 HS
BlockO's picture

The reality is that we should have not been limited to one fg for most of that game. I loved the heroics at the end but looking back that was just bad offense. How does purdue hold osu to 3 points for 4 quarters? Just saying

"faith seeking understanding” (fides quaerens intellectum)

+2 HS
allinosu's picture

How did purdue beat Brax so that Kenny G had to win it. How did Purdue hang with MSU at MSU clear to the end last year. Sometimes a bad team steps up. Just saying. F27 Thinks these teams are so bad with no chance as not show up.

Buckabroad's picture

With respect to all opinions, Krenzel had too many
clutch plays not to respect him: Holy Buckeye, the completion on 4th & 14 vs Miami just to name two.

"The minute we stop expecting greatness, we become Wisconsin."

jamesrbrown322's picture

Don't forget the clutch play vs. Wisconsin too and saving the day vs. Illinois and UC...

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

+1 HS
jamesrbrown322's picture

So, yeah, I had to...O-H

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

+1 HS
jamesrbrown322's picture

Wow, someone's not a fan of National Championships apparently...

"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill

741's picture

Did Krenzel cure cancer yet? (I keed.)

+1 HS
Buckeye Knight's picture

Interestingly enough, his tears do cure cancer, but he's too tough to cry.

+2 HS
Seattle Linga's picture

Kind of like Chuck Norris huh?

+3 HS
krodawg's picture

Scoreboard baby. It's the only stat that counts!

+1 HS
ohio gf's picture

Krenzel made clutch plays at crucial times....great leader, I really could not care less on his stats....he was a great leader and did what they asked him to do in big games.

+2 HS
CentralFloridaBuckeye's picture

This thread is just crazy.  No question he was a great player who got it done.  No, he wasn't the gunslinger who racked up all kinds of yards, but he ability to move in the pocket and make plays with his feet was second to none.  He also could throw it when he had to.  In Tressel's system many times the play calling didn't dictate that.  Krenzel was a winner and a great QB for the time.  Quite honestly, I would put him above Troy Smith, who I luv and had a great year, if I had to choose a QB to lead us into a NC game.  The man could simply get it done!

Go Bucks!!!

+1 HS
poop's picture

Tressel ball: as exciting as watching paint dry for 99% of the game. The other 1% made me shit my pants though. I would give anything to have that defense back.

+1 HS
ARMYBUCK's picture

Im at a loss with this thread topic.  Im not sure exactly how you can criticize Krenzels throwing and then ask if TP could have won a title with this team.  The answer is yes he probably could have but definitely not because he threw better than Krenzel.  Im not a TP hater but I would get so worked up during games about his lack of fundamentals throwing the football and shotputting everything off his back foot.  If TP were to win with this team it would most definitely have relied more on his legs than his arm.  Lets not forget the intelligence factor.  Krenzel was a genius! 

MichiganBuckeye222's picture

Are you bass dropper?

Representing the Buckeyes in the Mitten State since 1987.

www.septemberheisman.com