Heacock is counting on Williams and Moeller to playJim Heacock and the Ohio State defense learned yesterday that Leo starter Nathan Williams will be out at least a week but won't require surgery on the left knee he injured Saturday before the kick scrimmage.
While it's obviously good news that Williams reportedly won't go under the knife, the timetable spanning one to possibly five weeks is not. Unfortunately, this is the second potentially significant injury to a starter during camp (Devon Torrence's strained hammy being the other) in that there's no question the worst case of five weeks could be a substantial hit to the defensive front. The 'Canes visit the 'Shoe in roughly 3.5 weeks meaning it's at least possible Solomon Thomas could be your Leo starter with equally untested Melvin Fellows and possibly true frosh David Durham helping anchor a position key to the pass rush and the zone pass defense if Williams struggles to recover.
In any event, the Buckeyes have been pretty lucky when it comes to the injury bug this year even seeing previously injured guys like Adams, Pryor, Shugarts, Boren, Moeller and Herron etc. all come into fall camp at full strength.
With the Williams injury a chief focus right now, it got me wondering which position group you think could least avoid a significant injury to a starter if Ohio State plans on hoisting the crystal next January. Obviously, losing Pryor for an extended period would be a virtual death sentence for a championship season so we'll exclude QB for the sake of discussion. Since we've already touched on the defensive line, here are a few other key spots to consider:
Wide Receiver
An injury to Posey or Sanzenbacher would be a major hit to a talented but inexperienced receiving corp pushing guys like T-Wash, Chris Fields and Grant Schwartz into more prominent roles. It could also limit the times Tressel commits to throwing the football down the field allowing defenses to stack the box.
Pryor's ability to audible and check to hot routes could also be severely compromised if the Buckeyes suffer a big loss of either Posey or Dane.
Secondary
Torrence's hamstring could be nothing but you just never know with injuries in that area. That fact, combined with the number of unproven guys behind Torrence and fellow starter Chimdi Chekwa is enough to give me dry heaves. Practice observers indicate Travis Howard has really stepped up but if a major injury hit one of the starters at corner, the impact could be severe. There's also the worry some have about Tyler Moeller not being able to get through the season considering what he's been through. Certainly, the potential loss of safety Jermale Hines would also have a dangerous ripple effect on the back line of what is already the most questionable area of the 2010 defense.
Punter
I know. It's the punter but this is Ohio State where the punt is the most important play in football. Combine that with the fact the Buckeyes really only have Ben Buchanan at the position now that Drew Basil is spending virtually all his time placekicking and the loss of Buchanan would be huge. The current backup is sophomore walk-on Derek Erwin. He averaged 40.1 yards on seven kick scrimmage punts. Meanwhile, the highly decorated Buchanan had a strong showing in the scrimmage (9 punts, 45.8 yard avg) armed with the knowledge the job is his unless his leg falls off.
You could always make a case for the offensive line but I'm not sure the other units would be hurt as much by the loss of a starter. What say you - which unit would be most negatively impacted the loss of a starter to major injury?
Comments
Without question, if things started to get scarce at WR, I think that would be a huge blow. Especially if Posey were to go down because TP looks for him most of the time. It's my hope that we use the TE's more this year. It would take less pressure off of TP and help stretch the field.
Depth is why Ohio State is so good.
I dunno; if we have an injury to a WR during the Big X slate I think we'd be ok. We did beat up Iowa, PSU, and Michigan without a passing game last year, when those teams were stacking the box.
I'd have to go with the Secondary, and specifically corner. Chekwa hasn't proven to me he's a lock down, although aside from the bogus PI call in the Rose Bowl he looked pretty good. Losing him means big bad things IMO.
I'd definitely be MOST worried for a loss in the secondary. Our returnees are average at best and with unproven youngsters backing them up could lead to major problems.
We should be able to score via the ground pounding if a WR goes down and looking at what 11W and other blogs have written, we will throw to the TE and FB much more than in the past.
gotta go with secondary also. pryor is going to make things happen and our ability to run (despite previous threads on -line ability) will usually be better than the team we are playing. save for maybe wisconsin, i think we will control the game on the ground with pryor making enough plays to get enough points and the d doing the rest. but a loss in the secondary, especially to chekwa, would be pretty brutal.
Not worried.... QB is the one that worries me the most--If Pryor goes down, so does the season!
we better not have any of the top 4 WRs or corners returning punts/kicks. there is talent at the jr/so level but 0 experience.
I wanted to say the secondary at first but other guys in other positions on the field can make up for those inadequacies if we have any. I think back to the Florida game and to the loss of Ginn to see how that affected us. Maybe it was getting our ass beat in every position on the field or maybe the significant injury was the turning point in the game. That is debatable. The key fact is that we lost a man that contributed 6 points. If Posey was taken away from the offense that means you take away his contributions and that hurts. Our defense is why we win so often and no one questions that. I really believe that there is more of a cohesion and collaborative effort on defense, more so than on the offensive side. An individual skill player can make things happen {along with blocking} on offense and if we lose one of those it hurts, ala Beanie Wells, Ted Ginn. The defensive line can increase a pass rush, formations can be changed, and line backers dropped into a coverage role to compensate for an injury here or there. Some skill players just can't be replaced.
curiosity got the best of me about the secondary, alphabetcally there are 5 frosh. including redshirts, and 5 sophs from CJ Barnett thru Chris Maxwell listed as Db's, and that is only 1/2 the roster, counting only fr. and so., who knows where Verlon Reed ends up, programs like Ohio State overcome injuries and become great teams. Back in 02-03 all my cane friends used to brag about how much better the cane players were than our guys, fact is they probably were, but Ohio State had the better team! We have quality back ups at all positions, provided they play as a team, TOSU will have a successful year.
It's either QB or WR, hands down.
If Chekwa gets hurt, I won't care, because he's not any good anyway. Unless that means that the guys behind are just that bad they can't get ahead. So maybe I should worry.
TP goes down we go from at worst a 10 win team to at best probably a 9 win team.
Posey or Dane go down we'll see that 25-35 passes a game turn into 5-15.
Losing Posey changes the whole dynamics of the offense. It may be similar for the defense to lose Chekwa, but I think it is easier to insert/hide an inexperienced but talented DB than it is to replace a 2 yr starter/All-Big 10 caliber WR.
slippy, have some faith in our coaches and players, TP is a great player but isn't the whole team. Guiton throws a pretty nice ball, look at all the receivers behind Posey,might not be as polished but who knows come game time, what if sanz. gets hurt? there is about 10 options, how about saine for one.
In my opinion it would really hurt to lose Posey or Dane, but to say the passing game would take that much of a hit is a bit premature I think. We don't know how Louis, Washington, and others will pan out this season. In my opinion though, Posey is the best player on the offensive side of the ball and will probably take the next step to become one of the best receivers in America, so losing him would hurt the offense significantly.
I think it would definitely be a problem if Checkwa went down. I don't think people realize how good he is. Maybe not Jenkins back there, but he's not that bad. Have to agree about TP though. There is not another QB that is game ready. Guiton may have a lot of talent but has no experience. He would be coming in like Pryor did for Boeckman.
Well, the problem is the offensive packages and game plan and stuff. It changes a lot more than just the guy under center.
Our secondary will be fine, regardless of who we have back there. The reason for that is because our D-Line & LB's have good depth and ridiculous talent. If we start to lose 2-3 DL's, a stud LB, and/or somebody like Moeller, than the pressure will be put more squarely on the Secondary. Until then, hope for health with the front 7!
Will it is secondary hands down....
Think about how many games we won last year by running the football...
When you look at the end of the season we didn't need to pass to win!
However, and this is a big however we must be able to stop teams with our defense. That is what wins football games, and if we don't have a secondary that can stop the pass, then we are in a world of hurt.
Can't lose Hines. Secondary is still the weak link and Checkwa will again need all the help in the world. Expect to be facing many offenses on 3rd and long. Secondary experience is going to be irreplaceable.
I don't realize how good he is because he's not. Go back and watch the Fiesta bowl - they consistently caught passes for first downs in front of him, and he couldn't get off blocks on screens.
Iowa last year he gave up a long pass to let them in the redzone, then the ensuing touchdown. Gave up their next passing TD as well.
I can find others.
He gives up a lot in front of him, and he never locates the ball.
Sorry. Look at the NC game against Florida. Take away the top receiver and the team is so one dimensional. You can run the ball effectively when you have a threat of a passing game. It is so much more difficult when that threat is taken away (by injury, pass rush, or by weather conditions).
I don't think we should worry about losing a player hear or there. We have big time recruits all over the place. It's not like were illinois or michigan state with no young badasses. Look at teams like bama and flordia and texas and USC. They have freshman and soph's starting and playing like every position all the time and do fine. So will ours. Just cuz tress(god love him) don't have the nugs to throw young talent out there over older(and sometimes not as good)players.doesnt mean that if he is forced to that they won't perform just as good if not better than what's already out there. I'm not worried about an injury at any position besides if cam or tp go down. We have young badasses too. Like I said again. Just look at teams that win titles every year with frosh n soph's all over the place.
Don't confuse unimaginative playcalling with lack of personnel.
I don't know, I guess anyone can have 2 or 3 games that give people ammo to say he sucks. I feel like h has played pretty well the majority of the time and would take him in the secondary. There were NFL people who thought he was good enough to be a low round pick last year. It's not like he's the walk-on type talent that is in the Michigan secondary.
At the end of the day though, isn't executing what matters. You can tell the team what play you are going to run if you have the superior personel, you should execute. Unimagintive play calling works fine if you execute. Alabama didn't have a quirky and complex offense last season.
right on! recriut them, play them
Plus, the Florida game would not have had a different outcome any way you slice it. Unless, the O-line and Tory didn't enjoy so many meals on the awards tour as well as In and Out burgers. They were fat, overconfident, and unprepared. Florida was hungry and that game looked way more talented. Play calling or a Healthy Ginn wouldn't have changed who won the game. It may have been 10 points closer or something like that, but they would've lost that game that night.
I don't understand the Tressel doubters when it comes to starting younger players who are perceived to be not as good as older players. What specific player would've been better than an "older" guy in recent years. Last year's Line had 2 underclassman starters for a good chunk of the year, with a second year starting QB that was a sophomore. Posey played a lot of snaps as a Freshman and was the best receiver as a sophomore.
I don't get the criticism here. I know people were clamouring for Sabino last year, and maybe that's where this stems from but everything I saw said he wasn't grasping the defense and he wasn't working hard to get onto the field. When a player proves he is good enough, can grasp the system, isn't in any classroom or off the field trouble, and works hard/isn't lazy, he sees the field.
Don't talk about Chekwa too much or you'll get a derpa, from SouthBay, defender of all that is Chekwa. LOL
just took a quick brief trip down memory lane...look at clarrett,lil animal,jenkins, santonio holmes, even cam heyward to name a few. All thrown in ealry as frosh er soph's becuz of injury or what not. All ripped it up and were all sweet. That's just the few I thought of in like 2 seconds of thinking about it. We will be fine. Only position you really don't want a frosh er soph coming in at is QB. And I'm totally not trying to be a racist asshole but even at that position it seems like african american qb's have alot harder time at that position when there young than white dudes. It seems our darker skined friends take much longer to develop. Proly becuz they run alot more and run way more in high school. I mean I can't think of a frosh african american QB to ever really be special. But there are white ones every year doing well. Correct me if I am wrong but wernt bradford,claussen,tebow,mccoy,god help me for sayen this but even the forciers of the world starting and pretty sweet as frosh?
Agree some what. You can overcome superior talent with good playcalling thus the loss of a star WR is diminshed if the paycalling is complex. We need a seperate thread for this discussion.
While AL was not complex they did throw down field, thus keeping the D honest. OSU went into a run right ,run left pattern when teddy went down in the NC game.
Chekwa isn't horrible in all aspects of being a cornerback. He ust needs to be smacked around a little bit and loosen that neck up. He doesn't turn back for the ball and that is what gets him flagged for pass interference the majority of the time. Faceguarding, we called it in the old days. He covers closely and is good supporting the run. Kid just needs to look for the ball, play the receiver until he looks for the ball then turn around! I know he was flagged in Oregon and Iowa among many other games.
I get what you're saying, but I don't think either Posey or Sanz are a Ginn level talent. That's no knock on them either, but he was a unique player in a lot of ways.
In general, I think this year has a lot less 'standout player' strength, and a lot more 'team' to it.
That is the most idiotic spewing of garbage I've ever heard. Typically Freshman QB's struggle. Tebow wasn't the man as a Freshman, he was mostly brought in to run like the "darker skinned" guys you talk about. Do you remember Colt playing his Freshman year? It wasn't pretty. Just because you say, don't think I'm racist before an ignorant comment, doesn't mean it's not an ignorant comment.
look at like tp,t smith, leak, pat white, mike vick, tirod taylor. All took way longer to develop
I meant Colt playing OSU his Freshman year. Plus, Claussen wasn't good until last season. His first too were very disappointing to Golden Domers. Another example of a QB who wasn't good as a white Freshman, Carson Palmer. They were ready to w
rite him off as a failure. Not to mention our dark freshman QB was much more competent than Todd Boeckman.
I just threw up in my mouth.
ummm didn't Vick take his team the the BCS title game his first year as a starter? Pat White didn't have to be a passer because of the system he played in. Jacory Harris had a pretty good Freshman season last year.
Sorry , sopomore season
hell yea..way better than boekman. But I still think you are crazy if you don't think the black kids take way longer to develop than the white kids. It's usually becuz of there throwing motion tho. And tebow played a decent amount as a frosh. Then just went on to win the title and a heisman. In fact 3 white somp QB's won the heisman in a row I believe right? I perfer a blck qb over a white becuz of the run threat. But they are hands down not as good early as white ones. Look up the facts. It is fact
It doesn't matter what they did, saying that "our dark-skinned" friends take long to develop deserves no examples or explanations.
You need to stop. Now.
ur right about vick but his first year as starter was his senior year becuz he was and still is waaay to dumb to learn a play book.
I agree, that comment just pissed me off a lot, and I always feel the need to correct ignorance. Of courswe it won't matter usually those attitudes can't be changed no matter what kind of points you make to the contrary.
relax my best friend is black and I am half mexican. Like at least half my friends are black and we talk about it all the time. And they all agree. No racism here. I was just bringing up a point. Chill out. And I'll still say if ya go back and look up the stats/facts. That white dudes are always better sooner than the black kids in 90% of the cases. Look in the NFL. Has a black dude ever won the super bowl at QB?? I think there was one in like the 70's from the redskins.
it's because of d-bags like brian n pam that there is racism tho. Ya say one thing about race and every1 gets all up tight. It's not like I said anything bad about black people. Just that they take longer to develop at the pro n college ranks becuz they usually throw akward and run all the time. Especially in high school. I heard tp had like 2 plays in high school. They were look deep look cross then run. Which is all you need at that level. So when you get to college it takes alot longer to learn playbooks n whatnot. I just showed a few of my black buddys I work w mine and ur guys comments and they laughed and one even said. That's why there's racism. White people just don't get it. He followed it with but then again neither do most of us.
lol... the fact that you use one game means nothing.
We run the ball all year last year, and for the most part of a decade.
lol... you act like we throw the ball 30 times a game.
It's tressel ball buddy, we play great defense and run the ball which run's the clock.
Do I wish we would throw more. YES! Do i think we will yes! but whats more important.... Well, defense my friend and that would be i chose the secondary over the recievers.
just thoughts Brian, no hurt or critique heading anywhere, everyone is just amped for marshall and the season to get under way
Ridiculous talent? Talented yes, maybe Heyward is elite but other than that, they are average. Average players do well when they play within the system. We don't have a slew of players who can takeover a game when it matters most (USC's and the Longhorn's final drives are imprinted on my frontal lobe.) Chekwa got burned last year against equal talent...it will be interesting to see if he can improve. Gotta be able to play man consistently to have a championship caliber defense.
Proof is in the puddin'.....I hope they make me eat crow. I'm not touchin' the kool-aid anymore with my beloved Buckeyes. It is what it is.
Yes, people will read through the comment section and they'll say that Pam and I are the D-bags.
Dude your dead wrong. Cam is a top 10 pick. Simon is a beast he'll go pro. Nate Williams future pro. Back up freshman Hankins will be a pro. I'd say thats pretty good up front.
I don't know about you Brian, I would much rather be a d-bag than someone who believes that black QB's are slow to develop and then claim it to be a fact and back that up by saying I have black friends and am half Mexican
A prime example of why it would be nice to need a login to comment.
Leave the racism and stereotyping somewhere else. You may actually think you aren't but clearly you are. I would truly wish you could reflect on yourself and grow up. Sadly, I agree w/Brian. It's doubtful.
Moving on.
Aside from my chief concern always (QB), I'm mostly worried about the secondary. In my opinion, the d-line has helped hide some serious issues there for years. I actually feel lucky that opposing teams haven't gone after it more, but again ... the d-line has helped with that.
From just a wait-and-see approach, I am hoping for no long term injuries to the d-line. It still amazes me that Heacock WANTED to go on record as saying what he did in regards to the line. For someone who is the most senior member of the coaching staff (i want to say '95?), and who knows the history and knows some of the lines to come through tOSU. To want to say that should give any fan, or even opponent, chills. It's an astounding claim and one I can't wait to see pan out.
Recently? Running back.
I appreciate Boom in particular helping us through a tough time, but while him & Saine are solid players, I don't think either one of them is the future of the program.
Similarly, I think Mo Wells got way too many carries at the expense of Beanie. The only justification I can think of for that is seniority.
It's not a major flaw, and there are times (Pryor) that he's absolutely making the right decision to wait, but sometimes (Krenzel) it's hard to tell whether a younger kid will perform until you put him in and see.
Also, trusting our freshmen to step up and contribute if Bad Things happen is not the same as saying we should kick the seniors off the field while they're still healthy.
It certainly wouldn't be the first time I was accused of being a D-bag. It is however the first time I've eve had someone say I'm the reason racism exists.
But who last year was at RB that was younger and more competent than Saine or Herron? Someone you could've plugged in from day one and they would've been better?
I guess Beanie could've had more carries as a Freshman but wasn't Pittman still here then?
Cam is. Love that guy.
Simon is a feel good story, so is Williams. Dexter Larimore is a big,fat white dude. Remember, insane workout stories does not an NFL caliber DE or tackle make. They are JAG's (just another guy) in the SEC, Texas or USC or a host of other, for lack of a better word 'elite" programs..
That's a fact.
Hankins has potential.
Some of the other younger guys may develop like Cam. We shall see. None of them were better than 4 star I believe...most were 3 stars.
Shariff floyd...5 star...Florida. Nice.
Puddin...gotta see the proof.
When OSU's D-Line, on the biggest stage, does to an SEC team or another team that is a national title contender what Florida and LSU and USC's did to us on those wrist-slitting nights we all remember so well....count me in on the D-Line bandwagon.
J Martin
and you never know until they are in a game, I just hope we get to see a good dose of Hyde and Berry this year
I feel safe in saying the only position I feel would be okay with an injury would be running back. Maybe linebacker as well.
Hall was a better back in my opinion than Saine or Herron. Now Saine impressed me more toward the end of the season.
You really think J Martin was good enough to be the man last year? A few snaps in garbage time he looked good but I don't know how he would've been taking 20 carries against Iowa or PSU last year. I hope the young guys tis year get some work, but if they don't it likely means Saine and Herron are getting it done pretty well.
Doug Williams and I believe it was the late 80's.
I was watching tapes of our future QB, Mr. Miller, and he does seem to be run first but he certainly doesn't look like he lacks in the passing game.
Thread=derailed. Thanks Jay. Whenever you say "I don't wan't/mean to sound racist but ______" . Guess what? It almost always is. If you don't care about embarrassing yourself, please have the decency not to besmirch our boards and normal tOSU fans. Grow up or go to the lulzer-pwned-haxorz-pr0n-/b/ boards, there are plenty of like-minded simpletons there to converse with. If you'd like to talk football and not skin color then go ahead and stay. Nobody cares if you're half Mexican or your buddy is black. You are awarded a D- in Phil. 103, Intro to Logic. Check with you're counselor for course availability next term. Anyway..yeah, uh, our secondary.
/Sorry *takes off admin hat*
mexican isn't a race. just sayin
Running back is the only position that's safe. The loss of 2 starters in any same position group or Pryor would be devastating to this team. Talent..yes. Experience..no.
P.S. This article is depressing.
+1000
it is kind of hard to win a super bowl as a black QB when racist A-holes won't let them play. Jay, 90% of the cases? what study did you perform to get those facts?
I only half agree with Brian and Pam, your not racist. Your just a dumbass Jay!
Brian:
The point is, we don't know. Are you sure he *wasn't* that good?
The upperclassmen were adequate, so we never find out. Practice tells you something, but not everything.
It's an upshot of playing conservative. Where most coaches would put guys like that in for the second half against Illinois or something, Tressel waits until the last 10 minutes against Toledo. He gets results, so I'm not really arguing, but I think the point stands that our underclassmen are probably often better than we realize.
Let me just say this much, if there was a Moe Clarett or Beanie Wells on the team last year, they would've started. None of the Jordan Hall looked good at times, but when given more of an opportunity he was not better than Saine. Martin looked really good in one game during garbage time. When given more snaps at times that were more important, he was stopped often. If they were better they would've had more responsibility on the team.
Boeckman would've been adequate, the team would've probably finished close to where they did if he started all year is senior season, but they brought in Pryor. Laurinitis earned a lot of snaps his Freshman year, and that was when the team was stacked at LB. If they guys are good enough they'lls ee the field.
When John Simon first signed he was a 5 star on rivals, they later dropped him down. Hankins may not have been a 5 star but he didn't need to be. He possessed a lot of the same tools has Floyd, he was just a little more of a project. guess what, Floyd would've seen about the same amount of playing time as Hankins will this year. Who cares if they are 5 starsor not. Worthington was a 5 star and while he was a solid player, he never was a guy that people just said man what a stud. Same with Rob Rose. You can have your 5 stars like that, I'll take Williams, Cam, and Simon any day.
Here are the games I distinctly remember PI calls in and I am sure there are many others. Illinois, Iowa, and Oregon of Last year. Then we'll mention games in the past such as Texas (Big one) and MSU in 08 (Not so big) If I really want to be picky it does not bode well for 10'. Didn't he get called for one in the spring game? They are of the same type too, not looking for the ball. I would understand if it was him going for the ball and somehow getting a hand on the back or jersey.
Simon was a five star at linebacker wasn't he?
Good point about Worthington and Rose...which leads me back to another problem with both of our lines..development.
We will never know about Floyd, I agree that Hankins could be a force. Can we agree that Larimore is a big, fat white dude?
I'm still not sold...I am skeptical right now of just about everything involving our O & D lines.
I just know he was a 5 star not sure what position. Anyway, if you spend any time around the track at all you'll hear the saying, "preformance trumps pedigree". I'm a firm believer in this. Simon played very well last year as a true freshman Williams played very well last year. The guys are good players, just because someone didn't give them a 5 star in highschool doesn't mean the SEC schools weren't recruiting guys like them. With the known commodities we have and others waiting in the wings (Fellows) this D-line is going to be nasty.
This is the result of having all the speed in the world and not knowing how to use it. I would prefer a man 3-4 tenths slower in tihe 40 with good technique versus #5
rec'd
The majority of posts here are great to read, even your arguments. Keep in mind the Bucks play maybe 3 teams that actually have a shot at beating them, well, unless they run the type of offense that allows other teams to play with them. I don't want any players to get hurt, as you don't, but we need a breakout running back. One that can stretch the field and make Pryor an even bigger play maker. A player on a fake handoff that will freeze those linebackers, even for a second. That we don't have. I also think this team will get eaten by the pass. Screens, short routes are going to eat us up. Your Iowa's and Miami's will have the shot to beat you, and I just do not know if this team is actually built to go undefeated. And Jay, if you say a word of any downfall of black players or anything really, you will be labeled a racist in a second, just the way it is buddy. Reverse racism is the very biggest problem in this country. But the point you were trying to make is true.
I'm thinking that the unit that can least afford a major injury is the defensive line. Last year's line was really good because of the depth. We had talent with experience. OSU wins with defense and the defense starts up front. I think we'd better hope that Adam Bellamy and Garrett Goebel are pretty good. Don't even want to think of Heyward going down!
I believe the kid from my home town, Chris Fields, will be returning kicks for the Buckeyes. He's a speedster that can make things happen.
Geez what a speculative article, a good old "what if" piece.
All I can say in reply is this "If your grandfather would have had different plumbing he would have been your grandmother." GO BUCKS.