North Carolina Now Facing Potential Clery Act Violations

January 18, 2013 at 9:59a    by Jason Priestas    
22 Comments

Comments

Unky Buck's picture

Is there anything the people at UNC won't do? Man, they can't do anything correctly...

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GoBucks713's picture

What happened to the Miami NOA that we were supposed to hear about this week?

-The Aristocrats!

toad1204's picture

Since Miami is a private univeristy they can choose what they divulge.  I would think that someone at the NCAA or Miami would have leaked something by now though.  I think it was expected to be delivered on Tuesday.

Nothing like dancing on the field in 02... 

William's picture

Friends at NC State are going crazy about this, but in all honesty this happens at every university. That doesn't make it right, but let's not act like this doesn't happen at Ohio State, because guess what, it does. Again that doesn't make it right, in fact it makes it a tragedy, but let's not comment on the state of UNC when this happens at our beloved university. 

Brutus's picture

Not trying to be argumentative, but what information do you have that someone at OSU has pressured someone else to underreport sexual assault on campus.  There is no question that sexual assault happens at many/most (maybe all) universities, but I'm not sure how you can say that people are told to underreport "at every university". And you suggest that this has happened at OSU.  Are you stating opinion or fact?  Again, not arguing with you.  I just haven't heard anyone at OSU be accused of this. 

William's picture

I'll search for the links, but after it was announced that Michael Nodianos was no longer a student here at OSU, I saw plenty of people mentioning the fact that OSU has essentially ignored ~40 cases of sexual assault this year. 
Also to think that any university doesn't underreport rapes/sexual assaults to conserve its integrity it's laughable. It's all about portraying your campus as safe, when OSU in regards to sexual assault/muggings really isn't all that safe. A study by the National Institute of Justice projected that a university the size of Ohio State should experience roughly 1,750 rapes every school year. I think in my time at OSU (only two years), only two rapes have been reported and dealt with by OSU.  
Here's one instance of a botched case. Chick was raped in her dorm room and they suspended the guy for a year. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/05/08/student-upset-at-how-osu-handled-sexual-assault-case.html

Brutus's picture

Nevertheless, where is the evidence that someone at OSU tried to coerce someone else to underrport sexual assault?  That's the premise of your original post which I'm trying to figure out.  That's also what's most damning about the UNC story.  I don't doubt the statistics which suggest that there should be more instances of reported sexual assaults on a campus the size of OSU.  And I agree, any university would likely want to underreport in order to give the impression that its campus is safe.  But you implied that the OSU, as well as "every university", is engaged in the same type of cooercive behavior to force others to underreport sexual assault.  That's what I have a problem with.  You are making wide spread accusations without any proof (yet). It's one thing to say that statistically speaking, OSU is likely underreporting sexual assaults.  But I didn't think that's what you were saying in your original post, unless I completely misinterpreted (which I might have).

William's picture

I'm saying that statistically, it is impossible for OSU to not be underreporting rapes. I have no direct daming evidence (reports) as in the UNC case. But I find it impossible to think that OSU isn't somehow underreporting sexual assault or rape here. Here you go, Ohio State accused of violating disclosure acts in regards to rape: http://www.thelantern.com/campus/ohio-state-accused-of-concealing-rape-details-by-legal-blog-1.2964899

AndyVance's picture

The only thing this link "proves" in the context of this discussion is that federal law is extremely complicated as it relates to student privacy and what schools can, should, and must report legally.
There are very fine lines all around these types of allegations, and comparing those made in this Lantern story to those against UNC and the Penn State debacle is the nadir of rhetorical device. Poorly played, sir.

Unky Buck's picture

I'm not saying it doesn't happen anywhere. That's not what my post is intended to imply. I'm simply stating that UNC clearly has adminstrative issues. This is just magnifying the problem. I think that's why this is going to be or already is a bigger story than it probably normally would. The UNC adminstration needs to get some things together here real quick or it'll start to turn ugly.

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UrbanWoodrowEarlTressel's picture

This is a stupid comment, William. You throw OSU under the bus, while trying to equivocate OSU with UNC. You are comparing apples and oranges, and your example was flawed. Very poor.

UrbanWoodrowEarlTressel's picture

I still think if any school violated the Clery Act it was Penn State. Can't find a better example of this. Also, like I said before the Texas/Oregon State Alamo Bowl ... the ALLEGED sexual assault by Jordan Hicks and Case McCoy would be dismissed. And it was. Of course nobody is up in arms that these guys were falsely accused and had their reputations dragged through the mud, kinda like the Duke Lacrosse players.

William's picture

Umm no. None of that has been proved. They were reinstated four days ago, with Mack Brown claiming that it would be dealt with internally (Steubenville much?). Hicks's lawyer claimed that all charges had been dropped, when the San Antonio Police Department announced that they are still being investigated... http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/blog/eye-on-college-football/21554966

UrbanWoodrowEarlTressel's picture

Now you're trying to compare the ALLEGED incident in Texas with what happened in Steubenbille...just stop. You're entirely off base.
BTW-I know you would never admit it, but I guarantee when you heard the allegations against Kobe - you immediately deemed him guilty. Ditto with the Duke Lacrosse players.

William's picture

Well considering that both Mack Brown and Steubenville's coach chose to deal with the matters internally, umm yeah I'd say it's similar. Actually having grown up near the Triangle in NC, there was a lot of information out there that the woman was attempting to extort the players, so no I did not feel the same about the Duke Lacrosse case. But please keep making misinformed statements, they're rather comical. I also noticed you failed to address the fact that you were entirely wrong about the current state of the Jordan Hicks/Case McCoy case, but no worries there, just ignore that one!

buckeye_baker's picture

What? What does this situation have to do with the Texas case?

"I can accept failure, but I can't accept not trying." -Woody Hayes

rdubs's picture

One issue I have with these things is that it is a criminal matter and colleges and universities are not equipped (and shouldn't be) to deal with crimes of this nature.  A one year suspension for a sexual assault looks awful, but did the guy ever go to jail?  If he had, OSU doesn't even need to suspend anyone.
The other unfortunate thing is that these cases are virtually impossible to prove without video or other physical evidence and the shame associated with reporting these cases often leads to evidence being lost due to the amount of time passing before a report is filed.  Creating an atmosphere where people feel comfortable reporting these incidents is the most important thing so that they can be fairly investigated in a reasonable timeframe.

William's picture

I agree wholeheartedly about the difficulty to prove these cases without video or physical evidence. I also agree that an atmoshpere should be created where women can feel less shameful in regards to reporting rape. However, universities have their own police forces and are certainly equipped enough to deal with these incidents, to say that they aren't is a cop out. And why shouldn't a university be equipped to deal with sexual assault/rape? A huge part of American college life is sexual interactions. 

rdubs's picture

But a trial at a university disciplinary committee meeting is not the ultimate outcome that should happen.  If a student murders another student it should be handled by the local police (in coordination with campus police), sexual assault should be no different.  Campus police can be involved, but they are at a level between a security guard and a city police officer, their job is better served to be general peace keepers, not prosecuters of felony cases.

William's picture

No, but directly expelling someone because of rape instead of suspending them is a start, I understand this is more so on the adminsitration than it is Campus Police. Also it's Campus Police's duty to ensure the safety of students/the campus, so I fail to see how them dealing with rape in a more appropriate manner is out of their scope. 

btalbert25's picture

I agree with William, I think every school under reports this kind of stuff.  I went NKU and we had a rape on campus.  The campus police and school administration didn't publicize it.  They paid her to keep her quiet and then paid her tuition to any school she wanted to go to.  If little NKU and it's 15,000 students on one of the safest campuses out there is under reporting rapes, I can only imagine what a school of over 50,000 is doing. 

USMC11917's picture

I don't know the truth and won't throw an opinion out without seeing more evidence than he said/she said. I find it hard to give much credence to complaints from those that no longer work at said institution. These things should be filed at the moment they occur. Everything else looks retaliatory. That may or may not be the case here. If this is legit then shame on those who are involved.