Monday Skull Session

By DJ Byrnes on December 12, 2011 at 6:00a
46 Comments
RT @dril: no. the marine chant has always been "Oprah", not "oorah". you've just been mishearing it this entire time. "oorah" isn't even a word

Today is Monday December 12th in the two thousand and eleventh year of our Lord and Savior and 29th President of the United States of America: Warren Gamaliel Harding. 

 A PLAY-OFF COMETH. Apparently enough teams have been screwed by the BCS to finally get some wheels turning on a play-off system. Although it looks it will start with a field of four teams, I guess that's light years ahead of the current system. Eventually, the NCAA (or whoever controls the money bags once the super conferences give the NCAA the boot) will start smelling more cash and allow more teams into the field. I wish we could just cut to the chase, but I guess this is progress.

 JIM MORA JR WAS UCLA'S 106TH CHOICE BUT ALSO THEIR NEXT HEAD COACH. They started with Urban Meyer and ended up with Jim Mora Jr. You know, a man who hasn't coached college football in over a quarter century probably isn't the type of guy I'd want to pay 12 million dollars to coach my college football team, but then again, I'm not sure if I even have $12, let alone $12,000,000.  I was born in Pasadena and my uncle went to UCLA -- so I've always held a soft-spot for the Bruins -- but until they replace their 1970's facilities, I don't ever see UCLA competing. But hey, they just hired a guy who used to coach in the NFL! (He was a disaster who may have never gotten the chance if his last name were "James", but whatever! It's a splash!)

RT @admiral_baby LADLES— call me a spoon because i like to stir the pot >:]OUT THERE GOBBLIN' UP UR RECRUITZ RITE NOW

 WHEN A PISTOL LOSES ITS ONLY BULLET. "Mike" Dyer, Auburn's only semblance of offensive production this season, won't be playing in the Tigers' bowl game. Whatever ridiculously-named bowl Auburn is playing in, I won't be watching. If Auburn is the 25th best team in the country -- and that's what the oracles behind the BCS tell us -- then I move to strike this entire college football season from the records. Regardless, I think the times are changing in college football. Depending on whomever Penn State hires -- Pat Fitzgerald or Kyle Whittingham, anyone? -- I like the coaching changes going on in the Big Ten. Now, if only Kirk Ferentz could be toppled, the Big Ten could be getting its act together on the football front.

 OHIO IS PLAYING FOR KEEPS. While Ohio State is idle until January 2nd 2012, Mt. Union will be taking on Wisconsin-Whitewater (winner of their last 44 games) for the DIII championship on Saturday. I usually roll with any team from Ohio when facing out-of-state competition, but I have respect for the Wisconsin-Whitewater program. In the Spring of 2009, while on spring break in Daytona, a lineman for the Wisconsin-Whitewater was locked out of his hotel room while in a drunken stupor. Enraged his friends weren't answering his phone calls -- and instead of getting a new key at the front desk -- he scaled his 2nd story balcony, went through his unlocked balcony door and drove his grandma's minivan to the airport and bought a one way ticket home. He woke up in Atlanta. These are the kind of hoggz which Mt. Union will be banging with on Saturday. (Also, I'm rather salty Mt. Union fans get a play-off and yet I'm stuck watching BCS games.)

 JOE PATERNO FRACTURED HIS PELVIS. The exiled former coach of Penn State fell at his home but won't need surgery according to "a source close to the family."

BRADY HOKE'S REVOLUTIONARY FAR EASTERN DIET PLAN. A Sad Jerry Jones & family GIF... Alan Sepinwall interviews "Boardwalk Empire" creator Terence Winter in the wake of last night's banger... A scathing Twitterer's triumphant return... Two thieves in University Heights, Ohio, distracted Macy's employees and made off with a $10,000 necklace... Man took out a fake obituary for his mom in order to get paid leave from work... Mexico busts drug cartels' private phone network... Urban Meyer's Florida recruiting by the numbers... US blogger jailed for insulting Thai king... Five common strategy mistakes

46 Comments

Comments

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

No way in hell do I want to see a Plus-1 that uses the bowls as the semi-finals. If we do go to a four team playoff, I want a system that plays the semi finals this past weekend with the higher seed getting homefield advantage. People don't have the money to travel that much.

NC_Buckeye's picture

Humble, looks like playoffs have reached critical mass and Delany will no longer be able to roadblock it. The more I think about it, the more I like your idea of making conference championship a requisite for the plus one.

I'm absolutely against the idea of at-large berths as I think it will lead to more situations like what is happening this year (LSU vs Bama). If you lost to your conference champion (be it regular season or CCG), you don't deserve to be a part of the discussion IMO. This is the best method to preserve the relevance of the regular season. (Kudos to you for the idea.)

I'm just hoping that the masses will be satiated with a plus one. (Doubt it though. Praying that I don't live to see a 32 team college football playoff... ugh.)

btalbert25's picture

My favorite part of Wetzel's article about a playoff was Point number 4.

4. You have to have the illusion that you’re protecting the regular season. (A playoff actually would increase interest and TV ratings in the regular season, but the head-in-the-sand crowd argues otherwise. Even they can’t claim a four-team playoff changes much of anything, though.)

 

 

DallasTheologian's picture

What about team #5?

It scares me that this could turn into the basketball tournament very easily. They are toying with the idea of expanding the field from 68 to 90. Is it that far fetched that they will eventually bring in the entire field.

The NCAA men's basketball tournament started with the top 8 schools. It has expanded eponentially (literally).

The other problem is you will have the same arbitrary system which everyone is complaining about determining the field of participants. It is not as easy as everyone makes it out to be and there are far more pitfalls than people are willing to recognize.

btalbert25's picture

It'll expand from four, but no way it ever expands to 64.  I couldn't see it ever expanding beyond 12-16.  Once you get beyond that many teams regular seasons would probably have to be shorter.  No way the blue bloods are going to give away their non conference games, usually giving them 7 or 8 homegames, so they can play in an expanded playoff.

Also, the bowl system isn't going anywhere.  As Wetzel pointed out they'll be including bowls in this playoff, plus the other bowls, which make a ton of money are still in tact.  So people still have incentive to go 6-6 and make the Gator Bowl if they aren't going to make into the playoff.

As for making a case for number 5, at that point I think you do start to lose your beef with the system a little bit.  Granted if you took 100 teams, team 101 is going to be screaming about how they deserved a chance.  This is baby steps, but it's trending in the right direction at least. 

Orlando Buckeye's picture

This is why I want an 8 team playoff.  All AQ conference champs, best Non-AQ conference champ and a wild card.  Wild card goes to highest ranked team to not win coference (call it the redemption slot).  ND could qualify for this if ranked in the top ten (maybe).  Hell, the wild card could even go the Div. 2 champion for all I care.

 

This seems the fairest to me.  If you didn't win your conference you can't cry about it.  

 

In a top 4 situation, someone(s) is choosing the teams and I for do not want to see a final four that is LSU, BAMA, ARK, and fOSU.  "Clearly those are the 3 best teams in the country.  Bama only lost to LSU and ARK only lost to LSU and BAMA.  You can't hold that against them the SEC is such a fast and physical conference.  And, who else we got... Okie State, yeah, good luck to them." ugh.

btalbert25's picture

Then they need to redefine the AQ conferences and trash the Big East.  They are horrible and even with Boise it's ridiculous they get an auto bid.  You are going to credit a conference who is barely better than the sunbelt by giving them an autobid to the playoffs.  Maybe scrap the idea of AQ conferences all together and just take the champs from the top 7 conferences in a revamped BCS rating system.  Even then though the conference champ from the 7th ranked conference would be far less deserving the teams the 2nd or 3rd best team from top rated conference.  The idea that in this system West Virginia would be more deserving of a title shot than Bama or Stanford is just laughable.

I still don't see how every game matters when conference champs are all that's included.  No one has ever explained this to me.  Basically, you are saying the non conference schedule is meaningless.  A team could lose all 4 non conference game, but as long as they won their conference they get a shot to play for the title.  That's ridiculous. 

Also, they'll need to completely revamp how the conference schedules work.  Everyone would need to go to a round robin so you play EVERYONE in conference.  Scrap the conference championship game(which will never happen because those make a ton of cash).  You only know who the best team in conference really is, if they all play eachother.  That way Georgia or South Carolina couldn't win the conference title on a fluke in a season where they didn't have to face Bama or LSU.   This scenario will never happen though, it'll take away from theamount of home games and non conference games a team will be able to play.  That means 1 or 2 less sell outs of 105,000 people at the shoe and all the revenue that brings in.  The conference championships bring in way too much cash for a round robin model to be allowed.

Essentially, there's no way that will be "fair" to everyone involved.  One thing I know for sure is there are about 8 teams playing the BCS who would blow West Virginia out of the water this year, and in a conference champ model they'd be included, when all they had to do was beat the likes of UC, Louisville, South Florida, and other juggernauts like UConn and Rutgers. 

NC_Buckeye's picture

BT, your arguments make a good case for the plus one (4 teams) versus having an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Yes to no longer having AQ conference. Yes to having only conference champions. Then basing selection of the four on the top-ranked or a selection committee would take into account the non-conference schedule. (If you lost a non-conf, then you obviously wouldn't be ranked as high as those who didn't.)

It basically takes care of your WVU argument.

Of course, superconferences make all of this venting unnecessary as the regular season becomes the playoff.  

 

btalbert25's picture

Even with superconferences, we're going to have the same debates though.  We have controversy in 12 team conferences about whether or not the 2 best teams play for the conference title or not.  Michigan could've won their division in a year where they dodged Wisconsin and Penn State this year.  Georgia didn't play any of the top 3 from the west this year.  The Big 12 North representative is rarely as good as the 3rd team in the Big 12 south.  without playing everyone in conference it's impossible to know for sure which team is better.  There's no perfect way to do it, that's for sure. I just hate the idea of only taking into account who won their conference, because all conferences and conference schedules are not equal.  Would any of the big east have been top 7 or 8 in the SEC this year? 

I do like the idea of a selection committe, and I do like the idea of totally scrapping AQ conferences.  That's just a money grab.  Like Wetzel said, college football is not a free market.  They want to make sure that the power stays concentrated, so that rich get richer. 

 

Orlando Buckeye's picture

Non conference games will stay they way they are. Cup cakes to please in state teams or as a glorified scrimmage.  Or, play someone big for fame, fortune and SOS but at the risk of losing.  In a situation like BAMA where you'd have to rely on SOS to get you into the playoffs you might need a good nonconference win to ...who are we kidding SEC SEC SEC. ugh.

 

If the Big East sucks so be it, strip their AQ status and make two at large bids.  There are many other options here as well.  Maybe scrap the idea of AQ conferences all together and just take the champs from the top 7 conferences in a revamped BCS rating system...is a fine example.

 

However, if a team doesn't want to compete against their conference for a chance at a playoff berth then they should switch conferences.  Teams now have to play their conference schedule in the hopes of making a BCS bowl.  So the system doesn't really change.

Doc's picture

Delaney says the B1G would opt out of the Foosball Final Four.  Yeah, right!  If he would, we might as well help Urban pack up his home, because he won't stick at a school unable to win MNC's.  Come on Jimmy, give me a break....

"Say my name."

BucksfanXC's picture

If there was a playoff, would it still be an MNC or a plain ole NC?

“Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect.”  - Woody

Seabass1974's picture

Time for Delaney to go.

The harder you work, the harder it is to surrender. - Woody Hayes

Run_Fido_Run's picture

Delaney is half gangsta. Are you gonna personally see to it that he retires from the business? Don't botch the operation, or else it could backfire on you. See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPA9-kpPo_g.

William's picture

Delany is a fool. He admits that he lucked out with the BTN, and the Nebraska move was more of Nebraska wanting out of the Big 12 than it was Delany's wit and planning of conference expansion. The man said he could care less about the national title as long as the B1G has the Rose Bowl. Typical UNC Tarhole...

Run_Fido_Run's picture

Delany is no fool. Any successful person will have benefited from a certain amount of luck. We have no way of knowing to what extent success is attributable to intelligence, cunning, hard work, luck, or other factors. Lucky or otherwise, Delany has guided the conference during a highly successful period.

Delany is attempting to protect the valuable BT/Pac12 Rose Bowl property, which is understandable. Even if Delany secretly supported the plus-1 (4 team playoff), it might make sense to pretend otherwise to improve the BT's bargaining position. I don't know if that's his thinking - I'm just saying.    

flipbuckeye's picture

I live about 2 minutes away from that Macy's. True story.

GABuckeye's picture

Any news on the (official) visits this past weekend??

flipbuckeye's picture

Alex posted this in the forums.

GABuckeye's picture

Thanks!  Exciting news!  I can't wait to see how these situations turn out.

BTwrestle04's picture

I need more news. I'm bored to death at work right now.

cplunk's picture

That's work for ya

luckynewman13's picture

If we do eventually get t the "super" conference stage, then we will not need to have more than a 4 team playoff, because all of the conference championship games would basically serve as  another playoff round.

I think this is a good thing becase if we start talking about college kids playing 15, 16, or even 17 games a year, we are putting these players bodies and careers at risk. If we wanted an extended playoff we would have to shorten the regular season, which is an absolute non-starter for the lower tier programs, as they depend on big time non-conference opponenets to pull in extra cash every year.

I hate the BCS as much as anoyone, but when fans give their reasons for wanting a playoff the health and safety of the players rarely gets mentioned, and it should be.

Bucksfan's picture

C'mon.  It's only 1 or 2 more games.  After 10 straight years of getting hit in practice, one or two extra games for only 4 teams is not going to substantially endanger anyone.  Plus, there's already a playoff in the other college football divisions, and they don't seem to be worried about injury.  This is not a rare argument, it comes up all the time.  But it's a nonsense argument perpetuated by conference commissioners and coaches who have to subscribe to the powers-that-be: the Bowls.

luckynewman13's picture

Other divisions have a playoff because-gasp!-they have shorter regular seasons. And, sorry, this is not an argument being brught up by "conference commissioners" and "coaches" this is an argument that is being brought up by the players. Check the NFLPA's stance on the current 4 game re-season schedule and the proposed 18 game regular season schedule.

"After 10 straight years of getting hit in practice, one or two extra games for only 4 teams is not going to substantially endanger anyone."

And I don't know you, but this sounds like it is coming from someone who never played a down of football in his life. Yes, one or two games raises the danger level substantially.

William's picture

The only reason that you have had a spike in head injuries is because players don't know how to tackle. Rugby doesn't have anywhere near the same amount of head injuries that football does, yet few players wear any form of padding or protection. An extra game isn't going to affect or increase the chance of injury as much as improper tackling or play will.

luckynewman13's picture

if this were just about head injuries I would agree with you, but it isn't. And I don't see how telling every coach in the country, "hey, we're going to add games to the schedule, so teach your players how to tackle better" would affect anything. I think every coach since middle school stresses good tackling.

Players launch into other players with their heads and shoulder pads because of the momentum swing a big hit can have on a game situation, it isn't because they are unable or unwilling to form tackle. If we truly cared about these players, we would remove the helmets and shoulder pads because science has proved exatcly what you're saying: players are more cautious and use better technique when the don't have a battering ram attached to their upper torso. But, alas, as fans we don't care about the players. We want these guys flying at each other 100 mph at break neck speed, we want these guys to play all year round because--as Bucksfan noted--these guys have been brutalized for the last 5-10 years and they've done it essentially for free. So what is another 2, 3, 4 games to the schedule?

Do I want to see it? Absolutely. But unless we've played college football at this level, we really have no understanding of what we are asking these players to do.

btalbert25's picture

Yeah and I don't see how you'd ever determine a true champ in a superconference without round robin. That would be what 15 games?  You'd have what 2, 8 team divisions?  There could be 4 teams on the one side better than all 8 on the other side. I just don't see it playing out as a true champ of the conference.  We already have teams in 12 team conferences that don't play the best teams in conference.  You would get a lot of years like how the Big 12 has it every year.  Several teams in the south that are significantly better than those in the north.  Or like how the SEC has played out where 2 or 3 teams in the West are better than the whole east. 

I don't know, being a conference champ should have some significance I guess, but I just can't fathom the idea that you have to be a champ of a shitty conference to get a crack at the title game.  Plus with no at larges you basically turn non conference schedules into one big exhibition.

  

Orlando Buckeye's picture

The "true" champ of a superconference is the one that wins the conference championship game.  You don't need round robin in the same way that you don't need a round robin to determine the National Champion.  If you win your division you get to play for your conference championship.  If half of the teams in your division are better than all the teams in the other division then you should have no trouble beating them in the championship game.  Only one team makes it, it doesn't matter after that unless they are hoping for a Wild Card spot.  In which case I hope they have a good SOS.

btalbert25's picture

I guess I just feel like the best teams should be rewarded for being the best and proving it.  I hate it where a team can get lucky in one game and win the conference when all season long there were 3 better teams in the other division.  That's why I totally disagree with the notion that you have to be a conference champ to be the national champ. 

People all want the regular season to count so much, but upsets do happen in these conference championship games.  If Georgia upset LSU this year and LSU didn't get a shot at a playoff to win the title, but Clemson and West Virginia did, that's just effed up?  Well to me that's a worse system than what we have.  LSU beat 2 conference champs badly and the number 2 team in America as well.  Whether they won the SEC or not is irrelevant, if there's a playoff that team deserves it's shot.  Those are a lot of ifs, but in this conference championship scenario they are left out but 2 teams they embarrassed this year get a shot still?  I'm not down with that at all. 

 

NC_Buckeye's picture

While I would maintain that it's pretty effed up that Georgia might have to beat LSU twice in order to be crowned the national champ. OTH LSU would only have to beat Georgia once in your scenario.

That seems fair.

/sarcasm

btalbert25's picture

That's why I feel if you are using conference champions the conference champs have to be decided by round robin so EVERYONE in the conference plays eachother.  Not a the divisional system where LSU has to fight through Bama and Arkansas, plus tough non conference schedule that they won, and Georgia's stiffest competition came in the form of South Carolina. 

chibuck's picture

So, is this the week we finally hear our fate from the NCAA?

DJ Byrnes's picture

It'd make sense, but I haven't read anything on the matter. MGoBlog will be hysterical tho, no doubt. 

Californian by birth, Marionaire by the Grace of President Warren G. Harding.

BoFuquel's picture

Self imposed death penality,with the the hiring of UM. The NCAA will be satisfied that we destroyed ourselves.May as well have rehired Earl Bruce.A highly reguarded high schooler has already been "punished" for not wanting to practice in bad wheather.It won't take too long till the word gets around, and nobody will want to play for this Socirty Of Jesus inquistor.GO BUCKS!

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

DJ Byrnes's picture

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

Californian by birth, Marionaire by the Grace of President Warren G. Harding.

BuckeyeSki's picture

Drugs?

 

Banned from BlackShoeDiaries since 2008. Crime: Slander/Defamation of Character Judgement: Guilty

chitown buckeye's picture

I often wonder why so many people seem to be against a playoff? I think if there had been a 4-8 team playoff the buckeyes would have been looking at 3 or 4 NC over the last 20 years! Many of the teams in the 90's would have benefitted from a playoff and there is no question the 98 team would have won the title. A playoff system will not deminish the regular season because 1) you want to win every game anyway and shoot for the elusive undefeated season 2) the end of the season would have alot of meaning for teams fighting for the last spot into the dance. The positives to me are the fact we get to see it played out on the field. If you lose a tough game it does not deminish your season. (again think back to 98) 1 loss or not if you ran the table of the playoff you truley deserve to be called National Champions!

"I'm having a heart attack!"

BuckeyeSaab's picture

I am over Jim Delany.

I'm sorry for not being sorry.

3cent's picture

I hope you guys can follow me because what I am about to say makes since I just hope I can explain it on a message board. I have a plan where you can keep the regular season being important (including Out of conference games and conference games), winning conference championships being important, and still have a playoff.

First, the BCS formula needs to be kept. Second there should be 8 teams involved. The first criteria for earning a spot would be to be a conference champion and finish in the top 16 in the poll (and that is for all conferences from the SEC to Sunbelt). If there are more than 8 conference champs in the top 16 then the lowest ranked champs will be left out (I doubt that in any given year that all conference champs will be in the top 16).

But there is a way for a team to get in the playoff without winning the conference.  Obviously not all conference champions will be in the top 16 in the poll. I am pretty sure that in most years (this one included) not all 8 slots will be filled due to conference champs not meeting the criteria. If that is the case then there will be open spots (wild cards) given to the next highest ranked team who was not a conference champ and so on until all eight slots are filled. Once all teams are determined we use the BCS poll again to seed teams. Highest seeds host games until we get to two teams who will play on a neutral bowl sight.

This is how the selection would look this year:
LSU (SEC Champ)
Ok State (Big XII Champ)
Oregon (PAC 12 Champ)
Wisc (B1G Champ)
Clemson (ACC Champ)
3 open wild card slots because Big East, CUSA, MWC, Sun Belt, WAC, MAC, didn’t make the top 16
Bama (1st wild card slot)
Stanford (2nd wild card slot)
Arkansas (3rd wild card slot)

Seeding
1. LSU
2. BAMA
3. Ok State
4. Stanford
5. Ore
6. Arky
7. Wisc
8. Clemson
 

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

While I am extremely anti-playoff, this is something I might be able to be talked into. On the surface, I like this model.

3cent's picture

Thx, glad someone responded. I just think this model keeps the regular season relevent, keeps OOC games important, keeps conference championships important, but at the same time doesn't reward bad conference champs because you have to be at least in the top 16, gives better access to non AQ teams, and may still allow for a hiccup game.

boojtastic's picture

Why is it that playoff proponents think that those not on board are doddering buffoons that choke on split pea soub and lose shouting matches with clouds as we burden society by making relatives--souls crushed by the shattered remnaints of their own abandonned dreams--dab drool from the corners of our mouths and contemplate suffocating us with a pillow? (That may have been a run-on.)

The playoff is not inevitable. The playoff benefits no one. Vive la resistance!

The plus-one system takes all of the worst attributes of a playoff and the worst attributes of the BCS ad crushes them together in an orgy pre-digested ESPN drivel. No playoff!

Another Jason's picture

I think it's because all anti-playoff arguments are bad.  Plus-One isn't great, but it's better than the BCS because >2 teams would be included.  At this point, I'm for whatever the next step has to be.