ET and "The WB"Proving the theory that the conference POY will most likely come from the best player on the best team, Michigan State's Kalin Lucas took home the trophy over Evan Turner in both the Coaches and Media balloting.
That's not to say Kalin Lucas isn't a bad ass in his own right, he's clearly a stud and I love watching him play, but nobody meant more to their team this year than Evan Turner. That's not always the criteria but I'm still mildly surprised Turner didn't at least earn a split based on his impact to the Buckeyes bottom line compared to Lucas. Take Lucas off MSU for the year and take Turner off OSU for the year. Which team still competes for the league title? Exactly.
MSU fans - don't take it as sour grapes. It's not - just a truly unbiased opinion from a guy who watched more than his fair share of Big Ten basketball this year, not just Ohio State.
Take a peak at the conference stats head to head:
| Player | PPG | Asst | A/TO | Reb | FG% | 3FG% | Stl | Min |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Evan Turner | 16.8 (3) | 3.86 (8) | 1.11 (12) | 6.9 (5) | 51.6 (7) | 27.3 (NR) | 1.72 (4) | 36.0 (2) |
| Kalin Lucas | 14.8 (6) | 4.60 (4) | 2.26 (4) | 2.4 (NR) | 41.6 (NR) | 39.5 (8) | .83 (NR) | 31.8 (15) |
Still, I love Lucas and I think Talor Battle was really the only other guy besides Turner who deserved serious consideration. Lucas did say that if he couldn't vote for himself, he votes for Turner.
Turner, of course, did lock down a First Team selection as both the coaches and media agreed on all five selections, all of which are sophomores.
| Player | School | PPG |
|---|---|---|
| Manny Harris | Michigan | 17.1 |
| Kalin Lucas | Michigan State | 14.8 |
| Evan Turner | Ohio State | 16.8 |
| Talor Battle | Penn State | 17.3 |
| JaJuan Johnson | Purdue | 13.2 |
No Buckeyes made second or third team in either the coaches or media ballots but they were still well represented in other areas.
Wil Buford brought home Freshman of the Year honors and B.J Mullens picked up the best Sixth Man trophy. Both also earned spots on the All-Freshman squad. While I hoped Mullens would have a bigger impact this season, he's still a sure fire lottery pick.
Rounding out the Buckeye props, Jon Diebler and Buford picked up Honorable Mention.
Tom Izzo was tabbed as Coach of the Year.
Comments
I hate it when they just pick the coach and best player of the team that wins the conference.
Only in hoops, though. I'll take this opportunity to point out, once more, that Tressel has never won the Big Ten Coach of the Year in football.
Unreal.
What a joke. ET's stat line and value to his team was more important/impressive than Lucas. This should give him a reason to come back... (homer rationalism)
By the way, he has been snubbed for:
Slappy (John L. Smith)
The Zooker
Coach Meathead
and Ron Turner won it in 2001, though we can't say Tressel deserved it that particular year. Just thought it should be mentioned.
Eh. It works both ways. Just ask Laurinaitis.
Touche.
No sour grapes.
I do think if it was a straight MVP award, Turner would have a better case, but the award is "Player of the Year" so I think Lucas deserves it.
As for Izzo wining coach of the year, he was awarded that by fellow coaches, probably because they recognized that MSU had sickness problems all year and they still won the conference by four games and won 8 of 9 road games.
i think lucas had a legit claim to the award. The Villain put up some really really good numbers, but his assists to turnover ratio is not very good at all and he's vanished at times later in the season. if The Villain comes back next year it's his award to lose, but i'm not freaking out that he lost this year
No doubt Lucas is deserving but the numbers not only in conference, but with what Turner meant to his team, I think he's got just as good a case, if not stronger, for player of the year. Whether it's MVP or POY, he singlehandedly won more games than Lucas by a long way. That isn't the only criteria and I really like Lucas. I think it comes down to the voter's individual defintion of player of the year, mvp or whatever.
As for Izzo, he's a great coach and deserved the award. Izzo navigated the team through a good bit of adversity this year.
Vanished at times? I guess that's true to a degree but I think he compensated for that by flat taking over games down the stretch on numerous occasions while his teammates stood around and watched. And to take on the load without the aid of Lighty, as a true sophomore? Very impressive. And taking on the primary ball handler role late in games even though that's not his current skill set? I just think the dude deserves his due. I'm not freaking out - just think he was slighted by not getting a share.
Turner DID get snubbed!!! Turnover ratio comes with the territory from being a one man show 80 to 90% of the time!!!! You take Kalin Lucas off that team and they are STILL B10 champs, plain and simple. Now that I shot that advantage down, whats left?? A tad better 3pt %?? Paaleeeze.
Whatever you wanna call it POY or MVP, ET deserved the BOTH!!!
I think its just an absurd effort from the B10 to take some focus off OSU, and give the impression the whole conf. is strong. I can actually live with that reasoning.
The "Coach" award is questionable too. Thad has an entire NBA team bolt early, five star PG transfer, and lone senior go down, and we still win 20 games. Not to mention, actually improve from last year.
Call me a homer all you want, but looking at the facts, i just cant see where Im so wrong. BUUULLLSHIIIIT!!!
Pretty impressive stuff...
From Lesmerisis' blog:
Here are the individual Ohio State conference award winners under Thad Matta.
First Team All-Big Ten
2006 Terence Dials
2007 Mike Conley, Jr.
2007 Greg Oden
2008 Jamar Butler
2009 Evan Turner
Big Ten Player of the Year
2006 Terence Dials
Big Ten Freshman of the Year
2007 Greg Oden
2009 William Buford
Big Ten Sixth Man of the Year
2007 Daequan Cook
2009 B.J. Mullens
Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year
2007 Greg Oden
All-Big Ten Freshman Team
2007 Greg Oden
2007 Mike Conley, Jr.
2008 Kosta Koufos
2009 William Buford
2009 B.J. Mullens
who cares go win some games.
i mean, i agree with this, but i think spartan was right when he said that if it was an MVP trophy, The Villain wins hands down. POY, there's an argument to be made for lucas. and a lot of The Villain's numbers can be attributed to him playing pretty much nonstop
i dunno. i'm looking at his stats in our losses, and they aren't always flattering. 10 points in 40 minutes against WVU. 8 turnovers against NW. 4 points in 40 minutes against illinoize. no, he's not a point guard, but he's also not as dominant as i think he's made out to be.
i'm not trying to make the point that The Villain is a bad or even simply a good player; he's a great player, and if he had won he would've earned it. but i don't think he's head and shoulders above the other dude to the point where it's a big deal that he lost
and remember, this is coming from a dude who still curses the name of paul posluszny
Does anyone here watch How I Met Your Mother? Ted often wears buckeye shirts, and I was wondering if anyone knows where I can get the one he was wearing in last night's episode. I'm watching it now, and that shirt is pretty sweet. I'll try to remember to upload a pic of it tomorrow morning.
it's actually a lot like this shirt, only all in different shades of red
http://www.homageclothing.com/...
http://img.photobucket.com/alb...
If you think turner got hosed lets take a look at Manny Harris' stat line compared to turner and lucas:
ppg
harris 17.1 (2)
turner 16.8
lucas 14.8
asst pg
harris 4.29 (6)
turner 3.86 (8)
lucas 4.6(4)
a/to
harris 1.3 (10)
turner 1.1 (11)
lucas 2.26 (4)
reb
harris 7 (4)
turner 6.9 (5)
lucas 2.5 (NR)
fg%
harris 41 (NR)
turner 51 (7)
lucas 41 (NR)
3fg%
harris 31 (NR)
turner 27 (NR)
lucas 39.5 (8)
Min
harris 33 (10)
turner 36 (2)
lucas 31 (15)
Harris beat out turner in ever statistical category except for fg% and minutes. So enough wining about how he deserved it the most. the same argument goes for harris about taking him off the team cause michigan wouldve been terrible without him, and beilein should be in more consideration for coach of the year than thad as he took an 11-20 team and turned them into a potential tourney team. HOMER CITY on this blogosphere
By the way, Josh Radnor who plays Ted on the show is from Bexley. His character on the show is also from Ohio, and he does wear a lot of Buckeye gear.
you make a good point, but complaining about HOMER CITY is stupid, it's a freaking collegiate sports blog not the new york times. of course there's going to be a home team bias.
That was a well thought out and very informative post Go Blue, now get the hell out of here and back under the rock you crawled from!
Manny Harris had some good numbers this year and yes, if you take him off Michigan, they probably win about 4-5 conference games. However, I have always felt that the team needs to finish above .500 in order to be considered for POY.
We can all only hope that these four players return for their junior seasons next year and staged an all out battle for POY.
Another thing to take from these awards. BJ Mullens won 6th man of the year, but failed to be on any All-Conference teams, which should tell him about his NBA preparedness.
I know the NBA drafts on potential, but are you really a lottery pick if you can't be classified as one of the top 23 players in your conference?
How is Turner the only unanimous selection by the Media (Lucas wasn't) but he doesn't win their POY?
I would probably have voted for Turner too, but I hate that argument "take both players off their team and...". You shouldn't punish Lucas just because his teamates are be better players.
Go back to your sewer that is Ann Arbor and get ready for another embarssing season in the "Big House." I fart in your general direction.
and even if you do buy into that argument, if michigan makes the NCAA tourney harris comes out on top in that line of thinking.
the fact that lucas put up the numbers that he did, surrounded by the players he was, and doing it while averaging 4.2 minutes less than The Villain per game is a pretty strong endorsement for him to at least be considered for POY.
You can't fault the guy for wanting to be on 11W...he has forgotten what it is like to win and for a moment wanted to see what success was like. Now go back and blow Rich Rod.
I wasn't attempting to punish Lucas - only trying to make a case for Turner. And that case is strongly rooted in what he did in games Ohio State won. Without him they were garbage. I don't think you can ignore that as part of the criteria. That said, Lucas showed up in big games too, he just had a better supporting cast so he wasn't forced to play with such pressure. You gotta admit its easier to play when you aren't saddled by the fact it's all on you every game. Plus, I just felt the versatility he showed, playing nearly position on the court at one time or another really deserved some player of the year love. My argument was for a split, not Turner winning unanimously or anything. As for Harris, his team fell short of over .500 and I think that means something. Just my $.02.
Watch out guys. He may have to resort to that 'education' and try to outhink you. Lord knows he has no argument in the sports arena, otherwise he would be gargling with hippie balls over on MGoblog.com
Wins head-to-head:
Turner 2
Harris 0
Sadly I'm going to have to agree with Go Blue (moment of pause while I vomit)
Manny Harris was on the worst team of the 3. Lucas had TONS of help and Turner had occasional (even if inconsistant) help.
Harris getting his team to the Big Dance (most likely) is probably the most impressive thing any of the 3 have done.
You could say Northwestern's coach was snubbed. They have never made the dance and he took them the closest they have ever been. That said, nobody is impressed when you "almost make it."
I guess I just see the POY award more as the best player in the conference rather than the most valuable to his team. I think the award is deliberately not defined though, so that every voter can use their own criteria.
If by "take both players off their team and..." you meant Turner has more pressure on him due to fewer offensive options then I agree you have to consider that. But I also feel that Lucas would have better stats on a worse team. The increase in opportunities more than makes up for the decrease in pressure on the player as far as stat numbers go. Take Garnett for example. I don't think his performance has gone down that significantly since joining the celtics, but looking at his stats you would think it has.
I hear you. Like you said, it's a matter of interpretation as to criteria and then you gotta factor in the supporting cast one way or the other. I think it can be argued that Turner was not only most valuable but also the best player though I certainly respect your interpretation. Neither is wrong. Again, as you said, they purposely don't define criteria which triggers these debates.
Don't you think he has a lot of money to lose if he has another year (or three) similar to his freshmen year? By "potential", it is meant that he could grow into a productive player OR he could not. If it turns out that it is false potential then he sure as hell should enter the draft asap before his ceiling starts to shrink.
Basically if he stays he could grow into a top 5 pick, making a lot more money, or fall into a late first round pick. Leaving now is like taking insurance against the latter option.
Your brother is influencing you too much Wil.
He should be FIRED for recruiting that well!!!
I want mediocre recruits that stay all four and go .500 and barely make the dance.
Not.
BJ would be a fool not to turn pro.
Why does everyone feel they have to apologize for being a homer??
Just go with it man.
Its not like Mgoblue isnt flooded with homers, their just less cocky with it right now because of the ass whoopins and all.
Let em get a few wins under their huge belts, they'll be all over this site.
no one has to apologize for being a homer and rooting for the buckeyes above other teams, that'd be ridiculous. but if you (not you specifically) claim to be a fan of a sport and then ignore valid arguments about said sport because you're afraid of looking bad in front of your fellow fans... well, you're dumb.
i think it's a whole lot more irritating when OSU fans have to apologize for NOT being a homer all the time and in every situation
*unless it's poguemahone, who is generally just a pain in the ass
hahah just kidding
kind of
Mullens should not turn pro. If he does he'd have to compete in the draft with the likes of other big men like Hansbrough, Thabeet, and DaJuan Blair. (Assuming the last two decide to come out.) Not only is he not among the top players in the conference, he's not even one of the top three center's in this year's class.
The HOMER CITY was a joke...have a little humor. I like this blog thats why I read it and post on it. It is funny however how someone makes an informative statement and most responses are go F yourself. I just was stating another fact before all you OSU fans get your panties in a bundle over turner not recieving the award.
Ill repeat myself I was kidding about the HOMER CITY. Everyones in some form a homer. If not, then youre just a bystander and not a fan of your team.
POY is not only about stats....it's about being the best player in the conference...I think it was Chris who said take Turner off his team and Lucas of his team and see which team is still competing for the conference title....Take Manny harris off Michigan and they are still NIT bound...I am not going to say Turner deserves it any more than Lucas, but I will say they BOTH and Talor Battle deserve it over Harris....without turner OSU is NIT bound and not a Tournament team!
Mullens should go pro and here is why. While I have come to school to study sports management, he has come to school to play basketball. I cannot make a living without getting my degree and he cannot make a living without getting drafted or signed (and makes the most money by being an early draft pick). Whether you think he is ready or not, he is going to be a lottery pick because he is a 7-foot big man who can run the floor. Look how many solid NCAA players were not drafted or selected in the second round because underclassman or hyped up Euro stars were taken in front of them due to potential. The NBA is a league that thrives on athleticism and measurable rather then results and will continue to draft based on what they think a player will be like 2-3 years down the road rather than what they can give you this year. There are some instances where you need instant impact (Durant, Rose) on your team and you go with the more ready talent, but it works out the other way too (see: Wilson Chandler, Daequan Cook, Rajon Rondo).
I hope he comes back, but I can't blame him if he leaves!
I still think scUM is bound for the NIT-I really think they need to win 1 game in the B10 tourny
Agreed.
As to Harris v. ET, I think the lack of consideration for Manny is his inconsistency. Not to say ET was not subject so similar ups and downs but Manny had 6pts in a loss to PSU, 5pts in a loss to PU, 9 in a loss to Iowa and 9 pts in a loss to Wisky. ET's downs were maybe less egregious in the voters mind's, 4pts in a loss to Illinois and a bland 6 pts in 38 minutes in a win vs. PSU. Also, ET has 165 buckets to Manny's 161 with 70 fewer attempts. Manny has 44 3pts made this year to ET's 9...a clear sign ET is toting the ball a hell of a lot to have that many buckets with that few 3pters. Manny is a hell of a player though, it is too bad (for you) he doesn't have the shooters around him that ET does.
Cheers to you sir, enjoy your first trip to the tourney in the 21st century.
Nah, I was using the same comparison that I used justifying why Lebron should have won the MVP last year.
And after further analysis I think I would have Lucas 4th behind Turner, Harris, and Battle.
Not sure how I would have chosen between those 3.
...... yea
Man, you guys really, really hate me for proving you wrong and sullying your precious internets reputations, don't you? Lighten up. Everyone is wrong once in a while, and shouldn't be ashamed of getting called on it.
Don't forget 15pts against UCONN in a loss, 15pts against UCLA in a win and 17pts against Duke in a win. Turner is a good player and responsible for the position the Bucks are in right now, that being said Harris did everything for UM, Sims progressed well through the season and has really come on strong at the end of the season, other than that it has been nothing but sporadic 3pt shooting in support.
If Manny has an off day then UM loses, If Turner struggles so will OSU but a win is not out of the question.
let me know how the nit goes for ya.
Mullens is the most talented guy in the conference. He just needs to develop. So ya the nba drafts on what might happen not how well they played in their first year of college.
Bottom line is every michigan fan would trade harris for turner anyday.
c'mon. Pogue keeps everyone on their toes. Sounds like you just got your stepped on thats all. LOL
DISSENT IN THE RANKS
but seriously, i've got no beef with pogue, i was just yanking his chain a little
Coolio. Now get off my lawn.
Yea, but if you have a point you believe is valid and it is pro-Buckeye, then you get called a homer. Even though you may also agree with some points that may not be so favorable about your team.
I guess every fan who has a "team", has a little homer in them.
And thats..... OK.
Whos better me my Soph. year or ET?
Sorry Turner, but I gotta go with Redd his soph year.
Hey dont get ahead of yourself here and jinx us. We need to beat Iowa before michigan goes to the tourney. Thanks for the ealry congrats tho. I hope it is worth it (meaning we dont lose to Iowa)