Whether or not this ends up being the correct decision, the WAY that this was handled was a jumbled PR mess, and there is no excuse for that.
IF you're committed to doing this, lead up with strong public statements demonstrating that you're taking extra steps to ensure player safety, don't release a schedule in the week leading up to cancellation, and have a coherent message following the decision for cancellation
Freddie and Fitzsimmons made an interesting point today by quoting Urban, who would limit Spring contact reps for players who played 1000+ reps in the prior season, the idea being that players would need that span to fully recover from the abuse of a full season.
The idea that this is cancellation is about player safety, when back-to-back Spring & Fall seasons have been put forward, is so disingenuous it's disgusting.
This doesn't make sense to me. I hope that it's true!
Do you mind providing further thoughts?
This just makes too much sense. I'm really curious from any lawyers on the board, are there laws/statutes preventing such a waiver from holding weight? I just have to imagine that there are some intricacies that we're not seeing.
I have to think that we don't have a good picture of what is driving these decisions to postpone. I appreciate that there may be bars to circumventing a number of liabilities. I can (although don't personally believe) that the health risks are much greater than the numbers would suggest, in part because I don't imagine that the NBA, MLB, or even NCAA were ignoring their bottom lines when they decided to postpone/cancel.
Even if these are true, the B1G loyalty provides further trash optics, and make it hard to think that money isn't driving this. IF other conferences even get 2 games in, I imagine the effect will be an SMU like death sentence for all PAC12 and B1G teams.
What I can't understand is why now? I'm genuinely curious if anybody on this board has insights, because the optics just suck! If cancellation is inevitable, why not do it in step with other leagues?
Being a Buckeye is sometimes maddening! I really wonder if our shortcomings have nothing to do with a single person that has stepped foot in the Woody, and entirely stem from a PR department run by an incompetent lifer. Auburn after Cam's father confirmed that he received payment: "yes, but Cam Newton hasn't admitted that he knew"... blows over. Compare that to Urban, having done nothing wrong, having to read a disingenuous sounding statement from OSU's PR department written at an 8th grade level, admitting to an inaccurate Facebook post from a hack journalist.
To clarify, I imagine that a basketball player wouldn't be able to touch a ball handled by pro soccer player. Apologies for the ambiguity in my statement.
I hear what you're saying. I'm genuinely curious, do you not perceive growing interest and participation in soccer in the US? From the outside, it seems like fandom, participation, and the number and intensity of youth leagues have been increasing for a long time.
Also want to say that your post makes me wonder how many Europeans, Africans, etc would make amazing football players, and instead wash out as awkward soccer players.
I don't think that anyone would disagree that different sports, let alone different positions in a single sport, reward different types of abilities, types of athleticism, or body types.
The arguments from you and Miami in this thread, like: "forget football as a comparison because it's a sport where you have a TON of guys who aren't even necessarily hand-eye skilled" are beyond asinine and inaccurate to the point of ignorance, but I'll respond to them again nonetheless. No, soccer does not require more skill than football, basketball, baseball, hockey, etc. Soccer demands a specific skill set, and people who grow up playing it tend to have more developed soccer skills than those who focus on other sports. Since you brought him up earlier in the thread, if you watch Russell Westbrook and conclude that he gets by entirely on being faster than other people on the court, then don't seem baffled if someone makes an equally stupid assertion that soccer is just toeing a ball and running after it.
Having lived in New Zealand, I would say that the reason that they, a country with 4 million people, are routinely number 1 in rugby, is because they are diehard passionate and start playing the game from the time they can stand, so that by the time they start playing competitively, the skills of the game are ingrained as instincts.
Unrelatedly and more importantly, even as a new poster I feel that it's reasonable to say, don't do this: "Hate to say it, but by and large, from a physical perspective, black men are better "athletes" than whites."
Russell Westbrook is the epitome of an athlete who has spent his life crafting his skill. Where this thread gets ridiculous is with arguments like this implying that soccer is skill intensive, while other sports simply require speed or strength.
I'm pretty sure that Westbrook could keep the best living soccer playing from touching a basketball as he walked down a court. I assume that the same would be true in reverse if he were trying to take a soccer ball from any professional soccer player.
I think you're using athleticism too narrowly. It's not just how fast you run or how high you jump, but the broader ability to precisely control your movements, as well as kinesthetic awareness. Punting and kicking are prime examples of this. Most people do not have the makeup to punt like a Pat McAfee, and I think he's a perfect example of someone who could have focused on soccer, but built a career in football instead. Going further, would you say that Steph Curry's shooting ability isn't due to his athleticism. A lot of people have dedicated tens of thousands of hours to perfecting their shot. Very few have come remotely close to him, I would say because he possesses a different level of athletic ability.
Taking your point to an extreme, is the reason we're sub par in rugby not due to a shortage of our best athletes? I think the last time the All Blacks came to the states they won 84-6, or something like that. Rugby is an extremely cerebral and ability intensive sport, but be honest. We're not catching up to New Zealand by focusing more on skill development. We're catching up with New Zealand if more of our Lamar Jackson-type athletes grow up playing and decide to pursue rugby.
It's especially crazy when you look at WHO they beat:
Texas State (3-9)
Ole Miss (4-8)
Mississippi State (6-7)
S. Carolina (4-8)
Oklahoma State (8-5)
They beat 1 team with a winning record, and no team that ended the season ranked.
Are they a talented team? Definitely, but preseason #13, after beating ONE team with a winning record!?! Baylor beat that same team, by the way, and are unranked.
Every #$&!@ year! SEC teams don't have to do anything to start top 15. Florida beat Virginia by 8 and Miami by 4. Am I missing any strong resume points? Georgia beat ND by 6 at home, didn't belong on the same field as a real title contender in LSU, and then had a decent bowl win against Baylor. And what is up with Auburn being 7 spots higher than the Minnesota team that just beat them!?!
I think that it could especially matter this year when there are no interconference games for comparison. Can you imagine if there's no playoff? 100% chance that the AP national championship goes to an SEC team; maybe to Georgia, for beating a top 10 Kentucky team by 2 at home, barely losing to LSU by 27, and compiling good wins against top 25 South Carolina, Vanderbilt, and Missouri
That team should have a national championship
For people who follow Pittsburgh, why did it take Cam a couple of years to come into his own in the league? Was it just more exposure, a scheme or position change?
I'm hoping that the Latham turn around really was due to his mom. The JTT saga is going to be interesting to follow, for sure.
The important thing is that we can agree that neither would leave the program looking like this
Goin' by the 247 player comparisons which liken Payne to A'Shawn Robinson and Malone to Malik Jackson.
Regardless, should all be good players.
Pure speculation and interested in your thoughts. I wondered how much of Payne's recruitment came down to perceived fit. I see Bama as the premier program for developing huge, 2-gap tackles who are on the field to wipe out blocking schemes (and when healthy, make Georgia's run game look absolutely childish (btw can't stand the Dawgs)). Payne looks like the next one.
I don't think LJ wants to develop 330 pound linemen, and instead tries to 4 put down linemen on the field who are looking to shoot gaps.
Doesn't sound like OSU was too far in on Payne's recruitment, but it could have been augmented by Johnson valuing different traits.
For me, the metric is that the booth had minutes to sit on the Dobbins injury play with an indisputable helmet to helmet from Xavier Thomas, and ... crickets ... more time to watch the play while Dobbins is being checked out on the field ... crickets.
Just following the letter of the law I guess
I've just never been able to imagine that we showed up even at 50% for that game. We handled a d-line with Lamar Woodley and Alan Branch fine, we handled a d-line with Brian Orakpo and Frank Okam fine, we handled a top 10 defense in Penn State fine, but we couldn't handle a Florida defense with a front four who collectively did nothing in the NFL?
Maybe Florida still beats us if we actually showed up and didn't look like a team that had taken a 51 day vacation, but I don't think we were ever going to win that day with the state the team was in, even without the Ginn injury.
This rant has given me my answer. I'll trade a LOT of plays to rewrite Ryan Hamby's drop in the 2005 Texas game. That 2005 team should have played USC for the national championship. Man! Hawk, Carpenter, and Whitner against Leinart and Bush. Mangold against Sedrick Ellis. Ginn and Holmes against two cornerbacks who went undrafted and two 220lb safeties (can you imagine how satisfying this one would have been!?)
While you're here, can you explain the SEC pride thing to us?
For a school like Bama, why not stand solely behind your name? Does SEC feel larger than 17 titles?
For schools like Tennessee, is SEC pride any different than a grown man's version of 'my dad's friend could beat up your dad'?
Btw, really enjoyed the video, thanks for sharing.
As far as I'm aware, the only fanbase to ever throw snowballs at Santa Claus:
I am so sick of this being touted as a 'fact' by fans of the team up north. Over the last decade, OSU has consistently been penalized more heavily than TTUN, and still managed to win, so the analogy to Clemson does not hold.
There have definitely been bad or questionable calls that have gone both ways, but no they have not consistently gone against Michigan. From our fanbase's perspective, Don Brown's defense is predicated on his defensive backs holding opposing receivers downfield, and TTUN fans see any game where they're not allowed to do that as a screwjob. In 2015 Michael Thomas had 2 catches against Jourdan Lewis. Do you think an impartial observer would have watched that game and concluded that Michael Thomas simply went up against a better player that day? Compare that to Amarah Darboh, who over two years pulled in nearly 200 yards against 4 1st round draft picks at corner back against OSU. Are you saying that if the refs hadn't inserted themselves into the game that Darboh would have even better numbers?
Anyways, here are the penalty and penalty yard numbers from each year over the last decade. Please explain to me why a fairly refereed decade would have resulted in a greater penalty yards disparity than the 647-482 that went in favor of Michigan.
Year - (Penalties-Yards)
2010 - OSU 7-81 // UM 4-35
2011 - OSU 5-47 // UM 3-29
2012 - OSU 9-74 // UM 5-54
2013 - OSU 3-25 // UM 4-35
2014 - OSU 9-84 // UM 4-38
2015 - OSU 5-39 // UM 7-72
2016 - OSU 2-6 // UM 7-59
2017 - OSU 9-75 // UM 6-50
2018 - OSU 12-150 // UM 7-72
2019 - OSU 7-66 // UM 5-38
Here's a nice article summarizing the crazy 2011 off-season.
If you find yourself in need of some sane, rational, reassuring grounding during these crazy times, please refer to the summaries of Alabama, Auburn, LSU, and Boise State's offseasons, and take solace in the fact that the NCAA refused to stand for Boise State's transgressions against college football's sacrosanct rules.
2011 definitely exposed a bit of an underbelly in the program. I still cannot understand how certain areas had slipped so much in Tressel's final years. Even if you go back and watch Beanie highlights, many of them start with him dodging defenders who had pushed our O-lineman into the backfield. I remember Urban being incredibly vocal about the inexcusable state of the OL and receivers in his first offseason.
Having said that, Tressel's legacy may have been cemented by a full strength 2011 team, which at a minimum would have made the BCS championship game against LSU. 5 of our 6 regular season losses were by less than a touchdown, with the lone exception being a 6-24 loss to Miami in a game where Bauserman netted 13 passing yards on 12 attempts.
To rub salt in the festering wound that was the 2011 season, we watched the SEC waltz around LSU and Auburn getting caught paying tens of thousands of dollars to Lache Seastrunk's booster, and of course the beginning of Cam Newton's saga.
Thank you for putting this together! I've previously searched for Robert Smith highlights without success.
I'd love some insight from fans who remember better. 1992 has always stood out to me as a season where a few different bounces could have lead us to an undefeated season and Rose Bowl berth. What was that team missing?