Civil Protection Order Filed Against Zach Smith, Records Show History of Domestic Violence Allegations

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bennyhana311's picture

Oh wow. He gone.

Football is, after all, a wonderful way to get rid of your aggressions without going to jail for it.
- Woody Hayes

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Chic'sGhost's picture

Territorial Operations Alert Scramble Thesis

TOAST

"You're welcome for the house I built."

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McGrind's picture

First guy to leave a job saying “I will be leaving my position to spend less time with my family” 

If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear.

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WorthyBuck's picture

Kinda makes a mockery of Coach Meyer’s core value of respecting women if Smith remains with the team.  There is clearly a patrern here, even without a conviction. 

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shiloh's picture

During the best of times, but w/Ohio State currently embroiled with other legal scandals/entanglements his timing couldn't be worse.

Smith picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue er have all of his previous dirty laundry revealed.

$$$ will be exchanged and he will quietly disappear ...

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. ~ Mark Twain

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TJG32's picture

At 5:10pm, Smith’s lawyer will be on 105.7 The Zone with Matt McCoy.  Listen in people. 

TG Proud Buckeye alumnus.

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shiloh's picture

ok, $$$ will be exchanged and he will loudly disappear, but his coaching career will also probably disappear!

The old joke ~ when did you stop beating your wife?

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. ~ Mark Twain

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TJG32's picture

Just need to here all the facts before making judgment. All we have heard is her side. Just listened to his lawyer. He had some very interesting comments. The good thing is all this will be heard in court August 3rd. So the FACTS will come out. 

TG Proud Buckeye alumnus.

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82spencer's picture

If these allegations are true, and I can’t see how they aren’t, Smith should be fired immediately for it and Urban should be fired for keeping him on the staff all these years. 

I don't believe in no-win scenarios

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PhillyNut's picture

Not once was he actually tried in a court of law and found guilty.  Yes, the wife refused to press charges but to go to the extent of saying fire Meyer is just beyond reasonable consideration at this point.  In fact the school probably needs to be careful about firing Smith directly as a result of this.  The look is not good but he has not even been tried on anything let alone found guilty.  This is one where they need to do the proverbial "going in a different direction".

I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!

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TheBadOwl's picture

I mean, there's no way Urban didn't know about this (for literal years) and he kept him on the staff while parading around his 'respect women, no violence against women' values. 

Smith needs to be gone by the end of the day, and Urban's should take a lot of heat for it. Fireable? Maybe. Not sure how Urban can explain keeping Smith around – where he's in a role where he's shaping young men – when there's a public record of Smith being an abuser. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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SilvioDante's picture

Simple, he was never found guilty of DV. The same way he kept Barrett on the team and the same way he let Storm Klein back. Because neither were guilty.

It sounds horrible. DV against a pregnant woman. He was never tried though, or charges were dropped, so to make it back and white, he's not guilty.

That's how Meyer justifies it. And he will too.

Meyer won't fire him. He may force a resignation, but Meyer will not come out and publicly condemn Zach Smith. I guarantee it.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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Fatpants's picture

“I like to let the legal process play out before making a decision that can have such a big effect on a person’s life”

PG <3 PG

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TheBadOwl's picture

Simple, he was never found guilty of DV. 

I know someone who was in an abusive relationship for years and still has lasting scars from it. She tried to get a restraining order and didn't have it granted. After a lot of different tries, she finally succeeded in leaving the relationship. To this day, the thought of pressing charges is terrifying to her, because she doesn't want to see that piece of shit ever again or re-live that trauma.

Obviously the criminal justice system works that way for a reason – and I wouldn't know where to start in fixing it for this particular issue – but stories like that are why I'm always a bit queasy when that's the explanation of keeping someone around – even if a lack of legal guilt makes it legally difficult or impossible to dismiss them from that position. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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SilvioDante's picture

Bad Owl, I get your take on this issue. Pretty evident.

I'm not justifying it. I'm saying that's HOW Urban has justified it and will justify it.

Plus, it sounds like Urban was trying to push Smith out for sometime now.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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JTFor President2016's picture

Exactly. Maybe Urban did make a mistake. But there are justifying reasons that will keep him clean. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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SilverHaven's picture

"I get your take"? 
What Bad Owl said is illogical: "I know someone who was in an abusive relationship for years and still has lasting scars from it." So if "someone" is guilty, therefore Coach Zach is guilty. 
Let's view Coach Zach on the facts in evidence for his own case. He may be guilty and should then be punished, but not for someone else's crimes.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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TheBadOwl's picture

What Bad Owl said is illogical: "I know someone who was in an abusive relationship for years and still has lasting scars from it." So if "someone" is guilty, therefore Coach Zach is guilty. 

That wasn't remotely my point.

My point was that domestic violence often goes unpunished in the legal system – but the lack of charges or a conviction doesn't mean that the act itself didn't happen, and that it's easy to underestimate the impact of those actions. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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SilverHaven's picture

Bad Owl said: "My point was that domestic violence often goes unpunished."

So do we punish Coach Zach for others going unpunished?  Let's look at his own sad situation.

(And none of your DVs are from me.)

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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beavis's picture

if he wasn't tried or convicted of anything - what could urban really "know". now that there is a protection order against zach smith, that is something that can be acted upon.

beavis

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StickeyIckeyWoods's picture

Urban is looking like the preacher who doesn’t practice

open your mind

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cricejr's picture

This is completely out of line.  Meyer isn't the one charged with anything so your analogy is garbage. Furthermore, I don't understand why people keep saying Meyer HAD to know about this....why?  He doesn't live with Smith, charges were never filed, we don't know anything about the capacity that Smith has had her around the other coaches, and Smith isn't going to be like "yeah, I smacked my wife around today."  People just love to make assumptions or jump to conclusions without knowing even a smidgen of the facts, it's pretty pathetic. 

I bleed scarlet...literally

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TheBadOwl's picture

Furthermore, I don't understand why people keep saying Meyer HAD to know about this....why? 

The 11w staff knew about it, why wouldn't his boss? 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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BucknutinNC's picture

The 11W staff new about this? Really? Yea thats right I remember reading all those reports for the past 6 years here on the sight? Come on man, thats not an accurate statement at all.

A.E. Porter

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Monclovabuckeye's picture

I remember a few years ago a simple case of some players receiving free tats that ended up bringing down a successfull college football coach.

I don't give a damn for the whole state of Xichigan.

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CALPOPPY's picture

The 11W staff new about this? Really?

See the comment below by the owner of the site.

Memento mori

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TTUN@SS@SIN's picture

“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.” - Mark Twain

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DibbleDabble's picture

step back from the cliff, 82.  She never filed charges in 2009 when this incident occurred.  Smith showed horrible judgement dropping his son off at her apartment, after being warned BY THE COURT not to show up there, regardless of the circumstances, which in my opinion is enough to warrant his firing; however, to accuse Urban of fault in this case is silly in my opinion.  If Urban washes his hands of Zach immediately, like by the end of today, then justice is served and we move on.  Urban has set a tone and culture that he needs to not only embrace, but act on immediately - and I think he will, now that previous allegations are now in the public forum. 

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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TheBadOwl's picture

If Urban washes his hands of Zach immediately, like by the end of today, then justice is served and we move on.

Man, I love what Urban's done for Ohio State and how he's publicly carried himself, but he was the coach at Florida in 2009 – there's no way he wouldn't have been aware of the first incident – and obviously was here in 2015, when the second incident flared up. Not axing him after either of those incidents is really damn bad on his part. 

Urban has set a tone and culture that he needs to not only embrace, but act on immediately - and I think he will, now that previous allegations are now in the public forum.

Yes, he should be fired now.

I'd like to point out, though, that if that Urban Meyer genuinely cares about that culture you mentioned, he would have acted when he first found out, not when the media reported it. Waiting for the bad deed to be reported – and only acting on it then – is how we get the Jerry Sanduskys and Larry Nassars of the world.

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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DibbleDabble's picture

you assume too much.  your opinion is just that, your opinion. 

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

I think it’s important to point out that Dec of 2009 is when Coach Meyer began to suffer from a lot of anxiety and health issues, and he announced his first resignation from FL. Coincidence? I doubt it. My guess is there were many issues eating at his conscience, players & coaches. I doubt that he was comfortable with what was going on. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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GoBuckeyes1020's picture

Get what you are saying here but if it was eating at him in 2009 then why bring him to Columbus in 2012? If it was loyalty to Coach Bruce then come out this afternoon and state just that and that he was trying to give Smith a second chance on a short leash. His pay alone suggests he has been treated differently than other coaches. The fact that there are more than one instances of this behavour (charges filed or not) over the last decade is troubling. I am guessing you will see swift action today before Meyer faces the media tomorrow morning in Chicago.

The pain of discipline or the pain of regret, take your pick

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

I’m guessing there’s more to this story than we’ll ever know. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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beavis's picture

or need to know. 

really, OSU has a choice now - keep smith or get rid of him. i would vote to let him go but my vote doesn't count. what i think is ridiculous is reading comments that are trying to turn this into a witch hunt and destroy UFM. the guy has done a solid job for OSU - he deserves better than that.

i'm just looking forward to the season.

beavis

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lamplighter's picture

This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.

peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
 

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BuckeyeinFlorida's picture

Ok state has a very accomplished WR coach. This is a major step up. I will find the link to the top position coaches and add it.

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BuckeyeinFlorida's picture

I couldn't find the link to the 247.com story I read 2 days ago with top assistants but this is good too.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/247sports.com/Article/College-footballs-ris...

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GoBuckeyes1020's picture

That is a certainty! Hate this crap

The pain of discipline or the pain of regret, take your pick

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CincyBuck's picture

You're making a lot of assumptions.  I think it's entirely realistic that Urban was unaware of a lot of this stuff until just recently.

That said, I agree that, if he was aware, it's pretty dang hypocritical.  We suspended Hyde, what, 3-4 games, despite video evidence disproving the alleged victim's claims, essentially because of poor judgment?  Even if the evidence of these incidents was slim to non-existent, you'd think the mere fact that they happened would warrant a longer suspension for Smith -- if not release.

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stxbuck's picture

He was unaware that his staff member at Florida was charged (even if not convicted) of felony assault? To quote Cris Carter "C'mon man"!!!

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CincyBuck's picture

I think that's entirely realistic, yes (that Urban didn't know about much, if not all, of this stuff).  DV often (if not usually) goes on behind closed doors.  Both sides are often mum for years out of fear, shame, etc.  I doubt this is the kind of thing that Smith wanted everyone to know about. 

And I suspect "Zachary Smith" is the type of name that has 1,000s of open cases -- it took me quite some time to find the docket in Gainesville.  Guy gets arrested, nobody knows who the random GA is, and then released the next morning.  It'd be pretty easy to cover that up. 

I've known and worked with people who have shockingly dark pasts of which I (and others) were completely unaware until something hit the proverbial fan.  And, suffice it to say, Urban Meyer was probably far busier at that time than anyone I'm talking about.

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beavis's picture

why is your crusade directed at meyer. in all your posts, you  have spent not time questioning why the police/courts in 2 different states didn't prosecute and convict smith. oh, that's right, it's much more fun going after a big-name person like meyer - right owl?

beavis

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CALPOPPY's picture

why is your crusade directed at meyer.

Mostly what I get from Owl is not a crusade against Meyer...it is a crusade directed against ignorance.

Memento mori

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DibbleDabble's picture

Yet Calpoppy, Owl's first comments, his first sentence in his first post in this thread was the following:

"I mean, there's no way Urban didn't know about this (for literal years) and he kept him on the staff while parading around his 'respect women, no violence against women' values. "

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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TheBadOwl's picture

Per Jason's comment, 11W has known about the 2009 and 2015 reports for a few years. What are the chances they knew something about one of Urban's long-time employees that Urban himself did not know?

To be clear; I am not calling for Urban to be fired. He hasn't told us exactly what he knows, when he found out and why he kept Smith around as long as he did. If those answers are found to be unsatisfactory (or left unanswered) and we learn more of the extent of Smith's alleged abuse, I'll personally have a very hard time justifying cheering for a team led by someone who didn't confront an employee's domestic violence head-on.

In my opinion, having someone who enabled a domestic abuser running the university's flagship would do far more harm to the university's reputation than the benefits of Meyer's on-field results – and that's before getting into whether or not he'd deserve to keep his job at that point.

That's not all information we have now – and Urban's statement (or lack thereof) will end up being a big part of this. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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CincyBuck's picture

Per Jason's comment, 11W has known about the 2009 and 2015 reports for a few years. What are the chances they knew something about one of Urban's long-time employees that Urban himself did not know?

This is a fair take.  Though I agree with others that the lack of contemporaneous reporting is a bit odd.  Regardless, Urban and Gene should have some tough questions heading their way.

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Earle's picture

a crusade directed against ignorance.

And a quixotic, yet noble crusade it is.

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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okiebuck's picture

Owl; to compare this to Sandusky and Nassar is just plain BS.

The only hard day was yesterday

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TheBadOwl's picture

Not comparing the crimes – especially since Smith legally hasn't been convicted – but rather saying that figures who don't hold employees (and, in this case, public employees) accountable for their distasteful (and, in these cases, heinous) actions, and keeping those actions out of the public eye, in an effort to reap the results they deliver professionally, allows for abusers to stay around and continue to abuse. 

The cases here are certainly different as far as the crimes themselves, but there were a lot of people who knew about Nassar and Sandusky and didn't say anything. This is the third (!!) complaint against Zach Smith. The fact that 11W knew about the first two would certainly suggest that Urban and Gene did for a long time as well. To take no action then is morally reprehensible at best. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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cricejr's picture

So now this is comparable with Sandusky and Nassar?????  That is quite the leap; talk about false equivalence!  But please, regale us with when Meyer knew all the details, since you obviously know all the details. 

I bleed scarlet...literally

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TheBadOwl's picture

I am not saying Zach Smith is either of those men, nor am I saying that Urban is Joe Paterno. 

I am saying that I don't want Ohio State to be an institution that, after both of those high profile cases, thinks that it can get hire/allow people with allegations like this to remain employed until the media gets wind/starts publishing. Putting winning above ethics and decency is how those schools got into those situations.

Again, the staff here at 11W has known about the 2009 and 2015 incidents for a while. That means that Urban and Gene likely did as well. 

I may not be phrasing it in the best way – not saying that these are equal – but I am saying that it shows that Ohio State isn't immune to some of the institutional failings that led to Nassar and Sandusky running amok at their respective institutions. Moreover, Ohio State is in the midst of two similar scandals (in wrestling and diving), so perhaps my point would be better framed as Ohio State football not being immune to those failings, rather than the university. 

So, again, not equal. But, had it not been for last week's incident with Zach Smith, how much longer would the past two incidents stay hidden from public view? How much longer would he stay at OSU – and in a position where his job is to mentor teenagers into young men – without Ohio State taking action? 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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SilverBullet-98's picture

Urban owed Earle.
Earle is gone.
So is Smith.

"The Past Builds the Future"

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BucknutinNC's picture

Here you go, convicting Meyer with no evidence to support your opinion. You dont have any clue whay Meyer did or didnt know.

I have worked with people that at worked were very competent and professional and I knew mothing about their lives outside of work. I had no idea they were criminals until one day they didn't show up to work and I found out they had been arrested. Why didn't I know? Because its not my job to police my co-workers away from the job. As long as they perform their duties at work that's all I judged them on. People dont necessarily have close relationships with everyone they work with. Even if you do, Domestic Violence is something that can be hidden and stay hidden from people for years. My cousin was a victim of DV and the family new nothing for years, and we were Family!

Slow your role dude, your opinion isnt fact.

A.E. Porter

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stxbuck's picture

Big difference between a random/equal co-worker, and a member of a HC's staff. There is a much closer relationship, and responsibility for the HC in terms of who he brings into his program. Heck, Urban is on record-in the wake of some kind of sex scandal at another SEC school-saying at UF "I would fire any married member of my staff who had an affair". Cheatin'-no, beatin-meh?

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BucknutinNC's picture

Well I've never been a HC of a major football program. I have however served in the U.S. ARMY, and in that capacity I was in charge of teams of individuals. Also I would say the relationships and bonds I built with those I served with were/are probably stronger than those built in almost any other profession.

With that being said, at the end of the day as close as I was with those guys I had no idea what occurred behind closed doors at their house. I had no idea what they did after 1600 hours when we released them for the day. First hand account of that, I had a guy in my unit arrested for suspicion of robbery ( atm machine) he didnt tell us and we had no idea until he actually had to tell us because it was going to trial.

I also had a cousin who was a victim of Domestic Violence for years. No one in the family knew until her husband took it to far one night and she ended up in the hospital. Keep in mind we were family.

Point is there is no reason to think Urban knew anything for certain, even if he suspected firing Smith without proof wouldn't have gone well. Also not defending Smith, but keep in mind he is accused of this, not convicted. We may think that he is probably guilty or innocent but none of us know for certain. For all we know she could be the kind of person who made this stuff up to have a strong possition in their custody battle. Not saying that she did, but its entirely possible. My ex took out credit cards in mine and her names during our divorce and destroyed my credit before I knew what was happening.

Just sayin it may be a little bit premature to start deciding people's guilt or innocence, and definitely to early to start passing judgment.

A.E. Porter

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CincyBuck's picture

Not sure about the Urban part.  I'd want to know what he knew and when he knew it. 

I doubt background investigations and related due diligence are part of Urban's job duties.  Failure to pickup on these issues (which I assume to be what happened) is likely an administrative issue.  I can see how charges (as opposed to convictions) are tough to track down, and I suspect that DV issues are often kept private (e.g., like how she refused to press charges).  But one would think a detailed investigation -- which is appropriate given the status and compensation of Smith's job -- would've uncovered some of this stuff.

All of that said, yeah, I'd at least put Smith on leave for the time being.  I'm willing to accept the fact that non-physical "altercations" (i.e., loud arguments) can happen between couples, and maybe that's enough to get the cops called in a nice neighborhood.  But there's a lot of smoke, here.  Hard to believe at least some of it isn't true.

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Daniel's picture

82spencer.....really!  Maybe the first comment about Smith, but fire Urban Meyer over this.  Come on!

Va Buck

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82spencer's picture

If the allegations are true, no way in hell Urban didn’t know about it. That would mean he kept a coach on his staff (including hiring him a second time in 2012) that committed domestic violence. I don’t want a coach that does that and certainly not one who preaches his “values” so much. 

I don't believe in no-win scenarios

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BucknutinNC's picture

So you're saying you know everything about the lives of all your coworkers? Lets limit that, you know everything about your subordinates lives outside of work? Their home life, all there activities in evryday life away from work? All legal action that they may have been involved in? If you know all that thats just creepy.

A.E. Porter

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saintstephen11's picture

shhhh. You're killing their pontification with facts. Cut it out!

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82spencer's picture

See other comments here about the 11W staff knowing about the transgressions. If they knew, Urban knew. 

I don't believe in no-win scenarios

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Dstacify's picture

I'm okay with Smith being gone but pump the brakes on Urban for a second. You are straight up assuming a guy we know to be a devout family man knew about all this recent behind the scenes dirt on Smith (excluding the 2009 arrest). I think personally that is highly unlikely and that Urban thought he'd fully moved past his previous issues when he hired him. Urban doesn't deserve any punishment for this whatsoever (although it will ultimately be his call going forward on what happens to Smith now). If Urban continues to keep Smith on staff in response to this it could raise a few eyebrows but we don't know yet what his course of action will be.

11 Strong.

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UFest57's picture

So this happened under Urban's watch in Gainesville and then continued here in Columbus. Not a good look for any party involved. He has to go, IMO. 

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Dstacify's picture

Just stop. This is the worst overreaction possible wanting to fire our HC and burn the football program to the ground in the process. This is one position coach on the team. It's not a good half of the team like it was at Florida. Different scenario.

11 Strong.

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UFest57's picture

To be clear I wasn't referring to Urban as the one who needs to go. 

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Buckeyeinsc's picture

May be the unpopular opinion but, track record of coaching or not, this is not the role model young men should have. Not only was the wife in immediate danger but also their unborn child. Seems like the issue is recurring since a court order has been put in place. I think it is time to move along and find a replacement.

Fighting the good fight in SEC country. "Our honor defend"

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BrutusB's picture

It also sounds like it was made incredibly clear to Smith that he was NOT to go near his ex's apartment.  Then his dumbass rolls up to it in his car anyway.  Whether or not the order was fair is irrelevant.

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Buckloving's picture

Exactly. We expect the kids to follow the rules but not the adults?

bobbyd

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stxbuck's picture

That's the short and long of this situation. Urban is going to have to address that particular aspect of it directly.

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avail31678's picture

What's he supposed to do though?  His wife didn't show at the agreed upon spot (this would be specified in a legal parenting plan)...does he keep the kids with him past his allowed time?  Either way he could be violating something.    

To be clear, I'm not defending ANYthing else about Smith, just this recent trespassing thing.  Seriously, what was Zach supposed to do if his wife didn't show to the agreed upon place to drop off the kids?

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SilvioDante's picture

Uh, take the kids home

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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BucknutinNC's picture

He did take the boy home thus violating the agreement. She didnt show up to the neutral spoy, so he took him to her place because he was supposed to return him by a certain time. If he had kept him, he's in violation. He took him and dropped him, he's in violation. Either way he was screwed.

A.E. Porter

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SilvioDante's picture

I'm sure there is a case worker that he could have called and left a message that his wife was not at the agreed upon meeting spot at the meeting time and that he had waited a reasonable amount of time (15 min) and attempted to contact his wife to no avail.

That he was taking the children to his home until his wife could be located.

That's the correct answer.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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Iwouldliketotalktoyou's picture

Everybody thinks case workers are on call 24/7 because their case is "special"....no...it isn't. Nobody is taking your call. Get used to it. Best bet is to call the sheriff's department and tell them she isn't at the meeting spot. Sit there until a deputy shows up. Explain the situation. Have said deputy come with you to drop child off at her place. Everything is documented, probably on dash cam video..and you are cool. Case workers...whatever those are ...dont do that. They f things up.

Gotta love it.

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Dstacify's picture

This x1000. These are impressionable college students he's coaching who are going to be easily influenced by their teachers and coaches. I'm not so sure keeping Zach Smith on staff with these kinds of demons is the right way to go. At this point Urban should cut his losses and move on from Smith. If he sticks by him it will be a distraction which in turn could affect the players.

11 Strong.

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DibbleDabble's picture

Smith is toast.

I just hope Urban goes out and hires a proven WR coach that can recruit.  Hartline will need more time, experience, and results at recruiting before he is given an opportunity at a proven top 5 power school like Ohio State, alumni or not..  and I like Hartline.

Solid, proven coaches that can recruit will be knocking down Urban's door..  I hope he is willing to listen for the best of our program.

As far as Smith is concerned..

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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TheBadOwl's picture

I just hope Urban goes out and hires a proven WR coach that can recruit. 

1. I think it's a bit insensitive to immediately dive into the on-field impact, but maybe that's just me.

2. I also think it's really likely that Urban knew about the 2009 incident at Florida (either as the head coach at the time or during a background check for Smith when he was hired here in 2011) and also probably knew about the 2015 incident. Domestic violence is not excusable, and not firing him when there was a clear, visible pattern is a huge black mark on Meyer's record.

Just an opinion here – but if Urban kept Smith around, being aware of the multiple incidents – Urban may not deserve to keep his job. It'll be really interesting to see what he has to say about this. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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DibbleDabble's picture

1. yes, that's just you, Mr. PC guy.  This is first and foremost a buckeye football forum, not a political civility forum. 

2. you may want to gather more facts before making such a determined opinion on another person you have never met in person.

Hoot Hoot.

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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huffdaddy's picture

Uh, your comment #1 and comment #2 don't go together. If we limit determined opinions to people we have only met in person, this won't be much of a football forum.

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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DibbleDabble's picture

agreed, point taken Huff, but A) I have met Urban, and B) I am not calling for anyone to lose their job based solely on assumptions, rather facts only.  They kinda matter.

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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TheBadOwl's picture

1. If your first reaction to finding out that someone in a position of mentorship has been the aggressor in multiple domestic violence reports and your first reaction is "cool, we can get a better coach now" you should probably read up on just how fucking horrifying abusive relationships are. A few years ago, I may have had a similar reaction to the one you just did to my comment, but then I found out how many of my friends escaped abusive relationships, listened to some of their stories, and it gave me a much wider perspective. If you're going to take that as me being the PC police, go ahead and downvote me into oblivion.

2. That's not me trying to provide insight into who Meyer is as a person. I find it incredibly unlikely that a college football coach as powerful as Urban Meyer wouldn't have known about two separate instances of a staff member under his watch being accused of domestic violence, at two stops in his career. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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beavis's picture

ever hear of "innocent until proven guilty" ? everyone is entitled to due process. it can't be, as you suggest, being guilty because someone accuses you. and because you find something "incredibly unlikely" - that automatically means someone is in the wrong? i wonder how you'd feel if you were accused of something you weren't aware of?

beavis

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huffdaddy's picture

innocent until proven guilty is the bedrock of criminal law.

it's not the standard for maintaining a highly paid and extremely public position at a state university. Which doesn't mean that frivolous accusations should lead to getting fired, but it does mean that the burden of proof is shifted. Because you can't hang a giant sign about respecting women unless you are pretty darned sure the coaches abide by it. 

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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lamplighter's picture

not in the era of social media

This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.

peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
 

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beavis's picture

i think it's insensitive (and unfair/unjust) for you to be saying urban should be fired when you don't have any idea about any of the facts in this situation.....especially since, up to this restraining order, zach smith hasn't been convicted of anything.

beavis

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Mean Mr Mustard's picture

Vrabel's first coaching job was OSU

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PhillyNut's picture

At a minimum he should be put on "administrative leave" and removed from his coaching and recruiting duties as well as representing Ohio State in any capacity.  Public opinion should not be the one to assess guilt or innocence but the school needs to protect the school.

I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!

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Buckfrombirth's picture

Sounds like Step 1 in the administrative handbook, and completely reasonable while all this gets sorted out. In my line of work, a Restraining or Protection Order against someone in a leadership position is a very, very big deal, as a judge has found reason to issue one, with or without a criminal conviction. That's very damning, and Zach's continued run-ins with his ex establish a pretty clear pattern for disciplinary action by OSU.
Meyer's discovery timeline is a second, related issue that OSU should look into from an administrative standpoint and to protect the university. Urban may have already addressed this contractually, such as including specific behavior clauses in Smith's contract, for example. Regardless, UFM is ultimately responsible and accountable for his people, be they players or coaches. There's plenty of precedence in these matters, unfortunately, in every profession. But there are far too many assumptions out there right now to rearrange the cart and horse.

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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Pahimar's picture

Agreed this seems reasonable. Regardless of how the administration might feel about the charges, and I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and assume that they personally would condemn the alleged behavior just as strongly as any of us, how they actually handle the situation is still complicated. Whatever action they take has to be carefully justified by a reasonable confirmation of the known facts and language in his contract or the school can get into legal trouble. It would suck pretty badly if the allegations were true, he got immediately fired, and then successfully sued Ohio State for hundreds of thousands of dollars for breach of contract.

I am all for the right thing being done, but overly hasty justice is rarely good justice.

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Cooper's picture

Yikes.

This is definitely where I parked my car.

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Seattle Linga's picture

Just when the off season was rolling nice and smooth.

Go get'em Cal Poppy - we are behind you !!

It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.

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KBonay's picture

Have you need seen some of the threads recently?! 

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BrutusB's picture

This would never have happened if Burrow was our QB tbh.

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DrSpaceman's picture

*Burrows

"Medicine is not a science" - Leo Spaceman

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NorthBerg's picture

* Burreaux

Too much time spent at the North Heidelberg rather than the classroom. SSD 68-72

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Buckfrombirth's picture

HAHAHAHA!!!!

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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OldColumbusTown's picture

Disgusting and disappointing.  For all parties involved with Ohio State football/athletics.

If Urban and Gene Smith knew about this, it is bad.  Hard to believe they would have ever allowed Smith to be or remain employed.

If Urban and Gene Smith did not know about this, it is bad.  Hard to believe they would not have dug this up with background checks, etc.

Either way, it is disgusting and disappointing.

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martin anderson's picture

With the sex abuse of athletes scandal  continuing to grow and now this. There's no way the university will allow him to stay. 

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neo's picture

Adios, coach.  You're up, Hartline.

"Let's beat the shit out of Michigan. Have a good night." - UFM

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Earle's picture

Ready to parse words over whether Smith was "fired" or "chose to pursue other opportunities".

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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CALPOPPY's picture

So, you’re saying that he’ll no longer be detained by OSU?

Memento mori

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BrutusB's picture

Smith: "I'm deciding to spend more time with my family"

Police: bruh

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SilvioDante's picture

He's going to take arrest from the program to deal with some restraining issues in his personal life. It'll be a civil departure.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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neo's picture

I hate to say it, but it really makes you think he kept his role on the staff as a result of nepotism.  

"Let's beat the shit out of Michigan. Have a good night." - UFM

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PhillyNut's picture

It certainly did not hurt him.  Likely someone else who did not have his connections would not still be on the job but such is the way the world works.

I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!

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TheBadOwl's picture

I wouldn't care if he was the best receivers coach in the world – he should have been fired the second that Urban/Gene found out about this. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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neo's picture

I'd imagine he has less than 24 hours. 

"Let's beat the shit out of Michigan. Have a good night." - UFM

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SilvioDante's picture

Didn't he lambast the Nebraska coach for multiple DUIs?

What's that saying about casting a stone while living in a glass house? Something like that...

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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neo's picture

He definitely did.  Now he just looks like an hypocritical asshole instead of a fun and cheeky Twitter user.  Sigh.  #offseason

"Let's beat the shit out of Michigan. Have a good night." - UFM

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TobyMagic's picture

He can't survive this.. really surprised Urban gave him a gig in the first place.. unfortunately this will have ripple effects in recruiting

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kmp10's picture

Being Earl Bruce's grandson apparently carries significant weight with Urban Meyer. Zach Smith is a very good recruiter... who has roughly the same maturity level of the 17 year olds he's recruiting. This guy... trouble just finds him. When it was only irritating unpleasantness, i.e., his ridiculous twitter wars and social media presence, that was one thing, but now it's big boy accusations and serious crimes. All of that, coupled with the fact that the receivers have underperformed relative to their ability for a few seasons now, and there are two reasons Smith remains... he's a good recruiter, which Meyer apparently values more than anything, and he's Meyer's hero's grandson. If it turns out that Smith's alleged bullying during his time at Florida was more than a just disgruntled wife trying to 'get even', and that Meyer knew about that and still chose to bring Smith to Ohio State where the bullying allegedly continued, then Meyer has a very big problem on his hands. I dislike Zach Smith, and I did LONG before this latest mess came to light, but until the entirety of the story comes out and until Meyer and Smith tell heir side of things it would be unfair to jump to any conclusions. Women do exist who will go to great lengths to discredit their ex-husbands by telling lies about them. Despite my personal dislike for Smith, the possibility still exists that he's innocent of this and that his biggest mistake was that he made a grave tactical error by marrying the person he married. If he's truly guilty of hitting his wife, not physically defending himself from her attacks, then he should be gone before I finish typing this. I hate bullies, and if Meyer allowed a bully to coach on his staff because of his affinity for Bruce, then he (Meyer) has some serious explaining to do.

When I die, sprinkle my ashes over the 70's 

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DibbleDabble's picture

At first, I didn't think he could survive this either, after-all he has already been found guilty in the court of public opinion.    BUUUUT..  after listening to his attorney on the radio a few minutes ago, it sounds like his ex-wife might be bat shit crazy and forcing a narrative here that may be completely false? 

She told him to drop off his son at her apartment's clubhouse in May, that she would be there to pick him up, and she wasn' t there, so he swung by her apartment where his son obviously lives to drop him off, she was standing in the driveway and took a picture of Zach's car, as he was dropping his son off, and later used that picture to get a police officer to believe that was criminal trespassing - which it now sounds like obviously was not. 

It also sounds like she went ballistic in 2009 accusing Zach of having an affair, and he only defended himself, never hit her, and did not get violent with her, and there was no evidence of domestic violence so all charges were dropped within a day or two.  Two sides to every coin, every story, and who knows who did what we weren't there.. and not trying to minimize domestic violence at all - it happens daily and it is disgusting behavior - BUUUT ,  she is starting to sound like a spiteful ex-wife that is pushing the envelope without any facts or basis of truth, in an attempt to spite Zach.

I don't know.  Maybe Zach is a horrible guy, but it sounds like from his attorney's interviews that she has a history of crying wolf without one single shade of evidence in any documented domestic event made by her, be it 2009, 2015, or this past May.

I will wait for more facts to come out before I form an opinion of this situation.. and wait for the courts to work this out... domestic violence is inexcusable.  But so is stretching the truth for spiteful reasons in an attempt to ruin someone, especially if that such person is a father or mother of your children, who remain the real victims here.

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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GrandTheftHarley's picture

I don't know.  Maybe Zach is a horrible guy, but it sounds like from his attorney's interviews that she has a history of crying wolf without one single shade of evidence in any documented domestic event made by her, be it 2009, 2015, or this past May.

I will wait for more facts to come out before I form an opinion of this situation.. and wait for the courts to work this out... domestic violence is inexcusable.  But so is stretching the truth for spiteful reasons in an attempt to ruin someone, especially if that such person is a father or mother of your children, who remain the real victims here.

I mulled over this part of your comment, and have to say this strikes me as a classic case of a co-dependency relationship when Mr. and Ms. Smith were still married. I know a little about this because my dear Mom went thru this hell of abuse, separation, reconciliation, and abuse again several times over the decade she was married to my nasty stepdad. To elaborate:

Those who have studied domestic violence believe that it usually occurs in a cycle with three general stages. First, the abuser uses words or threats, perhaps humiliation or ridicule. Next, the abuser explodes at some perceived infraction by the other person, and the abuser's rage is manifested in physical violence. Finally, the abuser "cools off," asks forgiveness, and promises that the violence will never occur again. At that point, the victim often abandons any attempt to leave the situation or to have charges brought against the abuser, although some prosecutors will go forward with charges even if the victim is unwilling to do so. Typically, the abuser's rage begins to build again after the reconciliation, and the violent cycle is repeated.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Domestic+Violence

I am not very smart, but I recognize that I'm not very smart. --- W.W. Hayes

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DibbleDabble's picture

GTH - you may be correct here in this situation.. and you may be completely wrong if she is a spiteful ex-wife looking to ruin Zach.. we just don't know the entire story. 

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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GrandTheftHarley's picture

.. we just don't know the entire story.

No, we don't, because so much of domestic violence is behind closed doors and unreported. Fear of one's spouse has a lot to do with that.

At any rate, it's now academic. Z. Smith is done at TOSU. Maybe now he and his ex can move on with their lives. We can only hope.

I am not very smart, but I recognize that I'm not very smart. --- W.W. Hayes

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Frimmel's picture

Your take on this where there is a vindictive and spiteful and mentally un-well ex would explain why Smith has been kept on and only now being let go when the light is too bright. Yours is a very reasonable take but it is hard to push that through on large perception scales because of the societal tendency to rush to the aid of women. 

I was getting on an elevator with a couple of guys during one of the last times a domestic violence incident was big news and one of them said, "Never. EVER. An excuse to hit a woman." So I said what I always do, "What if she's coming after you with a kitchen knife?" And the third guy says, "What did you do to make her come after you with a kitchen knife?" 

If you look at Coach Smith's under-performance through the lens of dealing with a genuinely un-hinged ex-wife... 

http://shrink4men.com/ 

You've got to kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. 

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RubixTube's picture

I'll show my naiveté here.... how does a 10 year old DV report change the narrative from "oops, nothing to see here" (I mean, the crime was dropping his kid off at his ex's apartment...to my knowledge, no one was harmed) to "FIRE HIS ASS"? 

Are we assuming that Urban and Gene knew nothing of the prior charge when they hired him?

Are we calling for his firing simply because the news is public now? 

Never before in the history of man have lives less lived been more chronicled. - Dennis Miller

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CALPOPPY's picture

I'll show my naiveté here.... how does a 10 year old DV report change the narrative from "oops, nothing to see here" (I mean, the crime was dropping his kid off at his ex's apartment...to my knowledge, no one was harmed) to "FIRE HIS ASS"? 

I think that there are other issues in the past year or years that haven’t come to light. Because I’m not sure if a 9 year old allegation would be driving this.

Memento mori

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Numbers's picture

that's kind of where I'm at at this point. the 2015 incident is the most perplexing and troubling, though. There's a complaint from her about sustained assaults to Columbus PD...and they (the PD) apparently do nothing? 

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ohst8buxCP's picture

For me it 's the 2015 report of "sustained physical abuse by the suspect" that's far more damning. DV is NEVER ok but it wasn't just a one time drunken mistake. Seems like it was an ongoing pattern of behavior.

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Buckfrombirth's picture

Yep, that stood out like a sore thumb when I read it too. Good grief...

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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TheBadOwl's picture

how does a 10 year old DV report change the narrative from "oops, nothing to see here" (I mean, the crime was dropping his kid off at his ex's apartment...to my knowledge, no one was harmed) to "FIRE HIS ASS"? 

Before, we were only working off Smith's lawyer's story that he was just dropping off the kid and that his ex wife 'trapped' him by waiting for him to show up.

Now, there's a public record of multiple incidents that would typically indicate domestic abuse – records that'd be really goddamned hard for Urban/Gene to not have seen in 2011 (or heard about in 2015, or in Meyer's case, heard about the first incident when it happened in 2009), which certainly seems like they tried to keep it all in-house so Smith could keep his job. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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RubixTube's picture

To be clear, the "we" I reference isn't the 11W community.  I know (and respect) the overall approach to Domestic Violence among the commentariat here.   

My question was for all of the commenters who seem to be 110% certain that THIS REPORT on 10 year old news will be the final nail in the coffin for Smith.  As you said, Urban & Gene had to know about the 2009 incident prior to hiring him.  2015 (if Smith) doesn't seem like something that would've flown under their radar either.  So...why now?  

Never before in the history of man have lives less lived been more chronicled. - Dennis Miller

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swainpm's picture

Rubix, interesting thoughts.  I personally don't see an issue with giving Smith a chance to coach after his 1st incident 10 years prior.  I believe in 2nd chances and no charges were filed - so maybe his wife did as well, he was also drunk (not an excuse).  However, the problem lies in the 2015 incident, the latest dropping the kid off pics, and now the restraining order.  These 3 incidents coupled with the original 2008 episode do not make Smith look good in the court of public opinion; especially when he is working at a culture that explicitly states to respect women.  As a result, I just don't see how the University does not let Smith pursue other passions (hard to fire someone when they have no criminal record).

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beavis's picture

ok. owl tell me where to look to see the record of smith being prosecuted AND CONVICTED - and i'll agree with you.

beavis

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CALPOPPY's picture

ok. owl tell me where to look to see the record of smith being prosecuted AND CONVICTED - and i'll agree with you.

I think that you are REALLY missing his point. There are no CONVICTIONS, and Bad Owl would admit to that. What he is saying is that, often, there are no charges because the victim is scared, coerced, or manipulated into not pressing charges or following through on a prosecution. Doesn’t mean that the victim was not a victim.

Memento mori

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TheBadOwl's picture

Precisely. Zero convictions but two incidents where the police report described physical abuse at the hands of Smith, and a third incident ending in an arrest after violating an order to stay away from her home. That doesn't paint a pretty picture – and it's seemingly a long stretch to presume total innocence for Smith after reading those details. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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lamplighter's picture

speculation is fun

This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.

peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
 

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toad1204's picture

Sad stuff.  Feel bad for the kids.

Offseason cant end soon enough.

The offseason is the longest season.

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Sanantonefan's picture

#firetheoffseason

You Got Barbecue Back There!?!?!?!

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Alpha Foxtrot Uniform

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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GrandTheftHarley's picture

FUBAR.

I am not very smart, but I recognize that I'm not very smart. --- W.W. Hayes

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Numbers's picture

In the 2015 incident, was there anything in the paperwork from police that indicates Zach Smith was the person only named as 'suspect.'? it can be assumed that he is but how it's written is confusing.

'In 2015, Powell police were called to the Courtney's residence with further allegations of domestic abuse. The police report from the October 26 incident, obtained by Eleven Warriors, states "that a domestic incident happened last night at [Courtney's] home and that she has been a victim of sustained physical abuse by the suspect."

Whereas the Gainesville PD report has 'Zach' or 'Z Smith' named in its reports the Columbus report does not have such information. Also...and why no arrest or further investigation into the 2015 incident?

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HandsOfSweed's picture

It's long since past time to quit drinking forever, Zach. At least he will have plenty of free time to work on his sobriety now.

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huffdaddy's picture

Buckeye Jack: "An 'order' isn't an arrest - that's just like something you do at a restaurant."

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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Toledoan's picture

He must go. Seems to need time to work on himself anyhow. Sad stuff when family is involved. 

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BrutusB's picture

Just fire his ass already.  The only person who will be upset at this point is BuckeyeJack.  That makes it a win-win.

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Earle's picture

Urban's gonna drop him like a long ball to Parris Campbell.

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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QuadCitiesBuckeye's picture

Urban's gonna drop him like a long ball to Parris Campbell.

I was thinking a Ryan Hamby TD pass against Texas, but that works too

Shandy is not beer

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CALPOPPY's picture

I was thinking a Ryan Hamby TD pass against Texas, but that works too

I just see a lot of people being “11W mean girls” to him. I’m not happy that everyone says mean things.

Let’s just make fun of Bauserman, instead! He was shittier, so he’s fair game, right?

Memento mori

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stxbuck's picture

Ryan Hamby committed to The Ohio State University when the program didn't even have a coach-between Coop and JT. He wanted to be a Buckeye-period. I will always respect the hell out of him b/c of that-even if the "sidewalk alums" want to throw shade.

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Cincybuckeye's picture

Urban's gonna drop him like a long ball to Parris Campbell.

That's it. I've had enough. I'm calling Buckeye Jack on your ass.

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BrutusB's picture

Parris Campbell is an ELITE wide receiver and had a 94% catch efficiency rating on all throws between 7 and 9.5 yards outside the right hash marks.  That would rate him as the 2nd best WR in the NFL if those statistics were publicly available.

-BJ, probably.

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bucknut1994's picture

If you disagree with you must be a fan boy hater who is apart of the clique. 

#94Ways

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SilverHaven's picture

Mahalo, Earle, we needed some comic relief amidst this tragic tale.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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BuckeyeSki's picture

Leave one wolf alive....and the sheep are never safe

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cdubs's picture

First thing I thought of, too.

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QBYBuckeye's picture

Sorry to see you go, BUT your primary function is that of a role model and mentor for impressionable young players in search of the men they will become.  You have given up the privilege of continuing in that function at OSU.  Good luck in coming to terms with the issues that have led to this latest incident (as well as many former ones).  Seek help. Find peace. Move on. 

New York Buckeye

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SilvioDante's picture

Measured, rational, and appropriate response.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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tbdbitlbuck's picture

Smith has to go. I said he had to go after last week's revelation, but with this on top of it, how do you keep him?

He's shown before that he's immature, has on multiple occasions brought a bad light to the program for his twitter antics, and now has a history of domestic violence allegations. And if that's not enough, he's proven to be a middling-to low-quality WR coach. So we have a guy that's embroiled in scandal and doesn't even do his job well. I would say the same thing if this were Larry Johnson, and Larry's job performance is about 1000 times more instrumental to this program's success than Smith's. 

We don't need this type of distraction around the program. He needs to be fired. 

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

Exactly. I've always seen Zach Smith as an entitled, immature rich kid who's had every opportunity imaginable handed to him as a direct result of who his grandfather was, not because of his own merit. What an embarrassment.

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ohst8buxCP's picture

Guy should be fired immediately, hopefully we don't lose Garrett Wilson in the process.

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Buckeyedoc99200's picture

Well.... this puts a whole new spin on things. If there is any thread of truth to this I don't want him representing me or my University and he has to go IMO. If we lose some recruits in the process, so be it.

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Buckfrombirth's picture

I like your use of "my university," BDoc. Exactly. The institution is the bedrock, not the program (that hurts a little, honestly) and definitely NOT the coach. See #Briles, #Petrino,#Petino, #Paterno, #Tressel, etc., and now, it appears, #Smith.

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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Earle's picture

That's a pretty broad brush you're hashtagging with.

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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SilverState's picture

Takeaway: don't hire a coach whose last name starts with a p and ends in o.

"There's still some green showing before you see the chalk."

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Buckfrombirth's picture

You could call it a paint roller and it would still represent multiple examples of when a coach was placed above the institution, for varying reasons and to varying degrees of disaster. However, there's no intent to equate Tressell's faults with Paterno's, if that's what you're insinuating.

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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1MechEng's picture

What, no #Fickell?! 

Trust me! I'm an Engineer.

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Buckfrombirth's picture

Well played. I really wanted to include #FireBeck.

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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Dstacify's picture

God damn what did Fickell do? He doesn't deserve to be lumped in with the rest of those names, he rarely had any controversy surrounding him (off the field that is) and is by all accounts a pretty upstanding guy. The worst thing I've ever seen Fickell associated with off the field when he was here was his wife allegedly getting a pizza guy fired in 2012 when this guy had the cajones (and impulsiveness tbh since you're not supposed to be rude to customers) to criticize Fickell's defense to his face at his home in front of his family while delivering pizza to him.

11 Strong.

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Easy, killer.  #FireFickell is a longstanding meme in the comments.  He wasn't serious.

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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BrutusB's picture

At this point I'd rather lose a recruit AND Smith than keep both.

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tampatom's picture

I have never been a Zach fan, but I know there is more to this story, She moved from Gainesville with him and I am sure there may have been a requirement for counseling, etc to remain on staff or work through problems privately, plus there may have been some pressure from Earl Bruce. urban gets benefit of doubt from me, but now that details are coming out, it is more about University and also role model for student athletes, so not sure Zach can survive as more comes out...should be interesting questions at Big media day!

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TheBadOwl's picture

She moved from Gainesville with him

Wanted to specifically call out this part of the comment before anyone else uses the "well, she stayed with him" argument. Ending a relationship when you're living in fear and are routinely abused is incredibly difficult and takes a long-ass time. The physical abuse usually goes along with emotional manipulation that makes the victim lose all sense of self-value. Not sure what the exact stat is, but I've read that the average domestic violence victim attempts to leave a relationship something like 12 times before actually leaving for good. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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tampatom's picture

Bad Owl, that was not my point, I assumed that when they moved and Urban hired him after 09, there must have been some understanding that they go thru counseling, or he get anger management or something since they were still together, I never meant that since she moved, it was her fault. It was more, I was sure Meyer and Smith must have asked for something in order to hire him but kept it private

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TheBadOwl's picture

To clarify; I meant 'call out' as in highlight rather than criticize – didn't mean to imply you were victim-blaming. Agree with you that there's more we don't know. It's entirely possible that Smith gave an answer in private to Urban/Gene that satisfied them at the time. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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PhillyNut's picture

There is so little that we know about this situation but it is not uncommon for women in abusive relationships to keep forgiving the man because he promises to change and may even change for awhile to then go back to their abusive ways.  I have never walked in their shoes so there is no way I could or would pass judgement on decisions they make.

I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!

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buckeye_in_WI's picture

Let due process ensue and give Zach a chance to defend himself if he indeed is innocent.

However, in this day and age in these cases you're immediately cast as guilty by the media and public. On top of that, he has a history of this. I think Urban has no choice here and he has to send Zach on his way. If somehow its discovered that these allegations are false, then give him the chance to get his job back. But it looks much more like a smoking gun case to me.

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BrutusB's picture

After the 09 incident Urban should have told him that any other rumor of problems with the ex wouldn't be tolerated.  He absolutely should have been canned after the '15 report.  At this point it's just inexcusable.

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KBonay's picture

*Keith Williams opens Twitter.

*Smiles, then starts to think of a good tweet....

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SilvioDante's picture

Lol!

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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terryin20878's picture

Wow - lots of trolls on this site, evident by, "Fire Meyer".

I'm thinking Smith is gone.  Don't look for IMMEDIATELY, but I would be surprised if he survives the week.  The tough part will be finding and hiring a full-time position coach this late in the summer.  We may be looking at high schools.

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BrutusB's picture

This is one of the rare cases where that kind of talk is actually encouraging.  Urban's not getting fired over this, obviously, but this kind of nonsense should be unacceptable to any Buckeye fan.

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Pahimar's picture

Agreed, though there is such thing as too much of a good thing.

Lookin' at you Tennessee.

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KBonay's picture

You seriously think any WR coach wouldn't jump at the chance to take over a loaded Zone6 this year and with the recruits (like Wilson) coming on board?  We are Ohio State, bro.  Not Illinois. 

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DibbleDabble's picture

winner winner chicken dinner

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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DibbleDabble's picture

no

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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Mean Mr Mustard's picture

Vrabel's 1st job was OSU w/o any GA experience

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shiloh's picture

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/patriots/the_blitz/2015/12/bill_belichick_mike_vrabel_used_to_drive_brady_crazy_on_practice

Belichick quote:

"Mike Vrabel epitomizes everything a coach could seek in a professional football player," it read. "Toughness, intelligence, play-making, leadership, versatility and consistency at the highest level."

Belichick would probably characterize Vrabel as a player/coach during his time w/the Patriots.

"Belichick believes Vrabel is using his time as a player as a tool to become an even more effective coach.

As a Patriot, Vrabel played on both sides of the ball. He gained notoriety as a linebacker, but also played tight end in red zone situations. According to Belichick, he was also moonlighting as a free safety."

"Mike was a great player who played in different systems," Belichick said. "He played different positions. He played on offense, defense, special teams. He played tight end. He played linebacker. Honestly, he would play free safety in practice for us once or twice a year, especially when we were up against a guy like Ed Reed who really knew what he was going to do. Just say, 'OK, sit back there and go with what you see. If you want to gamble, gamble.'

"And Mike, he would love that. He'd drive Brady crazy. It's Ed Reed, you didn't know where he was going to be. He was usually wherever the ball was. He somehow got there. So, Mike did that. You could just see his overall passion for the game, whether it was offense, defense. He had a great total understanding of the game and loved to play it. Loved to play tight end. If it was a big receiver, he'd play receiver (on scout team)."

Went to the same high school ...

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. ~ Mark Twain

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Dstacify's picture

Just read an article that said Urban has apparently been telling Smith to interview for other jobs for some time now. Sounds like Urban saw this coming and wants to quietly remove him from the staff without actually firing him (like he did with Withers). It's probably too late for that now. No other team is going to want to hire Zach Smith now with this black cloud hanging over him. Urban kind of has no choice but to fire him at this point but will he have the cajones to do it since he and Smith go way back to their Florida days. I think Beck might be the only Asst Coach Urban has actually fired since he's been here (Warinner left of his own volition to take the Minnesota job as did numerous other coaches).

11 Strong.

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810Buck's picture

Go back and look at his performance reviews. Personal affairs was included in room for improvement -- including something I think he easily should have lost his job over before.  There's a reason he didn't get a raise some years and was on a short leash.  But he had the longest leash of all with his grandfather.  

My gut tells me Urban and others didn't know about the May incident right away.  Dude's personal life is a mess -- good luck to him with two kids involved.  He really needs to focus on getting his stuff together.  

He's gotta go. 

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brunstar's picture

Really nasty divorce, trying to end Smith’s career on a 9-year old DV arrest with no charges filed.

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tbdbitlbuck's picture

Or Smith could maybe stop getting himself in situations where he's being arrested or having the police called on him. He has no one to blame but himself.

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brunstar's picture

9-years ago.  Did you read the full story behind the trespassing citation?  He dropped his kid off at his ex’s residence because she didn’t meet at the agreed upon location.  Did you want Smith to let his kid walk home by himself?  That was the setup which led to using a 9-year old arrest with no charges to file a restraining order.

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OldColumbusTown's picture

I felt the same until more information has now come out.  Obviously his attorney is going to paint the picture a certain way, and only include the details he wants to be public.  We have no idea if the ex-wife told him she would meet him somewhere else or if she asked him to move the drop-off location.  No matter, Smith went somewhere he absolutely knew he should not be.

At this point we are all speculating.  Either way, the true tragedy is two children caught in the middle of what seems like a nasty divorce between two adults who cannot get along.  Who is at fault and who should take responsibility for all this is another matter and really not up for public debate.

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

The fact that the incident took place nine years ago has no bearing on my view of the situation. If I'm an employer, I'm not hiring or retaining anyone with a history of domestic violence, regardless of when it allegedly took place.

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Helmet Sticker Day Trader's picture

When you say "full story" are you referring to his defense attorney's account of the situation?

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HandsOfSweed's picture

Sure, That's what a dummy would do. Someone with a shred of intelligence takes the kid to the police station and tells them that the ex didn't meet at arranged time/place to pick up kid. Then you tell them that you are prohibited from dropping him off at her place bc of the restraining order....and then ask the fucking cops for help getting the kid home safely and respectfully. Boom. Problem solved.

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MichiBuck12's picture

Someone who gets drunk and takes a woman home where his wife is, clearly does not have a shred of intelligence. Am I the only one who picked up on that part of the story? What a monumental dumbfuck. 

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Buckfrombirth's picture

My wife even got pissed at me when I had a drunk buddy stay the night without coordinating with her first, because the house was a mess and he was obnoxious. Bringing a female home? Holy shit, that's beyond stupid.

I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.

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saintstephen11's picture

unless the wife is into that sort of thing ... then it is pure genius.

Seriously though ... he obviously had zero respect for her.  

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65 Toss Power Trap's picture

I was thinking the exact same thing

Knowledge is Power

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TheBadOwl's picture

Chalking it up to "she's trying to ruin his career because they had a nasty divorce" is the exact kind of attitude that discourages victims of abusive relationships to come forward. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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DibbleDabble's picture

and yet it still happens everyday in every state of America. 

The real victims in this situation as always are the kids.

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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TheBadOwl's picture

The kids are victims, yes.

So are, you know, the victims. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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DibbleDabble's picture

And you absolutely do not have all the facts about This case, do you? 

Yet, it is an absolute fact that divorces and domestic family law can become and many times do become very, very ugly, and many times it brings out the worst in both parties, and sometimes the divorce attorneys.  Correct?

Point being, gather some facts first here, before lecturing everyone how this all played out, when you honestly don't know anything else that general public knows about this case, this family situation.  Your assumptions are just that.

Domestic violence is horrible and scars, I agree 100%.  But you are letting your personal experiences drive this train on THIS specific family case - when you don't even know the facts. 

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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elitesmithie's picture

The problem with this statement is those situations do happen. We are a year from a talented Buckeye CB losing draft stock over something he feels so confident in that he is suing the woman "involved". Its not like this is a make believe situation.

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SilverState's picture

Just google "Mary Hunt" "caught on video."

(Have to think these situations are very, very rare, but outlier events happen all of the time.)

"There's still some green showing before you see the chalk."

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FairfaxBuckeye's picture

FYI they’ve been divorced since September 2015 

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

2018-2015 = 3

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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Arizona_Buckeye's picture

Zach needs to be booted out of the Zone... he obviously has some issues here and given Urban's stance on DV - I don't think there is another option!

The best thing about Pastafarianism? It is not only acceptable, but advisable, to be heavily sauced

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BrutusB's picture

On the bright side, this could finally be the opportunity to ditch that stupid nickname.

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southalabamabuckeye's picture

Sounds like a huge mess. Hopefully all parties involved take the high road.

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buckzilla1's picture

Smith needs to step away from the program, work on getting his life in order and take care of his kids. It is just that simple. 

Hey Cancer! This ass kicking is brought to you by the Guernsey county mafia. Give it Hell 84!

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Skunk bear blood's picture

Best comment...short and simple.  He needs to go.

Buy the ticket take the ride.

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hillsy&#039;91's picture

Should be put on suspension immediately and told to resign. I know its tough due to the history Urban has with him and his family, but there is no other choice.

hillsy'91

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

Eh, nobody knows the truth. Could be Zach is a monster (I seriously doubt it). Could be he and his ex-wife are like napalm and an open flame when they interact. Zach's problem is perception is stronger than fact in this day and age so he wont be here much longer regardless of the truth.

And you morons calling for Urban to be fired over this need to step away from the ledge and your keyboard before you hurt yourselves. 

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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TheBadOwl's picture

Could be he and his ex-wife are like napalm and an open flame when they interact. 

"Oh, those two have arguments all the time" is exactly the type of perception and attitude that make it really damn difficult for victims of abusive relationships to come forward. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

Yes because we know all women tell the truth 100% of the time, right?

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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TheBadOwl's picture

Oh come on. That's like me saying "No, Urban Meyer didn't murder that guy" and you saying "Yeah, because murders totally don't exist, huh guy???" 

You cannot honestly tell me that a woman wouldn't see that exact attitude as a barrier to leaving and reporting an abuser. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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DibbleDabble's picture

Oh come on.. your 15 posts in this thread are are the same, because obviously you are either dating a women that was previously in an abusive relationship, or have a family member that had the same experience.  You mean well, your heart is in the right place, and everything you are railing on about domestic abuse is correct - but it doesn't make your opinion on "Urban HAD to know!" correct..  that's just your uneducated opinion based solely on an assumption from your personal experiences (or those of a close friend or family member)

IBLEED is spot on. 

"Vision without execution is just hallucination."

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BuckeyeSki's picture

Leave one wolf alive....and the sheep are never safe

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Oakland Buckeye's picture

Let it go Owl - your argument does not apply here - she clearly has stepped up for herself and not only reported it recently - but as far back as 9 years ago - thus the divorce.

She has a voice and she used it.

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Amalgamate's picture

What makes you seriously doubt he is a monster? Do you know him personally? Anyone is capable of anything behind closed doors. If all of what you know of him is what you see in the media (and his own immature trolling on twitter), then what makes you think you know him enough to make that assessment? 

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Bringthejuice's picture

How long will it take for Urban to get asked about this at media days? Or will he?

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ohst8buxCP's picture

It'll take until the first question....

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DrSpaceman's picture

Oh it's a guaranteed question #1. I'd actually be surprised if he didn't address it in some way in his press conference.

"Medicine is not a science" - Leo Spaceman

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JTFor President2016's picture

Agreed. I think he opens up talking about it as soon as he sits down. Get it out there, get on to football. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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Makinggeorgiahowl's picture

Deep sigh and facepalm...

War is the remedy our enemies have chosen, and I say let us give them all they want.

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NorCal Buckeye's picture

Can't believe she stayed with him after he brought a co-worker home to their shared apartment, while 3 monthes pregnant and continued to call her baby.

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TheBadOwl's picture

Can't believe she stayed with him

Posted this above – don't have the exact stat but from what I've heard from friends who escaped abusive relationships, it seems about right – it often takes 10+ attempts to leave before actually leaving for good. It's a long process of physical abuse and emotional manipulation.

Saying "well, they stayed together, how bad could it be" is exactly why victims of domestic abuse have such a hard time coming forward. It's a shitty victim-blaming tactic and I encourage you to read up on the topic to see why. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

I think you have your opinion Zach is the only one who did anything wrong here.  That much is very clear. You dont know the truth either so put a cork in it.

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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TheBadOwl's picture

You're replying to a comment that did not refer to Zach Smith even once. 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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tbdbitlbuck's picture

So what exactly do you think we should be allowed to say on here?

We’re not the legal system. We can share our opinions on Smith. There’s no legal right to due process in the court of public opinion.

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wyatt's picture

Alcohol can make anybody do crazy things. 

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Trapper99's picture
 
Sure Urban will just love talking about this at Media Days
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buckeyeinWI's picture

Not a 'good look'....

the off season always sucks for this reason, or that...

GO BUCKEYES!

16-2 is SWEET!

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Go1Bucks's picture

This personal shit doesnt need to be on here. If found to be other than he/said she/said marriage crap, then the judge will decide and we can have a short post of why hes gine. But this gossip, pre judgemental crap has got to stop. This site is becoming a social cesspool.
Stick to sports.

Go Bucks!

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BrutusB's picture

You're going to be greyed out in like 7 minutes, but I want you to know I was here for your #badtake.

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buckzilla1's picture

Right on schedule. BrutusB what are tonights lottery numbers?

Hey Cancer! This ass kicking is brought to you by the Guernsey county mafia. Give it Hell 84!

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HandsOfSweed's picture

This is also about sports. We just found out that we're gonna need a new WR coach. That's a football-specific issue. 

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stpetebuck's picture

 it’s a recruiting story, as in any recruiting moral high ground has been lost at least in the wr room 

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

It would appear that you didn’t read the article. The judge did rule in that he put a restraining order in place against Coach Smith. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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dmiller2345's picture

Surprised this thread hasn't turned into a screaming match about how 11W hates Zach Smith and the headline is misleading!

Urban Meyer, undefeated (7-0) VS ttun | Ryan Day, undefeated (2-0) vs ttun

*As always, In (Urban) Ryan Day I Trust! There is a plan, even if we cannot see it right now!

God, Family, Guns, Country, and Sports!

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aj99's picture

So you don't think 11w hates Zach Smith?  I mean sure they only went back like 15 years in his past and dug up crap on him and posted the juicy stuff that supports their narrative.  Didn't bother doing any interviews with staff or admin to see if there's more to the story or if they knew.  Get this stuff to the masses because hot damn we nailed him.  Truth be damned. But nah they don't hate him.

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Jason Priestas's picture

I'm going to clue you in on three facts:

1) Everything in our piece was first reported by Brett McMurphy earlier this morning. We mentioned that early on in the piece, linking to Brett's report.
2) We've known about the 2009 and 2015 incidents for a few years but did not feel comfortable running them because charges were dropped. It's a judgment call, but one we stuck to. It would have been easy to trot that out last week when a chunk of you were questioning our phrasing after he was cited for criminal trespass, but we didn't.
3) To talk to people at Ohio State in the football program, you have to go through the SID, Jerry Emig. We reached out to him before publishing and he declined to make a comment. We included that in our piece. After we published, he offered a new comment, and we also updated our story.

Bonus 4th fact! 2009 was nine years ago, not 15.

But sure, go ahead and keep slinging baseless accusations at us.

TobyMagic's picture

Calm down DJ..

PS: I'm not sure how to designate this as sarcasm with out getting lectured

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Not sure if you realized that Jason is not DJ. 

Sarcasm - either place in italics or follow with “/s”. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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allinosu's picture

I was good with it until the poll question surface right after about him. It gave me a sense of piling on. 

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Jason Priestas's picture

I agree and we deleted that poll.

Oakland Buckeye's picture

And you also altered the headline. Jason you have been more than fair - as one who complained about the headline & the poll last week. Moreover, I have been impressed at how you & the staff have handled themselves in this story - one that will sadly only get dirtier I'm afraid.

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aj99's picture

Jason, I appreciate your restraint last week. Why not dig deeper a few years ago and report.  Or maybe you did and didn't like what you found? I don't see this as a baseless accusation.  You have not provided one iota of information from the other side of the story, and clearly another side exists.  Urban and the Athletic Departments at two NCAA institutions didn't fire him, so simple reasoning suggests there's more going on.  I think you're doing everyone a disservice when you just throw out one side of the story- throwing red meat at the dogs without giving the whole picture.  You're leading tens of thousands people on a lynch mob here, man.  Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong.  

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Not trying to speak for Jason, but it’s difficult to present the other side of the story (i.e. Smith’s or Meyer’s) when the organization they work for responds with “no comment.”  As a news organization you run with the story you have and note for the record that the other side was contacted but declined to comment. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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huffdaddy's picture

It's interesting that you held on reporting the previous charges. Not sure that was the right call, as opposed to putting it out there with comments from staff.

One thing it does mean though: Urban knew about this. And no I am not saying #fireurban. But if 11W knew about it for several years, so did UFM.

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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ohst8buxCP's picture

In a he-said she-said dispute like that where no charges are ever filed it's almost impossible to report what happened with any degree of certainty. Not sure it's 100% responsible to ruin someones reputation without being certain. Tough call.

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Buckeyechuck5's picture

1 acuization I stick to is the discretion applied in Whiting out comments on this site. That is where this site paints a picture of hipocracy littered agenda.

"Life is not about how hard you can hit, it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. THATS HOW WINNING IS DONE!!" - Rocky Ballboa

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Meek's picture

Posters do that with downvotes.

- OSU ISE -+-  Premium Banter -+- OH48 80k -

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

Buckeyechuck5, then don't post or read the stories here. Problem solved.

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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ChristianHaven's picture

Wow, good, Mr. Priestas, even the owner is stepping into this debate to clarify the facts.

Life starts all over again when it gets crisp in the fall. (F. Scott Fitzgerald)

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dmiller2345's picture

So you don't think 11w hates Zach Smith? 

NO! I do not think 11W hates Zach Smith! I believe they are reporting on a relevant story as unbiased as possible given the obvious... They are Ohio State fans!!!

Urban Meyer, undefeated (7-0) VS ttun | Ryan Day, undefeated (2-0) vs ttun

*As always, In (Urban) Ryan Day I Trust! There is a plan, even if we cannot see it right now!

God, Family, Guns, Country, and Sports!

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GIBS_STI's picture

I understand things happen in a relationship, but there is no excuse to put your hands on your wife or anyone else. I would let him go. You have no choice Urban. He’s a good recruiter and all, but this is just bad. Bye. 

Fortune favors the bold.

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Buck61's picture

nice to see that charged equals guilty mentality has taken over before a public statements have been given.

He may very well deserve to be fired but let some more facts come to light first.

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BrutusB's picture

For sure.  I think someone needs to be accused of domestic violence a minimum 6 or 7 times before the allegations deserve to be considered.

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

before the allegations deserve to be considered.

Time out: you're saying that the state, as a matter of policy, should *ignore* the first several accusations of domestic violence? Are you fucking serious? You realize that that is how women end up dead, right? 

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BrutusB's picture

I thought I was laying it on pretty thick.  Guess I should have gone with 27 or 28.

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Earle's picture

Nah, it was perfect.  It's just an emotionally charged topic, so sometimes sarcasm gets lost in the heat.

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

My bad--I should have known. It's just that A) sarcasm can be tough to pick up online, and B) these kinds of topics tend to bring out some pretty boneheaded opinions.

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

knee jerk reaction much?

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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hodge's picture

I understand where you're coming from, but you also have to consider the corollary: serial abusers get away with continual abuse because they manipulate their victims into not pressing charges.  

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EZE's picture

Are police reports and arrest records not facts? And a judge issuing a restraining order? Those are facts enough for me, especially the latter.

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stpetebuck's picture

“Hello parent of a 5 Star receiver recruit. Let me explain our family culture at The OSU..,..(click)” Hello?...”

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CowCat's picture

I was willing to give Smith the benefit of the doubt before, but this is a complete shit show now. There's no way to side-step this.

He's gone, and he won't get another job. Sad for his kids.

"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer

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BlackKeys's picture

Yeah he has to be fired. It’s just how it is now. Right or wrong, guilty or innocent, you step foot in the gray area and people and institutions and businesses have to distance themselves. If it’s even remotely true, while sad for his two boys, it’s also important for them to learn early on that there is no excuse and huge consequences for putting your hands on women.

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Buctor's picture

Is that true?  Wouldn't that open them up to potential lawsuits?  It would have at one time.  But I know very little about either firing someone or lawsuits.  Just asking.

Beat everyone, in every sport, all the time!!!

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BucksHave7's picture

Does THE OSU not conduct criminal background checks on hiring staff and faculty?

BucksHave7

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Amalgamate's picture

He wasn't ever charged, at least as far as I understand it reading this article.

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BucksHave7's picture

I was curious and I looked it up.....Most courts will provide arrest records in the same manner as they report convictions. 

BucksHave7

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JTFor President2016's picture

Didn't stop Zeke from missing 6 games. As being in a family with DV issues, it is very hard to judge based on charges. There are several factors. I'll lay it out there. A woman in my family was being abused physically and mentally. Called the cops one time. He was let go after one day, and she was scared as hell to ever call again. There can be a feeling of helplessness for women in these situations. I'll let due process take place, but judging these situations based on charges is a fickle matter. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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Dstacify's picture

The entire Zeke thing is bullshit and completely the NFL's shitshow now. The way the NFL handled that last season was so comically bad that it's no wonder JJ tried to block Goodell's re-election as commissioner afterwords (one of the few things Jerry Jones has done that makes sense IMO). All they had were accusations to go on there and not much more than that and Goodell spent a solid 10 weeks of the season turning it into a circus fighting Zeke to the death on those appeals. Zeke obviously is not a perfect individual (whether he was guilty there or not) but that was 100% an abuse of power in its finest form by the commissioner.

11 Strong.

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Keze's picture

Lowest form of a male

to grab and hurt a female.

Guess Urban was doing Earl a favor and giving his grandson a chance to clean his act up but that seems to be not happening.

Time for his ass to go Earl or NO Earl favors.

The only place for female abusers is in the NFL.

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Frimmel's picture

What if the female is coming after you with a kitchen knife? 

You've got to kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. 

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BroJim's picture

Run.

I season my simple food with hunger

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MD-PAbuck's picture

*mental note* don't marry a sprinter

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Earle's picture

Dodge, duck, dip, dive and dodge.

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

That's only she's throwing wrenches.

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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Frimmel's picture

I thought domestic violence wasn't funny.

You've got to kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. 

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SilverHaven's picture

And what if the female comes at you with a baseball bat? 
Throws rocks? 
Sics pitbull dogs on you?
 

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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Jabba1977's picture

Not good, I wonder how this is going to end?

SECHATER77

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ARMYBUCK's picture

After last weeks revelation I stated that it looked like a whole lot of nothing and could happen to anyone with shared custody and with the information given at that time that appeared to be the case...

This weeks newfound information has me singing a different tune.  It appears his run-ins with domestic disputes are more habitual than what I could conclude with the criminal trespassing.  I believe Smith should and will be relieved of his duties.

The more you know...

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hodge's picture

This is a horrid look for the entire athletic department.  There's no way in Hell Smith survives this.  The arrest in May could have been explained away, but separate incidents over the last decade show a pattern that even Stevie Wonder could see. 

My money says Smith's going to "resign to deal with personal issues", and Urban's going to say that he had no idea as to the extent of this problem.  It's going to look horrible on him and Gene Smith -- and rightly so, because if this storyline is to be believed, he should have been out in 2015 at the latest -- but Smith's prompt resignation will insulate them somewhat (for better or for worse).  Really wish Urban would/could set the record straight on this, but all we're going to hear from this point forward is going to be spin control.

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Hogan1's picture

This might be trivial but if they've been divorced for awhile and he's been abusive why does she still go by her married name? 

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BrutusB's picture

My mom's been divorced 30 years and never changed her name back.  It's a lot of effort and she didn't want to have a different last name than us (her kids).

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SilverHaven's picture

Yes, BB, after divorce, I invited my ex to quit using my name. She refused 'cuz she wanted to have the same name as her kid in school.  So when I got custody, I changed my name and my son's.  The ex sued me in court for changing my name and his. 
Yes, divorce is such an ongoing pleasant situation.  Aloha.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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ANOTHERMICHIGANLOSS's picture

Something tells me Meyer and Smith have known this was coming and probably already have a plan (and possible replacement) in place.  

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WezBuck28's picture

According to an article that I read on 24/7, Smith has been interviewing at other places, per Urban's request...fwiw

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BuckAlum09's picture

As far as the law goes he is "not guilty" from a technical standpoint in regards to domestic violence. But with the political climate towards anything that even remotely hints at violence/abuse/misconduct against women, it's not a survivable situation for Zach. Not here to speculate her motives or his guilt. It's irrelevant at this point considering the court of public opinion has all the ammunition it needs to take over.

And as has already been stated "Treat Women with Respect" is #1 in Urban's commandments. No exceptions. No second chances. No Tolerance.

If Zach is still a member of the staff by EOB today I would be very shocked. These things move quickly as the University's image/integrity are now on the clock... and the clock is ticking. Guarantee Urban, Gene and President Drake already have the action plan in motion as we speak.

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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buckzilla1's picture

It's irrelevant at this point considering the court of public opinion has all the ammunition it needs to take over.

Next up. Who knew what and when? Why was he hired? Hypocracy in leadership? Narrative after narrative. This is not going away. Perception is everything these days and is a large part of what is wrong with these days. 

Hey Cancer! This ass kicking is brought to you by the Guernsey county mafia. Give it Hell 84!

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BuckAlum09's picture

It will not be long before the headlines will read "Urban Supports Beating Pregnant Wives So Long As It Helps Him Win"

It's impossible to overstate how bad this will be perceived, twisted and painted across social media.

I honestly cannot believe that there hasn't been an announcement yet this morning of Zach's dismissal. What are they waiting on?

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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HandsOfSweed's picture

I'm looking over Mike Bianchi's shoulder right now and peeking at his screen. He just typed that headline verbatim.

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SilverState's picture

As far as the law goes he is "not guilty" from a technical standpoint in regards to domestic violence. But with the political climate towards anything that even remotely hints at violence/abuse/misconduct against women, it's not a survivable situation 

Couldn't agree more. Also, think the court of public opinion needs to be reigned back just a bit. 

"There's still some green showing before you see the chalk."

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BuckAlum09's picture

I can see the CollegeGameday Signs on ESPN now... *Picture of Urban in a White Tank top* and a caption that reads "Urban Loves his Wife Beaters"

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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Poco Loco's picture

BA09-Yours is by far the most reasoned thing I have read on the subject.

a hard rock miner from Butte, Montana

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RunEddieRun1983's picture

His ability as a coach aside, if I were a HC, this isn't the kind of guy I would want mentoring my kid if I had a potential D-1 player as a child. It's a bad look for the team/university.

Urban Meyer left an incredible legacy. 12/4/18 Ryan Day begins his.

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ohst8buxCP's picture
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BrutusB's picture

On one hand, at least Urban recognizes he's a liability.  On the other hand, just be decisive and fire his ass.

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ohst8buxCP's picture

Think Earl was probably the reason for that.

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HandsOfSweed's picture

Michael gave the order that no one touches Fredo while their mother is still alive. 

So now it's time for an afternoon fishing on the lake, Zach.

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urbansjacket2's picture

This looks, really, really bad. If he should have fired him and tried to get him off the staff quietly this goes to a completely different level. 

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urbansjacket2's picture

If this downvote is for anything other than improper use of comma...why?

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ohst8buxCP's picture

I didn't downvote you but I disagree. Glad Urban was at least trying to get rid of him, I would speculate that he probably didn't straight up fire him because of Earl. Also no indication this was because of the DV issues, given the WR performance alone it could have been for football reasons.

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BuckAlum09's picture

As the damage control clock continues to tick over the offices of Gene, Drake and most of all Urban... tick tock fellas... This problem doubles in size every hour minute that Zach is still a member of the staff.

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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Kevin Harrish's picture

I do not doubt this is true, but to be entirely fair, this could be performance based as well. It's not like that would be out of character for Urban Meyer (he's never fired an assistant at Ohio State, they usually leave for "other opportunities," e.i. Beck, Withers). Plus, it's not like there was any new information (that we know of) that just came up within the calendar year. This stuff all happened back in 2009 and in 2015. Two years later seems like an odd time to quietly get rid of him for those reasons.

Buckeye1996's picture

Oh boy.

"Most Noahs have two of everything, he's got four tonight" - Gus Johnson on Noah Brown's 4 TD catches against Oklahoma.

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SilvioDante's picture

Laurinaitis just said on 97.1 his sources said that Coach Meyer had pushed Smith to interview for other jobs this offseason.

Jack would have you believe it's because Smith is actually a coach in demand, not a wife beater Meyer is trying to wash his hands of.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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CALPOPPY's picture

Laurinaitis just said on 97.1 his sources said that Coach Meyer had pushed Smith to interview for other jobs this offseason.

Jack would have you believe it's because Smith is actually a coach in demand, not a wife beater Meyer is trying to wash his hands of.

What good times we’ve had the past week in the forums, huh?

I thought that Smith would get in trouble soon. I certainly didn’t think that it’d be the next day. Can I get some credit for being a predictor person as well? I’m batting like 1.000. I’m no “Oracle of Obfuscation”, but I think I’m doing alright. Who’s the Oracle? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Memento mori

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

Don't want someone guilty of anything like this associated with Ohio State, also don't want anyone perceived guilty of something like this if reasonable doubt exists around their guilt.

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Run_Fido_Run's picture

As of right now, Zach Smith's fireable offense is putting the university in a bad light, regardless of how any accusations might play out in a legal setting (innocent until proven guilty). Maybe the "fair" move is to put him on administrative leave, while he sorts out any potential legal issues, and only allow him back if/when he has cleared his name (and therefore is no longer putting the university in a bad light).

As for those calling for Reuben to be fired . . . I don't know if you're nuts, or if you're an extreme PC moral grandstander, or some combination thereof. But please stop boring us with your nonsense. 

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GrandTheftHarley's picture

Civil Protection Order Filed Against Zach Smith, Records Show History of Domestic Violence Allegations

...And on the eve of B1G Media Days, no less. Reporters are going to going to have a field day with this one.

I am not very smart, but I recognize that I'm not very smart. --- W.W. Hayes

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BrutusB's picture

I'm actively rooting for the Nebraska WR coach to annihilate him from the top rope soon.

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

No way that dude has slept off last night's bender yet.

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showgunz1408's picture

Smith is the lowest paid assistant and from the looks of it he has been his whole career, maybe Meyer did him a solid in a second  chance but also punished his pockets.  

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@osu.fbu's picture

Unpopular opinion: waiting to at least hear the explanation or some evidence to pass judgment.  It sounds true (in which case he should be fired and referred to anger management), but things that sound true are not always true.  

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BucksHave7's picture

This clearly has to be a violation of some sort of ethics clause in his contract, whether or not he was found guilty. Cops dont go around arresting people for domestic violence. 

BucksHave7

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

Cops dont go around arresting people for domestic violence. 

Aren't they required to do exactly that any time they get a DV call?

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

Yes. Not sure what BucksHave7 is talking about.

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BucksHave7's picture

Didnt think I needed to state the obvious, but I will.  I should have added to that 'that cops dont go around arresting people for DV'............ (for kicks, they must have felt a crime was indeed committed based on the circumstances).

BucksHave7

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tbdbitlbuck's picture

Exactly. The officers would have to have probable cause to make an arrest.

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Run_Fido_Run's picture

If it turns out that Smith is innocent of "this" alleged wrongdoing, then being accused would not be a violation of any ethics clause (although Smith might have done unethical things that fall short of criminal guilt, e.g.). 

Cops do sometimes go around arresting people for alleged crimes, which turn out not to be crimes when they go through the legal system. Given that cops make about 14 million arrests per year in the United States . . . most of time, cops go around arresting guilty people, but they also go around arresting hundreds of thousands of not guilty people per year, too.    

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actionstanleyjackson's picture

Hartline time 

Stay golden, Ponyboy.

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

Would rather get Hazell to leave MN or Joker to head a little further North, but the timing may necessitate Hartline if Smith is let go.

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Blockandtackle's picture

This is a larger issue than many here believe it to be.

1.  Urban had to know about the incident in 2009.  Let’s assume for the sake of argument that Zach agreed to get counseling and behaved himself leading into his hiring at OSU. This could then be seen as a one-time mistake where Smith learned a valuable lesson, therefore justifying his hiring at OSU.

2.  However, Urban and the administration also had to know about the incident in 2015. At that point, I believe the university had no choice but to fire Smith. The fact that they didn’t is a problem. 

3.  Whether fair or not the Dr. Strauss issue will influence how the athletic department handles this. Moreover, whether we’re talking about PSU, MSU or OSU, the climate that those in power knew or should have known, yet did nothing, will weigh on what our administration decides to do here. 

Many keep clamoring for the legal process to sort this thing out. I would argue that as callous as this sounds, this is as much, if not more of a public relations issue as it is a legal or moral issue.

I have no idea for sure what Urban, Gene Smith or the President of the university knew; as well as, what if anything was done after the 2015 incident.  However, given the deserved attention on universities giving a blind eye to “known” wrongs, I wouldn’t discount the notion that this could take down more than just Smith.

A joy which death alone can still.

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Trotwoodbuck's picture

If he is still an OSU employee at the end of the week I will be amazed. Conviction in a court of law may be required for incarceration, but it is not required for termination of employment.  I can not imagine the University will tolerate this individual being associated with such a high visibility program.  There is simply no upside for the University to retain him.

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bd2999's picture

I doubt that anything happens to Meyer, given that this is not as bad as some of the other things happening on campus at other schools. That said, Smith should have been fired if all of this was known by the staff.

No real way around that, this will have an impact on recruiting and probably on the field performance but I guess those are the breaks.

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BuckAlum09's picture

The truth behind it all is irrelevant now... The media already running wild with it.

The signs and headlines will read by days end "Urban Supports Coach Accused of Beating Pregnant Wife"

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

So it doesn't matter if he's innocent, he needs to be punished to appease the mob?  

Thank god for the Bill of Rights..........

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beavis's picture

yea, all we need is a mob with pitchforks and someone yelling "string him up!"

beavis

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lamplighter's picture

This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.

peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
 

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BuckAlum09's picture

Welcome to America since about 2014... Where have you been? Hopefully somewhere tropical?

But being serious, I absolutely agree with what you're getting at. It's just not the world we currently live in. 

ie. Zeke HEAVILY punished by the NFL, even though he was found to be innocent of all charges/accusations by an incredible amount evidence. Why? Because the NFL believed it was a smart move to show support to the woman regardless of what the court of law said. The NFL knows that its female viewers are raising the next generation of athletes, and promoting or discouraging them from playing/watching football, buying jerseys for their kids/husbands, wearing apparel of their own. 

Make no mistake about it. This is a PR problem as far as the brass at OSU is concerned. How do we save face as well as not lose money.

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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flickster's picture

I'm sure Urban is thrilled that all of this is happening during B1G Media Days, too.

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JTFor President2016's picture

Don't you know? It is a requirement that a shitstorm ensues the week of media days. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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HattanBuck85's picture

Fire his ass. He should have never been hired in the first place, but nepotism is a helluva drug. What an embarrassment. 

"The height of human desire is what wins, whether it's on Normandy Beach or in Ohio Stadium." - Woody Hayes

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CowCat's picture

There is no good end to this.

I'm speaking as a kid who went through my parents getting divorced essentially twice over. Custody battles, moving across the country. My sympathy is with the kids first.

If Smith is truly guilty, punish him, but realize that the kids will suffer in any situation.

"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer

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buckgrad04's picture

Innocent or guilty, doesn't matter at this point. Media will ride this until people are fired

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Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Pre-internet days

Finders of fact, n.  - Triers of fact, or finders of fact, are the persons (jury or arbitration panel or administrative tribunal), or a person (the judge, magistrate or special master in the case of a bench trial, or the arbitrator the case of arbitration, or the hearing officer in the case of an administrative hearing), who determine facts in a legal proceeding, usually a trial. To determine a fact is to decide, from the legally admissible evidence, whether something existed or some event occurred.

Today

Finders of fact, n. - Triers of fact, or finders of fact, are every yahoo on the worldwide interwebz with an opinion based upon limited facts or factoids, as reported by non-eyewitnesses, many of which may be inadmissible at a formal legal proceeding, or based upon rampant speculation, rumor, innuendo, or personal bias.

Bobbing for french fries.

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tbdbitlbuck's picture

Genuinely curious, what was your opinion on Jameis Winston in 2013?

But seriously, are you serious with this? You think that people didn't have biases before the internet existed? You think that people didn't make judgments before "all the facts were known"? That in 1994, everyone was genuinely waiting to hear all the facts before having an opinion in the OJ trial?

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65 Toss Power Trap's picture

I'm praying for all involved.

Especially the innocent victims (kids)

Knowledge is Power

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1MechEng's picture

Is it too early to start prognosticating Smith's replacement?!
 

Trust me! I'm an Engineer.

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Buckeye Chuck's picture

It's astonishing to me that Smith was ever brought up here after the 2009 incident. It's not like he was so overwhelmingly qualified for the job that you might be tempted to look the other way — he was a former Florida GA with all of two years of assistant experience.

Meyer will get hammered nationally for this, especially given everything else going on right now, and he brought it on himself.

And those of you who are giving rampant downvotes to anyone who dares bring up uncomfortable points are really showing your asses.

The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.

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JTFor President2016's picture

Earle definitely was a factor. He was Urban's role model. He is a great recruiter, we can't look past those qualifications. These reports now saying that Urban told him to interview for new jobs this summer was interesting. Either he knew what was about to come out, or he just wanted to move on. As it was mentioned above, Urban doesn't fire assistants. He finds them new jobs. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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Buckeye Jack's picture

There are also "reports" that Saban offered Zach a job, and Zach turned Saban down.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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JTFor President2016's picture

It's not like this would be anything new. The exact same thing happened with Withers and Beck. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

What about Saban's lawyer? Did you call him to ask?

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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Buckeye Jack's picture

What about Saban's lawyer? Did you call him to ask?

No.  But if you have his number, I'll give him a jingle.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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ohst8buxCP's picture

There are also "reports" Notre Dame offered me a Job to be head coach but I turned them down

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huffdaddy's picture

The only job Saban is offering Zach is the "polish my car and get the Wendy's order" job that Butch Jones currently has.

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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Buck61's picture

I am wondering if they placed Smith on some type of administrative leave how would this effect the number of coaches allowed to coach. It appears as if Smith could be replaced on a temporary basis and not count  against the numbers.

Found this on an NCAA. org powerpoint

Countable Coaches – Who is Doing What?
RSRO Question No. 1:
Is it permissible to replace a countable coach on a
temporary basis due to a family commitment (e.g.,
wedding), unique coaching opportunity (e.g., national
team coach), or medical issue?
 

Countable Coaches – Who is Doing What?
RSRO Answer No. 1:
Yes, provided there is no duplication of duties and
the replacement is temporary as opposed to
permanent

http://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/2018RR_Division_I_Introduction_t...

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Buck61's picture

falls under this by law

BYLAW 11.7.1.1.1

[*] An institution may replace temporarily or on a limited basis one of its countable coaches if the coach is unable to perform any or all of his or her duties because of extenuating circumstances (e.g., suspension, prolonged serious illness, pregnancy). [*] The replacement coach may perform only those coaching, administrative or recruiting duties, including the telephoning of PSAs, that the replaced coach is unable to perform. 
 

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QBYBuckeye's picture

The only question left is: Will Urban do the right thing?

New York Buckeye

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Trotwoodbuck's picture

I doubt what happens at this point is Meyer's decision.

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BrutusB's picture

Mean Gene about to drop the hammer

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IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

Agreed, this decision will come from higher than Urban and maybe even Gene.

"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine

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Sanitarian2's picture

On the surface it does appear that there is a problem here but to the person that said the police don't just go around arresting men on Domestic Violence charges.......................good one.  In fact if one reads the first case in Florida(Assuming it's description is accurate) she attempted to remove him from the family bed.  Sounds like he's  a mean drunk though we have to be careful here, many a man gets accused of DV by their significant others as a ploy or revenge. Works really well in child custody cases too.

Sani

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wyatt's picture

Sometimes an ex-to-be will make up any charge to get custody and money....or both.  Either way Smith will move to another place of employment. 

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My buck's picture

Unless anyone commenting have been through a bitter divorce, you have no idea how petty and cruel spouses can be to one another, especially when children are involved.  Relationships become very complex and complicated and there is no way any of us can understand the circumstances of all involved. Hitting a woman is never ok. A woman hitting a man is never ok.  Let the facts straighten things out. We’re judging mainly on speculation, which helps nothing. She said he brought a woman over.... does that make it true because she said it?  I’m sure his version sounds very different.  

All I am saying is, step back and let the courts sort all of this out.  It looks bad for Zach, Urban, and OSU, but I guarantee that this information is barely scratching the surface of what is the truth.  

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

A Master Chief I used to work with always said, “Skipper, no matter how thin you slice the baloney, there’s still two sides.”

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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ChristianHaven's picture

A slice of bologna looks the same on either side.  An even better metaphor might be:
"Every coin has two sides."
Because the heads and tails look different.

Life starts all over again when it gets crisp in the fall. (F. Scott Fitzgerald)

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neo's picture

Little bit of an interesting nugget here:

"Let's beat the shit out of Michigan. Have a good night." - UFM

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mathandler1's picture

Urban has a policy of no violence against women. He would suspend a player or even get rid of one. That seems to be what should be done here. Suspend him immediately and see where it goes. If it means termination so be it. We probably have tons of coaches who will step in immediately.

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SilverHaven's picture

Thank goodness, that pacifist policy does not extend to Wolverines on the field.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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westcampus's picture

If this was going on at a program we didn't like, what would our thoughts be?

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Buckeye Chuck's picture

Always a good thought experiment. 

The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.

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SilvioDante's picture

I'd say pretty close to the same response you see here.

Don't let the Zone6 door hit ya on the way out, Coach.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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westcampus's picture

Yes I've been really encouraged by the consensus here.  We've all been on this guy's case for being a bad coach anyway.  Now is the time to get rid of him.  Young assistants would be racing to get his job.

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JTFor President2016's picture

In that same light

If Smith was a Top-5 receiver coach, what would our thoughts be?

It shouldn't matter, but I have a feeling, that some, not all, but some of the "Fire him immediately" semantics, wouldn't be here if he was a Broyles award winner. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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SilvioDante's picture

And that will always be the rub, we will never know.

I know my personal response would still be the same, but I know that is unlikely to hold water for the masses.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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stpetebuck's picture

In the meantime,, other schools win recruits by insinuating an assistant might leave for a real job.  Convincing a recruit’s mom that Smith is damaged goods is like shooting fish in a barrel. This is way too easy for other programs. 

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SaltyD0gg's picture

I have a good friend that had an absolutely crazy ex-wife who had him arrested under similar circumstances and wrought issue in his life and kept him away from his kids until they became adults despite him doing nothing abusive whatsoever.

I also have a cousin that was married to a degenerate, cheating abuser who threatened to kill her and kept her living in fear for years.

I've seen both sides of this and it is safe to say that nothing good comes of it for anyone involved. Let's let the family resolve family issues and hope the staff and university uses measured judgment to address Smith as an employee.

Feel bad for everyone close to this.

Pain of Discipline

Pain of Regret

Take Your Pick

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65 Toss Power Trap's picture

Carpenter and Rothman on 97.1 The Fan don't seemed to worked up about this.

Didn't hear the morning guys takes.

Knowledge is Power

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Meek's picture

That settles it, nothing to see here.

- OSU ISE -+-  Premium Banter -+- OH48 80k -

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stxbuck's picture

Apparently Urban can't be bothered to have his staff read the giant "Respect Women" sign on the wall of the WHAC. Absolutely disgusting. Smith should be fired immediately.

If someone on your staff gets charged with felony assault at your old university, you sure as hell shouldn't bring them to the next stop. Urban has some major explaining to do.

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BuckAlum09's picture

Like it or not this, yours is the narrative that the media outlets will be feeding for click bait dollars.

But you should have the facts in your back pocket, just in case, that ZM was never charged/found guilty of beating his pregnant wife.

As you mentioned, Urban will definitely need to be explaining himself due to the core values he claims to stand behind and prop his program up on.

"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."

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CincyBuck's picture

But you should have the facts in your back pocket, just in case, that ZM was never charged/found guilty of beating his pregnant wife.

To narrow this debate, he was charged, but that charge was dismissed for insufficient evidence.  He never even retained private counsel (though there was a public defender appointed on a provisional basis).  The docket is online.

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Buckeye Jack's picture

Zach Smith has been convicted of NOTHING. 

If tOSU fired Smith on the basis of these two media storms, they would take on a sizable legal liability.  Particularly in view of the nature of the last attempt the ex made at having Zach arrested.

Let the courts work this out.  

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

What did Smith's attorney say this morning?

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Helmet Sticker Day Trader's picture

Apparently, Buckeye Jack is Smith's attorney.

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CALPOPPY's picture

Zach Smith has been convicted of NOTHING. 

If tOSU fired Smith on the basis of these two media storms, they would take on a sizable legal liability.  Particularly in view of the nature of the last attempt the ex made at having Zach arrested.

Let the courts work this out.  

You’re going to go down with the ship, aren’t you?

Memento mori

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bucknut1994's picture

If you have a good batting average like him why wouldn't you?

#94Ways

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Jumar's picture

You’re going to go down with the ship, aren’t you?

He will rise again.

If you continue to think what you always thought, you will continue to get what you always got. #AlumforStaff

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SilvioDante's picture

Did you honestly expect anything else, Poppy?

I would bet on Urban resigning before BJ ever admitted he was incorrect.

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Not for nothing, but I’m guessing Coach Smith is considered an “at will” employee. The university could let him go without major ramifications. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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513Buckeye's picture

Why is this guy always spouting legal opinions that are just flat out wrong (which is to say nothing about his other opinions)?  Stop with the stupid hot take stuff man.  As someone who will actually be a certified lawyer very soon, I'll tell you that you can fire an at-will employee for no reason whatsoever.  And even if he's not a classic at-will employee (he's under contract), I'm sure there are such clauses written into his contract.  He would still be paid the duration of his contract, sure, but he can't sue Ohio State simply for being fired.  

-Ohio Against The World-

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CincyBuck's picture

Yeah...  everybody thinks that anyone who gets fired for no reason has some huge claim.  Not so.  Maybe in Europe. 

Smith is an able-bodied guy in his 30s.  Good luck fashioning some sort of discrimination claim. 

And while he likely has some additional protections as a state employee (i.e., due process), OSU can overcome that hurdle pretty quickly.  Talking to his wife and giving Smith a brief opportunity to be heard probably gets that done.  The allegations are pretty damning.

And preemptive congrats on becoming a lawyer in the near future.  I assume you've either finished the Bar Exam or are about to take it.  Regardless, the waiting (for the results) is definitely the hardest part. 

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lamplighter's picture

never mind - something I didn't need to say.

That due process is a bitch, isn't it.

This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.

peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
 

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CincyBuck's picture

That due process is a bitch, isn't it.

Yep; BS, I say.  And I forgot to mention, as others have pointed out, we have factual findings (and sparse as they may be) from the Judge's TRO/Protection Order decision.  So yeah...  dude is toast if OSU wants him to be.

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Oakland Buckeye's picture

I have been (in the minority) a supporter of you on here Jack - especially in the rush to judgement we saw last week. But there would be no "sizable legal liability." There is plenty of cause with ZS "trespassing" last week that the university could fire him - plus we dont know what other aspects of his contract he may have violated. As much as I dont like it - you are waiting for the courts to decide smith's potential freedom or innocence - but the courts will not be deciding his employment at a public / state university.

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NativeSon's picture

A court has already seen a preponderance of evidence that led them to conclude that 

(Courtney Smith) is in immediate and present danger of domestic violence and for good cause the following temporary orders are necessary to protect the persons named

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huffdaddy's picture

Dude. They can fire him right now, full stop, based on the judge finding and the track record. 

If Zach's best play is "I'm going to sue tOSU" then he really doesn't have any other job options. 

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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wpbbuckeye's picture

Meyer needs to treat the coaches the same way he treats the players on this.  If the allegations from the female are deemed credible, Smith needs to go.  

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buckzilla1's picture

SECTION 1.5 of Zach Smith's contract. Clearly this has to be the one that gets his ass gone. Not a matter of if but when.

www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio-state-football/2017/05/82360/ohio-state-wide...

Hey Cancer! This ass kicking is brought to you by the Guernsey county mafia. Give it Hell 84!

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Buckeye Jack's picture

Actually I think 1.2 would kill a lawsuit.  In that it states that Smith "serves at the pleasure" of Coach Meyer.  So, essentially an at-will employee.  Fairly unusual for coaches represented by agents and lawyers.  

But I still maintain that if Meyer wants to keep him and higher ups force a firing, that Meyer would resign soon after.  And if Smith is ever convicted of domestic abuse, then Meyer would fire him on the spot.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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buckeyebilly312's picture

This might be the best zone 6 we've seen in years, even with the loss of Z. Smith.  t-minus 39 days 23 hours to kickoff....

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TobyMagic's picture

Why because it's been the same guys for 5 years?

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buckeyebilly312's picture

Haha sorry I forgot to turn on my sarcasm font.   

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scarpenter614's picture

When applying for jobs, most companies do a criminal background check, but I'm not sure if you can pass on a qualified candidate simply because they've committed a crime.  I worked with a convicted murderer at a sandwich shop in the old Ohio Union.  Blaming Urban for this makes no sense.  I don't know what my employees do at night with their families.  If one of them gets arrested for DV, my HR team reviews the case and decides if termination is prudent.  I'm sure Urban has a say in keeping him or letting him go, but law enforcement, courts, and OSU admin/legal are going to have most of the power, as they should.

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moopdawg's picture

I thought Coach Meyer had a thing that if the police get involved, folks automatically are suspended.  I don't recall ever hearing Smith being suspended or disciplined (maybe in house?).  

Regardless, this goes against Meyer's core values, and the fact that Smith has a history of being violent toward women makes me question the program's moral integrity.  Hopefully, we will hear honest statements and individuals well be held accountable, head coach and athletic director included.

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JTFor President2016's picture

I saw somewhere he received a summer suspension, but I have absolutely zero evidence to back that up. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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moopdawg's picture

Interesting.  If true, fans probably dismissed the suspension as something Twitter-related (I would have).  Like, Meyer got fed up with Smith popping his Twitter mouth.

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Buckeyes17's picture

I think we need to see what happens in court, no?

If Smith is guilty of something, fire him. Are you not innocent until proven guilty? Also, that is exactly how Urban can justify anything.

"Khajiit has wares if you have the coin."

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stxbuck's picture

So Urban should wait for a conviction before enforcing any of the team rules posted on the wall of the WHAC? Working for tOSU isn't a crimnal/legal right.

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GlassCityBuckeyes's picture

Has to be more to the story then what we are getting. Or Zach would of been gone long ago. Give the man his do before jumping to conclusions.

Noon games suck

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okiebuck's picture

Actions and consequences; if the rule is zero tolerance for mistreating a women; he should be cleaning out his desk. It's really no more complicated then that. 
 

The only hard day was yesterday

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ChazBuckeye's picture

This...^^^^
What's good for the players, should also be the same rules for the coaches. That's where the tough questions come in to play for Urban. And probably starting tomorrow....

It is time!!!!!

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TheBadOwl's picture

With that rule in mind, why not dismiss him back in 2015? 

When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.

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BiznessTime's picture

Urban can and probably will survive this (or perhaps this is an out for him as well), but this is a HUGE black eye for him and OSU. He has daughters, preaches against violence against women, and 100% know about the 2009 incident. He's just too loyal and could't fire Bruce's grandson, but that is squarely on Urban. I hope he survives this but it's going to hurt recruiting and the program in general, and you're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.

Also, I believe in due process but you all are fooling yourselves if you think Zach Smith will get it....that is not how our world works anymore. He's already guilty in the public view and needs to go by end of day.

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Buckeyes17's picture

That last sentence makes no sense.

IF he is actually innocent, he is damned because the media said bad things?

"Khajiit has wares if you have the coin."

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JTFor President2016's picture

When Fall camp opens, this will be forgotten about. I made a comment earlier about how convictions aren't everything, and that everything could, and probably is true, even though he wasn't convicted. However, when it comes to jobs, that is a viable reason to not fire someone. Urban and OSU are not going to go down for this. Unless there are behind the scenes stuff (emails, texts, etc...) between Urban (a la Tressel), nothing with come of this other than Smith being unemployed. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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ohst8buxCP's picture

Urban can and probably will survive this

......Seriously? Dear God the outrage over every little thing is out of control. Should ZS be fired? Probably. But if you think Urban is in any jeopardy over this you're delusional.

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JTFor President2016's picture

1000% agree. Will Urban get backlash? Absolutely. Urban always has backlash from outsiders, that jump at every opportunity. Does that matter? Hell no. Urban chose not to fire a guy, the same guy Doc Holliday and Steve Adazio hired in 2010 and 2011, who had no convictions. I'm not taking Urban's side if he knew more than the public. But at the end of the day, Urban chose not to fire a guy who had no convictions. Should Urban have done something if he knew? Maybe so. But there is nothing here that can take him down. This will be forgotten about in 2 weeks. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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buckeyeupnorth's picture

Posters are forgetting that Zach Smith technically doesn't work for Urban, he is employed by the Athletic Department via an employment contract with them. They are the finally arbiters as to whether he has violated his contract and is to be fired. Obviously , Urban has a lot of discretion in recommending a firing or hiring , but Gene Smith and Athletic administration are the final say.

People keep conflating Urban's team rules for his student athletes vs. employment rules for coaches, administrators , etc whose contracts are with OSU Athletics, not Urban Meyer.

The 2009 incident in Florida, which resulted in a police visit, and the wife refusing to press charges would have been included in a background check of arrest records. Smith, his agent, his lawyer, possibly his wife would have been involved is discussion of the incident with the athletic department and there was probably an understanding of the situation which allowed him to become employed by the Athletic Department. The subsequent situations, which occurred six years later, after Smith and his wife divorced, may or may not have been reported to the athletic department. The fact that his wife now has a restraining order tells me nothing about their situation other than Smith doesn't seem to like to follow rules laid out for him, which has now resulted in an RO.

We have a male friend who suffered a really ugly divorce from his wife which resulted in her getting a restraining order against him during the divorce and subsequently in the divorce decree, he was not permitted to have any physical contact with her, nor could he be within a mile of her residence, despite having three kids who he had been given visitation. There was never any actual physical violence between them, she said she was afraid of him because he raised his voice. Not joking , the court granted an RO based on that statemen then the decree included this crazy requirement. In order to pick up and transfer kids during visitation weekends, said friend had to have an approved family member drive sometimes several hours to pick up kids at approved meeting location, then deliver kids to said male friend, then do it all over again on Sunday, etc. 

I have no idea how the athletic department will handle this, they will have to work within their own rules(which are also influenced by the state of Ohio labor laws) while trying to deal with fallout from the mob mentality that is the way of social media today. Additionally, there is a separate employment contract involved which must be honored. 

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

Also, I believe in due process but you all are fooling yourselves if you think Zach Smith will get it....that is not how our world works anymore.

Due process is not, and never has been, a right to which people are entitled in the court of public opinion. Sucks, sure, but that's how the world has *always* worked.

As far as his actual, constitutionally guaranteed right to due process vis-a-vis the criminal justice system is concerned, I fail to see how that right has been infringed upon in any way.

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BucksHave7's picture

And just when I thought the Oregon State game couldnt get here fast enough.

BucksHave7

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ChazBuckeye's picture

Once he has been tried and convicted, he gone! And rightfully so. Urban may have a few tough questions to answer.

It is time!!!!!

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Homey1970's picture

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. 

 
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Buckeye Jack's picture

This is why we have courts and juries.

Mobs don't need hearings, evidence, deliberation, judges OR juries.

Let the courts work this out.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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CALPOPPY's picture

This is why we have courts and juries.

Mobs don't need hearings, evidence, deliberation, judges OR juries.

Let the courts work this out.

You’re like the band playing on the Titanic as it’s going down.

Memento mori

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Rearranging route trees as the playbook is being burned. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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Knarcisi's picture

Thought I’d see you in the 12W lounge. 

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Oakland Buckeye's picture

Geez Knars - stalker much? I am hiding in the lounge as i am afraid you will pants or swirly me. Thanks for the reminder!

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Earle's picture

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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huffdaddy's picture

A judge found evidence necessitating an order. OSU absolutely does not need to find him guilty by a "beyond a reasonable doubt" legal standard. That's not mob rule - that is just the reality of being an at will employee. 

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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Buckeye Jack's picture

The judge need not rule for the temporary time period to immediately begin. A form is filled out, and the complainant's signature is notarized.  All of this is proscribed by statute - not by a judge reviewing the merits of the case.

In this case, Zach's attorney will be heard on August 3.  Then a judge will rule on the facts of the case.

https://www.clarkcountyohio.gov/DocumentCenter/View/290

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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SilvioDante's picture

Clark County?

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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CincyBuck's picture

I don't believe that's how it works in Hamilton County.  Can't say I know Franklin County off the top of my head.  Though I'll note that, in the link you posted, it specifically states that, after filling-out the form, you will have an ex parte hearing before the judge.  That's when the judge makes preliminary findings of fact and either does or doesn't issue the protective order.  Then, yes, there's always a follow-up hearing (if not several).

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NativeSon's picture

It's not. In Hamilton County you're seen by a magistrate and it's either approved or denied. 

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SilverHaven's picture

Getting a temporary restraining order was easy breezy against my ex spouse. Just contacted the magistrate after court.  He signed off from a brief 2-minute explanation of emergency need, and then it went to the clerk of the court to set a later hearing for a judge to hear both sides and decide whether to make it a permanent injunction.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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Buckeye Jack's picture

It is an Ohio wide statute. It is an intelligent law designed to give emergency relief without taking the risk of delay caused by requiring a judge to review the facts of the matter beyond the notarized form. They are ex parte and are almost never denied.  The respondent can challenge the automatic order, which Smith has done.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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NativeSon's picture

When you apply for a CPO in Hamilton County, you go in front of a magistrate and they either approve it or deny it. You don't just fill out a form and have it approved. 

I'm not a lawyer but I believer ex parte hearings are emergency hearing that don't require the other party to be present. ZS will have the ability to defend himself but his ex had to present evidence that made the court believe it was more likely that not that she's in immediate danger. 

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SilverHaven's picture

Exactly my experience.

Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.

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bd2999's picture

I am a little disturbed by so many posters saying he needs to be found guilty first. No he doesn't. Unless his contract says so. The fact that there is a history and she could get a restraining order are not good signs towards him in this matter. Those things alone tend to point to repeated behavior and could be grounds for removal from a job.

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Buckeye Jack's picture

J'accuse!

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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EZE4TD's picture

I love how when the first report came out that he dropped the kids off, everyone was saying "oh, he didn't do anything, there's nothing here." Now with the 2009 incident, every one wants ZS burned and is questioning UFM. Is it at all possible that we message board warriors dont have all the info and are constantly jumping to conclusions and making assumptions on things we dont know the first thing about? Nah.

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OSU2002Grad's picture

I think it’s possible that posters are/were reacting to the information we had. We aren’t privy to everything but it sure would have been prudent for 11W to report on this back in 2015. It makes no sense to me how the reports were held back last week. We only know what they tell. Is there something else we are missing?

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

Or, the disparate comments in the two stories were actually made by different people. 

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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EZE4TD's picture

Fair enough, but both sides made with equal conviction. My comment is not about people who flip flopped, it's about people who choose to take a firm stance with little to no information. I work in media. Rarely are all the facts presented to the public in a complete and unbiased manner.

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buckeyepastor's picture

Given the WR performance in 2012, 2013, and 2016, I gotta think Meyer has a short list of WR coach candidates.  I am thinking that he is on staff until they have found and signed his replacement.  Were a student athlete to face such allegations, he’d be gone.  Same should happen for Smith.  

"Woody would have wanted it that way" 

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OSU2002Grad's picture

I’ve never been more disappointed in Urban Meyer. These issues should have been brought to light much sooner. It certainly seems many already knew about them and did/said nothing. 

As for Smith, get him the F out of here. I’ve seen this pattern of conduct before. It’s classic DV. I don’t need a conviction to see it.

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

Urban Meyer, what are you doing?

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CincyOSU's picture

Probably gathering facts before making a decision.

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

From which allegation? The 2009 charge still? 

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

There is no 2009 charge, it was dropped.  I'm willing to bet Meyer has a whole lot more info on this stuff than the all knowing general public.

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

CT - If it's a one time thing, I get it. But Urban must know a lot lot, every time there is an allegation, there's been more than two lol 

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

He definitely knows a lot, and has a really good track record at OSU getting it right.  That doesn't guarantee Smith's innocence, but it should prevent people from jumping to conclusions before they have enough pertinent information.

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JTFor President2016's picture

The same charges that Doc Holliday and Steve Adazio didn't think too much about?

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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CTBuckeyeFan's picture

Seems to be an outdated concept these days, sadly.

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82spencer's picture

This has been going on for a decade. 

I don't believe in no-win scenarios

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Sanitarian2's picture

"Urban can and probably will survive this" are you freaking kidding me?

I do agree that coaches should be held to the same standards as the players though that standard is a bit harsh when it comes to everyone. Players suspended for self defense is wrong.

Sani

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

Coaches should be held to a higher standard 

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JTFor President2016's picture

Why he will be fired, and Hyde was suspended 3 games. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

Coaches should be held to a higher standard 

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JTFor President2016's picture

Agree. That was a statement, not a question. Should have started the sentence with "that is"

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

JT - I got you man. I'm not saying Zach Smith SHOULD be fired, but as somebody who has defended him multiple times since he's been an Ohio State coach, I feel like there needs to be some sort of something going on with this guy. He's been an embarrassment. If I were Nebraska's former WR's coach, I would be going HAM on Smith right now. 

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Buckeye Jack's picture

Let me know when there is an actual conviction of abuse (an indictment, even).  If tOSU attempted to fire Smith OR Meyer with nothing more than media reports (that something maybe might have happened), they'd be taking on a 8 or 9 figure liability in Meyer's case - and a significant one in Smith's.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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CALPOPPY's picture

Let me know when there is an actual conviction of abuse (an indictment, even).

Dude, better let it go. This ain’t gonna end well for you.

Memento mori

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CincyOSU's picture

I hate to break it to you Jacky, but if OSU lets Smith go there isn't going to be any lawsuit.

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CincyBuck's picture

What, you don't think Smith would be able to get 300+ years of front pay (10-figure liability divided by $300K salary) for being fired based on multiple charges, a civil protection order (that includes factual findings), and a repeated pattern of being a Grade-A dipshit -- not to mention several other things? 

Hopefully OSU's legal team isn't as cavalier with the University's future as you seem to be...

Just kidding, BTW (sarcasm seems to be a lost art on this thread).

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CTBuckeye's picture

"Because we couldn't go for three"

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buckeyeEddie27's picture

Late to the party.....

Get him gone asap

I know there's a game Saturday, and my ass will be there.

I Believe In Ohio State.

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JTFor President2016's picture

Let's back up a minute. We are going off on Meyer for the 2009 incident. But after 2009 Smith was HIRED by two different coaches in 2010 and 2011. They obviously saw nothing to warrant not hiring him. Yes, Urban should and will fire him, but hold the phone on attacking Meyer over this. It can be a fickle matter firing. or not hiring, someone based on charges without a conviction. I 100% believe Smith did everything in those articles, but the hiring/firing world is crazy. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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Buckeye Jack's picture

"Get off my driveway!!!" is the only actual criminal charge the ex has ever filed.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

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CincyOSU's picture

Do you know what a "Fluffer" is Jack? Because you are FAST approaching that status with Smith.

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NavyBuckeye91's picture

I'll bet ESPN will be all over this story - blaming Urban Meyer, OSU and the Big Ten. They hate us.  

"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott

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CincyOSU's picture

I know you're joking, but, as of 3:30 today they don't have any mention of this on the main page or the CFB page.

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NativeSon's picture

She also filed for, and was granted a CPO which doesn't require a criminal charge 

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avail31678's picture

Just because she didn't file charges doesn't mean he didn't assault her.  Jesus, you don't have to have charges filed against you to be an ass or to be fired from a job.  

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BuckeyeinFlorida's picture

Urban yells I need the best choices !
WHERE ARE THE WEDDING PHOTO'S ?

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BuckeyeRealist13's picture

I'm a pretty diehard Ohio State fan, why is this the first time I'm hearing of any of this (outside of the issue last week)? I feel like an idiot for defending Smith last week. Urban Meyer needs to decide what does "zero tolerance" mean to him. Go Bucks! Beat Oregon State! 

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JTFor President2016's picture

We are all diehard fans on this site, and none of us knew anything about it. It's not just you. I think some in the comments are blowing this up bigger than it should be right now. Especially the "Meyer should never have brought him here" takes. That is hard to determine when he had 2 coaching jobs inbetween Florida and OSU. If Meyer stands up and says something along the lines of, "At the time, we determined his past allegations were not clear enough to warrant firing him. But in light of the recent charges, we have moved on". I would be totally fine with that. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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ohiopanda's picture

But the only recent change in Smith’s life was that he dropped his kids off and then got a restraining order. The history of violence was still firmly there. If Urban fires him now, then it looks like Urban is firing him solely because his violence has been publicized.

The quick decision of a restraining order essentially confirms that Smith was a violent jerk- so if Urban kept him due to lack of evidence, then he didn’t do a very good job checking out the claims

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JTFor President2016's picture

You make a good point. The 2015 incident is the one to be looked at. 2009 doesn't matter, because 3 separate head coaches didn't deem it worthy of firing/not hiring. 

Urban could very well say "There were  allegations in the past that were addressed but not deemed fireable, but this last incident was the final straw and we have decided to move on."

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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buckeyebilly312's picture

Color me ignorant but don't you all think there is a reason he's been signed to a one year contract and is the lowest paid assistant on the staff?   

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JTFor President2016's picture

Yeah, Urban must've forgotten to look over the catch rate stats. Joking joking. I need something happy. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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bonebuck's picture

Like many have mentioned I would put Zach on "temporary administrative leave". This does not look good. Sounds like his ex cut him slack the first time by not pressing charges-BUT-now he pulls the stunt of dropping his son off at the door when restraining orders were in place? Stupid decision by Zach.

I think TOSU will have no choice but to let him go eventually. Pretty sad.

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Buckeyes17's picture

I think at the end of the day, it shouldn't be tolerated, but I'm just not in the camp of freaking out. I just want to watch football, lol.

"Khajiit has wares if you have the coin."

HS
Buckeye Jack's picture

Urban will stand by Zach Smith.  And Meyer and Smith go back a lot longer than Florida.  Earle sent Zach to BGSU to be a walk-on for UFM - and Zach basically served as an apprentice coach at BG.

Meyer hates having fans, boosters, administrators, etc. usurping his CEO authority.  Don't hold your breath for Meyer to cave and dump Smith, unless there is a conviction.  Schiano and Wilson both arrived with some "baggage".  They're still here.

Let the courts work it out.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

HS
Buckeye Jack's picture

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

HS
Fatpants's picture

TELL IT TO THE JUDGE, ZACHARY!!!!

PG <3 PG

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huffdaddy's picture

Most 11W fans: "I have a problem with our WR coach having a restraining order against him while our head coach hangs a sign for the players that says to respect women."

BJ: Just relax guys.

Oh, OK.

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

HS
Buckeye Jack's picture

Zach has a restraining order against him? She filed a motion to seek one.  More likely the shared custody order may amended to prohibit Zach from pulling in to her driveway.  

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

HS
CTBuckeyeFan's picture

Zach has a restraining order against him? 

Well its currently illegal for him to be within 500 feet of her, what would you call that?

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Earle's picture

Zone 500

Axe leukemia!
#Poppystrong

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JTFor President2016's picture

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

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SilvioDante's picture

Shit, even his grandfather is piling on!!

"Tina, you fat lard, come get some DINNER!... Tina, eat. Food. Eat the FOOD!"

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Fatpants's picture

You’re not helping yourself here. 

PG <3 PG

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BuckeyeInDenver's picture

Zach has a restraining order against him? She filed a motion to seek one.  More likely the shared custody order may amended to prohibit Zach from pulling in to her driveway.  

The protection order was served. So, yes, there is a restraining order against him, and no, it's not an amendment to their custody agreement. That's not what a civil protection order is.

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Buckeye Jack's picture

Yes. You are correct in that she has invoked what is essentially a temporary order without any input from Zach's side.  On August 3,  Zach's attorney will present the other side to the judge.  I'd be surprised if the 5-year order is permitted to stand, but the judge will make that decision, not us.

Zone6, with rotating WR's, will have 1000+ yards at all 3 WR positions this season

HS
avail31678's picture

You can dance around with different wording all you want.  Here is what the judge said while granting this temporary RO:

The ruling states: "the court finds that (Courtney Smith) is in immediate and present danger of domestic violence and for good cause the following temporary orders are necessary to protect the persons named (Courtney Smith and her children Cameron, 8, and Quinn, 6) in this order from domestic violence.”

This is based on multiple, documented incidents WITH POLICE REPORTS, whether she chose to file charges or not.  They're still documented.

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saintstephen11's picture

so I'm confused. If there is a restraining order to stay away from her and the kids why did he have the kid and why was he dropping the kid off to her?

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avail31678's picture

The restraining order was just filed today (or very very recently).  

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Numbers's picture

doubtful any of this is new news to Urban Meyer. And I don't see him crumbling to media pressure. new information? that's different. but he clearly knows about 2009 and has to know about 2015. and the stuff about the civil order from today doesn't seem fireable on its face IMO.

also, we're (likely correctly) assuming Smith = 'suspect' in the 2015 report. at least by what is in the report here by 11W. Zach's name isn't attached to the 2015 situation according to the 11W story above. 'In 2015, Powell police were called to the Courtney's residence with further allegations of domestic abuse. The police report from the October 26 incident, obtained by Eleven Warriors, states "that a domestic incident happened last night at [Courtney's] home and that she has been a victim of sustained physical abuse by the suspect."' 

I say again...no word on why this incident wasn't looked at closer by authorities?

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JTFor President2016's picture

Yeah we just need more info from all parties involved. 2015 is weird. so far, I have no issues with anything Meyer has done. The 2015 issue was resolved so fast and nothing came of it other than a divorce. I still think no one will be talking about this in 2 weeks. Gimme football games. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

HS
Buckeyes17's picture

Of course no one will be talking about this. It's just because it is the off season.

"Khajiit has wares if you have the coin."

HS
huffdaddy's picture

We will be talking about it. Because either we will have a new WR coach (likely outcome) or many reporters and fans will ask why we don't have a new coach.

"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.

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JTFor President2016's picture

Okay true. I was mainly meaning Urban. I don't care how long we talk about Smith, but hope the talk of "Why did Urban keep this guy" is gone. 

Elliott dots the eye, on this national championship win. 

HS