Just win won, baby.
Man….. this football team.-Jeff Okudah
Yep-I don't think we could have gotten a clearer signal from the Committee that the Buckeyes are in!
Last week, the Committee said that they perceived a "significant" gap between Ohio State and Penn State, and per their new rankings, I think it's highly revealing that even though Penn State stomped Michigan State on Saturday while Oklahoma was dormant, it didn't change their perspective enough to see them leaping over the Sooners.
One is forced to ask, if Oklahoma beats #11 Oklahoma State and Penn State beats Wisconsin, would that be enough to leap Oklahoma? I would guess, yes, barely, but if it's barely enough to leap them, how will it be enough to leap over Michigan, which beat them 49-10, much less Ohio State?
The obvious answer: They won't. The embarrassing head-to-head loss TTUN is too much to overcome, which tells us that Michigan still has a chance if Penn State wins, but no way the Nittany Lions are jumping over the Buckeyes.
Actually, per TTUN, the bigger question is if Wisconsin can leap the Wolverines if they beat Penn State? My guess is no UNLESS the Bacgers win by a decided margin. That being the case, the Committee might say, "Well, given that Wisconsin won its conference championship, and given that they played Michigan in a close game on the road relatively early in the season, and furthermore, given that Wisconsin was strong at the end of the season whereas Michigan lost two of its last three games, we'll give them the nod."
In other words, TTUN should be cheering for a Penn State win, especially if it's a close game or fluke. Of course, I still think the chances of any second Big 10 team requires a Clemson or Washington loss, but or the Buckeyes, I don't think it really matters.
I think we're in. Moreover, if Clemson wins, that's who we'll face in Arizona, whereas if Clemson loses, we'll play Washington in Arizona, that is, unless Washington also loses, in which case, we'll play... I dunno. That's where it gets weird, because if Clemson and Washington both lost, Michigan and/or the Wisconsin/Penn State winner would be the next best two teams, but would they Committee really field a playoff with three big Ten teams?
If not, Oklahoma/Oklahoma State and USC would be the only teams in sight. My guess would be Oklahoma would go, but whomever occupies that fourth spot (Washington/Michigan/Wisconsin-Penn State/Oklahoma), they'll play Alabama in Atlanta.
As an addendum to tonight's rankings per the Committee's logic, we have to ask why Oklahoma State is ranked #11, while simultaneously asking why USC is ranked ahead of the Cowboys at #10? The crystal clear if ONLY viable answer is strength of schedule, whether in conference or non-conference--i.e., the quality of who you beat and to whom you lost.
Granted, they could suddenly value a conference championship so greatly that the winners leap over everyone, citing Ohio State's big leap in 2014, but people forget that when the Buckeyes trumped TCU in 2014, it wasn't just because Ohio State was the Bit Ten conference champion, whereas the Big 12 had none--it was every bit as much because the Buckeyes totally beat down a worthy opponent in Wisconsin and had a better overall schedule, while TCU's competition was relatively weak.
In short, as I look at their rankings, I think the Committee sees their job as, well, the way it should be--it's all about the total body of work. Thus, they count everything--not just conference championships and head to head results, which they can and should value, but strength of schedule, wins and losses at home or on the road, eye test, etc.
Ultimately, I think it reduces to the equation--which team performed better? Who had a better year?
To that end, if you were a genie who could grant Penn State's wishes prior to the season, tell me they wouldn't say they'd gladly pay the price of losing to Ohio State head to head in a fluke loss if it meant that they went 11-1 overall with wins against three top ten teams while the Buckeyes went 10-2 while losing to Pitt and getting stomped by Michigan along the way?
Tell me a single team that would consider the former situation to be a better outcome than the latter? Fact is, there is a significant difference between those two performances, and a PSU win over Wisconsin won't change that--it will only make the gap smaller, but not enough.
This is clearly how the Committee sees the situation, and sanity has prevailed, which means they compare ALL factors--that's their criteria, and there's no real mystery here, despite all of the controversy that the drama queens want to introduce into the discussion.
I didn't read your post that's longer than the article. Just scrolled right through it when I saw how long it was.
Sorry, I didn't read all of your whole post, so I'm not quite sure what you said. See, once I saw that you were someone who takes pride in having a short attention span, I stopped reading past the first sentence.
But--wait--geez! I guess this means I must have a short attention span, too, right? Oh, well, I guess the important thing is that I feel a deep need to broadcast this humiliating fact about myself in public rather than just move on to the next post.
Logged in on mobile just to DV your posts. No need to be a dick just because someone expressed they didn't want to read your novel. Us dumb, slow people can't help ourselves.
Damnit. I expressed that I don't like people that have a need to respond in a snarky manner publicly. Now I've done it myself. THERE'S A GLITCH IN THE MATRIX!
...no occifer, there's no drinking done been.
"Aut viam inveniam aut faciam!"
Take it easy fellow. Maybe I needed the dreaded italics. No need for the hostility, It's not personal.
A shame that you didn't. It was actually quite thought provoking. What must it be like to skip potential thought provoking words? But I suppose you won't read this either. Go back to taking selfies I guess - hope that serves you well in life.
Thanks, UpIrons. I'm guessing his self-phone, er, I mean, cell phone is a very safe and special place for him.
As for you, Yenots11 (in case you haven't gone back to your selfie sanctuary yet), if you were really sincere about people expressing themselves and not being jerks about it for no reason, then you might have noticed that Yuman didn't need to be a jerk to begin with, on top of which, you might have set a less dickish example for everybody by not calling me a dick.
Still, no big deal--I'm all for people expressing themselves, including you, but at least in my world, it's a two-way street. In which case, if the guy thought I was somehow out of line for what I wrote (to the extent it's logical to consider some one "out of line" for expressing a sports opinion in a... sports forum), well, I thought he was out of line, too. So it goes.
Anyway, if you or anybody else prefers to read to write short posts, I say, have at it. I have no objection. In fact, I expect it. It doesn't offend me in the least and I haven't lodged a single complaint--not one preemptive strike.
Meanwhile, in the interest of protecting your sensitive nature in the future, you might reconsider being such a precious snowflake that you melt on the spot whenever someone happens to express a preference or opinion other than yours. Heck, you might even consider not joining discussion groups.
Oh, and by the way, I know that you're probably used to reading texts with 160-character limits, as well as thinking in 160-character bytes, which I'm sure is enough to accommodate the expression of 99% of your thoughts, but as a little FYI, the last time I read a novel, it was actually more than a dozen or so paragraphs--and it wasn't even about sports!
BTW, if noticing this little fact makes me a dick in your eyes, I'll survive. Thing is, I got the memo that this is forum for discussions and no conformity is required.
No need to remark about it then. Props to Chicago connection for a solid, well constructed comment.
Ezekiel Elliott...And He's got an opening! Elliott! Can they catch him? No they can't.
It's better than the article. I'll amend that. Eric did a great job with all the need to know facts. CC did a great analysis, which, I am sure took a considerable investment of time and effort.
Thanks, Horvath, although I have to apologize for one significant mistake--Oklahoma is now ranked behind Penn State, moving from #7 to #9 with Colorado squeezing in between, begging the question of a possible meteoric rise for the Buffaloes should they win... and win big.
As for how I got it wrong, well, when I checked in at ESPN for the latest update on the rankings, I caught a short video on the Committee's new ranking for the first six teams, and then I went to their rankings page for everything beyond #6, but as it turns out, they hadn't updated those numbers yet, so I was working with last week's rankings.
Still, I'd like to think most of the analysis is logical and holds up per the perception of other potential developments.
As an added note, I didn't see the whole interview with the Committee's representative, but I sure wish someone would have asked how much separation the Committee perceived between the various ranked after TTUN and Washington.
TL; DR - Go Bucks!
Gonna be a nice stress free weekend watching some football and hoping for upsets and not worrying about being upset!
It shouldn't be this way though. If there was no playoff system we would all be sick. But their is a playoff system and frankly winning a natty trumps any conference championship "IMO". And let's be honest, Alabama can lose Saturday and will still be in the playoffs.
One other thing, I never thought I would say this, but the 4 team playoff is the perfect number.
"There are 3 things that can happen and 2 of them are bad" - the Curse of Woody Hayes
I did this earlier, but TTUN needs all of the following to have a sweepstakes chance: Clemson and UW lose (they beat Colorado) and Penn Stare beats Wisky (they trounced PSU). Even if that happens, the Committee would have to pass on Bi1G Ten conference winner and the 2 of 3 conference winners from P12, B12, & ACC. I'm not seeing it for a team that could only win twice on the road and lost to previously unrankrd Iowa.
You are entitled to you own opinion, not your own facts.
You may be right, and your logic definitely holds. It just depends which logic the Committee decides to apply. We'll see.
Right now, their overriding logic appears to be overall performance/resume, which is clear enough, that is, unless or until they perceive anything close to a tie between teams.
On a possibly related note, tonight, the Committee spokesperson reported very "little separation" between Michigan and Washington, which speaks to the perception of a tie, while it didn't reference a close call between Michigan and Wisconsin or Penn State.
Moreover, last week it reported a perception of a "significant" difference between Ohio State and Penn State, so it's logical to wonder if they might see a "significant" difference Michigan and Oklahoma, Colorado or a two-loss Clemson?
Now, maybe this apparent perception will change depending on the Wisky-PSU or Oklahoma/Oklahoma State, as well as the nature of the outcome (i.e., blowout, fluke win/loss, etc.), but on the face of it (per the Committee's current rankings, if nothing else), it's definitely a further reach for Oklahoma/Colorado/USC, or else a two loss Clemson.
The good news is that Ohio State appears to be safe from any such dramatic turn of events.
You just created a scenario where 3 B1G teams get in.
I think the scenario exists--the Committee's rankings obviously invite speculation over this scenario, and I'm certainly not the only one who's discussed it, although I suspect it won't happen. I would guess they'll go with Oklahoma, assuming they win, or Colorado.
And then the committee says "oh yeah, UM lost to Iowa. Nevermind, skunkweasels!" There is ZERO chance 3 B1G teams make the playoffs. If Wisconsin, Colorado, and VaTech all win, maybe the ACC and PAC12 get left out, but, IMO, Okla would get in, assuming they win this weekend.
"We gotta go win this next game and make the State of Ohio proud!"-UFM
Yeah, that's my guess, too. But it's pretty crazy that the current situation and Committee rankings have made it conceivable enough to generate logical chatter about it, even if there's no way the Committee goes for it.
I have been saying all along that something weird had to happen for OSU to get in because they were not conference champions. However, watching the playoff show tonight, it appears we are in no matter what - almost. They also made it sound like if anything strange happens with Clemson or Washington, um could also get in. They specifically said that Washington and um were very close. He said the job of the committee was to pick the 4 best teams and they clearly think OSU is #2, regardless of what happens this weekend. I did not think it possible.
Chicago, Penn State is already ahead of Oklahoma.
We can't stop here; this is bat country...
Wasn't Penn State already ranked above the Sooners? And they still are, right?
That's cute :)
Great job, CC. Well done. My thoughts, exactly.
"even though Penn State stomped Michigan State on Saturday while Oklahoma was dormant, it didn't change their perspective enough to see them leaping over the Sooners."
Um, correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not), but Penn St was ranked higher (7th both weeks) than the Sooners both last week (8th) AND this week (9th).
Simply: if Clemson or Washington lose, Wisconsin or Penn St is in. Both teams are ranked higher than Oki or Oki St, so no jumping there.
"There's a fine line between stupid, and....clever. David St. Hubbins/Nigel Tufnel
Louisville at 13? Really?
I don't apologize for anything. When I make a mistake, I take the blame and go on from there. - Woody Hayes
In as long as we don't lose on Saturday.
Only 5 days until it's official. Another great season by the Buckeyes. Hopefully there's another Natty in our future.
The world is yours
I like where this team's defense is. Not so confident about the offense. Is it championship caliber? Some aspects, yes, some aspects no. The best is that it is very likely that we'll get to find out. There is a future championship run for this team.
Can the offense's "situation(s)" get adequately addressed over the next month? If there is any coaching staff, and players, that can do it, it is a Coach Meyer led team.
"Life is ten percent what happens to you and ninety percent how you respond to it." - Woody Hayes
I do agree. This defense is elite. And while the offense has its issues - chiefly the offensive line and need for WRS to emerge as play makers - I'm actually extremely confident that we'll get the issues squared away over the next few weeks.
Youngest team in FBS, still crashing the playoff.
The only good thing about The Game is winning it - Urban Meyer
But, but...there's no chance!
Lol, mind your italics mister. People sure came with the DVs, no?
Oklahoma jumping Penn State is an interesting development.
"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.
Fwiw, Oklahoma will jump PSU when they beat Oklahoma State and PSU loses to Wisconsin, though.
Penn state is higher than Oklahoma.
My bad, was going off the article...
Im good with these 4, lets get this thing rolling.
Straight cash homey.
When you lose, say little. When you win, say less.
Clemson and Washington lose and we have 3 b1g teams in
Not so fast, my friend. I say BIG Champion and Big XII Champion with the Buckeyes and Bama.
Maybe, I should have said if and potentially. Who knows what committee will do in that scenario because Ttun will have win over B1G champion.
I agree with who knows quite a bit. f I were on the committee I would do what I said. Mostly, I was just channelling my inner Corso.
What sort of chaos reigns if Washington and Clemson lose on Saturday? We'd still be in, and likely Wisconsin/PSU, but who else? Oklahoma? TTUN?
Based on this weeks rankings, maybe Penn State and TTUN
Paralyze resistance with persistence
To me, a pure "best four" ranking is 1. Bama, 2. Clemson, 3. Ohio State, 4. Michigan.
If Washington beats Colorado, I will laugh at Michigan, but then the Huskies will get killed by Bama.
That's what you get when you try to run with the big boys.
Yeah, I live in Seattle. I'll root for Washington as long as they're not playing Ohio State. But Washington has nowhere the speed and depth of TOSU, Bama or Clemson. They will be crushed.
"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer
No way we fall from 2 to 5, we'll be playing Clemson (assuming they win), only thing that may change is the jersey color. That oughtta be a hell of a game.
Either way we still play in the southwest and not anywhere near America's wang.
Have you ever seen a fierce animal who you were sure wouldn't bite? Because I haven't.
What the fuck. HOW IS TENNESSEE STILL RANKED?! Auburn and Florida both got HOUSED and they don't drop at all, yet Nebraska goes from 16th to unranked and 8-4 Iowa - with two ranked wins in a row - aren't ranked at ALL? Aside from the top 4, this poll is straight BULLSHIT.
In all honesty, Alabama should be the only SEC team ranked. Whoever gets to go to the Sugar Bowl, looking like auburn, is going to get waxed by Oklahoma or Okie State
Exactly. How in the holy hell is a 9-3 Nebraska team inexplicably unranked?
Absolutely ridiculous. And Iowa should be ranked as well. They have better wins the 7-4 LSU, who is still ranked. What garbage.
They lost to every ranked team they played.
That doesn't explain Auburn, Florida and Tennessee inexplicably staying where they are, but it's at least an explanation I could accept in a vacuum.
When the world is too dark and I need the light inside of me
I'll walk into a bar and drink fifteen pints of beer
Agree on Iowa, but Nebraska was a pretender. Don't think they have a win against ranked team.
It's pretty clear that after the top 10 the committee literally didn't give a shit. I mean, Florida and Louisville? Are you fucking kidding me? And Utah? These rankings are downright pathetic.
I think the committee learned their lesson last year, the buckeyes will be in the playoffs.
FSU over Louisville is interesting considering Louisville clobbered them head to head.
Louisville just lost to UK and lost earlier to 9-3 Houston. FSU is their only decent win. The Noles just beat the SEC East champs.
"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott
You might as well have said that the Noles just beat a wet paper bag.
Better than losing to the pile of shit being carried by that wet paper bag.
The Noles just beat the SEC East champs
I didn't know they played Indiana...
Shandy is not beer
Does this mean those assholes up north have a shot?
No, MSU doesn't stand a chance.
"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read."-Groucho Marx
Goals: Beat Michigan. Win the B1G East. Beat Michigan. Win the B1G CG. Beat Michigan. Win a Natty. Beat Michigan.
No, MSU doesn't stand a chance.
Well played, sir. Very well played, indeed.
Please be more specific. There are a lot of assholes up north.
There ya go. Specificity added:
Pure truth! UV, kind Sloopy!
I'd rather be an hour early than a minute late.
Awesome comment. Funny AND true.
"The minute we stop expecting greatness, we become Wisconsin."
Based upon the song, I don't give a damn about the WHOLE state full of assholes up north.
Why you got to call Canadians names like that?
Also, Utah moved up after a loss. A good loss, yes, but still. UW getting way too much credit for that win, IMO.
More B1G teams in the top 7 than Indians wins in the World Series.
Wahoo! Wahoo! Rip, Zip, Bazoo! I Yell. I Yell. For O.S.U.
No. Just no. Chicago has all those bulls/bears/blackhawks championships. Plus harbaugh is a cubs fan.
With all due respect, eat a dick.
Hindsight is, and in, 2020
There are times where the worst thing that can be spread is misinformation
Hocutt just said "Penn State is not close to Ohio State in the eyes of the committee". Excellent.
The thing that really bothers me about the tOSU or PSU argument is what if notre dame was 11-1 with the sos of the buckeyes. They'd certainly be in no matter who they lost to.
See the ball...Be the ball...
This is true and it's exactly why we'll be in. And people like Kanell and Galloway will bitch about it, but that's nonsense. PSU and Ohio State aren't remotely similar, hence the head to head result not trumping everything else. Thankfully Wisconsin will beat their overrated asses.
Joey Galloway is on our side big time. He has been saying all week that we are in. Its *ichigan maybe getting in with losing 2 of 3 to finish he has a problem with. His gripe is Colorado whose QB got hurt shouldnt be boxed out by losing to *ichigan. He also thinks psu or wisky with winning the conference title should jump a *ichigan in the end. Im with him 100% this week.
Wordness to the turdness
The committee doesn't value losses in November any differently than losses in September. I can understand the gripe with Colorado's QB going down, but Michigan was also missing two of their best defenders (Lewis & Charlton) to injury for the entire game, not just a half like CU.
Michigan has a better resume than either Wisconsin or PSU, as well as the H2H match-ups over both of them. I think a blow-out in the Big Ten championship would be the only shot one of those teams would grab a #4 spot over Michigan.
The committee doesn't value losses in November any differently than losses in September.
Are you sure? The committee put FSU ahead of Louisville despite the fact that Louisville destroyed them in September and they have the same record.
Louisville was #5 and then lost two straight, to fringe 25 team Houston (by 26) and unranked Kentucky (by 3). They dropped to #13
FSU was #17 and then beat unranked Syracuse (by 31) and #15 Florida (by 18). They moved up to #12.
I think you probably would have seen similar movement no matter what month it was. Losing two games in a row is going to see a drop in the rankings regardless of time. They were pretty rough losses, too. Conversely, FSU won two decent games in the same timeframe. Their resumes are almost identical, and their rankings reflect that.
I'm not sure PSU will get owned... Their 2nd half closing stat was 40ish%, ie, they have endurance to close the deal. Just like our boys did in TG.
If difference in skill level is marginal, endurance will weigh heavily in the outcome. I think PSU showed that it matters against MSU who apparently didn't get their *vitamin* shots at the half.
Mach11 with hairball on fire
That's very true.
Like someone said above, the lessons of leaving the 2015 Buckeyes out last year is probably still fresh in the committees minds. Michigan would have also benefitted from that lesson too but they shit the bed in Iowa city
Urban Meyer >Jim Harbaugh for ever and ever, Amen. 0
There is no "lesson" for the committee to learn from leaving Ohio State out last year; they put a much-more deserving Michigan State team in instead. Unfortunately, as a pro-style team they happened to be a terrible matchup against Alabama, so they got thumped. It is not the committee's fault if the teams that deserve to be in the playoffs happen to match up terribly.
The "lesson" is that if the Buckeyes want to be in, they need to win the games that matter most and take advantage of whatever their schedule is. If they play a tough schedule (like this year), they have to win as many games as possible. If they play a light schedule (like last year), then they need to be dominant. This year's team has done enough to earn a playoff spot, and the committee has ranked them accordingly. Last year's Buckeyes did not, and they were ranked accordingly.
Hocutt is essentially saying right now that Penn State needs to f' off.
Unless they get in too which would be awesome. I'd love to beat them by 21 on a neutral field. PSU fans wanted Franklin fired 2 months ago, and now they legitimately believe they're the better team. Because of a blocked FG that bounced into the PSU defense hands.
That's what everyone else in the country has been saying for years.
Hocutt, always the diplomat... Managing expectations so no one gets their feelings hurt. A fuck off now is less painful than a fuck off later, at the altar.
I would like to see Washington vs Alabama, but Michigan vs Bama would be fun too.
Yep and I will say that Bama would rather see Washington than Michigan.
Everyone would rather see Washington than Michigan, which means Michigan should go to the playoffs because they're probably the better team.
Interesting, I can see the possibility that OSU drops to 4 after this weekend if Clemson and Washington look good.
Read my entire screen name....
Unless Washington demolishes Colorado, unlikely they jump above Ohio State. If both win, I see 1. Bama, 2. Clemson, 3. Ohio State, 4. Washington. Which would be one great match up and one fun contrast (although Bama would nuke Washington).
Not sure about destroys. Colorado is viewed as a high quality win for Washington. Plus they have the conference championship to go along with it.
I live in Alabama and my friends who are fans of the local team are shitting their pants after seeing that michigan is 5! No way Bama would get through michigan and us without an L.
I bet Saban is scared shitless about the prospect of playing Peppers. /S
Haha, Hocutt is burying Penn State rght now.
Buckeyes are in a good spot to make the Final 4
All I hope for is a win over TTUN so the rest of the year is gravy for me at this point
I saw Ryan Day hang 62 on Michigan...His hair was perfect.
Go Buckeyes Beat Michigan
I think the best sign for OSU is that ttun only dropped to 5. That means they respect that loss to OSU which tells me they think OSU is very good & there is nothing about these champ games can do about it!! OSU is in!!!!
"Championships are not won on Saturdays in November. Championships are won on Tuesdays in August." -- Kerry Combs
Yeah, I do agree where they put UM here. It would be strange to put them below two teams they beat and have generally looked more complete then.
Our protocol is to select the four very best teams in college football. Says they only go to conference championships if its razor thin
— Land-Grant Holy Land (@Landgrant33) November 30, 2016
"Medicine is not a science" - Leo Spaceman
Well that's that. We're in.
Fields of Dreams
Yeah, sounds like the committee is not buying much into PSU. The issue seems that the resumes are really important. And that seems about right at the moment.
This means we need to have solid ooc schedules
I'm still a bit worried. Cheeks will be tight on Sunday at noon.
This is definitely where I parked my car.
Cheeks will be tight on Sunday at noon
Only if you eat too much chili.
We're a 2 or 3 depending on how Clemson plays. Nobody else will impact our seeding. The committee pretty much slotted us into Phoenix. If Clemson wins a close game we wear red. If they blow VT out, we wear white. If they somehow lose, we wear red against TBD.
Logic does nothing for me right now. I'm a Cleveland fan, so neuroticism runs through my blood.
::pats Cooper on the head::
Just put all your eggs in the Buckeyes basket until the spring. You'll be fine.
I wouldn't say it's a "somehow" chance of VT beating Clemson. VT has been a difficult team to peg this year, some days they're elite, other days they're straight garbage. Clemson similarly has been up and down and has simply profited from a weak conference. I'd actually give VT as good as a 1/3 shot of beating Clemson.
"porque las estirpes condenadas a cien años de soledad no tenían una segunda oportunidad sobre la tierra."
I will feel much, much better if Virginia Tech can eliminate Clemson. I also go to VT so I'm rooting for them anyway but it's mostly Buckeye selfishness. I think Alabama, Ohio State, Washington, and Wisconsin would be so much fun.
11W User Map: https://goo.gl/mxUeyX
Alabama vs Wisconsin would be a good, classic game. Bama probably wins by 14 points, but the game would be in a dead heat up until the habitual 4th quarter Bama scoring-blitz.
We have five weeks to hire an offensive/QB consultant to band-aid the passing game and playcalling.
And you can use those five weeks to get some perspective.
Or call Herman. Prolly needs a break from 24/7 steers n queers by now.
Am I the only won who hope we finish 4th? I want to see us play Bama first again!!!!
"Captain, over here, I've found someth... AHHHH!!!!!!"
Yes, you are.
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
Yes, yes you are.
Worry is a misuse of imagination.
I hope you're the only one.
I want Bama in the championship game
I'll Don ya wee Laddy with my UV. You get the benefit of the doubt we would all like to receive. We're sure you meant finish 4th as in, ish-ishly *at worst finish 4th at the next committee ranking, or otherwise, whichever is required to play Bama first round because that's what you would like to see*
I'm gonna laugh uncontrollably if Washington and Clemson lose and the B1G gets 3 teams in. The south would explode.
You watch either Washington or Clemson will lose and scUM gets in at #4, and they beat Bama, and they play the Buckeyes in the NC.
Fine by me. I'd love to see us with beat those fuckers twice in a season.
Sidebar: it would be fun to see guys with six pairs of gold pants dangling from their necklaces. Even if it's only a few of them.
Or seceed. Again.
oops. I meat this for IBS&G's post above. Doesn't make much sense here.
I just don't want to face Michigan again, and I don't want them to claim a playoff victory over Alabama.
In that situation Oklahoma probably gets in over Michigan or the B1G Championship loser.
Surprised Nebraska fell out altogether
And yet, Tennessee remains ranked after losing to Vanderbilt and Florida and Auburn don't drop after losing both their games in disastrous fashion. Iowa also deserves to be ranked. Ridiculous.
Yep. I find it very hard to believe that if someone like Tennessee only had losses to OSU, Wiscy, and Iowa they would have dropped out of the top 25. Virginia Tech over Nebraska? No.
“Megadeth >>> Metallica” - Alum 2019. I couldn’t agree more.
Kanell is such a tool.
I don't understand how Nebraska drops out of this ranking over some of these teams. They only have losses to Ohio State, Wisconsin, and Iowa compared to some of these teams.....
***cough cough Tennessee***
Guh. If Clemson or Washington blow it, Michigan will totally get in.
That'd be kind of a bummer. I wanted that win to have exiled them to Orlando.
Not so fast. Michigan has two conference losses. The winner of the conference (likely Wiskey) will have some serious consideration over Michigan... in fact they'll get jumped. Bank on it.
"The future is bright at Ohio State." - Urban Meyer 1/1/15
Honestly, I think Penn State is going to win it. I really do.
The 2016 Buckeyes entered this season as the youngest team in all of FBS, beat three top ten teams, are currently ranked second, and are about to be in the playoff. Incredible.
Tom Brady lost to John Cooper. Never forget.
And yet Kirk Ferentz will go 8-4, lose to an FCS team and get Big Ten coach of the year.
I believe Paul Chryst won it.
You two are insane. Look at what we've done with our roster full of untested underclassmen. Urban wins it hands down this year unless there's just an outright conspiracy.
No, I'm saying Chryst has already won it, like not speculation, he was given the award.
I see that you're correct. And Franklin won the media's award.
Well fuck. Looks like Meyer will just have to settle for National COY when we win it all again.
The B1G awards have become such a joke I don't even tune in. That COY thing pisses me off even though I should not let it.
The more you act like a lady the more likely he’ll act like a gentleman.
I would imagine the majority of 11Dubbers all agree with you but the reality is Buckeye coaches are now essentially exempt from winning B1G COY awards. It's been since '79. The price paid for expectations I suppose.
It's called wealth redistribution among the top 0.01%
Cup o UFkingM overfloweth.
Its already been awarded =\
"It all goes so fast, and character makes the difference when it's close."
Lol what? Urban definitely didn't win. There's some weird bylaw that explicitly prohibits Ohio State from having a coach win the COY award.
Don't have a problem with that. Hell of a job with 2,3, and a few 4 stars.
But here is the thing, he's also the reason he is working with 2 & 3 stars. Recruiting is part of coaching.
True to a point, most of his players are Anderson's. Plus it's just a forgone reality that an Ohio State coach can't win it. Rather see Christ than that asshat in Happy Valley
Which is true, to a degree. However the best recruiter in the world probably wouldn't out recruit tOSU at Wisky. It is a dumb way to draw a conclusion, but it seems our constant excellence this decade has eliminated us from contention for the award.
Nailed it YCS
So who do the Buckeyes play in Phoenix is the only question left.
The easiest team to play would be Washington, but I want Clemson. I loathe Dabo.
Who should I want to win so scum doesn't get in? Really couldn't stand it if they made it...the arrogant ---h-les. So give me the surest scenario skunk rats don' make the final 4.
Clemson and Washington winning would send them to the Orange Bowl.
Either of them lose and Wisconsin thumps PSU and they're going to Pasadena.
One loses and PSU wins, they're in.
Both lose and they may go to a 3 seed and we play them in Phoenix.
If they get in their reward is to get bitch slapped by Bama.
In my opinion, TTUN is the only team 4 or lower that can give Bama a game. I may hate the bastards but I know they're a better matchup than Washington or PSU/Wisconsin. They've got more speed on defense.
I'd still expect Bama to win but not by the lopsided score it's going to be if Washington stays there or one of the others jump TTUN.
I think TTUN's offense is too vanilla to give Bama any concern.
Not as vanilla as LSU and they kept it within 10 against Bama, so they could have a shot. That said though, LSU didn't even score so even if UM is better, they still may not score.
I truly believe that out of all of the teams (not counting us) _ichigan has the best shot at beating Bama.
We beat bama last time because we had Zeke and an unknown QB with a cannon for an arm, we will have neither this time so it is certainly not a forgone conclusion that the end result with be the same as 14.
I think our defense is fine vs their offense
It's our offense that worries me...
They will not get in unless Clemson and Washington both lose this weekend. And even then it'd be difficult to envision.
I think they only need one. Especially if it's Washington who loses. Michigan would have wins over the Pac-12 champ (who would have to make a jump from #8 to #4) and a win over the Big Ten champ. Better resume than either of those teams, as well.
*ichigan isnt getting in. They will get jumped by either B1G winner, possibly the B12 winner, and possibly even Colorado who WAS winning in the big house until their QB got hurt throwing a 70 yard bomb. The committee just gave you guys false hope and if Iowa would have missed that fg you probably would be in. Losing 2 of your last 3 and dropping 3 spots is an illusion. I think *ichigan is a top 5 team but I would put big money on you guys dropping next week. I think the Buckeyes could drop too 3 or even possibly 4 also. That head to head versus wisky,psu,and.colorado will evaporate after they win a big title game and have a 13th data point plus a conference title. Lol you can hope though.
They will get jumped by either B1G winner, possibly the B12 winner, and possibly even Colorado who WAS winning in the big house until their QB got hurt throwing a 70 yard bomb.
Big 12 - The winner would have to jump from #9 or #10 to #4. Even if both Clemson and Washington lost, that would open the door for either #5 Michigan, winner of #6/#7 PSU vs Wisconsin, or #8 Colorado (win over Washington, in this scenario). So there's literally no chance the Big 12 gets in.
Colorado - Would have to make the jump from #8 to #4. Michigan had some injuries as well in that game. Even so, Michigan won by 3 scores. I think it's reasonable to say it's doubtful they jump 4 spots including a team that beat them this year. Plus, how exactly would they jump the Big Ten champ?
Big 10 - Decent possibility that one of these teams would jump Michigan. However, it seems that the committee, at least so far, values resumes very highly. Michigan has an edge over both Wisconsin and PSU in that department. Would the committee put PSU over Michigan even though they lost by 39 to the Wolverines? Wisconsin would have a stronger case against Michigan, only losing by 7 on the road. I think they could jump Michigan if a spot opens up.
I think *ichigan is a top 5 team but I would put big money on you guys dropping next week.
Have a hard time seeing them actually drop. Kirby Hocutt made it very clear that the line between #4 Washington and #5 Michigan was razor thin. Seems like he's setting up a potential flip if Washington loses. Now I could see Wisconsin and Washington trading places, but not Michigan dropping.
I think the Buckeyes could drop too 3 or even possibly 4 also.
Do not see this happening unless Clemson absolutely destroys VT. Even then, I'd probably keep them where they are. OSU has the best resume in football right now. The committee weighs resumes extremely strongly.
That head to head versus wisky,psu,and.colorado will evaporate after they win a big title game and have a 13th data point plus a conference title.
This is where we strongly disagree. If the committee weighed conference championships so much, they wouldn't have ranked OSU and UM as highly as they are right now just to drop them a bunch when the conference champions are decided. They've made it clear that it's the best 4 teams that should make it to the playoff. They learned to value resume over CC from MSU last year. You can win a weak conference and be left out (Big 12) or have an extremely strong conference and have 3 teams from the same division in the top 7 (OSU, UM, PSU).
Would you be willing to wager that you absolutely "will not" drop after a team picks up their 11th win and adds a conference championship game win and title while *ichigan sits idle? The committee didnt learn shit last year by putting msu in over us. Msu had one loss,beat us head to head, and had an EXTRA win over an undefeated iowa. Ohio state was the better team but the committee puts msu or whoever in in that same exact scenario again. Where you are failing to look is where the committe jumped Stanford a 2-loss team ahead of Ohio State's one close loss based soley on beating and winning the pac12. There is going to be some movement for sure after the championship games. The B12 I forgot still doesnt have a conference championship until next year so i retract that portion. Im will to bet that not only does *ichigan not make the playoff but that Psu or Wisky either winner actually passes *ichigan after picking up that 11th win and conference title. Only way *ichigan even stays at 5 is if Clemson and Washington both win and stay put then the 5th spot becomes meaningless. If one of those teams loses I guarentee that *ichigan gets passed up and I'll be willing to bet "never signing back in" "100 bucks" anything you want. My whole point is if it is going to be 2 B1G teams it certainly wont be a *ichigan team that lost 2 of 3 to finish. It will be Wisky or Psu or even a Pac-12 champion Colorado taking the 4th spot and they certainly wont put 3 B1G teams in. You are going to find the most unexplained movement this coming week.
Would you be willing to wager that you absolutely "will not" drop after a team picks up their 11th win and adds a conference championship game win and title while *ichigan sits idle?
Sure. Michigan will not drop. That's the bet. Loser has to change their picture to whatever the winner wants until the start of the 2017 season?
The committee didnt learn shit last year by putting msu in over us. Msu had one loss,beat us head to head, and had an EXTRA win over an undefeated iowa.
I disagree. You don't think MSUs embarrassing loss to Bama last year got the committee's attention? Even so, I don't see how the committee could have put in OSU over MSU last year. Comparing the two teams at the end of the year (before final rankings), MSU had 4 wins over ranked teams (Oregon, Michigan, MSU, Iowa), OSU had 1 (Michigan). Advantage MSU. Head-to-head? Advantage MSU. Conference championship? Advantage MSU. The only advantage OSU has is not a bad loss (MSU to Nebraska). However, the H2H and resume for MSU wins it over OSU, despite not being better than them. Too much went in MSUs favor to not rank them above OSU.
Where you are failing to look is where the committe jumped Stanford a 2-loss team ahead of Ohio State's one close loss based soley on beating and winning the pac12.
Again, after Stanford beat USC in the championship, they had 3 quality wins. Now they did have one more loss than OSU and neither of their losses were to particularly good teams. I think that made them balanced with OSU, but the conference championship pushed them ahead. That seems like the tiebreaker in that situation.
Im will to bet that not only does *ichigan not make the playoff but that Psu or Wisky either winner actually passes *ichigan after picking up that 11th win and conference title.
This isn't the bet. The bet was that Michigan would drop. I still think Michigan almost certainly moves up if Washington loses and likely the same if Clemson loses. The difference between Michigan's situation this year and OSU's last year is that Michigan actually has a strong resume, including wins over both teams playing in the B1G Championship. If PSU wins, it gives them their 2nd top 10 win. Still not as good as Michigan's 3. Wisconsin's win would only give them their 2nd win over a ranked team (LSU is the other).
Again, this is given Colorado beats Washington. That would give Colorado their 2nd win over a ranked team on the season.
If Washington loses, you're choosing between the Big Ten champion, Pac-12 champion, and Michigan. All have 2 losses, but Michigan has 3 top-10 wins compared to PSU's 2, Colorado would have 1, as well as another win over a ranked team. Wisconsin's resume is about the same as Colorado. Resume favors Michigan in that case. Furthermore, Michigan beat all 3 of Colorado, PSU, and Wisconsin. Even without a championship, they'd have wins over both the Big Ten and Pac-12 champs. Not sure how you put anyone over that.
So do you expect my bet or nah? Unless you respond the bet isn't on.
Expect? Accept*** Long day.
The obvious scenario that keeps Michigan out is both Clemson and Washington win. But if one loses, while Wisconsin looks really good against PSU, they could jump Michigan.
If Wisconsin lays waste to State Penn, we'll have to pray for VA tech and Colorado..
I remember when TCU was #3 and was bumped to #6, and I got a feeling that Ohio state and ttun are Baylor and TCU this time..
It. Is. Time.
This is so inaccurate, you should delete it.
Does it offend you?
I want them in just as much as everyone else, but when left to a committee that by the way, will not be watching us play next week, I have limited expectations.
I'm not going to fool myself by using BCS formulas that have been proven non effective, and I'm not on the committee a neither are you, so I don't know why the hell I would have to delete what I said because it could actually happen. It doesn't matter if you agree with it. Grow up.
You really believe a 2-loss team, who Ohio State beat on their home field, would jump them?
Wisconsin could beat Penn State 100-0 and it wouldn't supplant Ohio State. It might get them in as well as Ohio State, but there's only so much one game can do for a team.
Not even remotely comparable scenarios.
Exactly. If Baylor or TCU had our 2016 resume in 2014, we could've beaten Wisconsin by 100 and it wouldn't have mattered.
I got a feeling that Ohio state and ttun are Baylor and TCU this time..
Is that you Mark May?????!!!
"If you're not changing, you're falling behind."
I love Galloway but damn, he just cannot get past Penn State being left out.
- They lost to Pitt and TTUN by 39 man. The conference / h2h tiebreaker is only applicable when resumés are identical...
Losing by 39 to TTUN and losing to Pitt does not = Ohio State resumé.
Losing by 39 to TTUN automatically gives them the h2h tiebreaker.
I appreciate his passion, but I think it's misguided.
He's way off base. Penn state isn't close to Ohio State. PSU beat us fair and square, albeit in a fluke-ish manner. What's their second best win? Minnesota? Iowa? Maryland?
OSU is a better team than PSU, I have no doubt of that. My concern is, what if PSU beats Wisconsin 59-0 Clemson wins Huge and Washington wins huge?
Does that hurt us? If so, do we drop farther than four?
Here is my fear:
2017 OSU loses 2 games, OK, and some B1G team from the west
Somehow (fantasy world) Michigan is the number 1 team when we play them and we are 10 we win 42-39
We play for the B1G championship win a squeaker against number 4 Wisconsin 24-21 while we are ranked 6th
Who goes to the CFP?
What if Michigan only fell to 5?
Point is what we are cheering for today we could be complaining about tomorrow.
Nebraska falling out probably has to do with them getting owned by OSU and then by Iowa. Not a good look for them at all. Not just losing but getting blown out. Still, they do not get the love of the lower SEC teams.
Holcutt basically kept reiterating that their job is to find the "four very best teams" and only when there's not a lot of daylight between two teams' resumes (read: NOT comparing just one game or one championship), THEN they turn to the protocol.
Penn State will need at least Washington or Clemson to lose, and very possibly, both. Michigan may be on deck to snag a spot if there is some chaos. But the bottom line is that Ohio State is in. I absolutely HATE it that there are people in this thread who completely misunderstand or don't even listen to what's going on.
That is what he said. They tried to get him to say what it would take for PSU to jump them and the answer seemed to be not much. Their resume was not viewed as close. They would need to win the big ten and probably have Clemson and Washington go down...
Right, it's going to be tough for Penn State to get in. I suppose if they go in and blow out Wisconsin, say, 59-0, they might get some second looks compared to Washington, but I strongly suspect the committee will just say "hey, great season, but don't lose two games to Pitt and another by 39 points."
Why is it that the Pitt loss is hurting PSU more than it is hurting Clemson? Weird how that works.
Not really. It would be hurting them similarly if PSU did not also lose to UM. Clemson has lost once. PSU has lost twice. Be they to ranked teams or otherwise, they lost. That does matter. And their best quality win was sort of flukey in a game they never looked to be in control of through the course until the last series.
I do not think this is an issue at all really. PSU resume is honestly not great, Clemson's is not great either but they have a few more what would be called quality wins. PSU has one. They get a second one and go 0.500 over top 25 teams with a win over Wisconsin (I doubt that they do unless Wisconsin is banged up horribly).
The two losses were early, but one could argue that they really only played three decent teams based on these rankings. They barely got their quality win and lost the other two. So their losses matter.
To me Clemson has generally been a better team all year. Even if flawed.
I agree with everything that you said. I just keep hearing the Pitt loss brought up more than the Michigan one and I was curious as to why that seems to be sticking to PSU but no Clemson
You nailed it. OSU has the best resume by far. They're locked in. If Clemson or Washington looks extremely dominant, maybe OSU drops a spot. That's it. OSU is solidly in, as they should be.
I don't see Penn State passing Michigan if the #4 spot is up for grabs unless they absolutely destroy Wisconsin. Even then, they lost by 39 points to Michigan. Injuries to the LBs, sure, but 39 points is a lot. Wisconsin has a better shot since they have a better resume, but still, not quite the resume Michigan has, plus the H2H.
Yeah, if PSU only lost to UM than they would be in a great spot right now but losses do matter in this situation. Also, the teams that they are blowing out are not really very good teams. Iowa is solid, but not great.
I read an article earlier going on about PSU is getting screwed here as they will likely not get in. It was pretty amusing. More or less arguing the PSU is a better team now than early in the year and that the two losses should not count as much. PSU is much better but the only way a two loss team should be considered is if many teams have two losses that are in contention and not many one or zero loss teams to me.
Tennessee and LSU.
Also, i really, really, really, really, want for the right teams to lose and Michigan to get in at 4, then for us to win our semi and Michigan to beat #1 Bama. Oh my, how confident and arrogant those TSUN fans will be.........and then I want to watch the Bucks beat them in the champ game, in overtime, on a Peppers offensive fumble recovered for the win.
It would also be funny if Michigan makes the playoff and some of their guys enjoy themselves too much on the "bowl" (playoff) trip. In particular, I am looking forward to reading a post-playoff story that Taco ate too many burritos.
Good news: no rain in the forecast in Glendale on December 31.
If Colorado beats Washington & Wisconsin also wins we'd better hope Clemson wins or we might be looking at a rematch
Well OSU will be in. Question is if Clemson or Washington fall, and Whisky wins could UM and Whisky both get in ?? Is it possible ? There would be total meltdown in all other conferences.
Theire is only one truth...
It wont happen, even if it should. It would make the playoff far too regional for the average fan. I think 2 is a definite possibility, though.
UM is in.. wait for it
"To The House"
If Clemmy or Wash falters, UM will get jumped by a conference champ. Especially if it's Wiskey. UM already has 2 conference losses, which would make Wiskey more attractive. If PSU wins it gets more complicated, but if CU wins, they might have the resume to jump UM.
Maybe, the conference title game and another quality win would make Wisconsin comparable. The head to head may be the edge but given that game was close it would be hard to give UM the nod there.
if head to head is so important , why isn't Pitt rated ahead of Penn State ??
And ahead of Clemson. Pitt should probably be ahead of Bama now with the head-to-head wins they have.
Colin Cowherd thinks actual best 4 are Bama, Ohio St, USC, and Michigan.
If Clemson or Washington lose, I think Penn State in (if they beat Wisconsin).
I don't want to see Michigan again this year...Harbaugh, Peppers.
Only one scenario could keep out Ohio State:
Washington, Penn State, Clemson, Oklahoma State, and Temple win.
This would give Penn State wins over top 25 Temple, Ohio State, and Wisconsin and a loss to Michigan and Pitt (3-2 vs. top 25), Ohio State would have wins over Michigan, Oklahoma, and Wisconsin and a loss to Penn State (3-1 vs. top 25, but Oklahoma and Wisconsin would be less valuable).
In this scenario, Penn State and Ohio State might be considered comparable, in which case the head-to-head and the conference championship could be used as tiebreakers to rank Penn State ahead of Ohio State.
However, and this is important: Washington may not be able to be ranked higher than Ohio State. Washington would have wins over Utah, Colorado, and Stanford and a loss to USC (3-1). So the conference championship could be a tiebreaker in this scenario because their resumes may be considered similar.
This is, in my view based on my understanding of the committee's protocol, the only scenario in which Ohio State might get left out. So we'd have to have upsets where we don't want them (Penn State, Temple, and Oklahoma State) and wins where don't want them (Clemson and Washington). Even if all that happens, I think the committee would find it very difficult to put in Penn State and Washington.
The only scenario that could keep Ohio State out is if they charter a plane to play a soccer match in Colombia.
Ok, I might have had that DV coming.
It wasn't me, but yeah you earned that DV for sure ;)
I think Western Michigan gets in before State Penn. (I hope it's OK to use "M" again since The Game is over and we won.)
With Alabama and Ohio State being locks, I think that the committee is definitely looking at TV ratings from that point on. Since they kept a two loss Michigan at Number Five, I think they are considering that either Clemson or Washington loses. That way Michigan moves to number four. What a first round match Big Ten playing against SEC first game. Then if Ohio State should win against either Clemson or Washington, the committee can not lose: either a Big ten Final with a rematch of Mich---OSU or a rematch of Bama against the Buckeyes: either way, the final would set tv records. ( no way do they want both Wash and Clem to lose and set up three B10 teams in the finals: that would cause such an outcry from all parts of the country.)
My question is will both Wash and Clem jump us if they win next week? I think Clem will but the difference between No. 2 and No. 3 is irrelevant.
Harbaugh is Michigan, Michigan is Harbaugh. They are together the ultimate con.
I just don't get how michigan loses at Iowa then 2 weeks later at Ohio State and sits at 5.....not right, we fell farther than that losing at PSU, and I don't know how Wisconsin and/or PSU doesn't jump michigan with playing an extra game.
Well, they haven't played the extra game yet, and the winner could possibly jump TTUN in the final CFP rankings on Sunday. However, the current rankings make sense when you consider the following:
1. TTUN beat both Wisconsin and Penn State
2. TTUN currently has wins against 3 top 10 teams
3. The loss to Ohio State was in double overtime on the road after controlling the game for three quarters.
4. TTUN has one the best defenses statistically in the nation and would likely provide a more competitive against Bama then other teams ranked 6-9 if they were ranked 4th in the final rankings.
Lost at Iowa late in the season....I think losses late should be killer....so does Shannon Sharpe.
I see the SEC still has 6 teams in the rankings... LOL the bottom 3 have no business being there.
JMO, It is my belief that a #2 is suppose to beat a #3, TOSU VS TTUN, especially on the road in the greatest rivalry game in all of sports. A double OT loss, IMO, does not warrant a team to drop from #3 to #5. I also believe in "defense wins championships". The committee's job is to pick the four best CFB teams in the FBS, period. There are teams that have had a great season, and I commend them for their success, but I feel the four best teams are Bama, Clemson, Buckeyes, and TTUN. Washington SOS is a big reason for their omission and TTUN has beaten both teams playing for the BIG Ten championship, and TTUN defense is third best after Bama and the Silver Bullets. I believe these are the four best teams even after the outcomes of this weekend games. Go Bucks
I see what you are saying but they will play an extra game and both teams are in the top ten....bet anyone lunch the big ten winner jumps michigan due to playing an extra game versus a top 10 team.
Joey is a smart man, we know this because he went to Ohio State. (Quote from November 15, 2016)
So if Clemson and Washington get upset, would the B1G get three teams in the playoffs? ;-)
"Most Noahs have two of everything, he's got four tonight" - Gus Johnson on Noah Brown's 4 TD catches against Oklahoma.
I'm not an expert but I can't imagine 3 teams getting in from one conference
If your scenario happens, I think the answer would be a resounding YES! The rest of the country would go ballistic but the committee would have it right....
Saban on a cart eating cold pizza
Would end the suspense if Wisconsin beat PSU 7 - 6 or Clemson or Washington lost.
The will to win is not as important as the will to prepare to win. -- Woody Hayes
What do you mean Toledo? WMU plays Ohio
I think Colorado has a good chance of upending Washington on Friday which leaves open the chance for a second Big Ten team. If neither Wisconsin or Penn State have a "statement game" (like OSU's blowout of Wisconsin) then Michigan looks like a possibility. WOuldn't Harbaugh love a second chance against the Buckeyes!
Just to be on the safe side, we need to root hard for Wisconsin this weekend.
It would be nice but it was pretty clear from the statements that something major would have to change. As it is, does not sound like the committee sees PSU and the top five or so as on the same level. So the tie breakers do not matter. If they lose it helps, but they would need a blow out win against Wisconsin to even be considered at all. And more realistically losses.
Go Buckeyes! We are in!
Lead, follow, or get out of my way!
When did Louisville join the SEC?
"13 LOUISVILLE SEC 9-3"
Buckeye by birth. Christian by 2nd birth. "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Hebrews 11:1