I think back then a big ten title had much more prestige.
PG <3 PG
I know there's a game Saturday, and my ass will be there.
I Believe In Ohio State.
I couldn't type fast enough - YBMTI - we were ranked Number 1 at the time.
Go get'em Cal Poppy - we are behind you !!
It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.
I still can't forget how horrible that loss was and how much I hated those people even more than before.
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peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
Yeah, I was reading his wikipedia page (I know, I know it's wikipedia) and they listed that as his greatest victory of his entire career and that was in his first season. What did he do over the next two decades?
MGoBlog Blocked Me On Twitter.
I saw Ryan Day hang 62 on Michigan...His hair was perfect.
Go Buckeyes Beat Michigan
He made a living off that game.
I was going to say 1969 also but then I thought a lot more about it. I believe that it was the intensity of the rivalry during the 10 year war. Many close games highlighted by the 1973 tie which was chronicled on a special on BTN or ESPN, can't remember which.
During those 10 years TTUN's lowest final ranking was #9 and OSU broke their heart a number of times. Archie finished 3-0-1 against Bo. The games typically were defensive, hard hitting battles. The intensity of the games and what was riding on them made them a national must see. It was always the feature TV game along with Nebraska-Oklahoma on the Saturday before or after Thanksgiving.
As a point of reference, OSU and TTUN had a total of 17 AP final rankings in the Top 10. The entire SEC had only 18. Think about that for a moment. The national powers in those days was a short list - OSU, TTUN, Alabama, USC, Texas, Oklahoma, and Nebraska.
69 in 18
And why don't they say much about Gary "Grabass" Moeller?
I'll drink to that.
I had to run away high, so I wouldn't come home low...
Just don't drink to it too much, get grabby on a waitress then get belligerent with the cops.
Or work up there...
I remember a t-shirt after that incident: It's Moeller Time.
One of my uncles wanted me to come home and visit...and then go out and get all "Moellered up".
Not sure if people know Moeller was another one of Woody's players...believe a team captain as well iirc.
Once a Buckeye...
I know Yost was from the stone ages but I don't know why they don't view him as their best coach ever. He was 165-29 with 6 NCs
“I have yet to be in a game where luck was involved. Well-prepared players make plays. I have yet to be in a game where the most prepared team didn't win.” -Urban Meyer
Because they think they "stole" him from us.
Bo's fame is the result of riding Woody's coattails during the Ten Year War. TSUN fans think Bo was the perfect foil to Woody's legacy ('Former Student Schools Headmaster' kind of narrative), and restored Meatchicken superiority- at least for a spell- over the hated Buckeyes.
I am not very smart, but I recognize that I'm not very smart. --- W.W. Hayes
I think he had such a good start...'69 upset, his "winning" the 10 year war (5-4-1), some flirtation with the NC - think his best finish was a number two ranking in 1985.
Quite so, Hove. TSUN wallowed in mediocrity in the '60s under Bump Elliott. Bo was like a breath of fresh air by comparison. And he took his teams to bowl games, even if Missedagain lost most of them.
Because he was from ohio and they secretly admire buckeyes and know that they are superior to "michigan men"
People have to talk about something just to keep their voice boxes in working order so they'll have good voice boxes in case there's ever anything really meaningful to say. - Kurt Vonnegut
Coaching is about more than just winning (I know it sounds cliche & contradictory at the same time), given Bo's era, his reputation as a human being, & because he managed to upset some of Woody's greatest teams in establishing the rivalry as the best in CFB, he is regarded as a legend, but as far as Xs & Os, he really does not fit the bill, but then again the same can be said for Woody, meanwhile a guy like Weis who is phenomenal in regards to the intellectual side of the game, could not win a championship even with Superman at QB, the Flash at RB, & a defense composed entirely of X-Men...
"Because I couldn't go for three."
Wow... that was one long sentence but you made a good point...
"I love football. I think it is most wonderful game in world and I despise to lose."
Woody Hayes 1913 - 1987
The same cannot be said for Woody! Woody won five national championships. Bo won a snowball fight against a ball boy...huge difference.
Woody was a great motivator, fundamental coach, recruiter, & above all; a leader of men. He won 5 championships by having 5 teams with the most talent that were fundamentally sound, there was no mystery to what Woody was going to do, he just dared you to stop him...
You win the longest sentence competition-----hands down. That is the longest sentence I've read in quite some time.
5-12 Bowl record is awesome
It's nearly Cooperish.
And Cooper beats Bo in the '87 Rose, lands in Columbus the following season.
It's the circle of life...
Don't forget, Harbaugh was Bo's quarterback in that game also.
Never. A little nervous, but mostly excited for late November.
He helped revive a program which was in shambles and said all the little things a "Michigan Man" wants to hear. He went toe to toe with the enemy and made them feel good about themselves for a time.
It's all in the reflexes - Me
Without Woody, there's no Bo. At least not one that would be remembered for anything significant.
Bo is a legend based on the following - he brought a program back from the depths of dispare. Much like their program is today. The similarities are striking:
1) Poor performance on the field.
2) attendance was dismal where they did not even fill stadium.
3) no expectations of winning
He reversed all of the trends mentioned above. He molded young players into men. He taught them through great sacrifice you will rise to the top.
He learned from Woody and was the closest thing to Woody in persona, and what he gave back to the community and the university.
Records do not define a legend. We focus to much on records, statistics and other quantitative measures. The qaulitative measures should also be used to define an individual.
"To have a great life simply follow this rule: Do not bring undo conflict into your life..."
Charlie Baker - OSU - 1986
Saban on a cart eating cold pizza
A man got to have a code...
If I may add to your excellent post, I'd say that:
1. America was so much different from a cultural standpoint. How 'success' or a 'legend' was defined then and now are worlds apart.
2. For you youngsters, games were rarely seen on TV unless they were of a certain magnitude. I remember listening fondly to many Buckeye games on the radio as a child because games were not televised. In Coach Bo's case, the 'legend' is indisputable in that regard.
IMO, Bo Schembechler was a great American. I hated him as the leader of TTUN but do believe in his value structure and what he stood for almost completely. Go Bucks!
Bo's value structure .... taking a job to stab your mentor and best friend in the back. Great values.
BIGGY84 - I suggest you view the documentary The Ten Year War - it will show you the great appreciation and love of friendship these two men had for one another.
Woody never thought Bo stabbed him in the back. If he had, he would not have spoken at a retirement roast for Bo just a week before he died.
Parallels to now are eerily similar.
I'm hoping the new coach up there isn't nearly as good as Bo.
I'm OK if he's better than Hoke . . . but I want this OSU string of dominance to go on a little longer, like maybe 3-4 decades after my death at an extremely old age. By then I probably won't care as much.
Varys: I've always hated the bells. They ring for horror, a dead king, a city under siege.
Tyrion: A wedding.
I love how their best coach has no National Championships while our top 4 have at least one each. Suck it blue.
"The only good thing about it is winning the d*** thing" - Urban Meyer on The Game The War
Umm...13 conference titles in 21 years is pretty damn good....
Yet it's Cooper-esque in that it couldn't be converted into the one step slightly above, of a National Championship.
Its funny you bring up Cooper, I was going to mention that except Cooper was like 1-1000000599 vs Michigan so atleast Bo wasn't that bad.
our rivalry with them stems from the fact that more then once we went into the last game of the season with a chance to play for a national title, and was upset.... and Bo begun to talk about it... to brag about it like it was their purpose in life... and Woody took it personal....
What was Woody's Rose Bowl record?
Look closely, because the closer you think you are, the less you will actually see.
when i was growing up in the 60s (born in 1961) i knew nothing of national championships maybe because there was no NC game it was just voted on
what i do remember is :
the big 2 and little 8
Michigan bad Ohio State good
the rose bowl
USC vs. UCLA for the right to play either Michigan or Ohio State in the rose bowl
you hear some people claim it now but i think it was more true back then ............. beating Michigan/Ohio state is more important to their fans than winning any other game you could lose every game except Michigan/Ohio State and keep your job you could also win every other game but that one and be fired
sports channels and a championship game changed how fans look a college football
I believe that part of the problem is our definition of defining what is "great". 13 conference titles is pretty damn good in 21 years. By your definition of not winning a national championship, then 119 teams are failures each year. Over my 50 plus years of following Buckeye football, I have witnessed 3 consensus national championships. I have also witnessed another 10-15 years when a single game stood between a championship and by your definition, a failure. I don't buy that. Those were some damn good teams that fell one game short.
A better example is the Buffalo Bills. Were the Bills a failure since they lost 4 straight Super Bowls? I think not. Not a single team has been to four in a row except for the Bills. In fact, only one other team has been to 3 straight Super Bowls. What the Bills accomplished in consistent excellence is unprecedented, however they are historically viewed as failures.
Look at Michigan immediately before Bo became coach.
From 1951 to 1968 they were 93-68-4 (4-12-2 against Michigan St and 6-12 against Ohio State). They won 1 Big Ten title in 1964.
Because of his silly team speech. "The team, the team, the team" What a silly old man he was. "The team sucks and shall always suck"
He never slugged any opposing players, but he could be just as fiery on the sidelines as Woody was. Near the end of his last game as HC, as USC secured victory in the Rose Bowl, Bo did a headset slam for the ages. Well worth the price of admission.
Best of the Land
I hate to take the shine off an *ichigan icon (OK, maybe not), but Bo was really only a notch or two above pedestrian by today's standards.
Look at the records for Urban, Saban, and a few other top tier coaches around the nation. Bo's accomplishments as measured by today's inflation would get you fired.
"Most Noahs have two of everything, he's got four tonight" - Gus Johnson on Noah Brown's 4 TD catches against Oklahoma.
I doubt Bo would last two decades in this day and age, especially with the bowl record. But he has my respect - he did revive a storied program back to prominence, even if he did fall short of a title.
I see an analogy/trend here. TTUN is all fluff, whereas THE gets the job done. There's been so much unsubstantiated hype with Harbaugh this offseason and Schembechler with zero NCs in 21 seasons. UFM won a NC on his 3rd season and Woody reigning supreme with 5 NCs over 28 seasons.
The greatness of a warrior is defined by the greatness of his enemies there is no reason to denigrate Bo. Jeader of the enemy and friend of Woody. Praise Bo and you respect Woody. As Woody said, "If 'Bo' is not a winner, I never saw one and I should know. He beat me the last three games we played. We've fought and quarreled for years but we're great friends." [Quoted in The Lantern February 10, 1986.]