Why Should Ohio State Drop (or the Rankings Change at All?)

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EvanstonBuckeye's picture

There will be a strong, if not overwhelming, urge for voters to put LSU #1 based on how exciting the game vs. Bama was, and especially considering it was in Tuscaloosa. For our part, we did not give voters any reason to think we are not the most dominant team in the country, so I think we'll hold on to some support for #1 as well. 

LSU

OSU

Clemson

Bama

HS
milhouse4588's picture

The committee will probably put LSU above us and use the argument that they just beat Bama, on the road, and looked great doing it.

In reality their offense looked great and their defense didn't. But most people watching football look past a bad defense if your offense is truly great (which LSU's happens to be).

To me, it doesn't really matter much as long as we keep winning and end up in the playoffs. LSU has the resume, has their Heisman frontrunner, the headlines, and one can argue the best offense in the nation. They don't NOT deserve the #1 ranking.

If we dominant the next three games as we have all season, including a destruction of Michigan on the road...we would probably leapfrog them because we look better overall.

To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift.

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

I don't disagree with you, I'm just pointing out that there's a logical pathway to keeping us #1 that could potentially be followed thus pissing a bunch of people off. It would be nice to see, anyway...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
EvanstonBuckeye's picture

Yep. Looking more and more like there will be three undefeated teams this year again. Have fun, committee; you're going to piss somebody off. 

HS
milhouse4588's picture

If it ends up being 3...I feel like a 1-loss conference champ Oregon/Baylor/Oklahoma absolutely deserves it over Alabama based on resume.

Do I think Alabama can beat those teams, yeah probably, but they would have earned the shot over Alabama who wouldn't have done anything remarkable all year.

To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift.

HS
EvanstonBuckeye's picture

I agree if it's Oregon. 

I think they the inside track if they play well down the stretch. Where it might get interesting is if the Ducks struggle a bit as their remaining schedule is less than daunting and Bama finishes impressively. I don't see the Big 12 having much of a say in this unless Baylor goes undefeated. 

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obsessed_buckeye's picture

None of these preliminary rankings matter. Only CFP rankings that matter are the ones on Sunday 8 December.

GO BUCKS!
Beat Rutgers!
BEAT TTUN FOREVER!

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

We're all aware that these rankings don't ultimately matter, at this moment. That doesn't mean we can't discuss them :)

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
obsessed_buckeye's picture

Fair point my fellow Buckeye fan. I do enjoy reading the theories that are waaaaaaaaayyyyy outside my box of thoughts.

I'm of the opinion that these preliminary rankings are just an advertising money maker for ESPN as they're the ones broadcasting the results show.

GO BUCKS!
Beat Rutgers!
BEAT TTUN FOREVER!

HS
ponder10's picture

I hate the idea of complaining about LSU jumping us. Sure, we've dominated every opponent but LSU has been impressive. They beat Auburn, Florida, and Alabama. Give them #1. It'll all shake out in the end.

“In the end we will conserve only what we love. We will love only what we understand. We will understand only what we are taught.” ~ Baba Dioum

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Nutinpa's picture

Relax, Earthoid.   LSU deserves to be # 1.   They've beaten Bama, Texas and Auburn.    That trumps, Cincy, Wisconsin and Sparty no matter how badly we've beaten teams like Maryland.  Doesn't mean a damn thing right now.  We've got to focus on PSU and TTUN.  Nothing else matters. 

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

What gave you the impression that im not relaxed?

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

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Nutinpa's picture

I can hear you pounding on your keyboard and it had me concerned.......LOL!

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Earthoid.'s picture

Oh okay, yeah I may have been aggressively typing a bit :)

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
Tater_Schroeder's picture

Calmer'n you are.

Pray for potatoes with a hoe in your hand.

HS
EBBuck03's picture

Texas squeaked into the rankings with a 3 point win against K State at home.  Texas still have to beat Iowa State at Iowa State and Baylor at Baylor.  I think they drop one of those games.  They won't be ranked.  

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BtownBuckeye's picture

Why because their names are Texas and Auburn? certainly you didn't come to that conclusion based on what has happened on the field

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scarletgray's picture

Personally i think we stay number one for the very same reason we started number 1.  The committee pays attention to statistical dominance and we improved on that metric while both LSU and Bama simply proved that if they played again Bama would have the same probability of winning that they had going into Saturday.

JDK

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allinosu's picture

I have no problem with LSU over OSU because they had a big win. That said, I think OSU is the better team because of the difference in defense. If you go back and watch the LSU game with an open mind, I think the defenses had some really bad moments. Bad tackling and some coverage busts that were just plain awful. It's time for those in power to admit that SEC defenses aren't what they used to be. They brag about Florida's defense because it's the best in the SEC but not at OSU's level. I also don't see how a team (Georgia) can be ranked so high with a really bad loss to a bad team at home. The committee was willing to look at OSU the last two years with a bad loss and I have no problem with that but now time to see that loss by Georgia was bad and at home. I don't have Alabama in my top 4 because LSU should have won by 20 but for big Ed getting tight.

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kmp10's picture

Again, I'm not sure how you roll up 700+ yards of offense while hanging 73 points on a B1G team and lose the one spot in the process. Ohio State looks like a better team than LSU on the defensive side of the football, the OSU offense is every bit the equal of LSU's, and despite being only nine games into his career, I'll take Ryan Day at the head coach spot a billion times over Orgeron, a guy I'm absolutely amazed has made it this far. I don't think Ohio State drops to the two hole... but whatever. If the Buckeye get in, they have a great chance to win title nine with the way they're playing. 

When I die, sprinkle my ashes over the 70's 

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

We'll see just what kind of committee this is. Keeping us at no 1 would be a ballsy move and in both of our estimations correct. Agree with you, completely.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
southalabamabuckeye's picture

I'd probably rank LSU #1 this week because their resume is currently better than Ohio State's. That said, the Buckeyes should jump LSU after PSU and solidify that #1 spot after beating TTUN.

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Akron Buck's picture

I would put them at #1, they beat #3 on the road, it isn't a big deal because there is no reason we should drop below 2. If PSU is still top 10 and we dominate them we probably jump back to 1.   All we need is to be in top 4 in the final ranking

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readnguy's picture

Ask yourself this...if the Bucks were #2 and then went out and knocked off the #3 team while #1 thrashed an unranked team with only three wins; would you feel the same...I didn't think so.

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Earthoid.'s picture

If I were capable of being unbiased, I would... but your reasoning is the only reason we will drop to two. Not because we deserve to drop.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
RunEddieRun1983's picture

IMO I think LSU earned the #1 for this week. That said, as the Buckeyes get closer to the post season I think they move back into the #1 spot as long as they keep TCB as they have.

But they're where the need to be, 1-4 is all that matters in the end.

Urban Meyer left an incredible legacy. 12/4/18 Ryan Day begins his.

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Sheridanclan11's picture

My problem is not with LSU at #1 but with Alabama only dropping a spot or two after losing at home (the score was closer than the game) while Penn St goes on the road and almost takes the victory over an undefeated team and will probably drop 5 or 6 spots. That is how the SEC is in the conversation of having 2 teams in the playoffs every year. 

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I'm Ron Burgundy's picture

And worth pointing out you have a Penn St. team with a couple quality wins compared a big 0 for Alabama. Out of that crop of 1 loss teams, Penn St. definitely has a case to be the highest ranked based on objective measurements, but they almost drop out of the top 10 in the AP with a 5 pt road loss to an undefeated team. It's a double standard for sure.

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scarletgray's picture

if LSU jumps us now, it will tell me that the committee is doing things to appease people and networks. They would have had a plan all along to move the BAMA/LSU winner up just as they figured PSU over Clemmy was a safe bet knowing that it too would have to change after our game. I can not tell you if LSU is better or more deserving but these are the same people that actually did that. Changing now would point out their own contrived inconsistency.

JDK

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Earthoid.'s picture

Agreed, it's going to be interesting to see, "who they are working for"... the commentator of the bama/lsu game who said "I don't care if ohio state beat Maryland by 100...." or in being consistent...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

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BrutusB's picture

They deserve #1 given both of our seasons to date. We’ll deserve #1 if we beat Penn State, Michigan and (maybe) Minnesota. Both things can be true. 

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scarletgray's picture

i do not think the committee is involved with DESERVED. If we were better than both of them last week, after what i saw Saturday, we must still be better than both of them or worse than both of them. Which is it?

JDK

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Earthoid.'s picture

Exactly. I don't get this "deserves" argument. We're either better than LSU or we're not... and last week either convinced the committee that LSU is now a better team than us, or it didn't. And im not sure what they could've seen that would convince them of that...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
cajunbuckeye's picture

The Buckeyes are better than LSU. The defense is the difference in the Buckeyes and every other team in America. The end.

An angry fan...rooting for an angry team...led by angry coaches

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DowntownBuck's picture

They just beat the #3 team on the road...thats why.

Those who stir the shit pot should have to lick the spoon.

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Earthoid.'s picture

Ok but they are the #2 team as ranked by the committee. How does beating #3 mean you're better than #1? There's no logic or consistency in that unless #1 did something to deserve being questioned. We're didn't...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
DowntownBuck's picture

It is a combo of "deserving based on schedule" and the all mighty "eye test".

At the end of the day, who cares. Like I stated before, with both teams remaining schedule, we will jump back over them by the end.

Those who stir the shit pot should have to lick the spoon.

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

Yep, some random, completely inconsistent and subjective combination.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
macdaddybuckeyesupreme's picture

Eh I'm fine with getting dropped to 2. The rankings don't matter atm it's just something for fans to get worked up over.

While yes we should remain number 1 as we have the #1 defense and like #3 offense. We won't because of LSU win over alabama.

So it's fine, I wouldn't worry about it.

Even though Alabama defense is Doo Doo, and I've been saying it all year they can't stop the run, and guess what..the LSU running back ran all over them.

Successful people do what they have to, whether they feel like it or not

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Earthoid.'s picture

I believe we have both #1 offense and defense now. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

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youra6's picture

The narrative over the past 10 years is that you beat Bama, you're jumping a few spots forward. It just so happens that we are the only team in front of LSU.

I'm not going to lose sleep over dropping a rank from 1 to 2. 

HS
DowntownBuck's picture

I'm also of the opinion that LSU should be #1. If we win out we'll probably pass them as our end of year schedule has 3 ranked teams on it (PSU, Meatchicken and Minny) and they will only have Georgia.

That being said, I'd rather be #2 so I can go to Arizona for the game!

Those who stir the shit pot should have to lick the spoon.

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

I'd rather play Oregon round one than Clemson...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
Nutinpa's picture

Completely agree.  I'd kind of like to be Clemson for awhile.  Reigning nattys.   Everyone saying they're over-rated and haven't played anyone.  Got by -- by the skin of their asses vs. UNC.  Quietly going about their business and starting to take names.  Before my ashes are in an urn, I want to beat them.  Don't care if it's by 1 or by 30.  Heard a good ol boy on Sirius radio last week say "We''ll be happy to play Ohaio Staate....we'll just name the score laiiike we did the last time." 

Yup, I'd like to beat their asses, but yes, Oregon would be an easier win for sure. 

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Brutus's picture

I’d like some revenge on Clemson as well, but I want no part of them in the first round. They are either like the 2014 Seminoles, reigning champs who are no longer hungry and sleep walking through a terrible ACC schedule. Or the 2015 Buckeyes, reigning champs who are no longer hungry but one MSU-type of game away from waking up and being the juggernaut everyone expected. Until they show otherwise, I’m expecting the latter. 

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shiloh's picture

Rather play Clemson = revenge factor. OTOH Oregon would have revenge factor vs Buckeyes who they have never beat IIRC.

Regardless, Ohio State curb stomps both!

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. ~ Mark Twain

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tripol's picture

I have no problem with LSU at number one.  Prior to looking at how a team looks doing their work, we should first look at outcomes and resumes.  With the win at Bama this week, LSU has secured another win over a top 10 opponent.  Our three best wins are Cincinnati, Indiana, and Wisconsin.  LSU's three best are Florida, Auburn, and Bama.  I don't think it is unfair to say that LSU's wins are more impressive than ours.  

To be clear, this is not to say who would win or be favored heads up.  I think OSU is the better team when we start to add in how the teams have looked thus far, but I will always defer to resume first and have that be the biggest factor in determining rankings.  I wish the committee would consistently do the same.

The bigger curiosity to me is what they do with Minnesota.  They clearly under appreciated them last week.  Also, will Indiana break into the top 25.  I think they are more deserving than some of the teams, specifically Ok. St.

Tripol

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Earthoid.'s picture

That might be your ranking system but the committee doesn't rank like that. It would be nice if they were consistent which means since they ranked us #1 being consistent would mean not now using resume to rank LSU ahead if us... because if that was their ranking system we should've started at 2, period. Also I don't agree that ranking by resume is the way to go but that's just a difference of opinion.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
Wargor's picture

They underappreciated Minnesota, but I think over-estimated PSU.  Two teams that are both really good (#10, #11) ish, but not great.  

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saintstephen11's picture

Barely beating Florida, Auburn and Bama versus kicking the living crap out Cincy, IU and Wisky????  Magnitude of destruction matters.  Plus we both played more than those three games.  How did the teams look in the rest of their games. In the end it doesn't matter as long as we are #1 at the end to avoid Clemson first round.  Most deserving is LSU. Best team is OSU (and it isn't close). I'd put Clemson #2 for best team as well. They would destroy LSU on a neutral field.

HS
buckeye phi's picture

As long as we remain in the top four I'm not terribly concerned if the committee ranks LSU first tomorrow night on the heels of that thrilling victory. 

After all, Alabama is the only program that has been invited to every playoff so far.  So it's clear how highly the committee has regarded them in the brief history of the current format. 

Of course, there's still a very strong argument for us to remain at the top - but I wouldn't be too surprised if that good ol' SEC bias rears its ugly head again -

Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers

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mittenst8buck's picture

I think we should stay at 1. We did nothing but blow away a team we were supposed to blow away and we did it without our most dominant player. Alabama looks like shit...sorry but they just dont look any better than OSU did last year with no defense...AND they have not beaten anyone...they should be 8 as far as I'm concerned. LSU will probably be number 1 though due to the hype.

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NHBuckeye's picture

I won't be mad if they put LSU at #1.  What is burning my ass though is all that after that LSU-Bama game the analysts on multiple tv channels were talking more about how Bama is still a top-4 team rather than talking up the great win by LSU.   They are so damn desperate to get two SEC team into the CFP.  

Fields of Dreams

 

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Earthoid.'s picture

I honestly don't have a problem keeping bama in the top 4. That would at least be consistent with the results on the field...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
NHBuckeye's picture

I don't disagree with how good they look.  But they won't have a single "good win" on their resume.

Fields of Dreams

 

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Earthoid.'s picture

Yeah but the only loss they have is a 5 point loss to a team that technically they should've lost to, according to the rankings.  If Clemson had better wins than Bama, they would've been ranked higher.  But Bama maintaining their ranking can only happen because a very specific set of circumstances which, in my mind, have been met.  If Bama lost badly to #2 or lost to the #4 team or lower, then dropping them makes sense.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
1983Buckeye's picture

Gotta remember bama was at home... Home field advantage is a real thing.. They haven't played anyone and won't till auburn.   I hope auburn takes them out.. They actually have a defense you cld say is close to OSU... If bama blows them out then yea , id say top 4 but until then they should be ranked 6 to 10 range 

Go Bucks

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scarletgray's picture

Oh i wont be mad either, wont lose any of the sleep i already aint getting enough of either. LSU deserves every ounce of credit they get but just because an inferior team chalks up a win against another inferior team does not mean they are now better than a superior team. Now, how do i know who the superior team is? Well, this committee told me that LAST WEEK before they improved on that thought.

JDK

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Earthoid.'s picture

Exactly dude, and I'm starting to think that it's more and more possible that we keep our rank. And we should until we do something that changes the committee mind... or even if LSU did something like beat bama by four td's. In that case it'd be consistent for them to move up.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
TMac's picture

It will be interesting to see what they do on Tuesday.  The Committee has never dropped the #1 team without a loss, but 5 years isn't a lot of history either. I don't really care which of us is #1, the other will be #2, and without a loss they wil stay the top 2 until they meet in the Natty. Should be a Fun Ride!

#ItsGreatToBeABUCKEYE

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HowSheGoneEat's picture

This is an interesting year, if everything holds as it is now (LSU #1, OSU #2, Clemson #3) then the first seed in the playoff may have a huge advantage playing suspect PAC12 champ or BIG12 champ. Don't think either of those conferences are putting up a fight this year in the playoffs, where Clemson will be a challenge. 

Or bama makes the playoffs at 4 and we have a rematch

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EBBuck03's picture

If a second SEC team makes it, it will be UGA.  They will have to beat LSU in the SEC champ game though for that to happen.

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oprettyricky's picture

The same way people are saying 'alabama came back and made it a game' is the same way others can say that bomb hail mary that resulted in a score was just an LSU mistake...otherwise it would have been a two score game. LSU wouldn't give up that play again - shit just happens and it was one bad call. There were a few situations LSU could have improved on as well. I mean Alabama lost...penalize them. That is how it works, after all. Minnesota was expected to be BLOWN OUT and won relatively easily. They need to be given some respect as well. 

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EBBuck03's picture

LSU will jump us in tomorrow's rankings, but the key thing here is that LSU doesn't pay a ranked opponent for the rest of the season.  We still play at Top 10 PSU and a Top 15 TTUN.  If we win dominantly we most definitely have a chance to regain #1.

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Earthoid.'s picture

I think you're correct.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
tcm1968's picture

I think we drop to number 2 because at this point it's still about the lack of the love for the PAC12. If Penn State wins last week we stay at #1, but their loss means another two conference team needs to stay at 4 and you justify putting Bama there with LSU at #1..

LSU can't do much after this week though until potentially the SEC championship game. LSUs 3 regular season games are combined 12-17 and all unranked. 

Auburn Georgia game this weekend is a big deal. Won't effect the standings in the SEC East but hurts the SEC championship if Auburn can knock off Georgia..

Go Bucks!

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Brohio's picture

I would love to see this board if we had beaten #3 Bama on the road, #7 Florida, #9 Auburn and Texas on the road all in the same undefeated season and were ranked #2. lol. Still a lot of season left. We will be #1 if we win out. And we'll beat whoever they put in front of us in the playoffs. But there is no debating that LSU's resume is objectively better at this exact moment. 

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Earthoid.'s picture

We certainly would have thought that was unfair, but if that were the way the committee was ranking teams, we'd have to accept it including the fact that their way of ranking teams probably shouldn't magically change from week 1 to 2...

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
Brutus's picture

I personally think LSU should have always been #1 based on their strength of schedule. I know the computers say we have an overall stronger schedule but simply put, wins against Florida, Auburn, Bama and even Texas are better than our three good wins. Not because of their rankings but because those teams all recruit much better than Wisc, IU, and Cincinnati. Better recruits don’t always make for better teams but at the end of the day, LSU has faced tons more 4 and 5 star players than we have seen so far this year. Our schedule is about to get much tougher so we’ll have a chance to flip things but right now I’m perfectly fine with LSU taking the top spot. 

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I'm Ron Burgundy's picture

I definitely follow the logic of the OP, and it is the age old discussion of "deserves" versus "the best".  LSU objectively "deserves" to be #1 due to its wins.  OSU somewhat subjectively but actually quite objectively is "the best" team when you look at the dominance factor over a solid schedule.

When you try to mix the 2 standards, as the committee does, you'll often get these contradicting rankings.

For me if it is fair play for LSU to jump OSU after a 5 pt road win against #3, then it better be fair play for OSU to jump back to #1 after potential multiple score wins over PSU, @TTUN, hopefully Minnesota.  While LSU has a couple weaker teams and TXAM, and then presumably UGA coming up.

This only matters because I really think OSU and Clemson are the two best teams in the country, and it would be a shame for them to have to play in the semis.

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BUCKEYE3M's picture

To be clear, I'm 100% sure that the committee is going to put LSU ahead of us this week. 

I'm not. I think the committee had Ohio State #1 by a sizeable margin. I don't know that this changed. I realize LSU picked up the best win college football this year, and Texas will likely sneak into the rankings this week, but I still don't think it's enough after the Buckeyes showed they could have easily put 100 on the Terps. 

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Earthoid.'s picture

Am starting to come around to this as well.  

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

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BUCKEYE3M's picture

59 point wins are magical :) 

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shiloh's picture

Predict Buckeyes #1 tomorrow. #2 LSU beat #3 'bama by 5 pts. Not surprising. 'bama was an onside kick away from possibly winning the game.

Total yardage:  LSU = 559 / 'bama = 541, but that doesn't include a 77 yd punt return for td by 'bama. IOW the game was close, although LSU almost choked away their big halftime lead. Both of their defenses suck! Whereas Ohio State has the #1 defense not skipping a beat w/out CY notwithstanding.

But JB may have won the Heisman on Saturday. Stay tuned ...

>

btw ~ https://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/ ~ lies, damn lies and statistics!

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. ~ Mark Twain

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saintstephen11's picture

JB definitely won the Heisman. I agree there.

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Earthoid.'s picture

I think objectively, we all know that it is proper to keep the #1 team in this case at #1.  That team just happens to be the Buckeyes.  If it were the other way around and we were LSU, sure we wouldn't think the same, but objectively it would be correct to keep them at #1.  LSU pretty much gave the committee what they expected as the #2 team beating the #3 team by 5 points, while showing defensive deficiencies that the #1 team does not - even with their best defensive player missing (actually BOTH of their starting DE's).

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS
Earthoid.'s picture

JB for Heisman for sure, no argument there.

A gentle reminder to BE NICE. Plays guitar and makes iced tea in the winter.

HS