I think you're onto something there, AK. Come on down to Ryan Day's BOGOBoom Emporium!
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least, you need a beer." - Frank Zappa
BOOM! Welcome Josh Fryar. It's never a bad thing to have a big, versatile offensive lineman become a Buckeye and especially so considering his father was an outstanding player. Go Bucks!
My guess is that the relatively low rating for the #8 guard is more a function of the fact that higher-rated linemen are typically going to be tackles as that is the more "important" position. But if the position ranking is a good indication of his potential, then this is a big get.
Are you Snake84's twin brother? I think, though unable to prove, that with OL, there have been more over achieving 3* than 5* who have achieved greatness. OL are a different animal.
I'm at the age where food has taken the place of sex in my life. In fact, I've just had a mirror put over my kitchen table. - Rodney Dangerfield
Studs has already proven that he can't coach up 3* and 4* star recruits. Look at his tenure at LSU and you'll see why he was "asked" to seek other opportunities
Please stop giving Studrawa credit for developing a red shirt senior and a red shirt junior (which were what Elflein and Price were when Studrawa stepped onto the OSU campus).
He deserves credit for developing those guys. And if he somehow doesn't (he does), why does Hartline get credit for what he did with Campbell and McLaurin in 1 year?
You Stud haters aren't very consistent with your arguments.
That is a fair question. Zach Smith is widely considered by the fanbase at Ohio State as a good recruiter but a terrible developer of talent. Campbell and McLaurin “blew up” in their last year under Hartline’s leadership. Elflein and Price were already OL studs under Warinner well before Studrawa stepped foot on campus. It is a popular thought that the WR room is very strong and developing well under Hartline, He has taken an under-performing position group and turned it into a strength. Studrawa has a group that couldn’t block for the RPO so the offense had to abandon the concept and go more conventional in their offense. Heck, the OL couldn’t consistently open holes for our RBs even though our average OL weight was well over 300 lbs/man. Studrawa has brought in Smith type of talent with Smith type of results. I truly hope that he can turn things around and make the OL dominant again as Warinner did. He hasn’t yet but this year he has a lot of top talent on the OL, it is time for our OL to shine and show that they can be a unit that can gel and carry the team.
I know better, but what does what AZ Buckeye posted have to do with what I said. I never said anything about Stud developing him, I was just stating he was a three star. If you read down a few posts you will see that I showed the offense we won our last championship with consisted of 5 (3 stars) 5 (4 stars) and 1 (5 star), which proves you can compete for the national championship with some (3 stars) if you recruit and develop the right players.
My Pat Elflein response was in response to Mr. Anderson saying you can’t compete for NC’s with 3 star recruits. That’s why I put Mr. Anderson’s name at the beginning of my post so it would be obvious who I was responding to. Other people were responding to each other between me and Mr. Anderson, so my response is now lost in the thread and makes less sense. I wasn’t part of the discussion on stud.
I hate to agree with you, Martin Anderson - but looking at it logically, I kinda have to. No matter how much so many of us would like to overlook the importance of recruiting class rankings, I'm afraid that historically there is an undeniable correlation between those rankings and NCs.
Those who are in denial of this fact like to site a player here or a player there who developed from a two or three-star player in to an All American, but I'm afraid there are not enough of those instances to disprove the overall correlation year in and year out, To my surprise, it may be contrary to popular belief (at least on this thread), but the obvious link between national recruiting rankings and national championships has been remarkably consistent pretty much since the better recruiting ranking providers came in to being.
For example, most recently, with the exception of a couple of outliers (Michigan State and Washington) - since its inception, the remaining eighteen qualifiers for the national championship playoff so far, have averaged a ranking at least in the top twenty nationally in the previous four to five recruiting cycles. Of course, the only program that has appeared in every playoff so far, Alabama, has been at or near the very top in the recruiting cycles leading up to a given playoff appearance.
So, I'm a little perplexed to see so many 11Wers (who I think of as a rather college-football-savvy bunch, generally speaking) turning a blind eye to this fact.
However, on a positive note, in spite of the notable influx of three-stars recently, we're still sitting pretty good in the present cycle - with a fairly good chance of perhaps adding a five star or two and/or a few high four-stars to the class.
Naturally, I"m sending my best wishes to our newest Buckeye, in any case. Congratulations to him - and I hope he proves the "starhanderouters" (thank you, Stxbuck) wrong and that he eventually develops in to an All American -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
I still think you are being pessimistic on this at this point.
1. In RD's first year as head coach, we are currently ranked #4 in this class which is well within Urban zone and CFP zone as well. that is not just pretty good. That is outstanding.
2. Not all 3 stars are equal. This young man has offers from Alabama, Oklahoma and Ohio State.
Recruiting was and still is my biggest worry about whether Coach Day can compete at the top levels. So far, the answer not only looks like yes if looks Hell YES.
Yeah - I mentioned we are sitting pretty right now in the current cycle, Campg63. It's certainly not time to freak out over the recent streak of 3-stars. However, while we always recruit a few 3-star "projects", its been a while since we've taken quite this many all at once. But, to be fair, a couple of our latest 3-star commits have some impressive offers - not just Fryar.
I suppose my main point is that it is folly to deny there is a strong correlation between a team's recruiting rankings and a team's chances for national championships. An occasional 3-star recruit rising to the top - or not. Almost incredibly, I'm seeing a fair amount of that kind of attitude (not you). The doubters don't have to believe me. Just take the time to look it up - like I did.
And it's agreed, I think Coach Day and his staff are doing a phenomenal job, given the circumstances. In fact, as far as the upcoming season is concerned, I could easily be accused as being overly optimistic. If we don't drop our guard against some middling B1G West team again this season, I believe we have the players and the coaches to potentially run the table - win the conference and qualify for the playoff -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
Your points are all excellent. Alabama and Clemson have owned CFB for the last decade and they consistently finish in the top 3 in recruiting. We have 8(!) kids is this class ranked somewhere below #350 in the country and I’m not counting the kicker.
There are absolute studs in this class for sure. But it is undeniable that they have missed badly at a bunch of positions - notably OL.
i hope more than anyone that it works out, but count me concerned with 1/3 of this class.
In addition, Dabo S in an interview here in the Carolinas, he pretty much dismissed the low star importance, said he looked for talent yes but more so with future potential, football IQ and attitude. As a diehard Buckeye, I can’t stand Dabo, Clemson fans are almost as bad as TTUN fans close but not quite at least they have actually won something
Buckeye Phi, I am not going to say I disagree with you, but it’s still about development. Yes you probably need to be in the top 20 to consistently compete for the national championship, but you also have to recruit and develop the players that fit your scheme, not just who has the most stars. Our last national championship team consisted of the following starters on offense:
Line: Taylor Decker (4 star) Billy Price (4 star DT in HS converted to offensive line at OSU) Jacoby Boren (3 star) Pat Elflein (3 star) Darryl Baldwin (4 star SDE in HS converted to offensive line at OSU). So our championship line had 2 (3 star) 2 (4 stars converted from defense in HS to offensive line in college) and 1 (4 star) recruited offensive lineman. Our receivers consisted of (3 star) Devin Smith, (4 star) Evan Spencer, and (5 star) Jalin Marshall. Our TE was (3 star) Jeff Huerman. Our QB was (3 star) Cardale Jones and our RB was (4 star) Zeke Elliot. That’s not cherry picking one guy, that is reality. We won a championship with 5 (3 stars) 5 (4 stars) and 1 (5 star). Now this was just the offense, but if you care to look you will find just as many (3 stars) were on the starting defense as the offense. So it’s about getting the right players and coaching them up as much as it is about star ratings.
I didn't mean to suggest we should never recruit any 3-star kids, RollRedRoll. Naturally, developmental cases are a significant part of our program. I'm just saying we can't base our program on that if we're wanting to be in contention for NCs on a regular basis.
The majority of recruits have to be elite prospects if we're shooting for that. Again - the only program that has been in every playoff so far has been right at the top of the recruiting rankings year after year
In fact, even by your own beak-down above, we still had more 4-star and above recruits on a championship team that was rather unusual in that regard. And even then - our classes overall leading up to that run, were fairly highly ranked.
Also, keep in mind the only time we've been to the playoff since, it didn't turn out so well -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
I agree with you that we need to recruit a top 5 class every year if we want a good shot at the playoffs on a consistent basis, but the line is the hardest spot to predict in my opinion. You have to get some of the top players if you want to compete with the big boys, but you also have to develop that talent or it is wasted. My example was more to show that we won a national championship with a line that consisted of 3 guys who were recruited as lineman (2 of which were 3 stars) and 2 converted defensive linemen.
Yeah - I think we're essentially in agreement, RollRedRoll. I actually enjoy watching a three star (or on rare occasions even a two) rise above conventional expectations. I just hope our present staff is as good at developing these kids as our staffs have tended to be over the years - especially under UFM.
And I believe both of us have our sights set on bigger things than another B1G championship, alone. (Although, you'll never hear me complain about that!) But we clearly also agree that the chances are dramatically better for that if we're consistently ranked close to the top in recruiting every cycle.
A good back and forth, by the way -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
Once a recruit signs his LoI to The Ohio State University, I'll be one of his biggest fans. But let's be real: For those of us who follow recruiting, I don't believe Fryar, Trey Leroux, Jakob James or Grant Toutant were on the offensive line "wish list" - or Ty Hamilton and Mitchell Melton at DL and LB - tOSU recruiting analysts offered back in December. While stars are not the end all be all, generally, there is a strong correlation between star-ranking and production/draft position - which is Meyer focused on 5- and high 4-star recruits. Also, not all offers are created equal (e.g. committable vs. noncommittable).
To put it all into perspective, likely, tOSU missed on a lot of their primary targets due to Meyer's retirement coupled with the negative publicity generated by the Zach Smith fiasco. Even still, Day and Co. have been able to obtain commitments from many other top recruits, and will easily land a top-10, and maybe top-5 class. And I suspect that things will only get better once 2021+ recruits see the product under Day and Co. Further, players like Fryar, Leroux, James, Toutant, Hamilton and Melton will come in hungry to prove themselves, and may have 4-5 years to be developed without the pressure of proving their rankings.
The future looks bright for the Scarlet & Gray, and I am here for it.
I wonder what the comments were when Coach Tressel took this guy - a little known 3 star kid from Minnesota? How many people who "follow recruiting" left similar "why are we taking 3 star recruits when we should be getting 4-5 stars" comments. Yes, I too "follow" recruiting - but I would never presume to know more that those who actually do the recruiting for a living.
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
Had I bought 10,000 shares of Microsoft stock in the 80s, or Amazon stock in the 90s, I'd be long retired with a condo on a private island somewhere. Likewise, there are numerous examples of 3-, and maybe even 2-, star recruits who bucked the trend and had illustrious careers in college and/or the NFL. Still, they were exceptions to the general rule that highly-ranked high school players are more likely to be highly-productive college players and low-round NFL draft picks. For every Laurinaitis, Hawk and Darren Lee, there are probably 5 Beanie Wells, Terrelle Pryors, Raekwon McMillans, Joey/Nick Bosas, etc. across the college football landscape. Not to mention that perennial national title contenders routinely have among the best recruiting classes; and why teams with non-top-10 average class rankings rarely are in the playoff discussion come late November. Knock star rankings all you like, but it's no coincidence that Saban, Meyer, Jimbo Fisher, Kirby Smart and ol' Dabo build the vast majority of their classes with 5- and high 4-star recruits.
Using your own example, would you have listened to the guy in the office who "follows the markets" and told you it was a stupid investment buying Microsoft when IBM was a much higher rated stock? Or would you have said "let see how this goes" before making a decision on how "good" your investment was. Recruiting is the same thing - an investment in a young man with the hope of a big future return. Sometimes you hit, sometimes you don't. And while you might make money buying a "known" commodity, you can get filthy, stinking rich finding a diamond in the rough.
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
Laurinatis was actually a 2 star as was Khalil Mack out of Florida but went to Buffalo, Leveon Bell as well 2 Stars, Luke Kuechly an Ohio native was a 3 star but ended up at Boston College as we didn’t really recruit him, Malcom Jenkins too, hell Baker Mayfield was a 3 star, AJ Hawk,we supposedly hire top notch coaches, development specialists like Pantoni, these kids we are taking their commitments from, are for a reason
We were likely spoiled with Urban, and we still have a top five class right now. However, it feels like we are adding more three star recruits than usual and certainly more than the other top recruiting classes. Should we be concerned about that aspect of recruiting?
The world would be a better place if Buckeyes ran it...
Many here would post endless Boom GIFs if we got a 2* recruit. Of course it is concerning getting 3* guys instead of 4 and 5* guys, most just can’t see it through their scarlet lenses.
Comments Show All Comments
The world is yours
Boom!
SWEEEEEEEEEEET!
Fire Stud. He sucks and can't recruit. Oh yeah. Forgot that he has nothing to do about those we get, only the ones we lose or don't pan out.
Boom!
BOOM!
This one calls for Luke Combs....
"You have to play with emotion, you can't let emotion play with you." - Ryan Day
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
"Anything easy ain't worth a damn!" -Woody Hayes
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
"Anything easy ain't worth a damn!" -Woody Hayes
Isn’t that pre-boom...the week prior?
This more appropriately describes this week...
Boooooom - featuring new blocking techniques
Boom!
Jeez, what a day!
You had me at Alabama and Oklahoma. Penn State wanted him badly as well.
Father played on the teams that gave OSU trouble, I believe.
Anyway...Welcome aboard and congratulations!
BOOM!!
"Give your dream an aspiration date."
With an offer list like that I question why he’s a three star
B/c the people who are smart about such things have jobs like being college OL coaches instead of starhanderouters.
Would give you a second +1 for 'starhanderouter' if I could.
"It's always scotch-thirty on my island."
Well said IBB
Go get'em Cal Poppy - we are behind you !!
It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.
I always upvote "starhanderouters"
Logged in to upvote! Starhanderouters... classic
Indiana put a whuppin on tOSU w/ Anthony Thompson in 87’ or 88’.
Buy one get one today on the Booms!
I am a Michigan booster bud....just spent $182 bucks at Wal-Mart this morning.
I think you're onto something there, AK. Come on down to Ryan Day's BOGOBoom Emporium!
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least, you need a beer." - Frank Zappa
Hell yeah! Looking forward to seeing
FriarFryar body the bad guys around the field!Scarlet, Grey & Boom! - what a way to celebrate
#ItsGreatToBeABUCKEYE
So great, welcome Josh!
Welcome to the Buckeye family, Mr. Fryar! Kid is aggressive and stays with his blocks-I like it. He kinda looks like Mike Leach, too, fwiw!
MULTIPLE BOOMS
Happy Gilmore accomplished that feat no more than an hour ago.
Shooter McGavin!!!!!!!
Double BOOM!!! Best Independence Day ever!!!
Fields of Dreams
Another Holiday BOOM !!
Go get'em Cal Poppy - we are behind you !!
It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.
You need to be humble or you will get humbled. - Jocko Willink
Welcome, Josh Fryar!
Enjoying daily the 62-39 ttun beatdown.
BOOM! Welcome Josh Fryar. It's never a bad thing to have a big, versatile offensive lineman become a Buckeye and especially so considering his father was an outstanding player. Go Bucks!
Another great get! The cupboard is now officially stocked back up again. The future is looking good on the O-line!
Sure, I'll use this gif twice today.
emotionally exhausted and morally bankrupt
When it comes to OL. Forget the Stars...how many Nasties do they have ...
I think it’s already been said......BOOM
TG Proud Buckeye alumnus.
My guess is that the relatively low rating for the #8 guard is more a function of the fact that higher-rated linemen are typically going to be tackles as that is the more "important" position. But if the position ranking is a good indication of his potential, then this is a big get.
The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.
Good lord, blink and you'll miss a boom around here.
Congratulations to Josh Fryar...go Buckeyes!
Got M...igan gossip? Bang it here.
You got that right Hove; I went to take a harbough and come back to another BOOM!!
Welcome to Buckeye Nation Josh Fryar!
The only hard day was yesterday
Welcome to Buckeye Nation, Josh!
time to change up a litle
This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.
peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
Nice to have him committed but history has shown we ain't gonna compete for NC's with a class full of 3* recruits
Are you Snake84's twin brother? I think, though unable to prove, that with OL, there have been more over achieving 3* than 5* who have achieved greatness. OL are a different animal.
I'm at the age where food has taken the place of sex in my life. In fact, I've just had a mirror put over my kitchen table. - Rodney Dangerfield
Studs has already proven that he can't coach up 3* and 4* star recruits. Look at his tenure at LSU and you'll see why he was "asked" to seek other opportunities
LSU was how many years ago? I guess no one can learn grow or progress in life right?
There are differences at Ohio State as opposed to LSU that influence the outcome of player development.
One of them is Coach Mick.
In old Ohio there's a team that's known throughout the land...
If what you say is true, why would it be different with a 5*?a lot depends on the player.
I'm at the age where food has taken the place of sex in my life. In fact, I've just had a mirror put over my kitchen table. - Rodney Dangerfield
Except he coached 3* Pat Elflein and 4* Billy Price to Rimington awards. Your comment = trash.
Please stop giving Studrawa credit for developing a red shirt senior and a red shirt junior (which were what Elflein and Price were when Studrawa stepped onto the OSU campus).
He deserves credit for developing those guys. And if he somehow doesn't (he does), why does Hartline get credit for what he did with Campbell and McLaurin in 1 year?
You Stud haters aren't very consistent with your arguments.
That is a fair question. Zach Smith is widely considered by the fanbase at Ohio State as a good recruiter but a terrible developer of talent. Campbell and McLaurin “blew up” in their last year under Hartline’s leadership. Elflein and Price were already OL studs under Warinner well before Studrawa stepped foot on campus. It is a popular thought that the WR room is very strong and developing well under Hartline, He has taken an under-performing position group and turned it into a strength. Studrawa has a group that couldn’t block for the RPO so the offense had to abandon the concept and go more conventional in their offense. Heck, the OL couldn’t consistently open holes for our RBs even though our average OL weight was well over 300 lbs/man. Studrawa has brought in Smith type of talent with Smith type of results. I truly hope that he can turn things around and make the OL dominant again as Warinner did. He hasn’t yet but this year he has a lot of top talent on the OL, it is time for our OL to shine and show that they can be a unit that can gel and carry the team.
I believe Warriner was actually their o line coach.
Mr. Anderson, Pat Elflein says hello.
Like AZ Buckeye said two posts above
I know better, but what does what AZ Buckeye posted have to do with what I said. I never said anything about Stud developing him, I was just stating he was a three star. If you read down a few posts you will see that I showed the offense we won our last championship with consisted of 5 (3 stars) 5 (4 stars) and 1 (5 star), which proves you can compete for the national championship with some (3 stars) if you recruit and develop the right players.
Not that I agree with him, but
And he's staying Stud can't develop them well and Elflein isn't a counterexample because he was basically already developed.
My Pat Elflein response was in response to Mr. Anderson saying you can’t compete for NC’s with 3 star recruits. That’s why I put Mr. Anderson’s name at the beginning of my post so it would be obvious who I was responding to. Other people were responding to each other between me and Mr. Anderson, so my response is now lost in the thread and makes less sense. I wasn’t part of the discussion on stud.
I hate to agree with you, Martin Anderson - but looking at it logically, I kinda have to. No matter how much so many of us would like to overlook the importance of recruiting class rankings, I'm afraid that historically there is an undeniable correlation between those rankings and NCs.
Those who are in denial of this fact like to site a player here or a player there who developed from a two or three-star player in to an All American, but I'm afraid there are not enough of those instances to disprove the overall correlation year in and year out, To my surprise, it may be contrary to popular belief (at least on this thread), but the obvious link between national recruiting rankings and national championships has been remarkably consistent pretty much since the better recruiting ranking providers came in to being.
For example, most recently, with the exception of a couple of outliers (Michigan State and Washington) - since its inception, the remaining eighteen qualifiers for the national championship playoff so far, have averaged a ranking at least in the top twenty nationally in the previous four to five recruiting cycles. Of course, the only program that has appeared in every playoff so far, Alabama, has been at or near the very top in the recruiting cycles leading up to a given playoff appearance.
So, I'm a little perplexed to see so many 11Wers (who I think of as a rather college-football-savvy bunch, generally speaking) turning a blind eye to this fact.
However, on a positive note, in spite of the notable influx of three-stars recently, we're still sitting pretty good in the present cycle - with a fairly good chance of perhaps adding a five star or two and/or a few high four-stars to the class.
Naturally, I"m sending my best wishes to our newest Buckeye, in any case. Congratulations to him - and I hope he proves the "starhanderouters" (thank you, Stxbuck) wrong and that he eventually develops in to an All American -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
Good points BP.
I still think you are being pessimistic on this at this point.
1. In RD's first year as head coach, we are currently ranked #4 in this class which is well within Urban zone and CFP zone as well. that is not just pretty good. That is outstanding.
2. Not all 3 stars are equal. This young man has offers from Alabama, Oklahoma and Ohio State.
Recruiting was and still is my biggest worry about whether Coach Day can compete at the top levels. So far, the answer not only looks like yes if looks Hell YES.
Go Bucks
Forever is forever. Choose wisely.
Go Bucks
Yeah - I mentioned we are sitting pretty right now in the current cycle, Campg63. It's certainly not time to freak out over the recent streak of 3-stars. However, while we always recruit a few 3-star "projects", its been a while since we've taken quite this many all at once. But, to be fair, a couple of our latest 3-star commits have some impressive offers - not just Fryar.
I suppose my main point is that it is folly to deny there is a strong correlation between a team's recruiting rankings and a team's chances for national championships. An occasional 3-star recruit rising to the top - or not. Almost incredibly, I'm seeing a fair amount of that kind of attitude (not you). The doubters don't have to believe me. Just take the time to look it up - like I did.
And it's agreed, I think Coach Day and his staff are doing a phenomenal job, given the circumstances. In fact, as far as the upcoming season is concerned, I could easily be accused as being overly optimistic. If we don't drop our guard against some middling B1G West team again this season, I believe we have the players and the coaches to potentially run the table - win the conference and qualify for the playoff -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
Your points are all excellent. Alabama and Clemson have owned CFB for the last decade and they consistently finish in the top 3 in recruiting. We have 8(!) kids is this class ranked somewhere below #350 in the country and I’m not counting the kicker.
There are absolute studs in this class for sure. But it is undeniable that they have missed badly at a bunch of positions - notably OL.
i hope more than anyone that it works out, but count me concerned with 1/3 of this class.
Pain of Discipline
Pain of Regret
Take Your Pick
Clemson consistently finishes in the top 3 in recruiting?
2012 - 20th nationally. 2013 - 15th nationally. 2014 - 16th nationally. 2015 - 9th nationally. 2016- 11 nationally.
2017 - 16th nationally. 2018 - 7th nationally. 2019 - 10th nationally. Average class ranking last 8 years is 13th.
Clemson hasn’t been top three the last decade, maybe it’s coaching up those 3 stars they recruit.
In addition, Dabo S in an interview here in the Carolinas, he pretty much dismissed the low star importance, said he looked for talent yes but more so with future potential, football IQ and attitude. As a diehard Buckeye, I can’t stand Dabo, Clemson fans are almost as bad as TTUN fans close but not quite at least they have actually won something
Or perhaps it is SARMing up those 3 stars they recruit.
Buckeye Phi, I am not going to say I disagree with you, but it’s still about development. Yes you probably need to be in the top 20 to consistently compete for the national championship, but you also have to recruit and develop the players that fit your scheme, not just who has the most stars. Our last national championship team consisted of the following starters on offense:
Line: Taylor Decker (4 star) Billy Price (4 star DT in HS converted to offensive line at OSU) Jacoby Boren (3 star) Pat Elflein (3 star) Darryl Baldwin (4 star SDE in HS converted to offensive line at OSU). So our championship line had 2 (3 star) 2 (4 stars converted from defense in HS to offensive line in college) and 1 (4 star) recruited offensive lineman. Our receivers consisted of (3 star) Devin Smith, (4 star) Evan Spencer, and (5 star) Jalin Marshall. Our TE was (3 star) Jeff Huerman. Our QB was (3 star) Cardale Jones and our RB was (4 star) Zeke Elliot. That’s not cherry picking one guy, that is reality. We won a championship with 5 (3 stars) 5 (4 stars) and 1 (5 star). Now this was just the offense, but if you care to look you will find just as many (3 stars) were on the starting defense as the offense. So it’s about getting the right players and coaching them up as much as it is about star ratings.
I didn't mean to suggest we should never recruit any 3-star kids, RollRedRoll. Naturally, developmental cases are a significant part of our program. I'm just saying we can't base our program on that if we're wanting to be in contention for NCs on a regular basis.
The majority of recruits have to be elite prospects if we're shooting for that. Again - the only program that has been in every playoff so far has been right at the top of the recruiting rankings year after year
In fact, even by your own beak-down above, we still had more 4-star and above recruits on a championship team that was rather unusual in that regard. And even then - our classes overall leading up to that run, were fairly highly ranked.
Also, keep in mind the only time we've been to the playoff since, it didn't turn out so well -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
I agree with you that we need to recruit a top 5 class every year if we want a good shot at the playoffs on a consistent basis, but the line is the hardest spot to predict in my opinion. You have to get some of the top players if you want to compete with the big boys, but you also have to develop that talent or it is wasted. My example was more to show that we won a national championship with a line that consisted of 3 guys who were recruited as lineman (2 of which were 3 stars) and 2 converted defensive linemen.
Yeah - I think we're essentially in agreement, RollRedRoll. I actually enjoy watching a three star (or on rare occasions even a two) rise above conventional expectations. I just hope our present staff is as good at developing these kids as our staffs have tended to be over the years - especially under UFM.
And I believe both of us have our sights set on bigger things than another B1G championship, alone. (Although, you'll never hear me complain about that!) But we clearly also agree that the chances are dramatically better for that if we're consistently ranked close to the top in recruiting every cycle.
A good back and forth, by the way -
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Will Rogers
To be fair you 'ain't' competing for anything except ass of the day post.
another Independence Day BOOM!
WOO HOO!
Welcome aboard Josh!
GO BUCKEYES!
16-2 is SWEET!
Welcome to Pipeline U. !
Another July 4 B O O M
BOOMBITY BOOMMBITY BOOM
"I don't apologize for anything. When I make a mistake, I take the blame and go on from there." - Woody Hayes
Once a recruit signs his LoI to The Ohio State University, I'll be one of his biggest fans. But let's be real: For those of us who follow recruiting, I don't believe Fryar, Trey Leroux, Jakob James or Grant Toutant were on the offensive line "wish list" - or Ty Hamilton and Mitchell Melton at DL and LB - tOSU recruiting analysts offered back in December. While stars are not the end all be all, generally, there is a strong correlation between star-ranking and production/draft position - which is Meyer focused on 5- and high 4-star recruits. Also, not all offers are created equal (e.g. committable vs. noncommittable).
To put it all into perspective, likely, tOSU missed on a lot of their primary targets due to Meyer's retirement coupled with the negative publicity generated by the Zach Smith fiasco. Even still, Day and Co. have been able to obtain commitments from many other top recruits, and will easily land a top-10, and maybe top-5 class. And I suspect that things will only get better once 2021+ recruits see the product under Day and Co. Further, players like Fryar, Leroux, James, Toutant, Hamilton and Melton will come in hungry to prove themselves, and may have 4-5 years to be developed without the pressure of proving their rankings.
The future looks bright for the Scarlet & Gray, and I am here for it.
I wonder what the comments were when Coach Tressel took this guy - a little known 3 star kid from Minnesota? How many people who "follow recruiting" left similar "why are we taking 3 star recruits when we should be getting 4-5 stars" comments. Yes, I too "follow" recruiting - but I would never presume to know more that those who actually do the recruiting for a living.
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
"Anything easy ain't worth a damn!" -Woody Hayes
Had I bought 10,000 shares of Microsoft stock in the 80s, or Amazon stock in the 90s, I'd be long retired with a condo on a private island somewhere. Likewise, there are numerous examples of 3-, and maybe even 2-, star recruits who bucked the trend and had illustrious careers in college and/or the NFL. Still, they were exceptions to the general rule that highly-ranked high school players are more likely to be highly-productive college players and low-round NFL draft picks. For every Laurinaitis, Hawk and Darren Lee, there are probably 5 Beanie Wells, Terrelle Pryors, Raekwon McMillans, Joey/Nick Bosas, etc. across the college football landscape. Not to mention that perennial national title contenders routinely have among the best recruiting classes; and why teams with non-top-10 average class rankings rarely are in the playoff discussion come late November. Knock star rankings all you like, but it's no coincidence that Saban, Meyer, Jimbo Fisher, Kirby Smart and ol' Dabo build the vast majority of their classes with 5- and high 4-star recruits.
Careful with the logic
Using your own example, would you have listened to the guy in the office who "follows the markets" and told you it was a stupid investment buying Microsoft when IBM was a much higher rated stock? Or would you have said "let see how this goes" before making a decision on how "good" your investment was. Recruiting is the same thing - an investment in a young man with the hope of a big future return. Sometimes you hit, sometimes you don't. And while you might make money buying a "known" commodity, you can get filthy, stinking rich finding a diamond in the rough.
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
"Anything easy ain't worth a damn!" -Woody Hayes
Laurinatis was actually a 2 star as was Khalil Mack out of Florida but went to Buffalo, Leveon Bell as well 2 Stars, Luke Kuechly an Ohio native was a 3 star but ended up at Boston College as we didn’t really recruit him, Malcom Jenkins too, hell Baker Mayfield was a 3 star, AJ Hawk,we supposedly hire top notch coaches, development specialists like Pantoni, these kids we are taking their commitments from, are for a reason
https://247sports.com/Player/James-Laurinaitis-76650/
“But admit there was no splendor in all the bright array
Like the glory of the going when Chic Harley got away.” -James Thurber
"Anything easy ain't worth a damn!" -Woody Hayes
And the hits just keep on coming! Welcome aboard Mr. Fryar.
We were likely spoiled with Urban, and we still have a top five class right now. However, it feels like we are adding more three star recruits than usual and certainly more than the other top recruiting classes. Should we be concerned about that aspect of recruiting?
The world would be a better place if Buckeyes ran it...
Many here would post endless Boom GIFs if we got a 2* recruit. Of course it is concerning getting 3* guys instead of 4 and 5* guys, most just can’t see it through their scarlet lenses.
That's because all of our 3* recruits are under the radar hidden gems while other schools 3* are just that, 3*
And that is based on fact or scarlet glasses? Sounds like the latter.
He's trolling.
Boom!. I like that Fryar is versatile on the line.
"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer
11 Strong.