Sucks, but makes sense for him. Play the game before the real game!
If I'm the AZ Cardinals, I'm not overthinking this. I'm taking Bosa #1 overall and moving on to the second round. If your #2, it's got to be Quinnen Williams of Alabama in my opinion.
I think Arizona is taking Murray in large part due to Kingsbury's ties to him. Don't think it's the right decision at all but realistically Rosen was bad last season and Kingsbury owes no loyalty to him at this point. I think Bosa ends up going to the Niners at 2.
Other than coaching in the same conference that Murray played in, what ties do they have? Kliff was long gone from A&M by the time Murray got there.
Kingsbury recruited him out of HS. Read this article. Murray talks about it. They also both happen to have the same agent.
But what if he's improved in the past couple weeks!?
Smart move. Now would not be the time to reinjure himself.
I'd rather be an hour early than a minute late.
He should probably skip training camp too so he's fresh and healed up for the regular season, maybe even the season so he's good to go for the playoffs. I would suggest that he not play his first 63 games so he's healthy and ready for FA.
I don't even know what to say to this.
You said that if we allow A to happen, then Z will eventually happen too, therefore A should not happen.
The problem with this reasoning is that it avoids engaging with the issue at hand, and instead shifts attention to extreme hypotheticals.
The internet is one huge logical fallacy so.....
I think the pro folks have enough data & film at this point to make a reasonable decision.
This sort of stuff would make me nervous to draft him. All the talent in the world but it's the same agent/management company Joey uses and they are SUPER SUPER cautious with letting Joey play.. Injuries and the original holdout and Joey has only played in 37 of a possible 50 NFL games he could have played in... They aren't the same guy obviously but the guys running them are working from the same playbook... stay healthy enough to get to that second contract...
Yes, I'd be very nervous about a guy that could turn out to be Joey Bosa. Definitely don't want a rookie of the year type performance or any of those dumb sacks.
A GM isn't earning his paycheck if he doesn't at least think " are we going to sign this dude for 4 years and only get him on the field for 3 years"..
Lot of reports the Chargers may not want to pay Bosa and that Bosa's camp is already angling for an extension.. It has the potential to get ugly with more missed games..
I 10000000% get it from a players perspective. Maximize your earnings as much as possible... but from a team/gm perspective I'd be cautious..
Joey is a top 5 pass rusher in the NFL. Yes, he had the holdout and is cautious with his injuries. And when he plays, he dominates. Wouldn't you rather have someone who can play at 100% when they are on the field instead of someone who plays through injury at 75% and risks missing even more time?
To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift.
I root for the Chargers.. He had 5.5 sacks this past season. Good for 64th in the league. His agent said he wants him to become the highest paid non QB with his next contract.
As an owner or gm I would want more than that.. A lot more than that.. Aaron Donald has missed 2 games in 5 years... Plenty of top end guys who haven't missed a game..
13 missed games and counting is just a lot for a guy heading into year 4...
He had 5.5 sacks this past season. Good for 64th in the league
He also played 6 games, which projects to about 15 sacks. This season accounted for 9 of his 13 missed games. He played 28 consecutive games after the initial missed 4, and didn't miss any time after returning from this years injury. He's had 2 unlucky injuries that held him out, but it's not like he's aggravating the same injuries over and over (likely a result of his caution when returning from injury). If he can avoid missing more than a game or two over the next 2 seasons, he very well may get that mega deal he's looking for.
Sorry Urban, Woody is still my favorite
I agree from the GM perspective. If I'm a GM I dont want someone that appears to be just looking for that big contract. I would be worried about the kind of player he will be AFTER he gets what he wants. It happens all the time. A great player becomes content to be O.K. after they get payed. I would want a player that plays with intensity, passion and a team first attitude regardless of his contract situation. I want proof that your value to the team and organization are worth the money. The onerous is on the player to proof their value. He has to EARN that contract, and sometimes that means playing through injuries. Everyone in the league does it.
Wasn't the holdout also because the chargers were trying to shaft him instead of setting up the bonus like everyone else in the league does?
It was entirely due to that. They tried to make an example of Bosa in order to be cheap and change the precedent of what every other top pick's contract structure had been before him and in his own draft class.
Wouldn't sitting out the pro day be more beneficial to him staying healthy? You bash Joey for injuries that are outside his control, preach staying healthy, but then say Nick sitting out a pro day makes you nervous to draft him??
I want a fall Saturday in Ohio Stadium..
I said sort of nervous... and yes.... if the reporting is accurate that he's skipping the pro day...
I'm bashing Joey for missing games ( holdout and what most people would call cautious injuries). Joey hasn't had the JJ Watt season ending type stuff.. Most people believe the Bosa camp is just VERY cautious when it comes to injuries... Again NOT BLAMING THEM ONE BIT for being cautious.... my point was as a GM that sort of stuff would make me sort of nervous... If I'm drafting a guy top 5 I want 64+ games out of that dude before the next contract. Joey is most likely going to play under 50 games those first 4 years.. close to a full missing season.
Different strokes I guess.. I'd rather take the gamers... the guys who say any time any place...
And I've never thought of a pro day as a chance to get injured.. it's a workout with people watching... 99% of the time the guys who get injured at pro days or combines either aren't training right or can't control the emotion of the day.. more often then not you don't want those dudes anyway.. I don't think either of those things would be a problem for Nick so show up do the workout and move on..
Sitting out the pro day because he doesn’t have anything else to prove, and will only likely lower his stock at the pro day if something is not as good.
Where would he have the possibility to improve? If he can’t make things better, why risk not being “quite as good” at the pro day?
You enjoying those huge year for Poppy fields out there?
It doesn't matter whether you're the lion or a gazelle-when the sun comes up, you'd better be running.
You enjoying those huge year for Poppy fields out there?
They’ve been amazing. The Poppyapocalypse!
While I wish I could go out and see them in person, I’ll have to survive with photos this year.
The holdout was almost universally blamed on management. This was not a situation of a player holding out for some ridiculous sum of money. The contracts are slotted now anyway and there isn't much leeway. The cheap Chargers tried to add offset language to the deal and have his signing bonus split up. No other #3 overall or higher pick has had that type of language in their deal under the current NFL CBA.
Then the team tried to use its social media and PR to blame the holdout on Bosa. It was a crazy way to treat a player they want to be a cornerstone of their franchise. So if you wonder why Bosa may make sure he's 100% in coming back from injury some of it is probably because he doesn't trust Chargers management at all due to how they treated him from the jump.
I'm a big Joey Bosa fan, and I now watch Chargers games with interest because of Bosa. Having said that, I agree with everything TCM posted here. Joey Bosa has become injury prone, it's just that simple, and being injury prone, no matter how elite the talent, is a red flag to GMs negotiating future contracts. If you can't stay on the field, then it doesn't matter if you run 4.49 forty, have the best technique in the league, and are as strong as an ox, because you spend far too much time on the bench. This has been Joey's career so far. Can that change? Absolutely, but until if and/or when it actually does change, he can demand more money than any non QB in the league all he wants, he's not going to get it.
When I die, sprinkle my ashes over the 70's
Closet log-in for the Bengal's GM ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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I was harsh on Murray for not performing at the combine. I think bosa should try to improve his 40 time and take this time to improve his game as a pass rusher.
40 times at the Pro Day are useless. They're not laser timed so suddenly everyone's running a 4.3.
Not to mention, there are far more useful events that scouts will be looking at for a DE like the 3 cone and the shuttle run.
If Bosa were to run a 4.3 at the Pro Day, it'd be pretty damned special... but he still won't go higher than #1 overall.
Ya look at Rashan Gary. He runs fast but barely makes plays on the field.
Ya look at Rashan Gary any Michigan defender in the last 20 years....he barely makes plays on the field.
Fixed it for you
Diehard Eagles fan here.
Brandon Graham and I would like a word with you. :-)
Cmon really? I get it but you're way off. Brandon Graham, Ty Law, Woodson, and lots more that had solid careers.
Woodson falls outside that 20 year stretch. I don't remember any others making plays against Ohio Sate...
I thought he meant in the pros.
Only thing that matters is what they do vs Michigan or Ohio State. Nothing else matters.
+1 because this wasn't even remotely close to a DVable offense
Should I feel bad because at first look I read this as he was going to pro day somewhere else (away from C-bus)?
Man, offseason...you are indeed a bastard.
I think Nick Bosa's resume stands strong as is.
There he goes quitting on OSU again.
That hot take's been overused so much it's just soggy leftovers.
Here's a better one: since Haskins is leaving twice the number of eligible seasons on the table, he's double the quitter that Bosa is. Discuss.
Or maybe Urban is the ultimate quitter?
Couldn't even fulfill the contract he signed smdh
Never got that tattoo, either.
Fields of Dreams
Couldn't coach at USC if he did. Just saying
USC is a dumpster fire of a program right now thanks to Helton. Why would Urban think that job would be an improvement over OSU? USC hasn't been an elite program since Pete Carroll.
My remark was sarcastic...should have used the proper italics or symbol.
Very doubtful UFM is heading west anytime soon and nor would I want him to.
Not to get off subjective sarcasm as a topic, but Meyer wouldn't have to deal with being railroaded by his University president at USC.
No just endless scandal's that USC is always involved with, literally they are involved in a scandal about every other month. He can report to Lynn Swann who has had calls for his resignation and are getting louder, now USC is involved with the cheating scandal of kids "faking" their way into the school. USC is a dumpster fire with people throwing gas on it weekly. I wouldn't go anywhere near that place
"it matters not how strait the gate, How charged with punishments the scroll, I am the master of my fate: I am the captain of my soul.
Wanna bet? You must really think very little of OSU as a whole to believe that they are the only school in the country that railroads their own employees. People like Michael Drake exist at all large Universities. Not to mention if Meyer were to repeat the same mistakes he made with ZS at USC the reception he'd get there from the administration would probably be just as harsh.
Sure whats the bet? You alright boss, I'm just havin fun in here talking about hypotheticals, you seem real serious about this. I don't think very little of OSU, I think very little of Drake. I think very little of ZS. I think the whole thing was shit. I think Meyer would be fine at USC. I think he loves him some nepotism. I think his pride was his fall at OSU. I can go on, but that's not much fun and its offseason, better things to argue about like cargo shorts.
Why would that be, because maybe Meyer would better manage one of his position Coaches or would he maybe lend more credence to the AD’s suggestion to fire said under performing position coach.
I know this isn’t the Unpopular Opinion post, but I don’t subscribe to the ole’ Meyer was railroaded pitch.
because USC is a better from a coaching standpoint:
#1 Private university so you don't have to deal with all of the public information requests, etc. The Zach Smith thing could have been handled an order of magnitude more internally. The press doesn't have access to all of your emails and texts etc. This alone has to sound like a breath of fresh air for someone who is looking to destress
#2 Money partly because of #1, USC can pay him more, their donor base is richer and the university never has to face backlash because his otherworldly contract will have been too much of a focus on athletics. The number and details will be super high and stay private. He can negotiate a much better deal.
#3 Recruiting is 10x easier. He can stay in-state and put together an all-time rated recruiting class
#4 the pac-12 is at its bottom... less pressure = better for meyer while he rebuilds and can do so without risking his epic win-loss record
#5 better climate... the older you get the more important this gets
#6 A program's current on-field eliteness does not translate to its coaching job eliteness. USC is THE top job in the world of college football from that standpoint. Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, anyone... can put together something better at USC than they could at any other school largely because of it's recruiting position.
#7 Specifically for Urban, he can go to USC without risking his OSU legacy. If he comes back to OSU ever the pressure is too high. OSU he will always care the most about I think. And his 7-0 and win% are things he doesn't want to risk.
#8 If I was Meyer I would want to end with more NCs than Saban. This is his best chance.
#9 Urban is a great role model for young men, why not keep doing that if he can
#10 I think he is addicted to coaching, I think the draw of the USC job, the top job imho in CFB, will be too great
#11 If Urban ends now people will always associate the end of his coaching tenure with the Zach Smith scandal. People remember you how they last saw you, sadly. And I don't think he wants that to be him being forced out because of something stupid someone else did.
#12 I think Urban just needs a break. His win % is super high and I think we are realizing that just comes at a cost... if you push yourself that hard that long to get to that level you have to take some breaks every now and then.
Buckshots... always there for you if you missed the news last month
I agree with some of that, but I would argue that Bama is positioned better than both from a recruiting standpoint (not that it’s every really hurt us). And it’s almost mathematically impossible for Meyer to win more NCs than Saban at this point. Lastly, Urbans had a spotty reputation nationally even before the ZS scandal (mostly due to Hernandez and his Florida day’s). So it’s not like a stint at USC would wash it all clean.
#13 Urban's going to watch his son play baseball for the next 4-5 years or longer if he gets a shot at professional ball. Near 0% chance he takes ANY cfb job during this time span.
He coached while his daughters played sports.
I mean, even if he was coaching USC his schedule would be pretty clear from April through July. That’s a lot of baseball games.
A head coach at a D1 school doesn’t have down time....maybe 2weeks per year.
In response to #7 I think if Urban goes to USC and does better than he did at OSU (more Natties for example) his reputation here will be tainted. People who follow OSU will absolutely hold a grudge against him for that and feel like he didn't give it his all at OSU (the school he claims to love most of all) in comparison to his time at USC and Florida. I mean, hell, he gave the Gators two Natties and Florida fans still hold a grudge against him to this day for leaving. I think if he goes to USC he might have to be prepared to sever his relationship with OSU permanently. Not to mention him taking the USC job is bad for OSU in one major way. Guys still involved in OSU football like Marotti, Pantoni, Alford, and LJ are all hige risks to be poached out to So Cal by Urban which would subsequently screw over Day and the current OSU regime.
I don't think Meyer would touch it with a ten foot pole. Then again, you said dumpster fire at USC. There has never been a better "fireman" for dumpster fires in CF history....than Urban Meyer. Just sayin......
I can't remember what state the Florida football program was in when Meyer took the job (I know the Ron Zook years prior to Meyer were not good) but taking over USC in the state it's in now won't be like Meyer taking over OSU in 2012. The OSU team that Meyer inherited despite going 6-7 in 2011 was only one season removed from the Tressel era and still had quite a bit of a talent that Meyer was able to put to use (including a QB in Braxton Miller who was a perfect fit for his read-option offense). USC currently is a season removed from the Sam Darnold era (realistically he made the team look a lot better than they actually were) and Helton's recruiting classes have been beyond subpar in the last year. Meyer would be inheriting a team devoid of a lot of talent and likely would experience struggles during his first season on the job at least (and we all know Meyer is one of those coaches who doesn't take losing well). The OSU situation in 2012 was different because OSU didn't really experience much of a recruiting drop-off when Tattoogate happened (they had a few players like Kyle Kalis decommit but for the most part the team remained intact).
Or maybe he's concerned he might reinjure himself and cost himself millions in the process. Just stop. This decision has nothing to do with OSU and everything to do with protecting his body and not over-exerting himself.
Cant stop, wont stop.
Montana Silver Bullet
If you're going to post sarcasm use the font for it (it was not used above). The reality is I've seen enough angry posts about Bosa sitting out last season this past year to know that some OSU fans would not be above attacking his loyalty to OSU over this business decision to protect himself and not work out at OSU's Pro Day. Based on what we know about the Bosas they seem like an overly cautious bunch so this move doesn't really surprise me.
Sometimes sarcasm is so thick you don’t need the obvious.
Kyler Murray is meeting with Kingsbury and the Cards' GM today @ OU.
Please NFL give us Browns @ Cards for the opening Sunday or Monday Night Football!!!
I knew it, he's not a real Buckeye!!!
Seriously, there is nothing for him to gain from Pro Day. Enjoy draft day Nick, and get ready for NFL camps.
Can't blame him. I would probably advise Parris, Terry, and Dwayne (unless he wants to put a sub-5 40 out there) to do likewise.
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
Is he at least going to show up and grant the world a look at his magnificence, ride the golf cart and support the university and his teammates? Grab a beer with his old coaches?
That actually sounds like a good time. I don't know about Nick, but I'm in for that.
What's the point of him working out at the pro day? Murray didn't really participate at the Combine and some now most people think he will go #1. No point of risking injury
Pro Day is something a program does for its players - those who didn't get invited to the combine and those who didn't perform as well at the combine as they thought they could - and NOT the other way around. Each player makes his own evaluation of the risk/reward for participating, s it should be.
Bosa definitely needs to work out at the pro day. I've always looked at him as more of a thrower anyway, so this would be his chance to shine with his own WRs to throw to.
AKA the Horseshoe, the Shoe, and the House That Harley Built
At worst. Atttttttt worst he is a top 5 pick. This while coming off an injury ended season. Nick going through drills again will not change things one bit. Again at worst he top 5 but in all reality he is top 2 regardless. He has nothing to prove.
It would be nice for him to show up and pal around with his teammates and support them even if not he's going to work out Perhaps that is his intention, an action to show that his words are not hollow.
Bosa didn't show that he's the greatest athlete ever with his 40 time, and broad jump and all that, but who cares?
In the on-field drills, IMO (and I am not a pro scout) he looked head and shoulders above his peers I his fluidity and understanding of movement, hand placement, and hand usage.
That to me tells the story that Bosa needed to tell, his 40 time doesn't matter, and why should it?
Good move by Bosa IMO.
Urban Meyer left an incredible legacy. 12/4/18 Ryan Day begins his.
Perhaps there was just too much pain, to many bad memories associated with this injury and that didn't allow him to support his peeps.