Jerry’s not wrong, but good for Minnesota for finally having a coach with a pulse.
Kill is not wrong, and had the Gophers on an upward trend before his unfortunate health issues. Fleck is a narcissistic attention seeker like Lane Kiffin and Kliff Kingsbury. If you are the type of person to whom that vibe appeals to-good for you. The rest of the populace says "Thank you Coach Kill!"
I wonder how honest the perspective is versus how much of it is built in the bias of resentment surrounding how PJ is trying to rebuild the program.
I don't know much about how PJ treats his own guys, but clearly Jerry doesn't like how his former players were getting the short end of the stick. Regardless, I would think that a new coach should use just about whatever tactic they need to (within reason) so that they can get that boat rowing in the right direction - or whatever non-Fleckian analogy you'd prefer.
*looks for Minnesota equivalent of guy eating popcorn gif*
Ah, here we go
"get your mid-November snowy outdoor ice cream cones ready"
Fleck looks at the gif and realizes what a tiny oar Dilly Bar Dan is holding.
Ha, that just made ny night.
Somehow, "Lick the Sticks" just doesn't have the same cachet.
Whatever floats your rowboat
The original Dilly Dilly.
He's not nearly about himself as he is about competitive rowing.
I had to run away high, so I wouldn't come home low...
I read that Kill and Fleck got into it on the recruiting trail awhile ago and they basically hate each other now.
It's Minnesota. I'm meh as long as they lose to us.
Nothing cleanses the soul like a no call pass interference.
Golden Gophers you say - I remember watching this video awhile ago.
Go get'em Cal Poppy - we are behind you !!
It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.
I STILL can't believe Hayden, Luther and Dauber let that happen!
SCPO, USN (ret)
That's a few years before my time. Amazing.
That's a few years before my time.
And now I feel old, thanks.
Shandy is not beer
I know, right?
This is a forum post from a site member. It does not represent the views of Lamplighter LLC unless otherwise noted.
peidiwch â ffycin gyda'r Cymry
I listened to that game on the radio while driving to Erie, PA to meet the wife. I was midway through the Cuyahoga Valley National Recreation Area (now the Cuyahoga Valley National Park) with around 8 or 9 minutes to play in the first quarter. Throwing common sense and good judgment out the window, I throttled up and wantonly ignored the cursed double nickel national speed limit. I made it to our hotel in Erie in time to watch a decent portion of the second half. I believed they could come back and I was willing to pay a speeding ticket to get to a television to see it.
Bobbing for french fries.
Kill also said he would never step foot on Minnesota's campus again after they fired Tracy Claeys. Claeys' players were talking about boycotting their bowl game to support their 10 teammates accused of sexual assault, and Claeys told the University he supported them doing so.
Yep Claeys' stupidity got him fired. Not a good look for Kill protesting Minnesota for doing the right thing.
Fleck is a lover of himself. It is what it is. Not my style, but some people like him I guess.
The "Row the Boat" slogan tells me all I need to know about PJ. A B10 football program is about the tradition, not some gimmicky branding that will not last a decade. If I were a Gopher fan I would be pissed off. Minnesota football has been around for more than 100 years and this guy hasn't done much at all yet, other than two seasons in the MAC.
PJ believes he IS the program but the fanbase was around long before him, and it will still be around long after once he is done passing through. It is a lose-lose for Minny, he will most likely fail and be fired or put together a couple of nice years and bolt.
Minnesota football has been around for more than 100 years
Minnesota still has the third-most national championships in the Big Ten, incredibly. From a perspective of a guy who hasn't even seen 30, it's shocking. The 1930s were a great time for Minnesota lol.
I haven't paid much attention to Fleck, honestly, but I still think bringing the boat slogan with him is extremely bizarre. Can everything be a rowing analogy?
Not just bringing it, but paying to bring it...
Not just like him. Some OSU fans actually wanted him to come here as HC as opposed to Day taking over once the Urban Meyer retirement rumors started heating up. I personally don't see the appeal. Yeah, he's an energetic guy but so far he's been very meh at Minnesota. I'm not convinced he would've been successful here.
Absolutely nothing against the OP, but WHO CARES!?
"We gotta go win this next game and make the State of Ohio proud!"-UFM
I cared. You don't often hear the former coach of a prominent sports team tell the whole world that the current coach is a narcissistic prick.
Is FieldsofJreams a Burley Oak reference?
If Ann Arbor is a whore, what's Harbaugh for going back to her?
Fields of (D)("J"ustin)reams. Called my shot with him on Dec. 27th when he was still just a dream.
Why would someone downvote me for answering a question only I could possibly know the answer to??
My phone notified me of an article about this last night, I clicked, found it slightly interesting. Does it effect anything at all in my life? Nope. Will I remember this in a week, probably not.
Apparently everyone who agreed with him in this thread.
I'm glad our coaches get along.
Tom Brady lost to John Cooper. Never forget.
Love that picture, so awesome when your worst coaches are still hall of farmers.
I'm glad our coaches get along.
Something tells me Ed Warriner, Tim Beck, Alex Grinch, Ev Withers, and Mike Vrabel might have a differing opinion on that.
That aside, this is a really bad, bad look by Jerry Kill. Isn't he the guy with the seizure disorder? Regardless, a bad look.
Something tells me Ed Warriner, Tim Beck, Alex Grinch, Ev Withers, and Mike Vrabel might have a differing opinion on that.
Don't care, don't care, don't care, don't care, yeah that's unfortunate.
Didn't Grinch leave for a significantly better pay check? Withers I don't recall if he was fired or whatever, but he was a HC somewhere else wasn't he? And didn't Vrabel go coach in the NFL? Just curious why they'd have anything to say, seems like reasonable terms. (Wither being the one in question for me bc I don't recall what happened with him.)
Vrabel has no issues with OSU. He just prefers coaching in the NFL to college. From what I hear Vrabel is not big on the recruiting aspect of CFB. Also he and Fickell are really close friends.
Since my post raised a few eyebrows, I'll explain.....with a bit of sarcasm thrown in:
Warriner and Beck knew they were gone before the Clemson debacle; I seriously doubt their meetings with Meyer leading up to the post season were all that harmonious. Beck stood and answered reporters' questions while everyone else bolted -- he quite likely knew he was gone and was headed back to Texas. Warriner.....went from coaching at Ohio State to winding up at Michigan in a few short years. I doubt that he and Urban Meyer exchange Christmas cards any longer. Withers? Widely seen as one of Meyer's hiring mistakes....although yes, he landed nicely at James Madison upon leaving. Grinch? Either thought he was sold a bill of goods...or was just the victim of bad luck when Schiano did not leave. At any rate, he mailed in the season and clearly wasn't coming back, Ohio roots notwithstanding. Vrabel? A lifelong friend of Luke's, no doubt. Since he is in the NFL, I am sure that he and Meyer are on good terms now. But the rumors about the two of them while at OSU were pretty vivid in terms of animosity.
To be fair the two years under Urban that Vrabel was at OSU the defense was really bad. So bad that Meyer was actually sitting in on defensive meetings towards the end of 2013 (which from what I've heard rarely happens). When you are not performing up to par it's going to create tension among the staff (no doubt it did just that with Schiano and Grinch last year). I think if Vrabel had elected to stay after 2013 instead of bouncing to the NFL he and Urban would've been just fine when Ash came in the following season and turned things around. But him leaving WAS a blessing in disguise because Meyer replaced him with LJ.
Vrabel loves OSU
If somehow Woody had gotten into that picture it would have been perfect. Great shot as it is (other than Fickell looking at the ground).
I can only agree that it was messed up how Tracy Claeys was let go. After that, it just sounds like sour grapes and Jerry has way too much time on his hands now. Fleck did all of this at WMU and he was bound to bring his culture with him when he took the job. I would bet half of the people ripping him for this now were all about it when he was at WMU.
Kill has very little room to complain about sideline antics.
You aren't taking shots at epileptic seizures are you?
Proudly dispensing unbridled arrogance since 1983.
Maybe referring to the ice cream thing he was eating where it looks like he shoots a look at a camera.
That, uh, wasn't Jerry Kill.
When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.
If this is what he is referring to, I’m quite sure this is Jerry Kill
I am absolutely positive this is not Jerry Kill.
Memes are funny, a sizable minority on 11W still thinks this is Kill.
Also shows the irrelevance of Minnesota football. What random B10 fan doesn't remember what Tressell or Hoke looked like?
Funny, I was one who thought it was Kill.
The more you know . . .
"Because the rules won't let you go for three." - Woody Hayes
THE Ohio State University
Yeah.. I wasn't aware Jerry was very animated on the sidelines. The only distraction is of course his seizures. Being that I have them.. not exactly something you can control or want someone to think is an attempt at a distraction.
How firm thy friendship..
I refer to Fleck as "Magoo". He seems like a cartoon character come to life and not in a good way.
I've been saying this the second I saw him do it at Western. He's what 'scrappy try hard gym rat ' guy looks like if he were a coach.
If Fleck can get Minny to start beating Wisky, TTUN, etc. on a regular basis, and all the nay-sayers suddenly go away.
I will be the one to side with P.J. Fleck on this. Has anyone ever watched his interview behind the whole "row the boat" story? I can see people may think it seems gimmicky, but it is very well thought out. A lot of coaching is about leadership, and that is what Fleck try's to specialize in with his team. Dabo Swinney does a pretty decent job with a similar attitude. He may not run up and down the sidelines, but there are a lot of similarities between the two personality wise.
I agree. Lots of shots taken at Fleck.....Kill's was in horrible taste. Unless someone knows something I don't, if I had a son, I'd damn sure let him play for Fleck.
Its going to take a guy with Flecks personality to flip the switch at Minny. Kill is just being bitter. Not your program anymore old man, you had your chance.
It doesn't matter whether you're the lion or a gazelle-when the sun comes up, you'd better be running.
Crazy thing about this is Fleck was an asst for Kill for 2 years at Northern Illinois in 2008 and 2009 as a WR coach and in the 2nd year he added the title of Recruiting Coordinator
Kill still has sour grapes over Claeys firing and is bad mouthing Fleck for no good reason.
The team has gotten better under Fleck going 5-7/2-7 year 1 and 7-6/3-6 year 2 winning 4 of their last 6 including a bowl win
Or maybe he knows Fleck's true personality and you don't? Did you even listen to the interview, he said Fleck has changed since he worked for him. It was also rumored that PJ was sleeping around w/ married women at WMU. For me 1+1=2.
2014 & 2013 8-5
Trying to solve for 2 here, but Im not getting there with your logic. Opinions and Rumors amount to nothing. If so think about where this program would be...
I form educated opinions based on the correlating available data. Kill's interview was the lid on the coffin for me on what I think about PJ.
Kill's opinion on PJ is worth more than all others to me. Your opinion on Fleck is completely irrelevant.
My opinion is irrelevant enough for you to respond to me though.
Also not a fan of PJ leaving his first family and wife for his secretary. Now that fact is not an opinion (my interpretation of it is) or rumor.
So really this has nothing to do with Minnesota, and everything to do with your destain for Fleck. I see you’re making a lot friends here since December by telling everyone you don’t care about their opinions and what not. Keep that up sport, you’ll continue to see all those downvotes you don’t care about.
You sure know a lot about me, been doing your research?
If by research you mean clicking on your profile after continually seeing you make comments about other people’s opinions sure I guess so. I did my research, but if you don’t care, don’t comment. I’m irrelevant remember?
You are getting way too emotional, this is the internet sir, it doesn't actually exist. I get a kick out of you down-voting every single one of my recent posts.
So really this has nothing to do with Minnesota
Why would I care about the Gophers, I am a Buckeye homer? If PJ were the coach here his Row the Boat gimmick would piss me off.
your destain for Fleck
Look around the internet, a lot of football fans throughout the country are not buying what PJ is selling. I can seperate off and on the field, and I happen to dislike him from afar (might not if I knew him personally) and I don't think he is a legit big-time coach.
My opinion is irrelevant enough for you to respond
I didn't say your opinions are irrelevant. In proper context I said it is specifically irrelevant in regards to PJ's persona in comparision to his former colleague's opinion (unless you worked with him like Jerry Kill has).
telling everyone you don’t care about their opinions
Never said that, I am always open to intellectual debate. I often end up changing my opinions in due-time based on others reasoning. Sometimes I might take offense to others inserting a grey opinion in the place of a black/white fact.
continually seeing you make comments about other people’s opinions
Isn't that what every conversation centers on, either aggreeing or disagreeing on a subject? Go Bucks or Bucks suck!
you’ll continue to see all those downvotes you don’t care about
I don't care about them, they are silly like a teenage girl. If my goal was not to get down-voted, I would never say anything disaggreeable.
TL;DR big guy.
You sure had time to begin a rough draft on a research paper about me.
Bye whoever you are.
No don’t go, we were just starting to have fun.
I was and now I am not, once I realized you have the emotional capacity of a child.
What kind of child are we talking about? Stop editing your posts to get more shots in, just be put it all together before hitting save. Stick with me pup I’ll teach ya thing or two.
You're coming off pretty strong for someone who's been here short of two months. Noticed the same in your Juwan Johnson post.
You get along as you go along, friend...how about dialing it down a bit.
Many, it appears, don’t understand hyperbole, sarcasm or even just a different take. Not only true here, but also in classrooms across the country.
Fleck was sleeping around w/ the wife of a major WMU donor, a member of the family that owns the Stryker Corp.-medical equipment firm that is THE civic employer in Kalamazoo.
Fleck is all show. He took over a bowl team and in his first year, didn't make a bowl. Then in his second year, had to upset Purdue to get bowl eligible. He's out here rowing a boat while OSU, ttun, MSU, PSU, Wisky are flying jet planes.
I’d say you’re probably taking crazy pills if you thought that he’d be flying with the likes of those teams by the end of his second year. At WMU he went 1-11, 8-5, 8-5, 13-1. When you have his personality and coaching style, you need to have your players in the system that are going to buy in.
his second year, had to upset Purdue to get bowl eligible
Fair enough, but didn't he also have a walk-on true freshman as his starting QB?
The guy had two recruiting classes and couldn't sign a scholarship QB better than a frosh walk-on. Who's fault is that?
Never known Jerry Kill to throw shade at anyone. Ouch.
"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine
Stay golden, Ponyboy.
Fleck was a Julian Edelman type as a player and lasted a couple years in the NFL. He was a GA under Tress in 2006 to start his coaching career. It has to be tough coaching at "other" UM school in the B1G. Not sure what Coach Kill's real issue is here. I'm rooting for Coach Fleck.
“Being average means you are as close to the bottom as you are to the top.” John Wooden
First time I ever heard of PJ was when WMU came to OSU and they showed his pregame speech. It was corny and manufactured. First reaction was that he was fake. Still think he's fake.
Idk why you think it's fake, WMU ran through the MAC when he was there, led the conference in recruiting every year he was there, and now Minnesota's last two classes were better than any under Kill.
I have the same memory and first impression he did and boy did I think it was over the top and contrived too. At first I tbought it was just a one time thing, playing it up for the big game cameras but we all quickly learned from the ESPN special feature bandwagon all about the cult of Fleck.
Sorry, but I've been around enough fake people in my time to have a relatively calibrated BS Meter. It was the same for many others around these parts after that game.
If it were a one time thing...then it would of been fake
Seems to me like Fleck has a ton of passion, and he's got some fire in his belly, but I haven't paid a ton of attention to Minnesota football (neither has anyone else).
Urban Meyer left an incredible legacy. 12/4/18 Ryan Day begins his.
Ok.. So “Row the Boat” is bad and “Bring the Juice” or even “The Grind” is good.. Got it! Thanks
“Right now, Michigan is not at the pinnacle of college football, and that’s all Urban Meyer cares about...He’s been there and knows what it takes to get there.”
No one had "Bring the Juice" or "The Grind" printed on our unis - collars, stripe on the pants, and helmet.
All that ROW stuff seems to be about him and seems to make him the center of attention. I can't believe he changed WM's unis into boat rowing and stuff and now he's doing it to Minnesota. THEY'RE THE GOPHERS COACH, not a crew team.
Pretty sure neither of those slogans was trademarked so it could be taken to their next coaching stop either.
I Hate Michigan.
The next two years will be important for Fleck, not so much about what he's doing as the B1G West has significantly upgraded their coaching ranks with Brohm, Frost, and whatever Locksley can do in College Park. He's not the shiny new thing anymore.
That running up and down the sidelines is sheer craziness...everyone knows what works is slogans and wristbands.
If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear.
He's gonna blow a knee or something when he gets tangled up with something or someone, intentional or not. Just ask JT Barrett.
This isn't very Minnesota Nice.
Lifetime vs. UM: L 8-1, C 7-0, T 4-0
You've seen Fargo-when Minnesota Nice blows up, it blows up!!!!!!!
True. Even Minnesota Nice has its limits.
I saw thru PJ Fleck’s from the very beginning. First impression of this guy was, “he’s a phony.”
fake enthusiasm, obnoxious mantras, just a total doucher from the get-go. I never once thought he was one of the bright up & comers in the coaching profession, not for one second.
I don't necessarily think he's a phony, but he himself has admitted that he's not for everybody. I am one of those that couldn't take that act for too long.
If you go by 247 recruiting rankings, Fleck's last two recruiting classes has been on average about 15 spots higher than Kill's last two class at Minnesota. I personally don't see why there is any hate for Fleck, but people are gonna hate, he's definitely bringing a better caliber athlete to Minnesota than Kill was. Not to mention Minnesota absolutely blew out Wisconsin in their rivalry game.
I don't think anyone is criticizing the results. I think they're criticizing whether he's genuinely for the players or for himself. I think his antics are phony and just serve to increase his personal profile. He loves the spotlight
I don’t think anyone on this board knows him well enough to make that assumption. There’s worse people to be hating on, but hey haters will hate
Totally agree with those above that call Fleck a phony and a narcissist. He and James Franklin - dunno how anyone can think they’re genuine and want to play for them. They’re used car salesmen.