This group has gone from a deficiency to a major strength, in less than two years. I wonder what’s changed??
Feed the trolls
That which shall not be named.
Urban Meyer >Jim Harbaugh for ever and ever, Amen. 0
^ This is the correct answer. The WRs were very meh last year. Campbell is a good example. This year, I'm realizing just how much the team will miss him.
What's changed? Well, Hartline actually knows how to play/coach football.
Yes, Cincy, Campbell is an excellent example. He had so much speed, but also so many dropped passes.
I noted his intensity and determination were higher in the Big 10 champ game. And it showed in his stats. Did you too?
Ua Mau ke Ea o ka 'Aina I ka Pono. The life of the land is preserved in righteousness. (Hawai'i state motto) Aloha nui kakou.
Aren’t you and Cindy cute. Notes his determination bhaha
I also would throw in him who shall be named: Haskins
^ this is the actual correct answer. It was not Zach Smith holding the receivers back. It was an offense and a QB that weren't geared towards utilizing them. For many many years. (Mike Thomas... 3rd team all conference?! *vomits*)
"...and when we win the game, we'll buy a keg of booze. And we'll drink to old Ohio till we wobble in our shoes."
While I don't think that the Coach did anyone any favors, Haskins was the biggest difference here. We haven't had this accurate a passer since Troy Smith, Joe Germaine? Uncoincidentally, also the last times receivers were a strength on the team..... Next year will be different regardless of the names on the WR roster.
Right...non of this was Urban's fault
Hmm, That Which Shall Not Be Named and He Who Shall Not Be Named are both bald...
Number 1 rule in life: always beat That Team Up North.
Don't give him that much credit. At least Voldemort wasn't an immature douchebag.
"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine
And at least ZS hasn't completely lost his nose yet lol.
Experience. Dixon was injured the first 3 years, Campbell couldn't catch, Mclaurin wasn't really a speedster and more of a possession wr which led him at times to getting bottled up.
All Hail Urbz
You make a couple good points. But... Olave wasn’t experienced. And he looked all world when he stepped in for Mack. I’m giving Haskins 75%of the credit here.
Got to give Hartline some credit. We've seen position groups regress with a year of sub par position coaching. WRs definitely improved this year. There is a reason he was retained.
Did WR's improve? Or did we just start actually utilizing them consistently?
I put most of the WR success on a throw first QB and a new offense built around that. Hartline didn't take our WR's from mediocrity to setting school records in just 6 short weeks before the season started.
All I know is that they got better. But your contention is sound. I guess we will see the full results of an offseason this year.
Did WR's improve? Or did we just start actually utilizing them consistently? YES. A QB who was willing and able to put the ball 'on time and on target' was a big part; but a coach who inspired and created confidence due to his own body of work and proven success at getting 'the little things' right helped also. Saw guys go from 'body catchers' to 'hand snatchers' this year. That's coaching. Routes were crisp. Coaching. So YES.
There were a lot less drops this year. No way Haskins has the completion percentage record without vast improvement from the wide receiver group. JT was not have been the passer Haskins is, but he had receivers that were not nearly as good as they were this year. I give credit to improvement in coaching. Not all the credit, but it certainly helped.
I don’t know what the numbers are for this year, but the idea that a lot of JT’s passes were dropped was a major misconception.
As you can see here, his dropped pass rate was actually quite low.
Not that anyone cares, but I humbly agree w giving Hartline some credit. There were multiple times when different commentators mentioned the route running of our WRs. Did experience help? Sure. But so did Hartline.
“For me, this is who we are. We have a culture. We work at it very hard. And we’re efficient at it.” - Coach Day
I’d say it’s a combination of several factors mentioned above, and a few unmentioned, which made the whole greater than the sum of the individual parts.
1) Different coach with NFL experience as a WR.
2) Different QB throwing to the receivers. Throw first mentality on RPOs vicerun first
3) Different offensive playcalling that provided more opportunities for the receivers. Partly to do with the QB and partly with the WRs getting better.
4) Exeprience. Lots of time on the Juggs machine for Campbell and others. One extra year of collegiate football effectively doubles a player’s experience. That’s huge.
5) Different quality of defenses played from ‘17 to ‘18.
6) A group of highly talented backups pushing the starters to perform, or potentially be replaced.
"You beat cancer by how you live, why you live, & in the manner in which you live.
So, live. Live. Fight like hell. And when you get too tired to fight then lay down and rest and let somebody else fight for you. "
- Stuart Scott
B-but... I want to attribute it all to just ONE factor.
Analytical: It might still be mostly due to ONE factor. Navy did not weight the multiple factors. Am I too analytical?
I forgot the sarcasm font. As with most things in life, an interplay of factors creates the outcome.
Navy: Esp #4.
Haskins played 1 meaning quarter in 2017 with the first team players, forth qtr against Mich. After JT went 3 for 8 for 30 yards in 3 qtrs. of play, Haskins, with no experience went 5 for 6 for 96 yards in 1 qtr. Project that over an entire game and he throws for nearly 400 yards, against the best defensive team OSU played that year. This was with Zach Smith as receiver coach, same receivers, play calling, O line etc. that JT had. Simply, change at QB only. Haskins proved that was no one hit wonder, he did it in every game this year. The receiver production was the same in 2017 and 2018 when "Haskins" played. He was the only reason.
"I feel ready for whatever awaits me on the other side. I don’t fear adversity. I don’t fear the spotlight. I don’t fear success. And I don’t fear failure." - Braxton Miller
In all honesty i am sure its many things not just one. Haskins as a generational tallent, Hartline is a much better wr coach, WRs maturing, Day calling plays. No need to diminish any aspect of the improvement we can all just be grateful for what we had the luxery or watching and hope it continues!
barrett, for all his positives, couldn't hit receivers in stride - haskins could. the receivers last year were the same receivers that barrett had - and look at the difference haskins made.
i hope fields can play next year - him at qb with olave, wilson, hill and mccall on the field at the same time is my dream!
I trust that Day wont give the receivers get the Michael Thomas treatment by running the QB 30 times a game as opposed to throwing it to the playmakers on the outside. Pretty safe bet that we won't see any of that
With Martell and Dobbins you don't think they Buckeyes will run a healthy amount of read option?
Hoping to see more RPO and less Read Option in the coming years. Mobile QB's are the 'normal' at OSU. Running QB's not so much in the RD era. You gotta be able to sling the rock to stick around. But you also gotta be able to read defenses, make adjustments, handle pressure AND get the ball out effectively to the receivers; and know when to hand off or take off. Elite 11 only shows us a small part of the QB job description; the rest we find out under pressure from opposing defenses. Gonna be an interesting Spring/Summer.
Funny thing about that - before Haskins started, Barrett set school and conference records for ‘slinging the rock’, yet many want to put the blame for poor receiver stats/performance on him.
There are differences between career records and season records and there was also a difference between his RS Fr year and his remaining years.
Feel free to check out OSU’s Season Passing leaders. Numbers 4, 5 and 7 might surprise you.
Want to talk single season TDs? Until this year, Barrett was number 1 (2017). Now he’s 2, 3 and tied for 9 on the list.
And actually, Barrett’s 2017 season had about 250 more yards than his 2014 season.
I guess I was focusing on the conference portion of your comment. Prior to Haskins, lighting up the OSU passing record book for a single season isn’t terribly impressive to me considering the traditional and relative lack of production by QBs at OSU.
Though, #4 is also a career stat.
JT was a great football player, but he wasn’t a technically great passer and I’m not going to blame the receivers for his woes.
So had we had a better receivers coach, Barrett would have been able to get the ball out on time and on target consistently?
Had Barrett’s receivers in 2017 been more experienced, especially PC, they might have had fewer drops. A different coach may have helped as well. Hard to say.
You have to admit, his completion percentage in 2014 was very good. Then QBgeddon and Tim Beck happened.
Barrett only got one year with day. Haskins benefitted from two.
I watched Haskins miss his share of receivers badly as well. You don’t get to the leader board like Barrett did by being as attrocious as you and some others like to make out. I’m not saying he was better than Haskins. But he was a damn good QB.
if martell is the qb, the passing game goes in the tank - so we BETTER be able to run the ball.
We'll have eight months to endlessly debate this issue, but I don't think that is fair or accurate regarding Tate. He is not going to sling it like Haskins, but neither has anyone else in the history of the B10. He was the national POY in his class, played at a top-level program, won HS Natty(s), and never lost a game. Oh, and he holds the single-game completion percentage record at OSU. I see no reason to assume that the world will come to an end if he wins the QB competition. The offense might look different than it did with Dwayne, but there's more than one way to skin a wolverine.
My aim, then, is to whip the Weasels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom. - William Tecumseh Sherman (with apologies)
Totally agree LC. I’m excited to have Fields, but let’s not count Tate out. He has a great history, is a total competitor and has two years of experience with Day and the Bucks playbook. Fields may have all the tools but he couldn’t beat out Fromm. Baldwin is still a mystery. This should be a great competition and no one should be surprised if Martell gets the nod. The competition will make them all better. Can’t wait.
I can't wait to see Hill, Mack, Olave, and Wilson on the field at the same time... talk about options!
DBs and their coaches will cry themselves to sleep thinking of that lineup!
I'd rather be an hour early than a minute late.
Dont forget Gill. He is probably the most explosive guy. #30 isnt bad either though more of an h.
The WR room is stocked full of talent and have a coach that will exploit it. Hoping those guys that have been injured can come back and make big impacts.
Just posting and hoping my comment isn’t deleted.
The WR room is stocked full of talent right now and have a coach that will exploit it.
The room is stocked full of talent right now but I have to think the room will become a little less crowded by the time the 2019 season gets here. There are too many talented players but not enough footballs to go around. While everyone in the WR room has to love the opportunities that come with Day's offense, some will be buried on the depth chart and likely transfer. The WR room will still be loaded with talent, it just won't be as crowded.
I agree that some of those guys will likely not be there when fall camp comes around.
I think the roster attrition the offseason always brings will come from the receivers and linebackers.
I hope it all works with everyone aboard, but that just isn't the reality.
Maybe, but there will be a lot of natural attrition after next year (4 seniors), so the WR room will be wide open in 2020. Hopefully the younger guys are willing to stick around.
I think the ones we see transferring are not the ones that we expect to be on the field: Hill, Mack, Victor, Olave, Wilson, Babb, Gill, maybe Blue. The others I could see going. But they also have to realize we are losing three more receivers after this year as well so room will open up.
To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift.
I think with wide receivers there tends to be more patience to waiting their turn/opportunity than say QBs. 3-5 positions available each offensive play. Injuries regularly causing some to miss a few to many games. I will be surprised if any of the young players transfer.
I don't buy one goddam drop of gas in the state of Michigan!
You may see a transfer or too, but with Hill, Mack, Victor, Saunders and McCall all gone after this coming year, that opens up another big window of opportunity in 2020. Anyone who leaves after this spring would have to sit out a year anyway.
And finally some size! Let's use that like Clemson.....
Right on! We just need a passer as talented as Trevor Lawrence... I think we may have one of those too!
Outside of the talent - guys are really going to have to assert themselves over summer and step up if they want the playing time. Perfect timing for Coach Yurcich to come on board.
Here we come dabo !!
It's not a rivalry .............. it's a wreckoning.
Seattle Sounders 2019 MLS Champions
To me Bin Victor is the big X factor. Hill, Olave, and Mack (assuming he's back healthy) make a great trio but if Victor can step up for a 4th threat, the O will take off. Too many times he disappeared from games last year. If he can even be just a little reliable (5 catches a game too much to ask?) watch out!
There are 5 guys on the roster who are eager to take catches away from Victor. Wilson, Babb, Gardiner, Harris, and Blue Smith.
I think Victor is what he is at this point and one of the other five will challenge him for touches. But at this point we're arguing catches for the 4th receiver... we've got a ridiculous amount of talent.
I don't think we've seen what Victor is yet. We've seen what he's capable of, but I don't think he's reached his ceiling. In fact, I'd call him a better pro prospect than Hill and Mack because of his size and athleticism.
He's a freak athlete that needs fine-tuning. If he can get better at blocking and learn how to run better routes, he'll be on the field a lot more.
He is similar in that way to Sheffield. They have all of the tangibles for their positions (size, speed, athleticism) but neither has reached their potential. That's not to say they won't, it would be great for us if they did. Might it be they are missing some intangibles?
This is what UFM kept saying about Victor. I was so ho hum (putting it kindly) about Campbell being the guy at the start of last season but he showed up his senior year. Hoping for that level of improvement for Victor next year.
Re: Victor: People were saying the same thing about McLauren, Campbell and Dixon two years ago and even a year ago. "Coaching up," which I truly think we're getting from Hartline, doesn't always happen immediately. I think that Wilson, at least, get's in the rotation in 2019, with the others getting their chance to step up in 2020.
In a year where our QB set records the #3 and #4 WR combined for 74 catches, I think 5 catches a game (70 catches in a season) is probably a big ask.
"Because I couldn't go for three."
BV has shown the potential to be phenominal, if he can just be more consistent.
Is there a more important aspect to the WR position than getting open and catching the ball? BV, for all his measurable, is inconsistent at jobs 1&2 of his position; don't be surprised if he gets passed over for a less talented, but more reliable receiver. Or, he does the work to improve and we have another high draft pick.
No, Urban A, I don't see Binjimin as the key X factor at either X, Y or Z. If Bin does not excel, he will be beaten out by 5-star Garrett. And even if Bin does improve, Garrett may still replace him.
Some really good guys in the wings too. One has to think they will get playing time a fair bit too, at least earlier in the season at any rate. Surprised to see Wilson so high on the depth chart, but he is a special talent.
It was necessary for KJ to come back. I'm glad he did. I think he will be as well when he is the true leader this year. I think he cracks 1000 yards next year and helps his draft stock. Knock on wood, right now this team has the perfect blend of leaders and young talent. It's not top or bottom heavy this year.
Agreed and we'll stated.
If the defense fixes the big play problem, and with the addition of Fields, I don't see how this team loses a game...and I don't say that lightly.
As a side note, I’m ready to see Jameson Williams’s speed with his mid 10 times in the 100, a la Ted Ginn and Paris Campbell.
CJ Saunders is a bad man i'm telling you
Yes. I see him and I see Gonzalez. But that’s just me. Also excited for Mack to get back. I know he had that one game, but he has great hands.
After watching the DB's struggle at times I was saddened he did not stay with the CB room and receive the training that Coombs was providing for a couple of those seasons - We are now so deep that he is a nice addition yet not necessary while this past season he could have really helped our troubled corners!
I would rather be on hand with 10 men then elsewhere with 10,000 - Timur Lenk
I actually forgot he was once a corner, he could have definitely got reps there. But the man catches everything that comes his way, a little better than Mack i'd say.
Will we ever run the ball?!
Should I change my username?
^^^^ HAHAHAHA ^^^^ I spit my coffee on my laptop!
Naw....it still takes rushing to set up passing most of the time.
I look for them to pass early and often to open the run.
I agree our wrs are gonna be good but don't i don't see them having even close to a year next year as this year. Haskins was a special once in a generation QB. Day will play to the strength of whichever QB wins the battle so unless it's Baldwin expect to pass for no more then 3500 yards next year. Fields and Tate are going to be running the ball way more so I expect at least 700 yards rushing from either QB and 1500 yards from Robbins. Better passing game then JTB but way less the DH.
Pain heals, chicks dig scars, glory lasts forever
Robbins? Baskin? Did we recruit an ice cream maker?
I like ice cream
‘Tis a sign. I fought the Handel’s urge yesterday. Looks like I’m caving today.
Stupid auto correct Lol!
I am sure Hartline deserves some credit as route running and other than Mack's 1 inexplicable game they were much more sure handed
But opening up the offense and Haskins ability to hit guys in stride also made their jobs much easier
Add in 1 more year of experience and boom all is well
Even the RBs got better as between Dobbins, Weber and McCall this year they caught 56 balls for nearly 490 yards and 3 scores while last year that same trio caught only 33 passes for 280 yards and 2 scores
Only the TE's got worse mainly due to the loss of Baugh
Farrell made an impact later in the season. He may have the best hands in the TE room.
Jpf, did I miss the sarcasm italics for Baugh? According to 11W stats, Baugh had the most dropped passes and the highest percent of dropped passes by far of any member of the team.
Olave, Hill, Victor, Mac, and Wilson would make one of the best 5-man WR rotations we've ever seen.
Then remember we have Babb, Blue Smith, and Harris in the pipeline.
Add in the best rated QB in Ohio State history and a new head coach who actually likes it when QBs throw the ball and the future is looking bright at Ohio State!
If Ruckert makes a push and if McCall builds on the 3rd down back role, we could have a very versatile 3rd down attack. Could split out 5 wide or line up with 11 personnel and motion the H for a 2 back look. I am really high on our skill positions for next year.
Having a true freshman receiver as a game changer has been a thing these past 2 national championships. Let's hope that continues with GW.
Getting Victor and Hill back is huge! This is going to be a deep and talented group, and when you add in McCall's ability to catch out of the backfield I think the passing game at OSU is going to keep hitting strides. From what little I've seen of Tate his arm looks accurate, and I assume with all the hype Fields won't have trouble hitting WRs either so things look pretty good regardless of who the starter is.
I'm going to reserve judgment on who the starts should be until after the spring game. There's always that one guy that seems to have a massive performance, I want to see what they look like on the field. I have a feeling Blue Smith is going to do some thangs.
Urban Meyer left an incredible legacy. 12/4/18 Ryan Day begins his.
Yep, Bam Childress and Taurian Washington were Spring Game monsters.
"We gotta go win this next game and make the State of Ohio proud!"-UFM
This team is so loaded w returning talent it’s not even funny. What’s funny is that the pollsters consider guys like Mack, Victor, Hill and Dobbins as non-starters from last year when they post returning #s. .
I am amazed at the fact that we seem to NEED 6 players rotating - both the hope of seeing the best play and because we have so many wonderful players they are engaged and hence stick around! Their are not many places in the country where this is true, we are truly fortunate!
I'd bet my left nut Gill gets more snaps than Saunders. I can't see him seeing the field except in the occasional 5 wide situation and blowouts with the athletes we have in that room.
Sorry Urban, Woody is still my favorite
That is a pretty grim bet good man, I am not sure you understand just how good a player of that many years in a system can be!
I'm with you, Triv. Seeing what Gill can do on the field in a Ryan Day offense will be exciting. No disrespect for CJ, he's as reliable as they come and I absolutely love his leadership, but Gill is a turf burner and is going to do some serious damage to opposing Ds.
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least, you need a beer." - Frank Zappa
That's some crazy depth at WR we have. It's also really crowded and as was said above its entirely possible this list shrinks by the time August gets here.
Think this is a good year to simplify the rotation- the group has clear leaders at each position making even reps harder to justify.
Mack and Victor would be like a 60/40 split at X with Olave and Hill getting 80%+ of snaps at their spots. Then just be quicker to pull them during blowouts if you want to build depth.
Do any of the new kids coming in have Parris Campbell speed? Out of the three guys we're losing he's probably going to be the hardest to replace. His speed was absolutely critical to the passing game success this year as he could make so much happen after the catch.
From what I understand, Jameson Williams is comparable to Campbell / Ginn. Film on him is sick.
Everything that happens-good and bad-should motivate you to be persistent. ~JT
If he's at Ginn's level that's even better (Ginn was one of the fastest ever to play at OSU and was a downright danger in the open field whenever he touched the ball). That being said I don't believe Jameson Williams is supposed to enroll until 2020 (correct me if I'm wrong).
I believe you're wrong. He signed his LOI so I'm pretty sure he's coming in 2019.
Sick indeed! Maybe, just maybe, we can put this kid on punt and kick return and get a return for a...what are they called again...oh, yeah...a touchdown. They're rumored to exist. I've seen other teams get them. They just seem to be extinct in Columbus.
For others wishing to witness Williams' speed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjjhGoufBkE
Day training the QBs to throw into tight windows, Hartline training the WRs to run routes correctly, Haskins being an outright badass ... it's hard to pick those reasons apart.
But I'm glad we have this much talent on the team and the right coaching staff to utilize that talent.
"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer
KJ returning is huge. Excited to see what he does his senior year.
"Who do you think you are?!?!...I am!!" -Pete Weber, bowling legend and dominator of the English language
Wide Receiver U!!!
The will to win is not as important as the will to prepare to win. -- Woody Hayes
We lost great receiving talent but we have great receiving talent returning also. If we find one of our guys who can put the ball into their hands consistently. All will be good.
Good WR’S can make or break a QB. Don’t get me wrong my son was a good HS QB, but had average receivers. WR’s have to be coached, how to run routes properly, catch the ball out front with the hands, not catch it against the chest. ZS. Could not coach. WR’s improved greatly because of Brian Hartline. That also helped Haskins. He knew when he threw the ball and where he threw the receiver was going to be there because they ran precise routes. Who taught them, not Zach Smith, but Brian Hartline. Nuff said.
Jack L Frysinger
You think the 3 RS seniors completely undid 4 years of coaching and learned new techniques in the one month after ZS was fired/before the season started?
Great recruiting has stocked the room and now its “crowded”. This is partly a function of the unofficial but largely implemented policy under UM of not letting true freshman play unless it was an extreme circumstance. It’s not bad that KJ is coming back and there is something to be said for the experience of a 5th year senior, but the real valuable experience is on the field, not in the room. I’d like to see a more open mind about playing freshman (can you say Olave? Or how about the Clemson QB/WR combo?). I am totally ok with guys playing early and lising them after 3 years rather than have them bottled up on the bench for 2 years and only seeing regular action as a redshirt sophomore. Works at some other schools - ones that seem to be pretty successful
Binjimen Victor is going to be a senior? Jeez, where does the time go?
"porque las estirpes condenadas a cien años de soledad no tenían una segunda oportunidad sobre la tierra."
Good decision by Hill and good that he spoke with Chris Carter. If Garret is as good as advertised, we should be as good or better at receiver. Hill and Victor should be motivated with the NFL looming and Olave and Ma ck are obviously very good.. That said, we need to work with our QBs to work on progressions and scramble as a last resort, even though the two most likely to start are both good runners. That approach and coaching on that approach has historically been lacking here but things look like they will change under the new regime. In fact, don't count Baldwin out for exactly this reason. Time will tell.
The 2019 WR corps won't be as polished and well-rounded as the veteran-laden 2018 group. It also won't be quite as fast after losing straight burners like Campbell and McLauren (and Dixon is pretty damn fast, too, given his past knee troubles).
On the other hand, the 2019 group might have more of an overall "freak" factor if you include vertical "hops," wingspan, the size/strength/speed combo, etc. I could see next year's group being elite at one-on-one downfield "jump balls," especially if Mack and Victor make another jump in their developments (McSorley will be jealous).
RFR, and add in the ability to track the deep ball in the air.
Looking for Blue Smith to emerge in 2019. Kid's got skills!
OSU 2019 defense - The Twelfth Man
I'm guessing that he will emerge during blowouts only in 2019, and then contribute meaningfully the following year. The WR uis just too stacked this year.
First time comment, long time reader. Crazy opening week for Coach Day and our Buckeyes! Who could have imagined all that we've seen in just the past few days. Instead of a drop off following Urban's retirement, feels like a rocket is being launched. I'm very excited about the wide receivers we've got coming back, and hope they can all stay injury free and each one have their best personal season. Love Hill's decision to come back, and bring his leadership to the table. One thing about the qb discussion. We don't see what takes place in practice, or how one player emerges out of no where compared to the others, especially ones that have "more press." Anyone remember the excitement in recruiting both Wyatt Davis and Josh Myers for the offensive line, yet Munford came out of no where to be THE GUY from that class to break into the line up. He was a guy no one talked about, and yet look at his results! Who would have thought that??!! I'm excited, trust our process, and the coaches creating an environment of competition to yield the best QB, whether that's Tate, Baldwin, or Fields (listed based on their time in our program) to lead us to OUR NEXT NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP!! May the best guy WIN! Period. Until then, let's have fun speculating as to "who's right" but I would rather enjoy this journey than get bent out of shape. Feeling great about the future of our Buckeyes, and laughing at the pain & misery up North. Talk about the Titanic GOING DOWN! Hahahahaha.... So much fun.... GO BUCKS!!!