Last thread was full.
Thoughts on Battle are that DB recruiting has been abysmal this year especially corner recruiting. Our track record should not have yielded these results, which is basically little to no momentum with any top corner nationally. Mentioned it in the last thread but it's alarming that every recruiting update we did have with corners or DB's in general they rarely if ever brought up Taver's name. With the talent in the 2020 class I would take a long hard look at whether I want dead weight in recruiting around bc he's been awful in that department.
Theres a reason for that.... Coombs is gone and T. Johnson has done absolutely nothing to impress recruits.
"Come on, you sons of b!tches! Do you want to live forever?" -- Dan Daly, WWI
Johnson should absolutely be fired if we lose Battle. Sub par on field performance when we have the most talent at the CB position we have ever had based on average rating is just so unacceptable. Not getting it done on the field or off it. Zero reason we should be recruiting this poorly based on the reputation coombs built and how its been our best drafted position in the Meyer era with 5 first round picks. Theres obviously a reason why he was coaching at Temple before and not at a power 5.
I think the complaints about Taver are legitimate. I think he’s done a solid job this season coaching, but that hardly qualifies you for the job at tOSU...especially when you have not landed a single recruit in this cycle. A mannequin could land a couple of recruits at a school like Ohio State, and Taver has somehow managed ZERO.
“I have yet to be in a game where luck was involved. Well-prepared players make plays. I have yet to be in a game where the most prepared team didn't win.” - Urban Meyer
Solid job? At the very least Sheffield and Arnette got worse.
“In the end we will conserve only what we love. We will love only what we understand. We will understand only what we are taught.” ~ Baba Dioum
Where was the solid job? Sheffield was starting to play really well at the end of last season and he got worse this year. Arnette didn't improve at all. Okudah and Wade are two of the highest rated corners OSU football has ever had and while they both certainly performed very well at times being only sophomores, it's not like Taver Johnson made them superstars already. Both of those guys should be first round picks next year if Taver does even a decent job.
If it's "solid" to be the coach in charge of THE single biggest reason for the Buckeyes having their worst falloff at any position group in its history, which...
.... was THE biggest reason why the Buckeyes just turned in their worst defensive performance as a whole in history (despite being loaded with blue chip talent that features the highest average player rating since recruiting-rating records have been kept... true fact), not to mention...
... becoming the punching bag of every Buckeye fan, college football commentator, or Buckeye hater and critic across the fruited plain, and, oh, by the way...
... the guys under his watch were THE biggest reason why the Buckeyes got blown out by Purdue and didn't make the playoffs, but, oh, yeah, now, to top it all off...
... he might produce ZERO recruits, thereby yielding possibly THE worst recruiting job in Ohio State football history, especially when you consider that, given the immense wealth and reputation for excellence that he inherited, it actually should be EASIER for him to recruit DBs than any coach in Buckeye history, well...
... if that's "solid," God help us if we ever see Tavers doing a "bad" or "shaky" job.
Bottom line: Fire him.
Taver Johnson was a lazy hire. He seemed to be hired simply because he had OSU connections and had decent secondaries when Tress was here. Taver had nothing on his resume to say he'd set the world on fire since he left OSU. But then again, Urban had a lot of lazy hires the last few years.
The never ending “insert buckeye coach name here ______ needs to be fired” game.
Dude hasn’t even been on staff for a whole year.
So just so we're clear: you're cool with the way the DB's performed this year and the fact he hasn't signed a corner this year in recruiting at a place known as DBU?
This isn't the typical coach needs fired stuff after a game. It was an entire season of 3 position groups embarrassing the respective traditions that had been established into laughable play. All 3 of Stud, Davis, and Taver were lazy ass hires. Is it coincidence that none of the 3 were highly sought after names on the assistant market? Bc they weren't. Im seriously confused as to why there are people who don't understand we need elite recruiters more so now than at any other time Urban was here. Urban could mask recruiting deficiencies on his staff bc he was Urban freaking Meyer and he had won titles everywhere he went. We do not have that luxury any longer. Now reports come out that these 3 have not developed relationships with recruits they should have developed relationships with and well IMO you cannot have that on staff at all in this new era. To win it all you need to recruit nationally. To do that you need great to elite recruiters all working hard together. If there are 3 guys on staff who aren't cutting it (reports from insiders indicating they aren't and haven't) then you need to make changes that give you the best chance to pull in elite recruits and win at the highest levels consistently. None of these 3 have proven they are capable of helping out in that regard. Long story short agree to disagree but changes need to be made somewhere for the better.
Completely agree there spooner, this coaching staff that Day builds needs to be elite recruiters and if none of the people on staff now want to do that then cut ties. We need guys who are willing to go out and recruit their butts off and coach those recruits up.
I am actually happy with how corners played this year. Okudah became shut down by the end of the year. Wade is on his way there. Sheffield has improved from last year he just needs to work on finishing trough the ball because he’s always there, but I have always thought he has tight hips and is what he is despite being the fastest guy on the field. Arnette is same ole arnette that was coached by Coombs, not there mentally. The enept defensive scheme and Dline often not getting pressure after Bosa quit is being over looked. I can’t think of many long passes the CBs gave up all year to be honest.
When it comes to recruiting this was never going to be a large CB class. 1 or 2 tops. Jordan battle was never staying with urban quitting. I don’t know how you can blame that on Taver, it will be hard to recruit until Day shows results on the field.
Edit: Coaches start building relationships with recruits starting as sophomores and juniors in High school. I’m not going to judge a coach that comes in early spring and rake him over coals because of weaker relationships with kids who have developed rapport with other coaches at respective schools for years. The whole black and white cut and dry “these guys are terrible and need to be fired” is weak and exactly what I’d expect from people who haven’t been around college ball in their life.
Lets take a look at our stud corners over the years of Coombs....
Roby - 3* late recruit from GA
Apple - like Haskins, dreamed of playing for OSU since childhood wasn’t going anywhere else
Shon - OHIO
Ward - OHIO
Gareon - OHIO
Pulling Wade and Okudah was impressive. Johnson - thank the Wade’s. Williamson - OHIO and wasn’t highly recuited Banks.
Yeah it's not like Urban won 80+ games in Columbus.
"I find your lack of kalua disturbing" - Darth Lebowski
I’m so confused with this. So people are thinking Hill is now flipping back to TTUN? What has happened in the last few day? Bama will probably get both. I can’t wait for the day Saban retires
Pull your skirt up....this sounds like something pitiful I would read on MGO...
This class won't be nearly as good as the 2018 class but it will still be good. I hope we take less kids and not reach and end up having a big class next year.
Honestly we don’t need any DBs this class anyways. That will make it even more appealing for the 2020 stud DBs to choose the Buckeyes
You need at least 1 corner in every class IMO. To have none and have had no interest from top kids nationally has been alarming this year. I don't trust him to recruit at all just like I don't trust Davis or Stud to recruit. But out of those 3 I will at least give Davis some credit since he apparently developed a relationship with Stover. However, at the end of the day recruiting is all about relationships and I just don't hear anything on that front about Stud or Taver.
Anyone is going to be a downgrade compared to Coombs, but man Taver really isn’t living up to any exptectations right now.
This is definitely where I parked my car.
He's literally been on the staff a year and hasnt landed one commit yet. Not one.
We have to pray that guys like Hooker, Proctor, Banks, Brown, and Johnson pan out. Okudah could have a huge year next season and then be gone. A few of those guys have to be all B10 level players or else we’ll be in trouble. People can act like this doesn’t matter, but this is why Bama is so good. They stockpile blue chip recruits at every position. Sure some don’t pan out, but they get so many that they almost always field a defense full of future NFL players
You realize the guys you just listed are all mostly blue chip recruits? Not to mention Pryor, Riep, Williamson and Wade.
As I said in the last thread, between them Grinch and Taver are responsible for Shaw. That's it. Taver was only an average recruiter the first time around. A meh hire from the beginning. I'm willing to give Grinch more slack but Day needs to do something to get some better recruiters on staff. Going to be magnified if Schiano does leave.
Agreed with this and I believe Shaw is Grinch's signee. So that means Taver as a DB coach is not responsible for a single DB prospect we are expected to sign.......that's freaking terrible considering our history at the position.
Position coaches aren't solely responsible for recruiting the players at their position - recruiting responsibilities are mostly split up by region rather than by position. I often see that misconception when people talk about a position coach's recruiting.
I am well aware of territories. However at the end of the day there at least needs to be some kind of relationship between the recruit and their respective position coach. Ryan Day's area was not Michigan yet he has the best relationship with Dwan Mathis not Taver who has Michigan. Taver has no relationship with any of the DB recruits we went after this year. This tells me he is either extremely lazy or incapable of handling it to the level expected around here. It was fine under Tressel when you didn't have to report your time spent with recruits in great detail and then have your boss (Urban/Pantoni) follow up with people you met to verify those hours. It's not like Taver dominated recruiting under Tressel either. If you're not going to be an elite recruiter at least be an elite position coach and he's not that either IMO.
I don't see this class being as good as last year and our DBs coach can't recruit for shit. We are sorly missing coach coombs and now with Urban gone it's going to get rough.
" we play to win the game "
It may not be a record breaking class but I have a feeling a few good surprises are coming our way.
I like the optimism, too, Allinosu. I suspect you might be right, but then, we just might be wearing the same brand of rose-colored glasses. To that end, I'm curious where you see the "surprises" coming from and/or who are you hoping they might sign?
As for me...
I think the first category of "surprisses" aren't technically shockers so much as they are sighs-of-relief per either keeping guys who've already committed or else signing guys for whom we already had a decent chance of bring on board, i.e., Battle, Nester, Wright, Harrison and Davis.
From there, we've got some guys that have been flirting with the Buckeyes, like Bell, Ellies, Jacobs (a flip from Iowa), Broeker (a flip from Ole Miss) and Butler, while recruits like Keegan and Elam now appear to be out of the picture, in which case, we'd need some surprise 'reversals-of-fortune''.
Beyond that, there are some outside shots that haven't been discussed very much in this forum, and yet, they're still top-ranked players at key positions for whom the Buckeyes already have offered scholarships. Some names in this group include Zipperer, Bogle, and Foskey, as well as long list of names, although none that stand out for any particular reason.
Anyway, if Day and company landed most of the above names, including 9 new biggies to reach their goal of signing 25 players, and most especially if they sign in Harrison, Wright and Davis, they'd be well on their way to a top 5 class, or maybe top 3, and thus they wouldn't be too far from the 2018 class.
Granted, that's a lot to ask for or even hope for, but, hey, a fell can dream, so... I'm curious who might be on your personal "surprise list" and/or "wish list?"
Good insight. Like you I was hoping for Harrison but what I was referring to was a surprise like Petit Frere last year where there was very little talk before hand. Hoping there is a few Hooker's or Olave's at positions of need. You might have a serial DVer because your opinion didn't warrant one. +1 to you.
The recruiting support people have a list to be worked I'm sure.
I hope you're right. I pretty much drilled down the list of guys who are currently uncommitted and/or they're known to be recruiting and/or for whom they've already offered scholarships (even if the trail has been cold).
As you note per Petit-Frere, the biggest surprise of all would be an unforeseen flip or two--someone who hasn't been on the radar or even given a scholarship yet, but for whatever reason, they have a change of heart with their current commitment and switch to the Buckeyes.
The latter probably will be far more difficult for Ryan Day to pull off vs. Urban Meyer, because any kid choosing to hop on board with a legendary coach at the last minute could feel like he was minimizing his risks whereas signing with Day will feel more like a gamble, precisely because he's new and an unknown commodity.
That being the case, it would be quite a statement if Day could pull it off anyway. Still, Day has to be held to a high standard, so it might be unrealistic to expecting a Petit-Free type of surprise, I think he still needs to land at least two of the top 4 rated guys that they're known to be pursuing, i.e., Wright, Harrison, Crouch and Davis.
IMHO, landing any three of those four guys would surpass my expectations, while getting all four would amount to hitting a recruiting grand slam with two out in the bottom ninth inning. On the other hand, signing only one of those guys would be a mild disappointment, while getting none of those four would enter the status of a legit "concern," because it likely means the Buckeyes 2019 class would fall somewhere below the top 10.
I like the optimism
Taver did little to help on the field and even less off. They need at least one corner in this class.
Wouldn’t mind to see Davis, Schiano and taver let go. They can do better
Stay golden, Ponyboy.
There were a ton of supporters on here of the Taver Johnson hire, pointing to Jenkins and Chekwa. Jenkins was not recruited or developed by Taver and would have been a stud under any coach, and if Chekwa is your measuring stick then I think your expectations are too low. I've always been skeptical, and so far it's been justified. There's a reason you go from coaching at Ohio State to coaching at Arkansas, Purdue, and Temple.
Roby and t Howard both played extremely well under him. And he’s the one who landed roby. 2019 is a weird class and always was going to be. Chill.
Yep, you're right. I think those are better examples. Personally I'm willing to give him another year to prove himself as a recruiter. I always liked Urban's 2-year rule which seemed to go both ways (assistant leaving for over/underperforming). Just pointing out he's on the underperforming side thus far.
Maybe the reason the 2019 class wont have any DBs if Battle decommits is because of our insane depth at the position. No true freshman is going to play in 2019, especially if Sheffield and Arnette come back.
Really? He is going to Bama, they will end up having like 3- 5 star CB's and 3 5 star Safeties by the end of this class,lol….can't believe Battle is turning away from being the ONLY CB in OSU's class, crazy....
Yes, but Bama is also guaranteed to play in the playoff basically every year. That is not the case here.
Howard never played well here IMO.. was a high recruit but never really was that good. I remember BJ Cunningham mossing him in the 2011 MSU game.
Yeah he never got drafted or played a minute in the NFL. He thought he was a lockdown corner but he really wasn't.
Keep in mind Taver was the interim HC at Arkansas when the Petrino stuff happened and they named John L. Smith as the HC.
That was in 2012. I am not aware of him being considered for any HC jobs after that. There was a time when he was considered a rise star in the business. But where has that gone?
I think another issue not being discussed is the lack of leadership within the class. In years past, and even next year with Paris Johnson, there is a clear cut leader in the class. I have literally heard nothing from the guys in this class. There was talk a while back that the reason Harrison did not commit right away was because he was not close to anyone in this class. On Twitter you hear from Miller's mom more than any players.
Yeah in that regards it's been weird. But just because we don't hear about it publically doesn't mean it isn't happening behind the scenes. However, publically I agree it's absolutely not been great.
Not to be a Debbie Downer, but contrary to the thread name, I think it’s safe to say the 2019 class isn’t going to be as great as the 2018 class : (
If Ann Arbor is a whore, what's Harbaugh for going back to her?
No worries man we all knew that months ago it was more nostalgic in keeping it then anything.
Wont be the thread title anymore since Day is now the coach. So I'm open for suggestions...
"2019: Ryan Day's Greatest Recruiting Class"
I think this class has some really good pieces to it in Wilson and Miller. I really like Shaw and think he could surprise quite a few. But it feels like something is just missing from it.
It has plenty of good pieces, but not at the level of others, on paper. I like every guy who is in the class, it's just a little thin.
Maybe a high ceiling DE from Delaware County?
Stover, Jameson, and Crowley are also going to be monsters. Same for Nester if we can keep him.
Fields of Dreams
I'm a big fan of Steele Chambers as well. His body already + Coach Mick = freak show. I still think he ends up at LB, which I am fine with (assuming we get someone who can actually develop LB).
It is going to be fascinating to see where the staff focuses their attention starting next Thursday. New names with undoubtedly surface (Dawand Jones, MJ Devonshire, etc.). Going to be fun. Going to be interesting.
East Coast living with Ohio roots
Honestly I think the focus should go to squarely keeping whoever doesn’t sign with us and maybe 2-3 other kids then all the way to the 2020 class.
To me this class has some really high end guys at the top with a bunch of key glue pieces of players in the middle and bottom of the class. Kids that will be very important pieces to the puzzle later in their careers, and I think every 4-5 years u need these type of kids to keep the high ranked kids in check and to keep busting their butts. Sure it would be nice to be Alabama and get whoever we want but that’s not reality there is only one Alabama and until Saban retires he will get who he wants or pays for.
Eh, I agree Ohio State isn’t Alabama but for the past 3 years, the Buckeyes have out-recruited the Crimson Tide. There has been a foundation laid down here, and that comes with an expectation of having a top 5 class every year. Gene essentially stated as much at the introductory press conference for Day. I’m definitely going to give him a pass for 2019 because most of this class wasn’t even his responsibility, but 2020 and beyond needs to start having top 5 classes consistently with an occasional off year.
the Buckeyes have out-recruited the Crimson Tide.
It's close but using 247's composite rankings, Alabama barely edges out OSU. Alabama's last three classes ranked 5(2018), 1(2017), 1(2016) for an average of 2.3. OSU's last three classes ranked 2(2018), 2(2017), 4(2016) for an average of 2.7
Average isnt the best way to judge an aggregate of 3 classes. A class ranking is a moving target year to year and often the differences between classes up at the top is razor thin.
Doesn't account for how a few classes complement one another, or the difference between our past 2 classes with an unbelievable star average vs more quantity elsewhere, those kinda things.
Not at all how this should be evaluated because class size varies and recruiting year quality varies. Should be based on per recruit average.
Average recruit rank over those three years:
Numbers matter also. I would rather have a class of 15 four stars than 2 five stars, regardless of average.
Quality and quantity. ...you need both.
Bama has the higher composite ranking average over three years but OSU has them beat easily in average ranking per recruit. Once we add this year into the mix, depending on how the Buckeye's class finishes, there's a good chance that stat will be about a wash over the past four years.
Beantown's correct. The Buckeyes roster edges out Alabama's per average player rankings but Alabama has signed more players, which boosts their total score. In short, it's two different metrics.
By all accounts, I think it's safe to say that they're effectively equals (the rest amounts to quibbling, especially since these rankings are an imperfect science, which isn't to say useless or meaningless).
After OSU and Bama, there's a bit of a falloff from there to Georgia and Clemson, although Georgia is closing ground. That gap will further close or vanish if Day doesn't close out the 2019 recruiting season on a high note. I think that probably starts with signing Harrison and Wright, as well as maybe Crouch and Davis, then flip Jacobs and land a bunch of other surprises, all of which is a tall order, but that might be what it takes.
Seems like most folks are down about this class because it is below what our normal expectations are, but from where I sit, we have alot of high character guys who stuck with us despite a full year of negative press and now a coaching change. They want to be at OSU and while the class is smaller I think they will be the part of something special. We may lose Battle but we are fortunate for the group that recommitted....2019 the year of the recommit!!
The hiring of DJ Durkin and the treatment of Jalen Hurts has really brought it home for me.
Saban doesn't see his players for the people they are he sees then as a commodity, like a slave trader would have in Alabama 2 centuries ago.
Go ahead and DV all you want, but you never hear about the personal relationships he has with players (Urban w/ McLaurin & Campbell).
Instead, he hires a guy who had a player die in his watch. He doesn't have a conversation with Hurts the entire off-season about what happened in the championship game last year and his standing with the team before the season (in Jalen's own words).
Battle may choose Bama and they may get him well prepared for the NFL but they cannot claim they'll keep your kid safe and care for them.
Saban is a lot of what the media has portrayed Urban to be. He’s conniving and wants to win at all costs. He waited until Hurts was stuck at Bama for another year before naming Tua the starter, just so Hurts wouldn’t transfer. And it worked out for him. It worked out really well for Saban.
But you’re right. He sees these players as a means to an end and not as young people who need truth and guidance.
Saban could never succeed on a level playing field. He tried it in the NFL and failed. So he came back to college football and used his celebrity status to dominate recruiting and build a dynasty. He’ll be a legend forever for it.
Saban is a lot of what the media has portrayed Urban to be.
Truest statement I've ever read on here.
Nick Satan sold his soul for championships
Whoa, whoa, whoa. I get your frustration, but let’s not compare any college coach to a slave trader from an ugly period in our history. I’m sure it’s hyperbole, but we can do better here at 11W.
Perhaps a better analogy would be a corporate CEO who see employees as assets rather than people.
Do you really think any reasonable person would believe I am saying his a literal slave owner? No, he doesn't beat them and I'm not saying he's racist.
However, what I am saying is he doesn't see their value beyond their weight, speed, size, and athleticism and he and his boosters try to ensure they're the highest bidder for the players they want. THAT was the reason for the comparison since that's what the owners cared about.
, but let’s not compare any college coach to a slave trader from an ugly period in our history
There's a South Park episode where they do precisely that, comparing college athletics to slave trading. It was one of their better episodes.
Ponder, I'm assuming you watch a lot of CNN and ESPN.
“You know how they say we only use 10 percent of our brains? I think we only use 10 percent of our hearts.”
I surmise you're suggesting I'm a liberal or something even though there's nothing in my posts that would divulge my political leanings.
A said it's become clear to me that Saban cares only about obtaining talent and not about the person he's recruiting. How's that political?
Hmm, you conveniently left out the part where you compared a head coach to a slave owner. How odd.
Yeah, and other cable news outlets are just so objective /s
Face it, there isn't really a good major news network anymore in sports or for world events on a basic cable package if your aim is pure, unbiased objectivity so we are left to just find the people we agree with and to hate on those we disagree with. Sports media is fair game, but the latter shouldn't be discussed here as it does hint toward the "no politics" rule... 11W just is not a place for exposing one's political leanings based on which news network you choose to bash. Go elsewhere to share your views on that. This is for buckeye athletics.
You sound like a Michigan fan when they bitch about us.
Got that right and you can be sure that no one at ESPN will ever utter those words out of their mouths about Saban.
apparently PSU knocked visits with Harrison and his parents out of the park and Bill Greene says not to count them out. Also Greene is reporting that Battle told Day to not even waste his time coming to visit him because OSU was eliminated.
So pissed that Battle didn't just de-commit months ago. And he still sits there committed to us today. Friggin' waste. I sure hope that there's a plan B that we don't know about.
He had to hold onto his spot until Bama offered the right money.
If there was are you confident in Taver landing them? I'm not
C'mon NHB, you know the public commitment status is just for our benefit. Battle may or may not have been 100% straight with the staff, but the fact that he hasn't publicly "decommitted" means nothing.
DB recruiting has indeed been terrible this cycle, and I blame Meyer first and foremost for neither holding on to Coombs (he's definitely worth half a mil a year or more, as we now see) nor hiring a replacement that even approaches Coombs in EITHER recruiting or developing DBs. I'm all for giving the benefit of doubt to new coaches, but between DB play this year and the recruiting failures I think we've seen all we need to see.
I'm with you. Kids can and should go wherever they want, but handling their recruitment like this is not the way to do it. Won't be rooting for this kid if he indeed flips somewhere else this late.
Not that surprised. It sucks given the lack of DBs in this class though. But seemed like they were dependent on Meyer and when Alabama called they were out.
the kid will win there, just sucks.
I have been a little surprised how little we have heard about any of these visits. I know Michigan visited because it was reported but nothing else. I mean the kid can go where he wants to go, just surprised have not heard much.
Franklin is a pretty good recruiter really. Thing is, PSU is a chronic underachiever. They get good guys and just do not seem to do much with them in the end.
Have to see where Harrison goes in the end. I wonder if OSU has had their visits yet?
Wait, I'm confused. Why the hell did four OSU staff members go to watch Battle's Dad coach a basketball game if Jordan told them they were out? Am I missing something here?
Day wanted to try and see if he could change his mind. Also, probably bc there's no backup plan at this point.
Thanks, I'm sure that's it.
It's just ridiculous that the kid has stayed "committed", while apparently knowing for quite some time that he's not going to OSU. Then has so little respect for the staff that he tells them to not even bother visiting less than a week from signing day. I know the lack of a backup plan kind of forces Day's hand, but he should have told him to have fun at Bama and been done with it. Spend time with some other recruit.
I guess that's the recruiting game for you though. Crazy.
There is always a back up plan.
Not sure how people can really already place blame on Day not closing, he's literally trying to hold this class together as some of the recruits wanted to play for UFM and I think he's done a hell of a job. Losing battle had nothing to do with Day.
Losing battle had to do with Meyer retiring and Bama being in every CFP since it's inaugural season. "Slave Trader" or not, kids want to win championships...National Championships. Let's prevent our annual blowout and make it to the playoffs this year and show the cruits that nothing has changed and we are still a powerhouse with a new coach!
I'm just hoping OU shreds that defense and finds a way to stop Bamas offense. My hate for Bama is slightly below UM.
Those who say they can and those who say they can't are both right. Which one are you?
Meyer was there for almost all of this cycle, during which they barely seemed to be in on any CBs except Battle. They really miss Coombs, and they didn't even try to adequately replace him. Day needs to shake up this staff, and OSU will probably need to increase the assistant salary budget significantly. Toward the end there "Urban Meyer finishing school" wasn't what it once was, and now it's completely gone. It's nice to say that OSU shouldn't have to pay that much to assistants because it's OSU, but you're competing against Bama, who pay whatever it takes and don't tolerated duds on their staff.
Not sure how people can really already place blame on Day not closing, he's literally trying to hold this class together as some of the recruits wanted to play for UFM and I think he's done a hell of a job.
I think you're guilty of the same offense in reverse. He has not done a hell of a job or a shitty job...he has done no job at all yet.
My 2 cents
Nope. There were concern with recruits and hes slowly been making his in home visits and walking away successful for the most part.
He is the head coach this falls on him. He can lose guys and Urban lost guys to but he was able to close often on a replacement at the same level or better then what was lost. Fair or not Day is going to be expected to do the same. Ohio State is a school we’re expectations are extremely high. Losing Battle and Harrison would not be a strong start for Day. Salvaging what was already committed is the bare minimum expectation.
Franklin is a used car salesmen he will tell you everything you want to hear and then when you get home it’s nothing like you imagined or what you were sold to believe. I’m sure he sat in the Harrison’s living room and told them we need you to be elite you will get us there.
Franklin will finish with a top 10 team almost likely 3 years in a row. If leaving home he is a way better option then Michigan and Harbaugh.
Losing Battle is a major bummer. UGA stealing Nester seems very feasible. This class may very well finish ranked in the 20’s, but at least the last two classes were excellent. Day just needs to avoid filling up the class with 3 stars because we have so many open spots. Save those spots for next year when you have more time to establish relationships and prove you are a winner like Urban. Really hope OSU starts out strong next year and gets some momentum.
Teams cannot "save" spots for the following year anymore. We can sign 25 this year and 25 next year. Day will fill those scholarships one way or another. If we didnt sign 3-star recruits we wouldnt presently have Chris Olave so leaving us short of a full roster is a dumb idea.
I could be wrong but I don't think he meant "save" spots in the sense that we could sign 28 next year but rather "save" spots in that we only have 85 scholarships to offer which basically means we would be forcing/encouraging fewer players to transfer out.
UGA is stocking up on top tier OL like crazy.
Losing Battle is the killer -- losing Nester, ehhh, he was exposed at the Opening -- not that good, very replaceable -- a 6'1 hybrid CB/S -- not so much -- mark my words, Battle will regret this decision his "Daddy" made for him...bank on it.
It is obvious that Battle has been playing games and has not been in this class for some time. Ask Kendall sheffield about going to Bama and getting buried on the depth chart.
As for Nester, I think he does not stick also. That would put this class at about 14 for the early period, with Harrison and a few others considering. Will be interesting if they make a push for any kid that did not sign early or if they just move onto the 2020 class.
The lack of a corner is a concern, as well as a tackles on the o line. This class seemed doomed from the minute the Smith stuff broke this summer. Then Urban leaving. Day has done a good job salvaging the rest but not sure they find anymore new guys to bring in.
If Harrison goes to PSU...then that would be comical. Franklin is a swarmy used car salesman
Ask Kendall sheffield about going to Bama and getting buried on the depth chart.
I don't think we can can have it both ways. Either Battle is a big loss because he'll be good wherever he goes, or he isn't. I'm not aware of great players washing out at Bama, only to go on to do great things elsewhere. Sheffield has been good, but very far from great. Yes, he hasn't had the benefit of Coombs' coaching like the guys before him, but it also seems his 5* rating was based mainly on his speed. In other words, I'm not sure it's shocking that he washed out at Bama.
So, if the ceiling for Battle is being an Arnette-level corner at OSU or riding the bench / washing out at Bama ... then no great loss, in my opinion.
This. Sheffield only stayed one year at Bama and was competing for the 3rd CB spot by spring of his freshman year. He was in the same position he would have been at OSU had he picked the Buckeyes from the start. He wasn't able to jump guys right away and he left. He's been an average starter for the Buckeyes. We brought in one OSU starting caliber CB between the 2015-16 cycles in Ward and that's the reason Sheffield and Arnette are starters. On recent Buckeye teams each would be a 3rd or 4th CB. Thats the issue with striking out at CB in 2019. Now we need to grab a couple strong ones next cycle or we start to have a talent issue there.
Seriously, If Harrison and his family think the slimy Franklin is not a total 'Used Car Salesman' than he deserves to spend the next 4 years in 'the middle of nowhere valley' lol -- did Franklin play the 'race card' telling Harrison to come to PSU to help him become the first African American HC to win a NC?! -- I heard he has 'pulled that line out' quite often with recruits -- Franklin is as African American as well, absolutely the farthest thing from being one...lol...he tried the 'race card' stuff with Tyreke Smith last year...
Hooooooooo boy, we're talking now about how ethnic people are? Folks, I can't wait to end this cycle. This isn't our best look.
His point is Franklin uses that line. He told Tyreke Smith that he'd be the better coach for him because of the ethnic connection, that they should work together for his coaching success.
I don't see why we need to go there right now, but it has been part of Franklin's sales pitch in the past.
New Day for OSU. Same noon for TTUN.
Are you so incompetent that you are just going to dismiss the part where claims he isn’t black?
No, I wouldn't go with "incompetent," bub. But I didn't take "how ethnic" that way in first ready. Excuse me while I get out of your need-to-be-mad-online way.
What level of ignorance do you have to have to question his race? He is a mixed coach. Seriously what kind of piece of shit are you?
You make our fan base look ignorant. Move along.
"I don't think you necessarily have to get a trophy to be a winner." - Nick Saban 1/2/15.
His dad is black, his mom is white and from England. I think it's fine for a little good natured ribbing that nobody can figure out Franklin's race (as has been done with others like Vin Diesel), but it doesn't take much work to learn he has parents from two races.
To legitimately say the guy isn't black or shouldn't identify as such is plain ignorance. I have family who will have kids who will identify will two races and I'd hate for idiots like you to try and define who they are for them. Maybe stick with the "used car salesman" line as that may be a fair charge.
It’s obviously not the Zeke/Bosa/Lee class. It’ll end up as the worst class in a long time, from a rankings perspective. And we can’t compete with Bama with classes like this. But it’ll be an aberration, hopefully.
And I do think we will have some great contributors in this class like Miller and Wilson and Eichenberger and Stover.
Greater chance this class is full of guys that start for 3 and 4 years. We could use some long-term stability.
In order to start for 3 or 4 years you have to start as a true So. / RS Fr. at the latest. Not many in this class strike me as being able to do that. There was only one DLee in Meyer's entire time.
Wow, I didnt know you knew more about this recruiting class than Ryan Day. Maybe you should call him up and tell him to pull their offers ASAP!
So happy to see comments like this downvoted into the grays. Someone disagrees with them and they play this card.
Clemson has signed several classes like this one over the past 6-7 years - and they have used those classes to compete with Bama. Buckeyes will be fine.
They have had top of the line QBs and DLs in those classes filled out with above average guys in other areas...this class has neither of those.
Fair points - we'll see how everyone develops while at OSU. I was just countering the argument that you have to recruit at Bama's level to compete with Bama, because Clemson does not and at the end of this year they may end up having taken 2 titles from Bama in the last 3 years.
No top of the line qb? Have you seen Mathis play? Kids a baller.
Maybe we can flip a great DB coach from another school and he can bring us some DB’s with him.
All those DBs are signing in a week.
All I know is that the guys behind LJ and Schiano need to step it up, Taver especially. Not super impressed with Grinch so far either.
Taver's competition was the db coach from lsu if I recall. I do not have the time to look him up, but I recall many thought he was a good recruiter and coach.
I really have to wonder whether a fraction of the current staff, which didn't do Meyer a lot of favors either in terms of coach or recruiting, is dragging Day down. I'm worried Meyer papered over a lot of shortcomings with his record. Even if Day is as good a one-on-one recruited as Meyer, without Meyer's cache he has to rely even more on assistants to attract top recruits. When he was announced, I had hoped that we'd see an injection of youthful energy into the staff by now.
They’re not going to blow up the staff before the early signing period and before the rose bowl. Jan 2nd could be a different story, no matter what is being reported on coaches staying or leaving.
You're too stupid to have a good time. -Dalton
They’re not going to blow up the staff before the early signing period and before the rose bowl
I think those two things can and should be separate. No one is expecting them to bring on new coaches in time for the Rose Bowl. (Though that doesn't stop Bama from bringing in big name "consultants" around this time seemingly every year. Is James Laurinaitis so busy these days he can't help out at his alma mater?) But absolutely no one expects Davis to stick around, and it wouldn't hurt to come out of the gate with an exciting hire there. I don't particularly care how Davis feels about it or how motivated he is for the Rose Bowl in light of it. Do you really think OSU will play very differently because they were down a Bill Davis during bowl prep?
This is from Birm's daily piece on recruiting at Lettermen Row:
... an unstable coaching situation, and I don’t mean the transition to Ryan Day — I mean no one knows who Ohio State’s defensive coaches are going to be in 2019 and beyond. That kind of uncertainty is hard to navigate for even the most seasoned coaches.
He specifically references it in connection to losing Battle. Doesn't seem like not blowing up the staff is helping very much.
Urban is still head coach and he isnt going to fire his LB coach before their final game and sure as HELL isnt going to fire him before the early signing period. Get that through your head.
To me the keepers are: Cory Dennis, Alford, Wilson, Hartline, Larry Johnson and Grinch. I give Grinch a pass because I think he is beyond handcuffed by Schiano in every aspect...defense, development, recruiting.
Stud, Schiano, Taver, Davis can all leave immediately. Ohio State can and should do better on and off the field.
Schiano recruits though. Id give him a pass and see what his defense can do with new lb and cbs coach. He wasn't that bad the year before.
Why Urban’s son in law?
Just get a big W at the Rose bowl and then we'll see about coaching changes.
You mean when the door essentially closes on this recruiting cycle? A pretty serious self-inflicted wound.
Yeah the program is doomed. Oh wait there is the 2nd signing period in February. Chillax.
I mean when we are finished with any coach we might replace and before the February signing date. If Day has made up his mind and moves fast we might be able to improve our recruit class.
What might happen if a highly respected CB coach was hired? Say somebody like Kerry Coombs.
Pretty sure it is rough either way. There is never going to be a casual transition without losing anybody during a transition. This has been fairly smooth, all things considered.
The head coach thing is big, but adding in even more uncertainty will make things even worse. The 2020 group is great but they have relationships with the coaching staff. Dropping them too puts OSU back to square one with many of those relationships.
I do think they need better recruiters in there for sure. Particularly if they are not great coaches.
Right after the transition was announced, Chambers, Battle, Nestor, Stover, Miller were all on the fence, we kept the best and Nestor is still an option...Battle is only stinging as he was only db..I think things turned out better than anticipated.
Urban is coach until after the Rosebowl and he wants to finish with his guys, that is why no changes can be made until after the bowl games
Schiano can recruit. Grinch is DC in waiting? Does anyone know if Marcus Williamson is still a buckeye? Havnt herd a peep about him!!
I remember hearing a lot of good things regarding Williamson in the spring but not much during the season.
It's just the normal cost of a head coach transition. Even 'bama will miss a beat the year Saban ultimately retires --unless Dabo goes back there.
It’s the cost a coaching transition where a school decided not to bring in another proven head coach. Day might be in the end prove to be the right guy for the job but you see when other coaches move from one school to another they bring their elite commits with them. Often a first year class is really good because they bring top recruits and are able to salvage some of the top recruits previously committed to the prior coaching staff.
The reality is if Harrison and Battle both go elsewhere it’s a big blow to Day and the strength of the 2020 class could be the determining factor in his long term success. They basically as a staff have to hit a home run there.
Spot on, Cleve. To that end, the more big signings Day manages to pull out of his hat this year, the more momentum they'll have going into next year.
I can't say I'm especially confident about them keeping Battle or landing Harrison, Wright, Crouch, or Davis, not to mention signing Bell, Ellies or Butler, or flipping Jacobs and Broeker, as well as maybe popping in surprises like Zipperere, Bogle, Foskey or... well, who knows?
The point is, the more top guys Day signs now, and then the more wins he nets on the field in 2019, the better the 2020 class will be to keep the Buckeye train rolling well into the next decade.
By the same token, the worse this class looks now, and then maybe, God forbid, the team loses 3, 4 or more games next year, the worse 2020 will be with de-commitments and deep-dark questions about the future per confidence in Day owing to his inexperience.
In short, Day might 'get a pass' from the media for netting a sub-standard recruiting class in 2019, especially since 1) he's new, 2) there were all of the off-the-field issues, and 3) the class had a slow start to begin with, but he won't get any passes for losses on the field, and he won't get any passes from 2020 recruits, who will be watching all of these developments closely.
Winning attracts winners, and then, winners attract more winners who know how to win.
In other words, how Day finishes this years recruiting class will be more important than it looks at first sight. He may not need to land a top 5 class, which would obviously give him huge positive momentum, but I think he needs to at least finish in the top ten (the higher the better) to preserve a 'maintenance mode" and appearance thereof, whereas...
If he finishes below the top 10, or worse, let's say, this class ranks #15 or worse, that'll draw the attention of a whole lot of folks around the country (especially 2020 recruits), and not in a good way. That sort of class would virtually mandate that the Buckeyes win big in 2020 on the field.
As in, they'd almost 'need' to win the Big Ten Championship and go to the playoffs. The good news is that the 2020 class already has a great start. Now.. don't blow it, Ryan. Come out '19 big.
This is true, but many coaches in Day's position have lost much more of the class than it looks like he will. Battle probably wasn't signing with OSU even if Urban stayed. Urban didn't seem to be a factor for Harrison. There really weren't viable current head coaches available who could bring the type of recruits OSU would want.
Tom Herman wasn't going to be an option. Chris Petersen might be the only one and he would have to convince his top west coast recruits to leave the region at the last minute. Even then, Petersen may have lost Wilson and Miller who had relationships with Day. Matt Campbell has one 4* recruit at ISU. I truly believe this class and probably 2020 would both be affected negatively had OSU chosen anyone but Day.
This is a lazy take. There’s a reason a bunch of the guys in 11 were called the “loyal 11” like perry, Powell, etc. because they didn’t bail like kalis and others. So even urban, who was more than a known commodity, lost some guys. On top of that, urban had until feb to pull a class together. Day had 2 weeks.
A better analog would be harbaugh the year he got to Michigan. And even he, once again a known commodity, had trouble putting together a good class.
On top of that, no kid in 2020 cares about what 2019s class looks like. It honestly might even help because you can sell even earlier playing time. The product on the field next year matters a ton, but that’s about it.
What’s lazy is giving Day a free pass. He has known for weeks that this was the likely outcome. Elite coaches find a way no matter the circumstances. Ohio State should never finish outside the top 10 in recruiting.
Who was the proven coach option that we could have brought in who could have salvaged and improved the class?
I honestly don't know the realistic, established proven coach option who could have come in and had a substantial positive impact on this class. Particularly in light of the early signing period and the top successful and proven head coaches being in the playoffs and or major bowls.
Keegan to Michigan. Big win for them to hold off Georgia. Was hoping he would pick Georgia to help with Nester.
They’ll still suck
Sooooo, we getting Harrison or nah?
Nobody knows. The buzz is that he has moved away from Michigan some and that PSU and OSU have moved up, but it is not even clear that he knows at this point. His mom wants him to go to OSU, but if he wants to go away to school. Apparently PSU's in home with him was amazing.
I am still not clear if the OSU one has happened or not yet.
there's the argument that changing staff undermines recruits' confidence and relationships, but, hell, if that unit is subpar already, and the guy hasn't formed any recruiting relationships anyway, then NOW is the best time to replace. head coaches always bring in guys they've gotten to know, respect, proven, etc. do this now. get stronger. better. not stuck in neutral.
Except in Bill Davis case he formed a relationship with Ohios Mr. Football (Stover). Dont think Ryan Day is dumb enough to risk alienating him to appease armchair QBs.
Saban would make the coaching changes after the bowl and after the early signing period. Locking kids in before the tidal wave. Will Day do similar?
We can only hope man.....we can only hope.
Kind of a weird situation. Urban is still the coach until the bowl, so Day isn't going to fire his assistants before then. Only reason any of them would be gone is if they got a head gig somewhere else, but most of those seem to be wrapping up. I expect to see changes, though probably not a full-blown shake-up that one would normally expect in a coaching change. Two maybe three to be switched with Dennis taking over at QB coach.
fair point SG, but i dont think they would have missed out on stover regardless and 1 kid doesn't make a coach a recruiter. and yes, i admit i AM an armchair quarterback...and proud of it. go bucks!
Givler doubling down on the fact Stud is a gigantic turd on the trail that gives no effort.
He also made a great point by saying Bollman and Warriner weren't great recruiters but they didn't miss out on 5 offered OL from OH no less over a 2 cycle period. I didn't even think about that but that's even worse than Taver not signing a DB to this point. Like holy hell man the program recruits itself. You could give a medium sized effort and land solid 4* kids.
Honestly worried about the future of our program if we are so incompetent that we continue to retain guys like Stud/Davis/Taver
The Ohio State Meyer (Meyer Mach II), as great as he was, had a clear weakness... he was loyal to a significant fault. Look at Mike Zimmer, the Vikings head coach, and how he eliminates coaches or players not performing to an expected level or working within the parameters of Zimmer's protocol. Kicker misses three FGs resulting in a tie game Vs the Packers, Zimmer cuts him. Zimmer, asked at his Monday presser if cutting his kicker was a difficult decision, replies, "Nope, pretty easy decision." Last week, after the Vikings lose at Seattle and score only 7 points in the process, Zimmer fires his friend and offensive coordinator, John DiFilippo. Zimmer said, "It's about the direction of our offense, not one game but the overall direction as we head into the latter part of the season. We had to shake things up and try to get better." The OSU Meyer, imo, often put friendships and loyalty to individuals above the program, which is one of the two reasons I simply don't believe Meyer would succeed in the NFL. The other reason being that the talent is essentially level in the pros, and Meyer's entire coaching aesthetic is to amass more talent than everyone else. Can't do that on Sundays. Will Ryan Day follow Meyer's friendship above program lead? No one knows, but some changes are seemingly in order on the defensive staff, and at least debatably in order specific to the o-line. Day should 'shake things up and try to get better,' because this year's defense simply wasn't good enough.
When I die, sprinkle my ashes over the 70's
I agree that tough decisions need to be made regarding staff, but Zimmer’s approach won’t translate to the college level where long-term success depends on recruiting and recruiting often depends on relationships (I.e. stability). In the pros one season is a lifetime unto itself so coaching changes can occur more abruptly. But shaking things up in college can have longer ramifications
I hear you, Jr.... and no, Zimmer's philosophy probably won't work at the college level, like Meyer's approach won't work on Sundays, at least in my opinion, but that wasn't my point. The reason I mentioned Zimmer is because he's a very recent example of putting program before personal loyalties. That isn't a college or pro specific thing, it's a management thing. The defense last season was embarrassing at times and subpar throughout, and some position groups, like the linebackers, have struggled for a few seasons now, so standing pat, at least in totality, seems ill-advised. No one wants to fire people they've spent thousands of hours with in a team setting... but sometimes, for the betterment of the program, changes must be made. I agree that college presents different challenges than does the NFL relative to turnover, but coaches run their course, and changes, despite possible temporary recruiting setbacks, are sometimes in the best interest of the whole. I would never retain a coach who isn't meeting expectations because a few recruits hold him in high regard, so maybe that's why we see things a bit differently here.
Gotta cut loose the dead weight immediately
Exactly he needs to be his own man and bring in guys who will do the damn job on and off the field. So incredibly frustrated reading updates like that.
Looking back on Urban's comments during last presser where he said he tried being more CEO-ish and it didn't work. Those make sooooo much sense now with all these reports coming out about those three and he has no one to blame but himself for those hires.
It’s weird he showed to be a pretty solid recruiter at maryland and LSU. Got lael Collins, Damian prince and Ethan pocic as the primary recruiter listed. Just a weird pattern
If you're going off the 247 stuff it's not entirely accurate. I've noticed it usually defaults to position coach even though they may not have even recruited the kid.
LSU gets all the Louisiana talent without any work and most of the kids are crazy good.
Not even close to being true if you watch recruiting. They’ve struggled a lot in recent years keeping their best. My best friend is a massive LSU fan and is always complaining about it.
5 of the top 6 in 2019
5 of top 10 in 18 with all that weird Kansas stuff
3 of 10 in 17. Bama cleaned up there. But that was coaching change year
9 of 10 in 16
i mean fir for a state as talent rich as that I’d tell your friend to stop complaining
I actually think stud interviewing at BG is a sign he’s out. One of those find a spot somewhere else kind of things.
We will see how the staff changes after the bowl game. I think Day will find some new coaching/recruiter talent.
How is this kind of thing even happening at a school like Ohio State? These guys are getting paid in the high 6 figures and theyre half-assing it?
I doubt it will happen but keep LJ, Wilson, and Hartline and clean the house. No wonder Meyer looked exhausted. He's been carrying around his dead weight buddies for far too long.
This one should be subtitled (Part XXV - Complaining About the Assitant Coaches)
And Nick Saban
Done and done. Always happy to oblige the TVG :)
You're just the best Spoon!
Holy cow, I come in here for an update and what a buzzkill. Firstly, all the damn bickering. Looks like a bunch of junior high girls. Jeez. Secondly, we’ve lost Battle, Harrison, and possibly Nester. Maybe that’s true. Thirdly, our staff suddenly can’t recruit.
Im actually OK with a down recruiting year if that is what this is going to be. I’m very confident that there are guys in our roster every year that can play, and are getting buried in the depth chart due to favoritism, not flashing in practice, or not playing special teams. Shaun Wade, for example. Brendon White, Kendre Jones, Justin Hilliard. I could go on and on.
Yes, some guys will prove it in practice or will be happy to play special teams. I’m an old school guy and mostly agree with this. However, some guys don’t have the light go on til the lights go on. And those guys will get better with real playing time.
We don’t get any CBs for this class? We should have Johnson, Banks and others for several years. We will be fine.
Yeah, it's been getting a bit cringey around here lately
A class ranked in the 20s should never happen at Ohio State. A coaching change but still a stable situation and coming after a B1G title and a likely top 5 or 6 finish. No corners hurts pretty bad no matter what anyone says. Went from being the number one school for corner recruits to having 0 in a couple years.
So...did we feel this way when Tressel was the coach? Several of his classes finished lower than you might remember. Including his first class which finished in the OMG 20 something place. 07' also another 20 something finish. No wonder we fired him.
Go Bucks********Muck Fichigan
That's probably why we had so much trouble against the SEC in title games. The bottom line is you can't compete for national championships without consistently bringing in top classes
someone on here mentioned the in-home Harrison visit by penn state was "amazing". anybody else have anything on this?
Used car salesman or not, every recruit—including the ones that have selected our Buckeyes over JF's pitches—continually says that there's a "family atmosphere" with PSU's coaching staff, and that they're highly relatable and parents really like them.
To me, it has to do with age and approach, and I think OSU getting a little younger in the staff room isn't the worst thing ever.
Not going to lie...with the soon defections of battle and most likely nester and the news about the 2020 class...very concerned we could see a massive drop off and have to settle for guys just to fill classes.
Bringing in just 14 guys in 2019 is just not healthy esp when there are no corners or offensive tackles
Wow, to read these threads anymore and people's opinions. You would think OSU is the worst school ever and about every other team is better and will be better for all of eternity.
Things go bad in coaching transitions. It is the way it is. How things rebound is going to be important. Still fairly early though. The early signing period makes the problem worse this year.
I'm not concerned at all. Attrition will happen with a coaching change and the kids will tell you what you want to hear. I want to see who signs early. Win the bowl game. See if Day makes any coaching changes. See who signs in February. Then focus on the 2020 class.
If Day fails to make any coaching changes and we have the same problems next year, and we don't pick up a few 2020 recruits by the spring with the amount of interest we have with top recruits...I'll start to worry.
2017 and 2018 classes were good to us and although a small class, we have some really good kids coming in 2019.
Just my opinion.
At the risk of being massively down-voted, I believe a poor recruiting class in 2019 isn't a reflection on Ryan Day, it's a reflection on Urban Meyer (and I love Urban Meyer). He's never stayed in a program longer than he did at OSU so it's not like he's ever shown any willingness to stay around and he quits/retires a few weeks BEFORE the early signing period. He shows significant loyalty to players versus benching them for more talented ones (i.e. Werner, Borland,…). He has brought old friends into the program who we all believe aren't great coaches (Studrawa, Davis ) or that we'd like to see leave (Schiano). He kept and enabled a coach who was clearly an embarrassment (Zach Smith). He ignored Ohio kids to get "the very best" and then we wonder why Ohio kids won't flip from schools that always wanted them to one that only wanted them when they couldn't get other players.
The 2019 class isn't going to be great…so let's just accept that. Let's judge Ryan Day by his 2020 class, one that he was fully in charge of assembling with a staff of coaches that (hopefully) he had a chance to select.
Nothing is too difficult for the person that doesn't have to do it.
The Zach Smith thing hurt this class the most. August is the month the December class is essentially locked down and Urban was out that entire month. If he doesnt get suspended the class fares better and we likely keep the guys we lose.
And he didnt "ignore" the Ohio kids. He took the ones who were truly elite. I pray Ryan Day doesnt just take a kid from Ohio just for the sake because he's from Ohio. Tressel did that and it got our asses kicked in two national title games.
The poor recruiting is a reflection of the new head coach and some of the sub-par assistant coaching hires over the past few years. Trying to maintain status-quo is not what the program should be doing right now because Ryan Day should be identifying where the deficiencies are and try to correct them. The uncertainty around our program is going to linger until tough changes are made.
That's ridiculous. You realize he's been the HC for like a week? Maybe when he has a full recruiting cycle and year of coaching he can correct the deficiencies (recruits and coaches).
Right. I think he's done a great job keeping the 2019 class together. And getting Eichenberg goes a long way toward replacing Kane Patterson.
And, as much as we fans don't like Davis and Studrawa, can you imagine the chaos that would have ensued with recruiting if Ryan Day had said at the press conference "I'll be replacing Davis and Studrawa after the Rose Bowl. I don't know who I'll be hiring yet but trust me, they'll be great."
Great job is a bit of an exaggeration. We are on the cusp of losing Battle and Nester.
Miami DC Manny Diaz left and they lost 4 commits the next day. Any time there is a coaching change kids will leave. Battle has been leaning towards leaving for a long time and Nester may still stay. As well as adding EIhenberg. So yes he is doing a great job so far.
He’s not even the head coach yet technically.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.
And Tressel won a national title with that recruiting approach — the same number of national titles that Urban won with a more "national", more "elitist" approach. And, Urban got his ass handed to him 31-0 by Clemson in a national semi-final and even worse at Iowa and Purdue the last two years.
I'd rather have these Ohio Guys we didn't get: Trey DePriest, Joe Bolden, Taco Charlton, Tyree Kinnel, Dymonte Thomas, Mike McCray (a legacy), Malik Zaire, Deshone Kizer, Jake Butt, LJ Scott, Tommy Kremer, Liam Eichenberg, Justin Layne, Danny Davis, or Jackson Carmen...
to the Urban Meyer-recruited "truly elite" Ohio players we did get: Kenny Hayes, DerJuan Gambrell, Ron Tanner, Bri'onte Dunn, De'von Bogard, Najee Murray, Evan Lisle, Donovan Munger, Kyle Trout, Marcyles Jones, Eric Glover-Williams, Alex Stump, Jack Wohlabaugh, and Gavin Cupp.
Maybe I ust don't understand the definition of "elite."
Trey Depriest sucked, are you serious?
Urban recruited some of those players hard, especially Kraemer, Eichenberg, and Carman. Tressel lost some top Ohio players too. This is not a good post.
Maybe you should look up "cherry picking."
What's even the point of this post? Urban cant evaluate Ohio talent? Lol
Urban Meyer is a coaching LEGEND. He's also one of the greatest recruiters in history. Losing him is something that really scares recruits, even those who are firmly committed. It's hard to predict the reaction that each recruit will have, and Day (and others on the staff) have done a pretty admirable job of trying to hold things together.
Battle was fading away from Ohio State before Urban ever retired. He was basically backing out after the Zach Smith stuff, and it has been an uphill battle to keep him since then. It may not have even been directly related to Zach Smith and the Meyer suspension, but those things served as convenient areas of concern for Battle and his dad.
Nester was also looking around at Penn State and Va Tech before Meyer announced he was leaving. I have no idea what has caused that since he was the very first commit in the class and seemed solid, but now it does appear to be a fight to hold on to him.
Harrison was also trending away from OSU even before Meyer retired, so I don't think Day can take the blame for that either. Day needs to somehow keep Nester (Battle seems to be a lost cause), sign an OL and a DT, and then maybe somehow pull Harrison, and that would be a fantastic finish, all things considered.
Ok back to recruiting, skimming through the end of the world posts is there ZH info that we are out? Saw a few posts saying we lost him don't know the truth to it if its just people complaining or if there is actual info.
I think the most recent piece of Harrison information was that Kurelic moved his crystal ball to foggy, which gave a lot of people hope that he might be trending back toward OSU.
PSU supposedly had a great in-home visit with him, TTUN had theirs as well, but I have not seen it confirmed that OSU visited with him again. A visit may have happened, but there hasn't been any info about it, at least not that I have seen.
Hey pals take a quick look at the 2012 class and compare it to this one. The average rating is higher for 2019 with the potential of adding ZH who would gurantee the average stays higher. Also almost every 4 star in the 2012 class did not pan out. The 5 star did not pan out. I think there are going to be real stars in this class. Also that was the class signed by a multi championship winning coach, this is one being signed by somebody who has never been a HC. Seeing what Day does with the staff, the 2020 class, and the fact that we have the most talented roster in OSU history is much more important than the 2019 class.
That class finished #5 in the country. The number of recruits matters too. Like you pointed out, even a good number of highly rated recruits won't pan out. That's why you want a full class to give you as many chances as possible to find good players.
Let's see how the average stars look if they lose Nester, Battle, and Harrison. Then take a few low rated guys to round it out.
Kayvon Thibodeaux commits to Oregon over Alabama. We'll see him his Sophomore and Junior seasons
That's cool. Sounds like he made a big mistake having to play us.
Thank God, Bama doesn't need anymore 5 stars lol
Mario cristobal is a hell of a recruiter. Don’t know yet if he’s a great coach but he’s a top 3 recruiter in the country. He will bring Oregon back I bet. Learned from Saban how to do it and is now getting elite recruits. Something that kelly and helfrich couldn’t do because they weren’t huge recruiters. Oregon’s going to be back to being a perennial national contender.
Lets pump the brakes on Oregon being back. Im sure FSU fans and Nebraska fans and even Michigan fans have said the same about their amazing HC hires.
I didn’t say they were back yet?!? I said they will be. They are recruiting unbelievably well for them. Getting some real studs and becoming the banner of pac 12 recruiting. They are recruiting really well under Cristobal was all I was saying. And FSU not Nebraska aren’t doing nearly as well. First off, they both had losing seasons. Second, they aren’t recruiting nearly as well. None of those programs you mentioned have gotten a top 5 recruiting class under there coach. So I’d say it’s fairly different in this instance and they could be returning the number one rated qb in this draft class.
He’s gotten some good young o-line players, going to be nasty by the time we play them.
Good to see. With a few exceptions (including a couple future Buckeyes) it seems like Bama and Georgia are taking any recruit they want from anywhere this cycle.
Georgia did that last cycle too. Though I'm sure most forget what their class looked like in the summer. It was horrendous until Zamir White committed and then they basically just sucked up every five star after that. They have an amazing oline coach and a great LB coach, both of whom are tremendous recruiters.
Just now catching up on this.
I think blaming Day for any of this is borderline asinine. He's got some major damage control to do and that's going to happen any time your school loses someone like Urban Meyer. The same is going to happen at some point in his career when Larry Johnson leaves and he has to handle all of the guys that committed because of LJ.
Jordan Battle grew up in Florida while Meyer was dominating at UF. He committed to Ohio State because of Urban Meyer. The minute there were talks about Meyer's future being up in the air was pretty much the moment I thought that kid was gone (Nov 5 to be exact). Seems like there was a bit of optimism lately but I believe that was because his family was telling media outlets and coaches what they wanted to hear.
The biggest issues right now – as far as the coaching staff goes – are Stud and obviously Bill Davis. How many times have we seen a kid commit to Ohio State BECAUSE of Stud? Sure seems like he's the least active recruiter but overall the OL play hasn't been near as poor as linebacker. I honestly think the secondary will be fine. This season Arnette and Sheffield have mostly been meh or even bad, and while there are talented guys behind them, they just weren't ready yet.
Also the coaches being on recruiting visits with Day is absolutely zero indicator of whether or not they'll be back in 2019. That's been a hot topic on some sites and it really doesn't tell us anything one way or the other.
The Stud stuff is kind of confusing. We keep hearing he’s not recruiting well, but I’ve read on here in the past 2 days that Paris Johnson has a great relationship with him and Nester has doubts because he’s being told Studs gone. Kind of contradicting.
Yeah I am confused by that myself.
I am as well, I feel like we need a thread about who recruits and who doesn’t just to clarify
He's having doubts because he has no clue who his position coach will be. I'm not sure if it's so much about Stud or if it's just the fact that they can't tell him who it will be if it's going to be someone else. And Stud leaving wouldn't cost them Paris Johnson. Johnson has been on campus about 50 times so of course there's a relationship there, but he was Meyer's guy.
Not related to OSU, but yesterday Kayvon Thibodeaux followed a bunch of Bama outlets leading up to his commitment just to troll people into thinking he was picking the Tide.
That just cheers me right up!
Not sure if that's good or bad since the Buckeyes will see him in 20 and 21.
Doug Nester is on an unofficial visit to PSU.
In my opinion, we knew something like this was going to happen when UFM retired. Truth of the matter, recruiting has been very underwhelming since the summer but all in all I had a feeling this was going to be a small class, maybe 20.
As of today, what I read from everyone that posts on this board, we will lose Battle but like many of you that has been a foregone conclusion for a while now. Nester I feel 50/50. Other than that, I feel we hold on to everyone that has verballed.
Day walked into a tough job of following in Urban's foot steps. Urban Myer, as some has said, is a rock star. However, Urban is not perfect and made some mistakes. While he is a rock star, he is still a human being capable of making mistakes. Some of those mistakes are with some of those hires he has made (Davis, Stud, for example). Right now the best thing for Day to do is play it close to the vest about the future of some of the coaches, two who might be gone after the Rose Bowl are Stud and Tarver. Why those two? Because they are a liability on the recruiting trail. But have a plan in place to bring in some one soon afterwards.
This most important thing Day can do is keep the current class together and add a few pieces by Feb 19. The 2020 class will be greatly affected by how well the team plays next season. Go out, kick ass on the field, and let the results on the field be the distinguishing factor on recruiting. That is the best we can hope for at the moment. In the end, I think we will fine. I am more confident with Day being the HC with this team than when Fickell was forced to take over for Tressel and that team.
Change is never easy but we'll be okay.
Looks like Birm is saying that Battle wants to flip to Bama, but they're telling him to hold off because they don't want his commitment to cause Daxton Hill to flip back to TTUN. Bama sees Battle as a safety instead of a corner, and Hill doesn't want them to sign three safeties (Hill, Hellams, and Battle) in this class. He also thinks that if Battle somehow doesn't sign with Bama because of this, he's just as likely to flip to Oklahoma as he is to stay with OSU.
Why in the hell would this kid want to go to a school that views him as a second choice. They clearly have prioritized Dax Hill. It’s just hard to imagine a kid saying okay I’m not the most important player on their board but I’ll still go there. I hate to say it, but with the depth bama has this kid will not see the field. Bama has an embarrassment of riches. Battle will most likely be a backup with that talented secondary. If he comes here he is almost definitely gonna be a starter and game changer. I know some kids don’t care about playing time. But it’s hard for me to believe that this kid is picking a championship (which is almost guaranteed at bama) over a starting spot( which I can’t see him playing at bama and see him starting here).
Bama appears to have achieved the rare distinction of being able to tell kids they may not be good enough for their class, thus making Bama even more desirable to the recruit. Unfortunately, while we can point to our recent success with DBs, I'm guessing other schools are quick to point out that both the DB coach and head coach affiliated with that success are now gone.
Seems the sooner they dump the dead weight on the coaching staff the better. Hope it is immediately after the Rose bowl
Nicely said, Ryan needs to upgrade the coaching staff to improve our recruiting. This Ol, LB, and CB coaches need to be replaced. Grinch to take over the D.
His Daddy is steering this recruitment -- likely 'padding his pockets' -- any H.S. DB who has the chance to be the "the" DB of his class @ the undisputed ''DBU" and says "no thanks" is not getting good sound advice lol...totally clueless move he and his family will regret. LMAO, now Saban is treating him like a 'second class citizen' holding off accepting his commitment where he will be end up buried on the depth chart anyways or then instead he will go to OU where their HC is leaving, like yesterday, for the NFL in the offseason and the program can't even spell the word defense lol -- BRILLIANT! -- good job Daddy, good job screwing up your sons CFB life pffffffft.
Makes you wonder if the Dax hill allegations of $ being transferred are true. If they are willing to give it to Dax they’d be willing to give it to others. Makes this whole battle recruitment make a lot more sense if that is the case.
It was DBU under Meyer and other defensive coaches. Meyer is gone and the defensive coaches we have the board wants removed from staff and you are shocked players are looking elsewhere? Quit blaming it on money you sound like a Michigan fan.
While I agree about the complaining about bag men is a bad look, and that Coombs and Meyer being gone doesn't help, Ohio State has been producing stud DBs since the mid 90s at least.. more draft picks at CB and S than any other school from the past 20 years. So it wasn't just Urban and Coombs.. started long before that. Only can hope it continues
If there was any merit to this Dax/Bama thing I'm sure the NCAA would be all over it since it's so publicy broadcasted.
In my opinion, "Fake News"
I don't think the NCAA does much "all over" investigating. Especially on their cash cows.
I used double quotes. I feel like I owe Buck68 royalties.
Seems like an extremely smart dude but can never understand what he is trying to say.
There are some pretty sneaky ways you can get around the rules and there's been a lot of smoke at some programs. It's not as simple as Saban or an assistant handing a recruit a bag of cash. That would never happen, at least not at Bama. There are ways for wealthy fans of the programs to get things to recruits and players or their families so that it will never been connected to a Saban or Kirby Smart. The work the NCAA would have to do to police this would be too much for them so I believe they are aware of certain things but aren't going to do anything about it.
Wiltfong foggy on Harrison now
The world is yours
That's VERY interesting. Only have to wait a couple more days.
Kurelic and Wiltfong are the most conservative...if they go foggy...it means something. Only trepidation is PSU. Kurelic believes they are more of a threat than scUM at this point.
"Give your dream an aspiration date."
What was Wiltfong?
Ohio State > *ichigan
Urban > Hairbaugh
He was on Michigan. He’s pretty up front, tries to give a real-time prediction.
Speaking of Saban,
I saw this story and found it funny. Saban made an in-home visit to Ty Robinson (DE out of Arizona) the other day. Scott Frost had another in-home scheduled with him the week after that and shut down recruiting on the last day and had all 11 coaches on the recruiting trail show up for the in-home visit.
Wiltfong is hearing its OSU/ Penn St battle but doesn’t want to rule out Michigan since he believes that’s where Harrison wanted to go all season. He also thinks Harrison vibes more with the Penn St staff and commits more than any other school. He reiterates that LJ and Ohio State being close to home are Harrison’s top reason for going to OSU.
Thanks for the summary. Gonna be a wild couple days before the early signing period starts.
What are people saying the reason for TTUN falling off is?
Id speculate that after the ass beating, Harrison realized the horrible possibility of getting an embarrassing beatdown from the hometown team for 5 years.
62-39 is the reason.
So in other words he has no clue where Harrison is going....lol.
Damn, kids. Step away from the Penn State. That program is going to fall off a cliff.
The snake oil salesman is about to lose his last golden goose.
Program will absolutely not fall off a cliff is he's bringing in big dogs. I want the big time recruits to step away so they are less dangerous.
Well if you call a zone read on 4th and 5 against Ohio State, it doesn't matter if you have big dogs or not.
I disagree. He needs more than top recruits. He needed a freak at runnning back, a great college quarterback and a top tier coordinator to briefly touch elite status. There are no Barkleys or McSorleys waiting in the wings.
That’s a terrible take also. So Urban needed the an NFL HOF running back to win at Ohio State and arguably the greatest college quarterback of all time to win at Florida. Recruting elite players is 90 percent of the battle in college football. Franklin has killed it at recruiting. Penn State has had us on the ropes multiple times. Second best program in the Big Ten and it’s not even close.
Again, Michigan kicked their ass last year.
I think Michigan and PSU are pretty even as #2 in the Big Ten right now. PSU won a title but it was on a complete fluke play against us and they had 2 losses. I'd argue Michigan actually deserved beating us in 2016 more than PSU did that year, but luckily you don't always get what you deserve. Michigan clearly seemed to be better than PSU this season despite the bad loss to us. Michigan beat them 42-7 this season and Harbaugh is 3-1 vs Franklin. Franklin is a better recruiter than Harbaugh though.
That's weird. Sounds like you just described recruits being a big part of the equation.
True. I mean he needs to absolutely strike gold with recruits at key positions. Even though he's always recruited well, I dont think he's going to get that lucky again.
He was on the chopping block even though he had a lot of talent before Mcsorley and Barkley bailed him out.
The stupidity of this take is beyond measure. Penn State is in a way better position then Michigan and with us in flux they have a real good shot of taking the next step. Day needs to win this battle for Harrison.
Penn St regressed badly this season, next year will be worse. They’re nowhere near taking the step to the CFP, no matter what happens with OSU
Yeah, Im not sure this guy watched any Penn State games besides when they played us. They looked mediocre to bad most of the year.
How do you fix regressing? Bring in big time recruits.
Assuming you have elite level coaches, something that doesn’t reside in HV.
In his case it’s find another Joe Moorhead. He was trash before him and is now trash after him.
or coaches that can coach up the kids they have.
Harbaugh is 3-1 against PSU. They absolutely beat down Penn State last year. Penn State is losing their best player. Penn State barely beat App State, Indiana, and Iowa. But whatever you say, guy. 'Stupity beyond measure.' Lol
Review the last 3 years.
2016 Penn State - Big Ten Champs 7th overall and Michigan finished 3rd in the east.
2017 Penn State - 2 losss by a combined 4 points to Ohio State and Michigan State finished 8th in the country. Michigan went 8-5 and I ranked.
2018- Michigan had a good year with a veteran team. Penn State in what will be their worst year in 3 seasons could finish in the top 10 again with a win over Kentucky. Something Michigan hasnt done since Gary Moeller was coaching.
So yes Penn State is far ahead of Michigan right now. Michigan is the school that’s about to lose a glut of talent and if Shea Patterson jumps the bottom for Michigan might not be pretty.
Yes. Youre showing a clear regression. After 2016 they lost the OC. After 2017 they lost Barkley. Now they lose Mcsorley. Franklin's last golden goose. My original point. Thanks for commenting.
They lost both OC and Barkley after last season.
To be fair, PSU/Franklin has out recruited Michigan (it's closer this year however), and I suspect it'll balance itself out.
Michigan has 9 more current commits. If Penn State were to win out on Harrison and win another couple battles they will pass them. Beating them by a decent margin on avg per recruit.
Hoping Larry Johnson and mom win out
Going to take a wild guess. He wants to go away to college, and Penn State offers the low key option Harrison wants. Even though his head is telling him OSU makes the most sense, it's never seemed he dreams of playing in Columbus.
Penn state will struggle to Finish third next year in the east
Ohio State repeats, but Michigan is taking a large step back with the departures and PSU only had something like 4 senior starters this year.
Anthony Soloman a 4 star OLB from St. Thomas Aquinas flipped from Miami to Michigan. He is #198 on the composite but is 6" 200 thinking he may be the Viper(Jabrill Peppers) position in a couple years, this is a solid developmental guy for them. He has time to add 20 pounds and he already was clocked at 4.2 in the shuttle so he is an athlete. They are at 25 verbals so we get to see how much they plan to go over 25(if they can) and cuts are probably going to start.
For those who think PSU is about to fall off a cliff without McSorley think about the thread we are in right now. PSU has been recruiting very well and last year was the best class of the Franklin era. They were fairly young last year and have a decent amount of people back and they will still have stars at the skill positions. KJ Hamler, Friermuth, and all their RBs will be back. The only question mark on their roster is QB but that does not mean they will not be good next year or in the future. It isnt a stretch to say we are lucky they havent beat us 3 years in a row. Nearly every position on their roster will improve next year except QB and they are bringing in 2 4 star DT QBs so they will likely find one soon. Is their future as bright as ours? No. But they are not going anywhere. For this class they are in a similiar boat as us, they don't have many guys on board but have a high average.
Im not trying to downplay the significance of recruiting, but Franklin is an absolute F tactician. He's never fulfilled the potential of his roster. It's why so many people call him a snake oil salesman. The guy can recruit, but he is never going to deliver on that 'elite' status promise. Penn State was far from great this year as well.
We'll see if one of their 4 star quarterbacks pan out. I remember Hackenburg being rated quite high...
Hackenburg was not recruited by Franklin and did not fit in his offense people need to stop with that comparison. Trace was a mid level 3 star recruit who turned into a star stock piling talented QBs is going to work out for whoever does it. Again we could/should be 0-3 against them the last 3 years we are not miles ahead of them.
Right. Franklin wouldnt have gone after Hackenburg. Whatever you say. They recruit pro style quarterbacks.
I don't think people understand McSorely was such a middling recruit.
Oh please. Mcsorley was the PSU equivalent of D.Lee. Guy that outperformed his recruiting website ranking.
You don’t hit on that jackpot consistently and PSU will certainly take a tumble now that he’s gone.
What exactly do you consider great? He wins against Kentucky he finishes with 3 top 10 teams in 3 years. He has won the Big Ten. He finished with back to back ranked seasons at Vanderbilt in the SEC. That is arguably the toughest job in power 5.
What are his Top 5 wins at PSU? Career? The lone win over OSU would be #1 I imagine, what rounds it out?
He has a win over us, a win in the Big Ten Championship game, and a win in the Rose Bowl. 3 wins bigger then anything Harbaugh has done.
Well I personally don’t consider Harbaugh a great college coach, same with Franklin. If either were, listing an impressive Top 5 would be easy.
Hmm. I must have missed that Rose Bowl win...
FSU and LSU were recruiting better than PSU and what has it gotten them? It’s not always jimmys and joes but x’s and o’s. They can’t figure out that in HV regardless of who signs their class sheet.
And yes their mcsorley backup is absolutely junk.
That’s really not true. It has less to do with X’s and O’s and more to do with bad evaluations on the talent. The recruting rankings are one thing but paying attention to how hard schools were going after players. To many times the evaluations with the recruiting services don’t match the push for a player. The scholarship offers are there but then as evaluations deepen teams start to end communication.
Oh, bullshit. You just said Michigan isn't close to Penn State despite beating them 3 out of 4 years and blowing them out last year. You dont know what you're talking about.
And we lost to Purdue so it’s a better overall program? Get the hell out of here. Look at the overall programs. On top of it Franklin was still dealing with a program coming off of sanctions. Harbaugh has literally no excuse. Let me know when Franklin has a 5 loss team at Penn state. Michigan is more likely to be back near 5 losses next year if Patterson jumps ship then competing for the Big Ten. Franklin only loss 5 times once at Vanderbilt in the SEC.
Who is the leader on the field for PSU going forward? Mcsorley moving on and missing out on fields last cycle there’s no one known and reliable at this time.
UM at least has shea if he stays and a top qb recruit in mccaffrey with a year under his belt. That’s an upswing when comparing the two teams.
PSU isn’t a consistent threat going forward. They may have a decent season and might play OSU tough occasionally kind of like Wisconsin historically. That doesn’t make Wisconsin on the same level as OSU either btw.
It is what it is.
It isnt a stretch to say we are lucky they havent beat us 3 years in a row
There best team the last 10 years almost beat us. All these other close games or defeats have been in arguably the best home crowd in all of college football at their house at night in the White Out. Urban was 6-1 against them and the beatdown in 2015 was glorious and I could even say it isn't a stretch to say they are lucky to have beaten us when and how they did. Inept special teams play cost us that game.
"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes
I hate to bring him up again, but I just reviewed the recruiting calendar and the "contact" period ended yesterday, meaning if we didn't visit Zach Harrison on or before yesterday we won't be able to before he decides Wednesday morning. Has anyone heard that the visit actually happened? I'm beginning to wonder if it ever did.
Pick up your feet, turn your corners square! And DRIVE DRIVE DRIVE!!!
This is a good question. I have never heard confirmation that OSU had an in-home visit with Harrison this past week.
His visit with Penn State was supposedly "amazing", so if TTUN is truly out of it like some are suggesting, it wouldn't shock me in the least if he picked PSU. Ever since he changed his original commitment date, I've been worried that he was planning to leave the state and was simply waiting until the early signing period began so he could sign, graduate early, and leave the Columbus area immediately.
Seems like there will be a good bit of suspense on Wednesday morning.
Day visited him on Wednesday per Kurelic.
Can somebody clarify this for me? On giving crystal balls on 247, is Wiltfong and Kuerlic allowed to switch their pick back to Ohio State if that was their original pick for him before they switched to UM thus resulting in having to be forced to go cloudy instead of back to OSU?
They can do whatever they want on an uncommitted recruit.
They can change to anything except to a team he commits to after he commits.
Thats why sometimes you’ll see people still throw in a selection for some team with no shot just in case if they missed out on the committal.
Yeah. The downside for them is they lose all the points for having held the ball for so long.
I’ll be able to tell my grandkids that I remember when these threads use to be about recruits.
You're right and I apologize. I digress.
So Zach is apparently feeing like TTUN can’t develop him into the player he wants to be yet Ohio State is still not the clear choice with LJ? PSU is now a serious threat? Well what exactly have they done to churn out top DE’s to then NFL?
I also remember reading a long while ago that Zach was blown away with Real Life Wednesdays and that was very important to him. If it comes down to really just wanting to get away from home vs. so many other factors that favor Ohio State, it sure seems like he would be making a really bad decision in picking PSU.
Where did you get this info?
It was written in the recruiting articles here. The Real Life Wednesday’s was talked about quite a while ago. Zach said that was very important to him. Contributed to why he was considered a slam dunk back then.
Oh, I knew that part. I was talking about the first paragraph, guessing that was just your speculation?
PSU is now a serious threat? Well what exactly have they done to churn out top DE’s to then NFL?
I can name 5 first team all-americans from Penn State: Devon Still, first rounders Tamba Hali, Michael Haynes, and Jimmy Kennedy, and #1 overall pick Courtney Brown.
OH WAIT - *checks who the DL coach was* - Larry Johnson was their coach....choice is easy.
Also, PSU helped develop Big Bear into the #3 overall pick