I love reports
Oh yeah? If you love them so much why don't you MARRY THEM
When I walked in this morning and saw the flag was at half mast I thought, "Alright, another bureaucrat ate it." but then I saw it was Li'l Sebastian. Half mast is too high. Show some damn respect.
I got two words, "Bye Felicia!!!"
BigBuckeye says Go Bucks
Speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
Class of 81
He’s gone. No matter how it happens....Day needs to make this his own. Wilson staying would be one thing but not Schiano.
"Three things can happen when you pass the ball, and two of them are bad." - Woody
I just don't think Schiano is the same after what happened with Tennessee. It almost feels like he's been one foot out the door the whole year, because I know he's a better defensive coordinator than what the product on the field this year indicated.
I would think Grinch is solo DC next year unless Day is going to continue with the co-coordinator thing that Urban started. I look forward to seeing what Grinch does with full control of the defense and, most importantly, a new linebackers coach.
I'm not a fan of co coordinators. Just a guess I think they had to give titles to them because of the bump in pay the staff received not sure but Bama and other elite staffs have one boss and the rest Indian's.
It's literally just a title to justify a bigger paycheck.
They're all chickens. The rooster has sex with all of them.
The Tennessee thing was this year. How do you explain last year?
Last year when the D was 15th in the nation giving up 19 ppg?
Last year when they gave up 55 points to Iowa, a team that averaged 28.2 points per game
So we can judge entire seasons on 1 game? Not the best analysis imo
The point is that after coach Fickell left the D took a step back and after coach Coombs left it cratered. Maybe not totally coach Schiano's fault but the fact remains that he kept trying to do the same things with a team that couldn't do the same things.
Faux, this is exactly right. Nicely put.
That ONE GAME cost us a CFP spot
I’m sure the loss to OU had nothing to do with it.......
Sounds like something the committee would do.
Agreed. Consistancy is the key. The Defense has severely lacked it the last 2 years.
do we ignore the 4 int?
I'm all for a new LB coach, however I think a lot of the LB problems stem from the fact that they are forced systematically to play off the L.O.S. Schiano leaving would solve a lot of problems.
"The hate of men will pass, and dictators die, and the power they took from the people will return to the people. And so long as men die, liberty will never perish" - Charlie Chaplin
Maybe, unless the problems are just as prevalent with grinch. Im pretty torn at where to point the finger for this defense. Schiano was fine in his first two years except for a couple already noted games. He was also coching safeties. Grinch shows up and the defense takes a massive tumble. Safeties also drop like a rock under his supervision. Makes me wonder if this is a 2013 issue where fickle took the heat for what was likely whithers problems.
I agree with you on this one. There are a lot of people that love Grinch and I don't know if its because he is an Ohio guy or he is a young supposed up and coming guy...but like you said the defense looked far worse this year than before he showed up. People like to point to WSU having a highly ranked defense in 2017 but they got a lot of points hung on them by the good teams they played...including an MSU team that we dismantled in 2017. I know he improved a defense from a lower level team in the PAC 12 but I also don't think the PAC 12 is that great at the moment. Typically when a traditional middle of the road team is in the running for a conference championship it is usually because the bigger programs are having issues.
I have a sneaky suspicion that Schiano has been butt hurt with Day replacing Meyer during his suspension. Schiano is definitely replaceable and wouldn't that just open up for Marcus Freeman.
Good. Please go.
And take Bill Davis with you
Agreed there, again, Martin ole’ pal.
All is well.
Bill Davis isn't under contract, so that's a plus.
Tailgate Fare Historical Archive
Davis should be a dead man walking. He should get his walking papers after signing day.
Billy Davis gotta' be gone. Bad hire.
That would be a great job for Schiano!
I'll work for helmet stickers!
I agree. Outstanding fit.
I will gladly personally send our LB's wandering up into pre-snap determined LOS gaps and voluntarily take away our second level of defenders in his Columbus home to help with packing and moving 'free of charge' in exchange for the end to the sharp pains in my 'Temples' while watching him turn in historically bad defensive performances in OSU history, turning the former 'Silver Bullets' into 'Slivers of Scrap'!!
I'm not anto Schiano and am probably in the minority in saying that I think he does a pretty good job, but a move like this might be whats best for everyone
I think it's a combination of things that's caused defensive problems. Losing our DB coach, LB coach not worth a shit, Day replacing Urban after the Tennessee crap. I think it took it's toll. If he even if he does stay I think things will get better.
I know some don't like him but a very good coach and recruiter. Davis and the linebackers was the cancer on our defense. No defense that doesn't have linebacker play will be very good. You also can't take away what he did at Rutgers. So he is either upset for being passed over or knows he will be let go. Then again he wants a head coaching job and nearly got the Vols gig.
Real mixed feelings about this. No secret NFL GMs and Coaches LOVE how he gets DBs ready for the NFL day 1. He's been a huge part of the success we have had here lately with guys going to the NFL..
And no one knows for sure what Schiano is or isn't allowed to do in terms of on the field personnel. That was the worst linebacking group we have had in a LONG time. Probably Cooper or Bruce long time ago. No defensive coordinator was going to look good with those guys. If Schiano is the one putting them on the field then yeah I don't mind him leaving. But if Urban and Davis had final say on the group and it ties Schiano's hands that a TOTALLY different conversation.
Once Bosa went down and we couldn't pass rush from both sides of the line the pressured ticked up on the back 7 and they were just straight exposed. They started to make a little lemonade from lemons when they got White in there and played Wade more.. and things got even a little better when they pretty much moved Werner to star position and had him dropping in coverage all the time... but that of course had it's trade off because it put more pressure on Borland... which didn't work..
Hard to say go or stay without all the information... Urban has always preached he let's his coaches dictate lineups and play calling but those things HAVE ALWAYS come with strings... He wouldn't let Day and Wilson line Haskins up under center is just one example and I'm sure there are things he does for the defense as well...
I still tend to think that Davis is the problem and Schiano got dealt a crap hand and that's why we've seen him on the sideline so angry so often..
I'd hate to lose Schiano... still a force in recruiting and knows his stuff if given the right guys to put on the field..
This is an insightful analysis, Tcm. Some years you just don't have the players you need. Losing Schiano might be throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Maybe extend his tenure and give him a competent set of linebackers and a new LB coach.
I'd be happy to write him a letter of recommendation.
Truthfully, I was hoping we'd trade him to Rutgers for Chris Ash and a player to be named later.
We can't stop here; this is bat country...
Please Santa make this happen as my Christmas wish
Someone tell me why no love for Schiano what were his issues ? He took bad angles and missed tackles or all the interference calls game after game? You can take a horse to water but you can't make them drink.
His scheme was terrible
Stay golden, Ponyboy.
Maybe or execution you could be correct
Did you happen to notice the LBers playing at the line of scrimmage all year? That wasn't their idea and it wasn't the position coaches either.
Please go Greg.
I’m on the fence if I really want to see him leave or not. Mainly because I’m not sure Grinch is ready to take over completely. If Schiano leaves, would they elevate LJ to Co-DC? It would be a well deserved promotion for him and also possibly serve to quell any fears that recruits might have about him staying or leaving.
Fields of Dreams
Could also open the door for Marcus Freeman to come home, that’s the best case scenario imo
Why do you believe that Coach Grinch isn't ready to take over? As DC, Coach Grinch’s Washington State defensive units improved for three consecutive years, and, after having just eight turnovers forced the year before he arrived, followed that up with 24, 23 and 28 in his three seasons at WSU.
In 2014, the year before Coach Grinch's tenure at WSU, the Cougars defense, in the offense-dominate Pac-12, was 99th in the nation in Total Defense and 117th in Scoring Defense. In his first year as DC in 2015, the Cougars were 84th and 74th, respectively. In 2016, 62nd and 50th. In 2017, 16th and 56th.
So, in three years as DC, in the offense dominate Pac-12, he took a defense from 99th/117th in the nation of the 128 FBS Division I football teams to 16th/56th. And, while at WSU, he was a three-time nominee for the Broyles Award, given to the top assistant coach in the nation.
I realize that numbers don't tell the whole story, but the consensus seemed to be that Coach Grinch was brought to Ohio State to become the DC, sooner rather than later.
"Life is ten percent what happens to you and ninety percent how you respond to it." - Woody Hayes
But he didn't perform well during his probationary period.
Assuming you're serious, in what sense, during his first year at Ohio State?
This year's defense was Coach Schiano's defense, and I suspect that Coach Grinch, while he most likely had continual input into the defense throughout the year, made no ultimate decisions regarding either defensive scheme or personnel. While he had position responsibility to coach the safeties this year, he, most likely, didn't have final say on who played the two safety positions. Coach Schiano ran this year's defense. I suspect that Coach Meyer had more direct influence on who-played-where on the defense than Coach Grinch did. One year's performance, in what was, in reality, a rather limited role, does not provide an adequate body of work to make a definitive judgement on Coach Grinch's abilities.
I don't believe it is fair to pin this year's defense issues, to any real extent, on Coach Grinch. It was the general consensus that he was brought on staff as DC-in-waiting, and, when Coach Schiano moves on, I fully expect Coach Grinch to become DC.
Completely agree with TomD. There is no way I am pinning any of this year's Deficiencies on any member of the coaching staff except for Schiano and Meyer. It starts at the top. These were THEIR schemes and guys like Grinch, Davis and (both) Johnsons were there to take orders. If Schiano is gone next year and the same shit show continues, then, well, we blamed the wrong guy. But 13 games is a trend, boys and girls.
Don’t trust him as a D coordinator. Safeties this year were awful at times and that wasn’t the case prior to him being here.
One year's performance, in what was, in reality, a rather limited role, does not provide an adequate body of work to make a definitive judgement on Coach Grinch's abilities.
Also alot more responsibilities on the safeties when your LBs are sucked up at the line.
High powered offense and supposedly good defense and gets smoked by Cal, Arizona, Washington and MSU in 2017. Sorry...don't think Grinch is that wonderful. Seems like teams figure out how to beat him...like we figured out Don Brown.
Coach Meyer must have seen something very positive in his total body of work in order to bring Coach Grinch on staff and make him co-DC, and, effectively, DC-in-waiting, for when Coach Schiano moves on. I'll trust Coach Meyer on this one.
Perhaps...guess with this being his worst defense yet it can only go up.
The same Meyer who hired his best friend (proven bad coach), his mentor's grandson (proven bad coach), and his own son-in-law (no experience). Sorry. Urban Liar lacks credibility.
Hey, who invited Clay Travis to this forum? Geez, buck....a little salt on those eggs this morning, eh?
Coach Meyer also hired Billy Davis.
Coach Meyer also hired Larry Johnson, Kerry Coombs, Chris Ash, Tom Herman and Ryan Day.
Love this kind of analysis in isolation
Cal game - 7 points were from a fumble return for TD, not the defense fault, overall WSU committed 7 turnovers in that game,
Cal's first FG was set up by a WSU INT giving them the ball on the WSU 20
Cal's first TD was setup by a long PR to the WSU 23
Cal's next score was a 52 yard FG
Their next FG was again off an INT
Cal then sustained a drive for a score
Their next FG was off a WSU fumble and the last score i mentioned was a FR returned for TD
Overall Cal had only 18 1st downs and 365 yards
Arizona game - again 4 TO's by the WSU offense and yes they played poorly that day but a pick 6 and 3 other TO's did them no favors
Washington - 4 more WSU TO's - 2 of Wash scores were directly the results of a fumble and INT deep in WSU's end
MSU - 7 points off TO's again and the MSU D dominated the WSU offense so that MSU had a 13.5 minute TOP advantage
so yeah some bad scores, but not entirely his units fault in most cases and besides it is WSU level talent
Jury def out on Grinch.
I've been critical of Schiano but I wouldn't mind him staying one more year for some continuity of the staff and making sure this class stays together. Wouldn't want to lose players we really need like Stover and Battle at the last second because the head coach and DC are both gone within a few weeks of each other.
I'm on the fence because I've seen what Schiano's defense has done in year's past, but this year was just flat out atrocious. Idk...
I think he could do well as a head coach again. Not sure why our D was so off this year, it sure ain't because of poor recruiting.
AKA the Horseshoe, the Shoe, and the House That Harley Built
This seems like it came out of nowhere. Makes sense for Schiano, being a New Jersey guy. Also wonder if Meyer isnt pulling some strings or old IOU's. He knows Schiano wanted a HC gig. Plus, OSU had 3 coaches with Head Coaching experience. At some level toes had to he stepped on making the room uncomfortable. Maybe, maybe not. I believe having Wilson on staff helps Day immensely. But, having another coach, who was already looking at other jobs is too much. Clear the room, allow Day to bring in who he wants and establish complete control in the coaching room.
Schiano had a shitty D this year, but man can he recruit!
If he goes, I see 2020 commit Luke Wypler following.
Those who say they can and those who say they can't are both right. Which one are you?
You see Wypler going to Temple?
Did you see Rondale Moore going to Purdue? Wypler has had a relationship with Schiano since he was in like 6th grade. Crazier things have happened.
And when I say he goes and Wypler following, I mean he is also going (as in away from OSU.) Not necessarily to Temple, but he may.
Greg, thanks, but the energy of Urban's staff has grown stale and it's time for everyone to start fresh. We wish you well.
"Life is not about how hard you can hit, it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. THATS HOW WINNING IS DONE!!" - Rocky Ballboa
Lol, we went 12-1. I wouldnt call that stale.
The defense is what kept OSU out of the playoff and Urban wearing down is why these very talented OSU teams loose a head scratcher every year to teams like Iowa and Purdue. That is stale so I respectfully disagree.
Good man. Good coach. Goodbye.
I know there's a game Saturday, and my ass will be there.
I Believe In Ohio State.
Should he leave it will be interesting to see if it has any effect on Luke Wypler’s commitment. IIRC, Schiano is the main reason we landed him.
Coach Day has indicated he wants a new direction on D..
Pigskins & Porkrinds
As long as that direction is still Big Ten D, I'm ok. But if this new direction is the direction of Texas or Oklahoma, I'll still have Schiano.
If you die before you die, then you won't die when you die.
What part of this year was a B1G defense?
This wasn't an Ohio State Defense this year, but as far as it being Big 12 I don't agree. I think changes were made just too late.
No secret that Schiano wants to be a HC. Not sure anyone will touch him due to the circus Tennessee put on.
That program deserves to be sued for the millions they costed Schiano. What a toxic environment.
I think this would be a good fit for both parties.
As I understand it, he was probably looking for an exit with Grinch being reputed as DC-in-waiting.
"porque las estirpes condenadas a cien años de soledad no tenían una segunda oportunidad sobre la tierra."
Good. Now please take Bill "My Best Man" Davis and Alex "The Grinch Who Stole Our Defense" Grinch with you.
Would be hysterical to see Schiano leave and Davis stay only to see our LBs improve next season because we play a scheme that fits our personnel instead of the other way around.
"You're the patron saint of the totally effed" - Hot Tub Time Machine
I do not want to sound like the bad guy but I don't think Schiano is that bad. I think Bill Davis and the LBs were the problem coupled with the scheme that I believe Urban fell in love with after having an embarrassment of riches with the DBs that were here in the past. Schiano was always a zone coverage kind of guy and honestly was pretty masterful at it mixing up cover 2/3/quarter quarter half. He was never a leave your DB on an island kind of coach. He is a great recruiter and a great coach. Truthfully I want him on staff this coming year and see how they do on defense next year and then if things still trend downwards then maybe I'll switch up.
"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes
Agreed. Not to mention the loss of a great CB coach this year. I know the D wasn't what we're used to but I don't get all the hate.
Thanks for the dance Greg...Go Greg...Go Bucks
This OSU staff defensively needs to be seriously overhauled so this is news to my ears if Schiano takes the Temple job.
We'd find out quick if the defensive woes were him like most of us suspect. If this happened and the rest of the staff held as is, we'd see what Grinch is really made of, really quickly.
"The only good thing about it is winning the d*** thing" - Urban Meyer on The Game The War
Good! Hopefully a couple other coaches on the defense follow him too.
I would like to see Schiano not get the Temple job or any other and see what would shake out. Then as fans we would see who is the blame for the poor defense. We all have our bad guy but the new coaching staff is going to weed out the problems. Myself blame Davis but I have been wrong a time or two and eat a mean crow. With a little salt not to bad.
I like Schiano. I didn't understand why it took us so long to adjust to our talent or why he was so committed to making the LBs crowd the LOS after everyone figured out how to beat that.
However, he's had some good defenses and he's a really smart coordinator.
Bottom line - he came to OSU to rehab his image and learn from Urban's program. He would have been gone last year to Tennesse had the fiasco not happened. Urban is gone and Schiano is 100% a head coach type of guy.
Temple would be a good way to rebuild his image. It's not as bad off as Rutgers was when he turned it around. Fertile NJ recruiting ground. Do some good work there and Power 5 and/or NFL head coaching jobs open back up.
You win with people.
And so forth...
9 Units Strong!
I tend to agree. I saw in many games the outside backers getting tricked to the inside and that is where most of the long rushing gains were. This year I had the impression that they were maybe not as smart as previous players. OSU has never been weak on the outside and held their gaps. These guys, for whatever reason, did not in several games. I can’t imagne a coach telling players not to hold their assigned area and just jump inside every time. And you have to use what you have available. Hopefully enough time to shore it up before the Rose.
I'm with you, Dewman. Are there some coaching and schematic issues? Yep, it appears that way. But, the players own a fair share of the blame too, whether it was LBs repeatedly losing gap integrity or CBs not turning to find the ball and getting beaten or committing PI. I suspect that the D's problems were a combination of Xs and Os AND Jimmies and Joes. I just don't know the ratio between the two.
I survived Cooper, and I hate Tai Streets.
My first reaction was wow, he wants to go back.
Took me a while to differentiate between Rutgers and Temple.
That's an insult to Temple.
But is the Temple job interested in him?
I think hes more interested in Temple than Temple is him. I say he goes the NFL route sometime soon.
Ventured over to their fan boards, they definitely don't want him.
Temple really thinks they can do better?
They say they don't want a "creep" on their team. Seems to be the word of use for them.
Personally I think this guy belongs in the NFL as a defensive coordinator with all the stuff he likes to run. I don't think he's NFL head coach material, but DC seems appropriate.
Remember last year when you all loved him?
Schiano is the new Fickell?
Make no mistake. There is no replacing or comparing Ohio's First Son, The Greatest of Buckeye's, Coach Fickell.
I never understood the love for the guy. He had some success at Rutgers, that was great, but also a LONG time ago.
2017 college football rankings:
Total defense: 15th
Yards per game: 9th
Average yards per play: 3rd
Average yards per rush: 2nd
Total rushing yards: 6th
Doesn't seem like that "LONG" ago...
He was talking about when Schiano was at Rutgers (2001-2011)
Shandy is not beer
"I never understood the love for the guy"
Hopefully he understands it now.
We also had Denzel Ward, Nick Bosa, Sam Hubbard, Tyquan Lewis, and Jalyn Holmes, all NFL draft picks. The kids we put in there to replace them werent near as solid. Is that on Schiano or recruiting?
Absolutely no one has used the term "Silver Bullets" to describe this season's defense. Lousy linebacker play and corners. It wasn't til end of the season for White to surface at safety. We heard "fixable" in post game analysis our defense since the first game and obviously never fixed. Most of the fan base did not entertain play off aspirations because of the lack of defense. Thanks to Haskins for outscoring the opponents.
Howzit my bruddahs? I may live in Hawaii but my heart is O-H-I-O
I'm conflicted on this one.
Apparently, we'd be losing a DC and Specials coach (that designed and called our TTUN block). He has a history of being a good DC and certainly has a ton of experience that Day lacks. Plus, I'm not sold Grinch/Taver weren't at very least partly to blame for the troubles (in addition to Davis).
I guess it comes down to, never jump into a situation until you know how you're getting out of that situation. In other words, who the hell are we hiring to replace him? That has to be nailed down before you go pushing the guy out imho.
Schiano is a GREAT coach.
Really hope we don’t lose him.
But, if we did ... I’d be all for hiring Fred Pagac, Sr. back to OSU to guide the Silver Bullets.
Seemingly a great recruiter too
Pagac can't and doesnt want to recruit. Can't coach an elite defense if you can't recruit elite talent.
"Come on, you sons of b!tches! Do you want to live forever?" -- Dan Daly, WWI
Really? Did you get this info personally from him, or are you just repeating some bs you heard?
Pagac can coach. He can recruit, but he won’t need as much as the head coach.
Maybe he’d like one last job before he retires — perhaps LB Coach at his alma mater.
He’s certainly more qualified and proven than Marcus Freeman.
Amazing how many uninformed people are on here, hoping Schiano leaves. Some of you people are truly clueless about college football.
As you lobby for a man who’s been out of college football for how long?
You’re just as ignorant as the people you’re scolding.
I would prefer not to lose him. It is continuity into Day's first year as a coach. After that, it may be easier for Day to get things going. It also helps continuity with recruiting a ton.
I agree that the defense was not up to OSU standards this year. But I do not think that he is a bad coach.
Butch Jones joining Locksley at Maryland as a TE coach (and associate head coach).
Can't judge a coach on 1 year- players come and go. It's life.
Sciano, if he was horrible, would not be around starting 10 years ago.....he isn't a "rookie" learning the ropes. There is merit to having a seasoned coach in Day's 1st year and would help with recruiting, which is a huge priority in college football.
Enjoying daily the 62-39 ttun beatdown.
DO IT GREG
Dear Schiano defenders,
We want him gone not because he isn't a good coach, or a very good recruiter, or because his seasoned experience could help Day. We want him gone because he is as stubborn as a mule and refused to adapt his scheme to match his personnel.