Decker did have multiple bad games that year, whereas Prince really only struggled against Mich and PSU, both of who have talented, future NFL caliber players on their lines. Decker still to this day struggles against the speed rusher (see Vic Beasley in the Orange Bowl).
And whose to say that Taco Charlton (who will be a first round draft pick) won't be the DPoY in 2 or 3 years. Plus Decker actually always struggled against the speed rush, see Clemson OSU game where Vic Beasley abused him over and over again. But the reason I use Decker as a comparison is that they have the exact same build and Prince does have the same ceiling as Decker. I just don't like when people completely give up on a player this early in their career. Looking back, he really struggled against PSU and Mich, both of whom have NFL caliber linemen all, so it's not like he was struggling against a MAC school.
So I find it funny that I got into an argument on a different thread about the staff not doing enough to help a struggling Prince by never putting a TE on his side or having the RB chip and BEHOLD the picture of Bowen above... Lined up on Jones side of the field, just like Baugh did everytime as well.
Prince was not that bad in the running game, and when he could get his ling arms on the DE, he typically held up very well. His problem came when PSU showed that he really struggles against the speed rush and the stunts (which many linemen do). Schematically if you are in an obvious passing situation, the easiest way to help a struggling player is to chip with the TE or RB. From the PSU game on I can probably count on two hand the number of times Prince got this help. Everyone needs to remember that most linemen struggle in their first year as starters (I take you back to that Taylor Decker guy, whom many on this site were calling for his head when he got beat horribly by Buffalo).
If he struggles in year 2, then question if he should be on the table, but don't completely write off the guy, he has an NFL body and athleticism, the question with him is if he has the nastiness needed to be great. If he does, then you will all be eating your words.
Is it fall yet?
But, he did come in with a lot of talent and hype, and has yet to show any improvement that would make me think next year is gonna be the year.
As much as a appreciate what Thad has done for the program, and the good years that were very fun to watch, it's time to move on, for both sides. Thad is not healthy, dude looks like he's 65+ and he's what, 50? That is not good. He can barely walk, which probably hurts him in practice, where he used to be a very hands on coach, especially with Defense. I feel like ever since his surgery the D has gotten terrible, coincidence? I think not...
Also, reading through the comments, many of you keep saying that a national championship is not the expectation for the program, then why is he the 7th highest paid coach??? To me the 7th highest paid coach means we should be getting a top 7 team yearly, which means a 1 or 2 seed team, meaning a title contender.
My last point is that Thad has really been struggling on the recruiting trail lately, whether it's talented players that he thoughts he could turn into great ones, Loving, KBD, Tate, Amir, Sam T, Lyle, Scott, Ross, and the list goes on for a while. I mean Russell was the last guy we put in the league since Sully, but all the aforementioned names were decently highly rated guys (many top 50 at least). Plus he hasn't been able to keep the top Ohio kids home (Kennard really is the one the Kills me here, but Bragg was a top 10 players and we never had a chance with him).
Long story short, we are paying customers and the product we have been getting is crap. If you enjoyed a fine steakhouse for a few years and they literally brought out cat shit would you continue to go there? No, you would move on to another place, and that's probably the best analogy I can come up with for what I've seen from this program for the last 3 years.
Im calling it right now, IF Dobbins is healthy, he will be the starter or have the Urban "OR" next to his name by season's end. He is essentially Zeke 2.0. I loved his highlight, especially his passing game usage in the 7 on 7, where he ran great routes and embarrassed the linebackers put on him. He has the gamebreaking speed that Weber unfortunately doesn't have.
Let me go back for a sec though and say that I like the way Weber runs and seeks out contact, But, I think Dobbins is the real deal if he comes back healthy from the ankle injury. The only thing that may keep him off the field early is pass pro, but once he figures that out, dude is gonna be awesome.
Last point, for all those who think that he's too small to be a 3 down back, which I've heard a lot of throughout his recruitment, he is half an inch sorter than Zeke and 5lbs heavier as freshmen, so he can easily put on the 10-15 lbs to play everydown in Urban's system.
The player I'm concerned about transferring is Hilliard. I have no idea if he's even thinking about it, but he's had some injury issues and his primary recruiter and position coach just left to coach his hometown college. Again, purely speculation, but I know people from Cincinnati never leave, so I could see him being drawn back if he looses the battle to Booker in the spring.
I really second your opinions. Holmes has the exact frame the NFL covets in a 4-3 end. If he was a starter, he'd be a top 10 pick next year, especially with the ability to move inside. Hubbard to me is going to be a great OLB at the next level, that dude is such a freak.
I hope Barrow sheds off the injury and comes back with a vengeance. I remember scouts saying he was the best player on the field most gams for IMG, which is saying something.
But, Clemson hopefully wont have to play a Beck/Warriner coached team again. It's a lot easier to play end when all you have to worry about is the jet sweep and never an actual run up the middle, am I right?
What a fucking disaster that game was.
It will be interesting to see what happens with him. I really liked him to put on 30 lbs and move inside for us, but Bama uses their ends/tackles very differently.
What games were you watching? The only true weakness that the line showed was lack of the true 1 tech run clogger. Against Xich, we struggled on 3rd down to generate pressure because it was 3rd and 3, which is a very easy conversion. Joey Bosa couldn't have got pressure on easy distances like that. I agree that there isn't a JBosa talent but the depth was remarkable. These guys constantly beat their man in 1on1s. Most of the teams went to max-protect looks on 3rd downs to slow them, which should've left our secondary with an advantage.
Football is a game of Xs and Os, just because 4 linemen don't beat a max protect look with 6/7 guys blocking doesn't mean that they are good. In fact, it means they are so good the opposing coach knows he can't win with his 5 linemen.
Go back and watch the end of the Wisconsin game, on 4th down we rushed 4 and all 4 got to the qb in under 3 seconds, that's not coverage, that's a great pass rush.
But to make your point even less valid, a coverage sack is much easier to get when you have the ability to rush only 3 or 4. It's a hell of a lot easier to defend when you have 7 in coverage than 6 or 5. Our line was so good that we never brought blitzes on 3rd down, instead relying on our front 4 to be disruptive. D-Lines should not only be measured by the sacks they generate, because that's what the average person views as the only stat that matters, but qb hurries, knockdowns, are often overlooked stats. And some things like a early throw underneath that gets broken up or tackled short doesn't come off as a d-line stat. These guys force all of these things to happen, and it really is a shame that a line this elite and a secondary to match it were pair with such an inept offense.
Go back and watch the games and count how many times we rushed 4 in obvious passing situations, then watch the quick, forced throws that qbs had to make that got us off the field. We were top 5 in 3rd down conversions for a reason and it was the d-line.
This has been my biggest critique of Meyer, winning by 20-30 is fine especially if backups can get some valuable PT. That being said don't burn an obvious RS but when you have an injury history at QB, get him the hell out of there when we are up 20+ in the 4th quarter lol
Personally I like Holmes potential a lot more as a DE. Hubbard's best position will be a stand up OLB in a 3-4, where he can rush using his speed and athleticism. For someone that played safety in HS he has really turned into a great lineman though.
I would disagree, not in the "Elite" player, because right now we don't have a top 3 pick currently enrolled (Looking at you Mr. Young), but we do have 4 very, very, very good players. When you only have to rush 4 on passing downs, and you still get consistent pressure, that's a lot better than average.
Watch the games again and see how many times we brought a blitz to help the rushmen get pressure. Then watch it and see how many times we dropped 7+ into coverage to help the secondary. Everyone says the secondary had all the elite players, yet they benefited from phenomenal line play. Not saying that they weren't elite, but give the line credit for what it was; easily top 5 line we have ever had at tOSU.
Your last point is the best, though the rest are very solid in their own right. It's crazy to think about how we were top 10 in so many defensive statistics and yet one of the lowest in blitz percentage. While I believe that Hooker, Lattimore and Conley are going to be great pros, they had it easy knowing that they only needed to cover for 2-4 seconds before the QB had to get rid of it.
PSU had a legit D line, as they always do, but our line played very well against Wisconsin and Oklahoma, the latter may not have a great statistical defense but has talented players and puts guys in the league. We consistently moved the ball all game long in both games.
But like I said, it was more about play calling, not the scheme or many of the individual players.
That's interesting that you say he specializes in creating blitz packages, cuz this team never needed to bring the extra man with the elite dline that we have. I can't wait to see what he comes up with for them. I fear for opposing QBs.
I have to disagree, the system did show, at times the last 2 seasons, the ability to get the ball to players in space. There were drives where everything looked great and some that didn't. In terms of scheme, there's nothing that needs to be changed, just more emphasis on better play calling. To say the system sucks means you don't like the power run-zone read scheme that we employ, which won us a Natty. The play calling was what needed the major change, and now we have it.
For Prince, I have defended him over and over again. The dude was in his first year as a starter and held up very well against the scrubs, Wisc, and Okla. He struggled in the back half against the top defenses that we played against (which once they had film from the PSU game it made it very easy to exploit his deficiencies). Prince was not helped by the coaching staff one bit. If you know he struggles with the speed rush, throw a TE over there or chip with your RB. I didn't once see either of those happen down the stretch last year. But he has the frame and natural athleticism that it takes to be a tackle at the college and NFL levels, he just needs to refine his technique. He now has a full season of film to study and an off season to fix his deficiencies.
Agreed, this is just a talent filled bad team. Ever since the Amir WIlliams class, (2011ish) there has been a lack of effort put forth on and especially off the court. There are some many little things that a player can do to progress in the offseason without coaches and we haven't seen a player do that in years. I've said it for years now, Matta is a good coach, but he is paid to be a top 10 coach (I wana say 7th highest paid in NCAA). I wanted change ever since he couldn't fix Craft's shot.
Hindsight is always 20/20 but I agree. He has yet to show any signs of bringing something to the team. Maybe in 10 years he'll be a good coach, but not yet.
My bad, I had included Jersey in my numbers for those areas, I forgot that NJ is not part of the MDV area. Regardless Harbaugh has made a priority in the east coast, which will hurt PSU
You'd be surprised, I recall many different outlets saying it was a must win, because he hadn't won a single big game yet at PSU and the boosters/athletic department were growing impatient
Agree, I pray that Conley is there in the 2nd for my Cardinals to take. Would also love Elflien in the 3rd, Kwon in the 4th, Brown in the 5th
But my Cards never draft buckeyes so probably won't happen (Outside of Wells of course)
Yea, but that 2-3 inches comes back as 4-6 with wingspan and height added together. Unless he's got a freak wingspan that is