Agree! But until then if Loving can keep -- or start.....stroking it from the arc, it will create a really good inside - out game.
I agree with those who believe that it is waaay to soon to downgrade Sparty. While next year's team will lose some of its Defense (more DBs as someone posted) the return of Connor Cook will keep them in every game as he is, without question, returning as the 2nd best quarterback in the BIg Ten. Losing Narduzzi willl hurt, but this team is bult in Dantonio's image and he is among the best there is. Next to the game at Michigan, I see the home game vs. Sparty to be the biggest threat on the schedule in 2015.
Yes, more energy than we've seen all year. But as Kellogg pointed out, for a game dominated by the Buckeyes all they have to show for it is to be down by 1. No points scored while DAR was taking a break. smh.
Really interesting article to provoke the thought, let alone pages of posts ! You know how to stoke the fire, Michael!
I do not have the time to look up facts and figures to support my opinion on this, so I will just be honest enough to say this is just my "gut feel" and waver a bit off the OPs opinion of JTB as the starter. And I take a bit of issue with Mr. Citro's position that the "love" for Cardale is solely predicated on "recency bias". I think it is a little more than that as it relates to a favorite for a starter next year.
The bottom line to me...is that Jones ran a gauntlet like few ever have. He was the QB of record when Ohio State got the twin monkeys off its back of not being able to beat the SEC and moreover, win a big game outside of the Big Ten and all of its "softness." For this hungry fanbase, that is pretty damn powerful.
No sane fan can argue with the tools Braxton Miller brings to the Offense. You can also argue that if Braxton had the Defense last year that Cardale had this year, he'd have led this team to a natty as well. But he didn't.....and he couldn't. There is a love affair (justified) for Miller and there is a balance of concern about him as well. For all of his heroics and freakishness, can he REALLY lead this team back to the promised land? Can he win in a truly hostile environment, make 1st Downs and score a winning TD when the chips are flat ass down? I am not so sure. While less than fair, many fans remember the Offense, led by Miller which could not get the job done against Michigan State and Clemson last year. The team could not recover. This year, against Bama and Oregon (especially Bama) when things got squirrelly, Jones took over, calmly and the team responded. So there is your "recency", I guess.
It's true that the Defense bailed out Cardale this year when last year's came up lame for Miller when he needed them. You could also say that Tom Herman really came into his own this year as a play caller ....and improved over last year. Miller did not have the benefit of either "advantage" that Jones had.
One more thing....based on perception. The offense under Miller, even with Carlos Hyde, was still at times, dependent on the big, highlight reel play from Miller. Under JTB and even Jones, the offense clicked like a machine, chewing up first downs, time of poss, not to mention, points. It was more precise, and teams did not know whether to shit or go blind, not knowing if they were going to be beaten by the run or the pass. That was why....imho....we heard the smart ass comments before the Sparty game from their Defensive players. They KNEW what they were getting in Miller and with Barrett; they feared Barrett more, and were proven right.
So, net, net? Call it "recency bias" or whatever term you want for Jones or JTB vs. Miller arguments. As Miller will get what I hope will be many standing ovations when he takes his first snap next year, behind those cheers will be people privately wondering..."can he really lead this team like the guys last year did"? I agree that eventually, JTB will get the majority of snaps next year. But I don't think that will happen against VT unless he takes a lot more snaps in August than I am giving credit. IF Jones prepares in the off-season, I think in the short run, the job is his to lose.
Nobody is going to "chase Matta out of town". He's earned too much equity as 305Buck describes. When he leaves, it will be of his own choosing.
But there is always another point of view to 305's factual argument that I offer...that is supported even by lead writers of this fan site:
1. The 20 win season streak has been padded by an embarrassing number of cupcakes in the OOC schedule over the years. That is not even up for debate, yet in fairness to Matta, it is not unique to him.
2. His post season record is outstanding, but it can also be argued that 2 of his Elite 8 teams under-achieved and should have made it to the Final 4, most notably, Sully's Freshman year, IIRC. Yet, to be an elite coach, you need to cut down the final nets...not be a bridesmaid.
3.The comparison to Cooper for Michigan is not relevant, and I dare say, Cooper recruited way more NFL caliber talent than Matta has for the NBA, if you exclude the "Thad 5". When the recruiting sanctions for Indiana were lifted, Tom Crean stopped being Thad Matta's bitch all of a sudden. Here's hoping today has a happy outcome.
4. Like Cooper.....it is evident that at times (like last season) Matta loses this team for stretches at a time. Not to the extreme dysfunction that we saw with a couple of Coop's teams, but flat and uninspired, even on the National stage, nonetheless.
5. Player development has been suspect....at best. With noted exceptions like Jon Diebler, David Lighty and Evan Turner, there has been a stark lack of real skill improvement from a number of 3 and 4 year players in recent memory.
I am not saying that I agree with much of the commentary -- or maybe even any of it from the aforementioned Penn State fan. But there is more than a bit of concern that the bloom is gone from Matta's rose. Like I said, here is hoping that today is a fresh start for this team and for him.
No offense, but I think some of you are over-thinking this and taking the pessimism about a repeat a little too seriously or literally.
Yes, the odds are against a Buckeye repeat. Not saying it can't happen....see Alabama.
But we are walking in fresh snow here boys and girls. Never before has an OSU or any other coach had to run a gauntlet of:
1. Winning their Division
2. Win the Conference championship
3. Win their 1st playoff game
4. Win the Natty
That's a helluva gauntlet no matter who your coach is or how many QBs you have returning to your roster. I have seen 3 NCs in my lifetime since 1968. Of the teams best suited for repeats, none was better equipped than the '69 Team which for the vast majority of my fellow posters, was way before your time. It was written about that team, that "the best game to watch that season, was the scrimmage that Woody would have between the 1st Team O an the 1st team D during the week." What happened? The Loss to Michigan and the beginning of the 10 year war. The 2003 team was loaded, but who foresaw the debacle with Clarett, the Andy Geiger public relations fiasco, etc?
A hundred things can mess up a run for a NC....so, without reading the entire article, I can at least, understand the premise and not be the least bit offended by it. Remember, the other guys have scholarship players too, and the target on this team will be huge. Lastly, with the embarrassment of riches on this team talent-wise, Meyer's first task going into August camp, will be to maintain a unified locker room.
Take a breath, folks. It's a long journey, and there are no guarantees.
Agree with consensus. Have re-watched both games on DVR and the Bama game really could've gone either way on the outcome of less than 6 plays. The Vonn Bell INT really, really was critical as was the long TD to Smith when the cornerback fell down. When you watch both games, the Bama game was clearly the closer of the two.
Here is more thing to consider Andy (and everyone).
Think of the MILLIONS other big name Universities are paying FIRED former coaches. Notre Dame comes to mind. IIRC, they are still paying Charlie Weiss! smh. And that is just the tip of the iceberg. Think of all the fired coaches with brief tenure (Brady Hoke, Muschamp, etc.) who fairly or unfairly, are by definition, bad hires, yet still on the Universities' payrolls for big money. You can nitpick me on the behind the scenes deal that Smith and the BOT made with Jim Tressel, but I'll stubbornly stand my ground and say that was different, way different.
So, net/net: If Smith deserves a bonus for anything, it is for being, at least by outward appearances, a good steward of OSU's money and at the end of the day, that is his job.
None of this changes his miscalculation of the 2012 Bowl ban fiasco or that he thought the NCAA may have gone easy on Tressel. That is in the rear-view mirror. I am simply addressing the issue of his bonus for the team's success.
Have a good weekend, gang!
Agree. And last year's squad checked out of their season too. Dayton just put them out of their misery.
This Sunday will tell us a lot.
Your comparison to Zwick .......should be an insult to Zwick. While he never lived up to expectations, the comparison is is not accurate at least in my opinion.
The CEO of the Company I work for will receive a bonus that is GEOMETRICALLY larger than the one I will receive in 6 weeks.
Gene Smith hired Urban Meyer, which at the time, was one of the most important hires in the history of Ohio State athletics for the athletic program that defines the University.
So he made a great hire.....he reaps the spoils. As a percentage of what he already makes....for a guy with that level of budget responsibility, it's not that outlandish. That's the way it goes boys and girls. I don't think the Buckeye staff will stay up at night being pissed off at what Smith makes. He made them their deals.....and that's all they care about when the $ are deposited in their accounts. Their wives will be using their Platinum cards with pleasure quite soon, lol.
They're just standing around watching him. That's fine for us fans, lol...but not good for the team.
Loving has regressed to the point where he is just a smaller version of Amir, only with more talent. Haven't seen a kid like Marc with so much talent and play with so little enthusiasm. If Tate had Loving's shooting ability or if Loving had Tate's passion, they'd both be All-Americans. I just don't see much upside for this team. I hope the Schott is LOUD on Sunday, cuz these kids will need all the help they can get. Anything's possible though!
Assuming that is true.....I would guess it's 2 years in a row then.
Loving and Amir. Kindred spirits.
True. But don't lay it all at his feet. This dog poop is being spread like peanut butter.
Poor Sammy. Never met a rim he didn't like. Trouble is if he isn't dunking over it, the ball isn't going in.
C'mon, boys. Get it together. Thad! Bueller! Someone??
Devin Smith featured in the Philly papers this morning; chatting up how the Eagles may be interested in him and vice versa as a stretch the field receiver. He is promoting himself not just as a stretch the field guy (to replace DeSean Jackson, etc) but a possession guy like Maclin.
Interesting commentary. It was nice to see him get some local (for me anyway) press and a bit of love.
Interesting article. I guess what remains is....who the new, 5th slob will be? Farris? Jones? Someone else?
Should be a lot of competition to see who the final cog will be in what will be pre-season, considered one of the best units in the country.
That will bring a lot of pressure on its own....as even this year's D line took awhile to really gel and perform as everyone had expected.
I keep forgetting the Quad Cities....are beachfront!!! It's always good to be reminded. :-)
You make a strong argument, fan.....but I suggest things are not always as black and white as you suggest....with regard to what you are told and what reality turns out to be. Is he full of bull shit? Maybe. But there could be more than a hint of truth to what he states as well.
One this is for sure. Wisconsin, and Barry A by extension, have lost 2 coaches in the past 4 years who have left, by all appearances, in the middle of the night when nobody was watching. That alone, is strange. OTOH, it's as if Alvarez could not have cared less as he got his man Paul Cryst back after-all.
LOL. Okay....in Arizona....in the desert....far from any rivers! And it's still up for sale!
I am a bit conflicted in this report as Andersen was able to field a very competitive (our beatdown of them notwithstanding) football team in the midst of strict academic standards. The basketball team at Wisky has been amazingly successful with the same academic standards.....not to mention looking like a bunch of Lutheran vicars ....so I am not sure I understand this.
OTOH, I wonder why this Forum jumped all over Andersen's ass for his comments if he truly was being honest....and no, I don't have the time right now to go listen to the entire interview.
If anyone thinks that Urban Meyer accepted this job without being assured that he would have more of a say (meaning gaining concessions from Admissions) in the recruitment and selection of football players, then I have a beach to sell you in Iowa. Meyer knew that Academic standards are an oxymoron in the SEC and a big reason for the SEC's filthy success over the years. As we thump our chests over this year's Bowl season in which the SEC got its comeuppance from the B1G and others, we are quickly forgetting the previous ten years in which the conference teabagged the Big Ten, including Ohio State. So, I'm not sure I'd be so smug.
Ask Tyrone Willingham what "graduating with honor" did for him at Notre Dame? Got his ass fired. Yes, I know that losing to Navy did not help.
You can't compete for natty's unless admissions does you some favors. If Andersen truly felt he could not compete (which admittedly is strange) then I can't blame him for leaving. While he certainly did not pull a "Pelini" in defaming Wisconsin, I think coaches are better off keeping their mouths shut. Cuz, in essence, he said that he was was more comfortable at a place like Oregon State which allowed marginally literate players on the team. Not sure I'd like to have that as my sign post.
Actually what made it moot....was the Buckeye performance, much more so than the Sparty last minute heroics.
There was no argument when the Buckeye's ran the table. Had we been curb stomped by Bama, the howls would've come from TCU.
Now.....they and Baylor can bitch....and nobody will listen.
Lol. Might be cuz of General Sherman.
"Plus, people are forgetting that Braxton's arm, when healthy, is better than JT's".
I am not so sure about that. Yes, Braxton's arm is stronger. He can throw the long ball better and his bullets for TDs vs. Wisconsin in recent years were something to marvel.
But I suggest you are overlooking something: JT seemed to go through his progressions better, and you can argue that if you wish. One thing that cannot be argued, at least IMHO....is that Barrett was better at hitting receivers in stride. With a few bad games or moreover poor halves, Barrett moved the chains more consistently and put the ball on the money more predictably. It is tempting to over-generalize the outcome of one game, but this year's offense shredded Sparty's Defense. When the chips were on the line, last year's offense could not. Again, play calling is in the mix on that and so are dozens of other variables. But if a game is on the line, I like JTB's chances of getting in position for a FG or TD slightly better than Miller's........ arm strength regardless.
The article hit home with me in a couple of ways.
First of all, like the writer, I had pretty much written off the season after the VA Tech game. A NYD bowl game in Florida seemed like a stretch. Like Michael, I was 'all in' after the victory over Sparty. When JT went down in the Michigan game, I thought, "oh well, it's been a great season". On this and other fan sites, when fellow posters guessed the score of the Wisky game to be 59-0, as I predicted a one TD loss, I could only pray for those folks to be cured of whatever ailed them. Then what do you know? The joke was on me!
This Natty is the most memorable for me.....and I go back longer than most of you, to the Rose Bowl on Jan. 1, 1969 when the Super Sophs beat USC's future felons after spotting them a 10 point lead. It was a happy day to say the least! Fast forward to 2003 and that game capped off a magical year, with the only stain on the game being Dan Fouts' commentary and the controversy over 'the call".
No....for me....this NC is a classic. TCU and their bitching nothwithstanding, the Buckeyes ghostbusted the curse of the SEC and routed Oregon with no Official controversies of any of the kind, short of some Duck fans bitching about our last TD. A very satisfying victory in every sense of the word. No....what ifs....from a team that by outward appearances and moreover, their performance on the field, was and is, truly united. A game that is noteworthy in that it rescued not only Ohio State's street cred, but the entire Big Ten conference's (and midwest football) along with it. We had no street cred issues in 1968 and 2002. We sure as hell did in 2014 and this went a long way to silence the haters....if even for only a short while.
Next year will bring more excitement, anticipation, and challenges no doubt. Some we are expecting and some we don't know about yet. But I'll take Meyer's advice and enjoy the day. It's been one sweet week, but is for damn sure!