Catch 5's picture

Catch 5

Alabama

Member since 25 October 2011 | Blog

Helmet Stickers: 394 | Leaderboard

I'm a Bama fan looking to expand my knowledge and experience beyond the South. I mostly read the articles but will occasionally spout off to defend SEC country or question the perveived evils of oversigning.

Favorites

  • SPORTS MOMENT: 1992 Sugar Bowl, when Langham stripped the ball. Awesome.
  • COLLEGE FOOTBALL PLAYER: Current: Barrett Jones All time: Mark Ingram
  • COLLEGE BASKETBALL PLAYER: N/A
  • NFL TEAM: Atlanta, I guess. No real affiliation
  • NHL TEAM: Philly, but I dint know why.
  • NBA TEAM: N/A
  • MLB TEAM: Braves
  • SOCCER TEAM: Manchester United

Recent Activity

Comment 15 Apr 2014

I get your point - I just disagree with it.  You don't go changing the terms of an agreement after the fact.  I've never seen a kid on signing day with a scowl on his face upset with the scholarship offer he's signing.  Likewise, if you agree to work for a company at a certain wage, and terms dictate that what you produce is property of the company, then why are you surprised if they act as you describe?  If you are the only one producing results and they don't reward you as you feel is appropriate, then go to a competitor and get a better deal when your contract is up - or better yet, start your own company.

You like the quote?  It was the end of a pre-game speech - I think the SEC Championship game against Florida in 2009 but I'm not 100% sure on that.

Comment 15 Apr 2014
Also realize you got nothing.

Is that the value you put on a degree from THE Ohio State University?   Heck, I'm a southern guy born and bred and even I have more respect for OSU than that!  Of course he didn't get nothing.  He got everything promised him in his LOI - and then some.

Players that see their jerseys worn all over the place like you say not only get the (opportunity of) education promised with their scholarship, but are given the training and exposure to be drafted into the NFL and earn a very handsome paycheck indeed.  Is there any doubt that Miller will be drafted and given a decent signing bonus next year - or that he would have done so this year had he come out?  Why is that?  It is not because of his high school career or potential. No, that is why he was given a scholarship.  It is because he has made the most of that chance to compete and show his skills at one of the most popular venues in the country.  What is that worth?

Realize that your boss got a huge bonus because profits are up

Then he deserved it.  If he took a chance on me and it paid off (and apparently did so without having to offer any of the windfall to me) then he deserves it.

Comment 15 Apr 2014

That depends on what your contract with that company says.  If you are in a position to do such a thing (invent/develop a billion dollar product) then you should have provisions in your contract that would give you a percentage of the profits.  If you don't then no, you aren't entitled to such.

Framed differently, suppose you worked for the same company and instead of your product being successful, it is a failure.  You did your job correctly, the outcome was just not feasible or possible.  This attempted development cost the company several million dollars.  Should you pay a piece of that?  Of course not, you did your job - the company took on the risk of that product and absorbs the costs or reaps the benefits depending on the outcome.

Comment 08 Apr 2014
It's pretty hilarious that you failed to acknowledge that those are all SEC teams!

Of Course they were.  The point I was responding to was that it was favoritism that Bama has a bye before their toughest opponents (who happen to be SEC teams).  I am simply pointing out that those very opponents have the same consideration before the game.  If Bama has a bye before LSU, but LSU also has a bye before Bama, who benefits more?  If Bama plays a patsy before Auburn while Auburn plays a patsy before Bama, who is given the greater advantage?

...ensure that their top teams have favorable schedules. EVERY. SINGLE. YEAR.

Well ... except maybe 2010.  Bama was coming off of a national championship and had a preseason #1 ranking.  I guess you would agree that they were considered one of the SEC's top teams.  They started SEC play that year with #10 Arkansas, #7 Florida, and a #19 South Carolina that started a run of 6 straight opponents for the Tide who were coming off of byes:  USCe, Ole Miss, Tennessee, LSU, Miss State, and Auburn.  4 of those 6 were ranked teams, including the eventual champions.

First, we play 2 of our toughest games ON THE ROAD (Bama has ONE tough road game..)

And who is that?  Michigan State I'll grant you (though I expect a bit of a drop-off from the Spartans this year).  What is the other?  Penn State?  Surely you don't mean the team you beat by 49 points last year -  I mean, not if you are unwilling to count Ole Miss as a tough away game for Bama.

...Sparty was better than LSU last year

You won't get much debate from anybody on that.  I don't expect them to be better this year, however.  LSU has a ton of talent.  They are built to reload and their down years are 3-4 losses and come around every 3-4 years.  They will always be among the top teams because of the wealth of talent they bring in every year.  Mich State is not built this way.  They have very meager recruiting, meaning their good years are a result of hidden talent and good developmental coaching.  These are the type of teams that are suseptable to up and down years depending on who graduates and moves on.  I'm not saying they are going to drop off the face of the earth, just that they aren't going to be as good as last year.  LSU will be.

Let's expand your excercise.  How about we compare the top teams on each schedule and see how that works:

  1.  Auburn vs Michigan State - Both were very good last year but Auburn lost a close game in the championship game while MSU won the Rose against a good Stanford Team.  I want to give the edge to Auburn (AU doesn't lose as much as MSU in my opinion), but you B10 guys probably want MSU here.  Let's call this one a draw.
  2.  LSU vs. Michigan - I went with Michigan because they gave ya'll the best game and I think they are getting better.  LSU wins this one easily though.
  3.  Ole Miss vs. Virginia Tech - Ole Miss beat Vandy, Texas and LSU, but lost to Miss State.  Va Tech beat Miami, Ga Tech, and N Carolina but lost to Boston College and Maryland.  Both will be better this year but Ole Miss will be the better team.
  4.  Tennessee vs Penn State - Yes, I think Tennessee is getting better and will get noticed next year.  Look for them to return to a bowl game and finish 3rd or maybe even 2nd in the East.  Penn State is a dumpster fire.  BOB did a great job of holding it together but I still feel that State is a powder keg.  That said, Franklin is a great hire so it may not explode on them as bad as I think - and Franklin has beaten Tn the last two years with Vandy, so I have to concede this one to State.
  5.  Texas A&M or Florida vs Cincinnati - Sorry, the rest of that B10 schedule is pretty lame.  It is a good thing OSU has a good OOC schedule.  Cincy plays in a crap conference but had a good record last year and is coached by Tubby, who can be good when he wants to be.  I expect Tamu to drop like a rock, but everyone says Sumlin is a great coach and will have them competing again.  Conversely, I expect Florida to return to decency as there is too much talent for them to continue losing to Div II teams while most expect Muschamp to be fired this year.  One of these teams should end up being better than Cincinnati (my money is on Florida)

Now, if Bama or OSU loses to anyone else on their schedules this argument is useless.  No one else on either schedule is worthy of being considered a threat at this point, whether that be a sorry Div II school or a conference team like Indiana.  Top 10 programs like OSU and Bama don't lose to those teams, regardless.  Now look at the comparisons above.  At best they are even and I would argue that Bama has a slightly tougher row to hoe.  That's not to say it is a terribly difficult schedule.  I agree that it is not - but neither is the Buckeyes'.  Both only have 4 away games in conference, and while both only have 1 top-10 opponent (from last year's rankings), Bama has (only) 2 other top-25 finishers compared to none for OSU.  Let's face it, neither of these are particularly daunting.

Comment 07 Apr 2014

So it is unfair that Bama has a bye before LSU?  The same LSU who has a bye before playing Bama?  And unfair that they have an easy game before playing Auburn - who plays Samford before playing Bama?  Or the Bye before Ole Miss, who has a bye, then Memphis before playing Bama?

Yeah, seems completely unfair to me.

Look, I'm not gonna claim Bama's schedule is the toughest out there, but looking at OSU's, there's no way it's any worse than theirs (and imo, it is tougher than theirs).  There isn't a team that should give you guys any trouble before that November 8th tilt against Mich State, and won't be tested again until Michigan.

 

Comment 28 Mar 2014

The one glaring hole in your argument is that the B10 plays all their OOC games the first 3-4 weeks of the season.  When was the last time you played any team from any conference when it was cold?

Comment 27 Mar 2014
Ok. Northwestern can unionize - what now? How does this help anybody? What are they banding together to prevent? Are they being mistreated? All the players sign an LOI that guarantees a scholarship if they play football for the school. I assume all these kids were happy to do so when they did. Why then are they so miserable now? Of course the answer is money. But if they are employees, then the LOI is a contract - and they signed it. If they aren't happy to receive the compensation offered (a free education at one of the most respected universities in the country) then they don't have to play.
Comment 26 Mar 2014

You really aren't too high on the B12 are you?  K State, Texas Tech, Texas, even West Virginia are good teams that have vied for national titles in recent years.  WV and Tx Tech have dropped a bit but Texas has all the talent in the world and K State hasn't really dropped that much - look for them to be in the 10-20 range at least.  As overall conference strength, I would put the B12/P12 even in the 2/3 slots with the B10 a closer 4th than in years past.

Comment 25 Mar 2014
how little SEC teams travel outside of their footprint and play true road games

 Ah, so a neutral site game within the "footprint of the conference" is not a true test of a team?  Nor is a true road game against Clemson, FSU, Ga Tech, Louisville, etc?  Sorry, but I tend to think that the opener against Michigan a couple years ago was a valad test, as were the Chic fil A games against Clemson, and Virginia Tech (twice) - and that's just Alabama.

Just this year, Arkansas is traveling to Texas Tech, Auburn to Kansas State, Mizzouri to lowly Toledo, and Tennessee to Oklahoma.  Since the SEC shares its footprint with the ACC, B12 and whatever the heck we call the Beast now, we can't count games against Ga Tech, FSU, Clemson, Louisville, Memphis (among others) and we can't count the neutral site games against Wisconsin, Michigan, Arizona, West Virginia, etc. that the SEC does do a good job of scheduling.

Hey, I'd like to see more cross-country games - though a quick glance at future schedules produces home and homes with UCLA, Oregon, Arizona State, and an interesting neutral-neutral with Wisconsin (Arlington-Green Bay) - but to imply it doesn't happen at all is to be ignorant of both recent and future games.

Comment 25 Mar 2014
"SEC teams won't come north" 1. Alabama just went North a couple years ago and beat Penn State in Happy Valley. 2. What does it matter? The B10 doesn't play OOC teams after the first month of the season anyway. Not like the weather is going to be very cold the anyway.
Comment 19 Mar 2014
Well, except for the "free" education that offers increased earning potential throughout the rest of their lives. If only I had been so mistreated in college.
Comment 06 Mar 2014

Tyrion Lannister, the greatest character on the greatest show on tv right now.  Great addition to the others mentioned.

Comment 27 Feb 2014

Do you think he still leaves if he wasn't unhappy with playing time?  Several years ago, AJ McCarron and Phillip Sims were battling for the starting QB job at Bama.  It was the 3rd game of the season before AJ was declared the starter.  Phillip played the year out as a dutiful backup and said all the right things.  Then he transferred the following spring - nearer to home to be with an ailing aunt I believe.  He even got a hardship waiver from the NCAA to play right away - but I don't believe for one minute that he would have left had he won the starting job.  He was a kid with a lot of talent who wanted to play, not sit behind someone else.  It happens a lot, and happens everywhere.

Comment 27 Feb 2014

 And it's not 'a coincidence' that the number you oversign ends up = to the number of players that are gray-shirted or transfer out.

No, but that doesn't mean anything.  If I'm a coach and I have 5 guys tell me after the season that they are leaving at the end of the school year, and I look at the roster and foresee 3 positions that has more talent than I can give adequate playing time to - then I can sign 8 over with three incoming guys willing to greyshirt.  I will end up with your scenario but haven't forced anyone out or cut a scholarship.  BTW, Bama has played the last 3 seasons under the 85 scholarship limit, so it hasn't been as perfect as you say...

The problem with the SEC rule against oversigning is that it really isn't about oversigning.  Its focus is solely on the 25-man yearly limit and not the 85-man total roster, which is the real issue.  Tennessee was able to sign so many because they could back-count a lot - effectively filling up previous year's class before adding to this year's 25.  What the SEC rule does do, is discourage teams from signing kids who may be academically ineligable - as they cannot accept more than 25 LOIs in any class.  Some may see that as a good thing, but I disagree - anything that may encourage kids to take their education more seriously is good in my book.  Also, it keeps potential greyshirts from signing their LOIs.  Under the NCAA rules, you can sign a kid on NSD and have him delay his enrollment until after the next football season, where he will count toward next year's class.  He has the protection of the LOI - which guarantees his scholarship upon enrollment for up to 1 year from signing.  In the SEC, if a team wants to greyshirt a kid (and has an otherwise full class) he can't sign an LOI so there is nothing binding the school to the kid.  Again, this is not a very good thing in my opinion.  The B10 rule against oversigning is much better, though it really isn't about oversigning either - it really only restricts the number of greyshirts used.

Comment 26 Feb 2014

In all probability, Saban is aware of at least 2 other transfers  - or at least has two guys who agreed to greyshirt if room doesn't open up.  Nothing wrong with that - and again, within the B10 rules were Bama to be held to them.

If you think that guys who have been on the team for 4 years without contributing in a significant capacity on the field (how does that happen with Saban?) and who have earned their degrees are being wronged if they are told their scholarship won't be renewed for a 5th year, then I can respect that, but we will just have to disagree.  It is well known that Notre Dame makes players petition the school for a 5th year, but nobody cries foul at that.  As I mentioned, JT Moore seems to be in this situation for OSU this year - do you view him the same?  It is not that hard to believe that a guy may not want to go through another year of hard work when he has a degree in hand, is ready for life after college, and isn't going to see the field.

Same with being at odds with a player.  With 85 guys, there will usually be at least a couple who can't act right.  Sometimes they straighten themselves out, sometimes they don't.  Again, Bama isn't the only school with this problem, but if you view Baugh's suspensions in the same light then I have no problem with you.

Yes, Bama has a handful of QBs.  Most teams do.  Most teams take one in every class.  Bama took 2 last year (along with a walk-on) which I thought was odd, and another 2 this year (counting the transfer from FSU).  I'll agree that he may have signed too many.  I questioned one of the guys last year - but he now holds a 4-year scholarship so if any of the new guys leave, it's definately their choice, right?  QB is a unique position in that there is only one who gets meaningful playing time.  Bama has an opening for that position this year and there will be a fierce battle for that spot.  Upperclassmen who don't win that spot may look elsewhere for playing time.  Again, this happens everywhere.  Next year, OSU will have a similar battle after Miller departs.  Do you think Cardale Jones will stick around if JT Barrett wins the job?  It's possible I guess, but you have to believe that he'd consider a transfer.