I agree. Crazy to me that so many Buckeye fans are applauding these comments and some find it 'refreshing.'
It makes me want to puke. He sounds like a prima donna, and frankly, kind of a jerk. This dude is barely a top 50 recruit, and all seems to care about is the NBA. I loved his potential and hated to see him go (until these comments), but he's not some ridiculous phenom. He averaged 11 pts a game last year. On a team that he transferred to by the way.
I won't go as far to say 'good riddance' to a 17 year old kid. But let's just say I'm not going be rooting for him wherever he ends up. Hopefully it is Michigan, so it will be even easier to root against him.
Well, they won't be his incoming teammates anymore.
But it will be interesting if he plays OSU his Freshman year. I would be expecting a hard foul from Kaleb Wesson on his first drive in the lane. I hope those comments piss off and motivate Kaleb and Braxton, and honestly, the entire team.
I get what he is saying, but his reasoning is horse shit. He wants to play for a team that puts him 'on a bigger stage and in a better position to show those NBA scouts.'
Here's an idea, play well. Markell Fultz is likely going to be the #1 pick. Most of his games started after 10pm Eastern time. They won 7 games. Yet he somehow managed to be on a big enough stage?
Heck, nearly half the draft these days are from players who don't play college basketball. They are from overseas. If you are good at basketball, NBA scouts will find you. It is their job. It doesn't matter if you play at Kentucky, OSU, Washington, or some club team in Turkey.
I don't blame the kid for not wanting to come here. But I wish someone close to him would explain to him that is reasoning is garbage.
What does this year have to do with a decommit for 2018?
That must have been a dream you had. We never played Rutgers in Chicago.
'The program is a mess.'
The program could certainly be described in such a negative way. But it has nothing to do with Kam and Trevor declaring early for the NBA.
137 college players from 82 different teams have declared early. Purdue has 3 players. Indiana has 3 (1 has signed w/an agent). Maryland has 2 (Trimble has signed). Michigan has 2.
Tim, curious if you think Kam will pursue playing overseas this year. I would imagine he is close to graduating from OSU and he has to be at least 21 years old.
It just seems like we are finding out about a potential transfer (Cam Johnson, James Daniel, etc) nearly every day that OSU is interested. The guard depth isn't strong even with Kam on board. And I would think we would have recruited Mark Smith regardless. But it almost seems like we are in desperation mode to land a transfer, preferably a grad transfer who can contribute right away.
As much as I would love to land Smith, I don't think it is happening. He would be the perfect commitment out of all these names mentioned. Not only would he add depth to our weakest spot (guard) next year, he also has the highest ceiling and could be in Columbus for 3-4 years. But no recruiting expert has him landing at OSU and today he retweeted Illini Designs, with a pic of Smith along side Illini legends Derron Williams and Dee Brown. I love that Kaleb Wesson tried to recruit him via social media, but Smith did not respond or retweet anything Kaleb put out there.
Assuming we don't land Smith, I like the idea of getting James Daniel and Elijah Long. Long looks better on paper, certainly more efficient, but Daniel is eligible now. This team needs guards depth now and for the future. Daniel would provide the now and Long would provide the future. They seem to have similar skill sets, but would never play together.
+1 for some ALL CAPS words for emphasis.
'Talking with high school coaches in our area, the players recruited for 2018 are good high school players but not players who will make a huge difference.'
Are these the same coaches whose teams defended Goodwin so well he led the area in scoring (nearly 30 ppg)? And why would their opinion of Ahrens and Bazley hold any more water than a Fan's opinion? They don't play in Central Ohio.
I am not sure what you guys saw on Cam Johnson to think we have no chance. Everything I have read online says his recruitment is wide open. But that being said, he has at least 10 offers, so I am not sure any team involved feels all that confident. Maybe Kentucky, because they are Kentucky $$.
As for Daniel, at first I thought it was ridiculous that we were going after another small guard with CJ and Kam already on the roster and Braxton joining the fold. But I have changed my opinion.
First of all, there is minimal risk involved. If he works out, great, if he doesn't, who cares? We were either not going to use that scholarship or Lane or Jent would be using it. It has no impact on future recruiting. Secondly, this teams needs a speed infusion. The Lyle-3 Forwards-Center starting lineup did not work. It was like we were playing in wet cement. I sincerely hope that our starting backcourt is CJ and Lyle. Daniel would bring some much needed quickness off the bench. He basically would be a smaller version of Kam with better ball handling skills. Finally, I agree his numbers are a little scary especially in a weak league. But I read an article about him that gave an interesting perspective. It said the whole offense revolved around him and he was facing defenses solely geared to stop him (double teams, box-and-ones, etc.) nearly every game. He said in the article that he was looking forward to getting better shot opportunities and taking better shots.
I agree that the recruiting game plan has been a huge factor in the decline. It seems like there are too many examples for it to be a coincidence that Ohio kids generally work out better at OSU than non-Ohio kids. Look at the underachieving 2011 class (Scott, Williams, Thompson, etc) and the one and done transfer class of 2015 (Giddens, Grandstaff, etc). Out of those 10 players, one was from Ohio (AJ Harris). Now look at the players that had relatively successful careers at OSU and see how many are Ohioans: Butler, Lewis, Lighty, Diebler, Lauderdale, Buford, Sully, Craft, Tate, etc. And Andre Wesson, Potter, and Funderburk may very well join that group.
I feel like Matta has realized this mistake, but it may be too late. 3 of his 4 2016 recruits are from Ohio. He has Mr. Basketball in Ohio (Kaleb Wesson) coming in this year. He has 3 of the top 5 players in Ohio (Bazley, Ahrens, and Goodwin) verbally committed for 2018. He also has offers out to the other top 5 players in Cohill and Hunter. He has offers to the two top rated Ohio kids in 2019: Jeremiah Francis and Jordan Mitchell.
Unfortunately, Matta may have learned this lesson too late. If he loses his job after next year, I would point to the recruiting classes of 2011 and 2015 as the main reasons why.
I think landing Daniel, Cam Johnson (from Pitt), or another grad transfer is much more realistic than landing Smith.
I do think Mark Smith is a program changer. This kid went from not even being on an all State team as a Junior to Mr.Basketball in the state of Illinois as a senior. He went from barely a 3 star recruit to the #52 ranked overall in the country. I think this kid is the real deal and would contribute immediately.
That being said, MSU is considered the heavy favorite to land him. And with Kentucky, Duke, and home state school Illinois all in the picture, how can you place OSU anywhere else but 5th best chance to land him? I'd feel better if I actually heard he made it to Columbus. He has postponed the visit to OSU twice already. This week alone he has in-home visits with Sparty and Duke (yesterday and today) and an unofficial visit to Illinois on Thursday. I would be surprised if he actually steps foot in Ohio.
There we go. Nice work with the ALL CAPS, fellas.
This should be a fun batch of comments. Fingers crossed for a few of them in ALL CAPS.
Buckeyes cannot play a tourney game at Nationwide even if we were a #1 seed.
Agree with pretty much everything you say here, Wigmon.
I think I have a little higher opinion of KBD than you, but I could say that of most anyone. I just feel like he has all the tools to be a 1st Team All Big 10 player. I have never felt that about Loving. The biggest knock on Keita is his tendency to not be as aggressive as he should. He disappears sometimes.
I am hoping that sitting out a year due to injury and being an upperclassmen gives him a greater sense of urgency. Let's hope so.
'The thing I fear is will Lyle go down the same road, or will he rise up next year?'
I agree. That is probably the most important question mark next year. At the very least, he needs to be way more consistent. Even if he never becomes an All Big 10 player, there is no excuse for the 'no show' games he has had the first two years. He is too talented to have these 2 pts, 1 assist, 5 turnovers type games.
'where if he wouldn't have been on the court, we would have lost by 30 because he was the only one who could score.'
IP, I completely respect your opinion. And on most matters with OSU basketball, we seem to see things eye to eye. But I could not disagree more with this statement.
Loving was a decent (though wildly inconsistent) scorer for this program. But to me, he failed in every other aspect of basketball. Let's start with the areas you can't measure. Not only was he the worst defender on the team the past couple of years, you could argue he was the worst defensive player under Matta in 14 seasons. So even if he scores 22, if he gives up 24 to who he is guarding, did he really have a great game? Secondly, how many hustle plays did he make at OSU? You know when the announcer says 'that won't show up on the stat sheet.' Was that ever mentioned in regards to Loving? And the terrible body language is obviously something you cannot quantify but clearly had a negative impact on this program.
Now, let's look at measurables. Despite leading the team in mins per game the last two seasons (34.0 and 33.9), he was 4th on the team in rebounding (5.3 and 4.7) each season. In 39 Big 10 games the last two seasons, he had 3 total games in which he got double digit rebs. Keep in mind this is a 6'7" SF/PF we are talking about. Turnovers is an even worse category. He led the team in turnovers (89) this year and was 2nd (82) only to a Freshman PG arguably playing out of position (Lyle) two seasons ago. His assist to turnover ratios were worst on the team both seasons (1 assist to 1.51 turnovers and 1 assist to 1.48 turnovers).
I hate piling on the kid as well. I hope he does not come up in comments 3 years from now like Amir still does. But to me, he needed to average about 18-20 a game to even be a 'push' considering all the other negative aspects of his game. And he came up way short in that area, averaging 12 pts a game this past season with 12 games in which he scored single digits.
Agree to disagree. I think this year's team will have a pretty different make up and feel. Loving and likely Thompson are gone. KBD, Kaleb Wesson, and Funderburk will join the rotation. And whereas Jackson and Andre Wesson were basically non factors from Nov-Jan, they should be starting off at the Feb-March level they were playing at which was pretty positive.
Now whether or not these differences translate to success, we'll have to wait and see.
Hilarious. Enjoy the Spring Game.
Forum Post 14 Apr 2017
At first I wanted nothing to do with Bragg.
But if he is interested in OSU, that changes things for me. He wanted nothing to do with Ohio State out of high school. And I am sure the kid has been humbled by his on the court and off the court performance in Lawrence. I am all for second chances. As for Matta, he has built up some equity in this department. He has barely had any off the court issues with his players at OSU in well over a decade here. At this point, Matta needs wins. I think he might be more apt to roll the dice on Bragg and I would not blame him.
As for Smith, I think he could be a program changer. He looks like the real deal and seems like a great kid. But I am not getting my hopes up. I actually think MSU, not Butler, is the front runner to land him with Kentucky, Illinois, Butler, and Ohio State also in the picture. I'll feel better if we can actually get him on campus. I won't be confident, but at least I think the Bucks would have a chance at that point.
As for the grad transfers, I could take or leave them. The last grad transfer we landed, Anthony Lee, was a complete bust. But there is minimal risk in landing one since it only burns a scholly for a year or two.
David is from Cleveland. His girlfriend is either from Florida or has family from Florida and that is why she is moving down there.
Do you think Carlton Bragg is mad that this topic was hi-jacked by 'KBD redshirt' talk?
Hopefully he is healthy and has such a break out season that having one or two years of eligibility left is a moot point and he'll be a legit pro prospect.