So far nothing official with regards to Wheatley. The jags are one of a couple opportunities he is weighing. His two year contract was up a couple days ago, so he is in the renegotiating phase right now. I guess we will find out soon if he is actually leaving or if this is just his agent working to get more money out of Michigan. I hope he stays.
Hate to lose a kid, but it was his choice to go
I'm pretty positive that based on the timeline on how things went down and the limited spaces in the class that Simmon's was forced out. If I remember correctly, 11W staffers subtly hinted as much as well, but it was labeled a mutual parting of ways and not so much being pushed out. At the end of the day, the kid was all Buckeye, even down to a strong level of hate for Michigan, so kind of fitting to land at another rival. In the end, tOSU ended up upgrading to higher rates linebackers and Simmons will still get to go to a decent DI program where he should develop nicely. Worked out ok for everyone in my opinion.
I agree that it was a bad loss, but if you look at it now, it is a 1 point loss on a last second play to a top 25 team ( AP 22 and Coaches 25). I think that is the perspective the committee must be taking. The view is Michigan is literally 10 seconds or so of regulation time from being undefeated.
I don't think Michigan gets in though because I think Wisconsin or Penn State will jump them. I will say though, a 4 team playoff of Bama, tOSU, Clemson, and Michigan is a Monetary/Ratings dream scenario for the NCAA. If it lands on that 4, that probably plays a role, especially since they are a defendable number 4 with 2 losses based on quality wins and quality losses. I still don't see this playing out that way though.
The results really have positioned the B1G really well to get two teams in though. Would you ever have imagined a scenario before today where the B1G would get two teams into the CFP and neither was the B1G champion? I wouldn't have. I also think it still doesn't happen, but I guess it is more real than I would have ever said it could be.
Following back up to let you know I've seen confirmation that one of the referees was John Wiercinski, and he is from Michigan. His Facebook has a picture of him reffing a Michigan vs. Northwestern game, but he is supposedly a Spartan fan. Link to where I first saw the information. Anyway, just following up since I came across the information.
I haven't seen the rumor that the referee that spotted the ball was from Michigan, but it could be true. I wasn't able to find it with a google search either. If the B1G isn't worrying about conflicts of interest then it makes sense it could go both ways and a Michigan fan could make it on the crew. If you see something in an article, feel free to reply with a link and I'll read it.
I appreciate your thoughts on the penalties. The refs made the calls that they did for whatever reason. I wasn't trying to make any judgement on their calls. I just find it interesting that the B1G changed its COI policies to open themselves up to scrutiny in this type of scenario. There is some speculation that they had to because the pool of qualified referees has gotten smaller so they no longer can field enough refs to accommodate COI situations.
I'm going to go ahead and sign off on this topic now though. I actually was done, but since you had a well thought out good response, I wanted to reply out of respect for your time and as an appreciation for good conversation. If we don't cross paths on here again before the holidays, I hope you have a great season with friends and family and a happy new year.
I'm not a smoker, so I'll have to skip the cigar. I will make sure to have some good rum though.
Since you enjoy cigars, do you drink scotch? If so, and you like the kind with a smokey flavor, I can make a recommendation there. I recently just tried one that probably has the strongest smoke taste I've ever had. I didn't like it but some of my friends did. Just let me know and I'll pass the info on.
Damn, you have it better than me. :) I'm headed to the Dominican.
Have a great vacation Leftcoast Buckeye, have a few rum punches for me.
Did Sager do the same with any of the Michigan players? Did any of them get a pat on the butt and an atta boy? If not, this can point to inconsistent behavior by the ref which only adds to the perception of bias.
Again, I am only talking about the B1G putting themselves in a bad position by allowing for the perception of a conflict of interest, not if the refs actually called the game based on any bias. So I am talking about a bad business practice and not actually spewing a conspiracy theory. My comments concern only the B1G and not the actual refs.
poor substitute for the infamous MMan
Infamous as in more than famous?
I'm working on trying not to snap like MMan, but the continual losses to you guys aren't helping my sanity.
Thanks for the recommendation. I'm heading to the beach in a couple weeks. I'll make sure to follow your suggestion then. :)
I'm not accusing the referees of being biased, I am simply stating that typically organizations attempt to eliminate conflict of interest scenarios. The B1G did not do that here, instead allowing two referees that are from Ohio to referee the game (along with another one they had previously fired). So what that means is since the game was so poorly and inconsistently officiated, it can create a perception that it was due to the bias of the officials. Organizations normally protect themselves from these potential perceptions by using neutral 3rd parties. The B1G did not do that here, which is a little surprising since they had done it in the past (2006 Game)
Here are the two Ohio refs
Bobby Sagers Jr - patted Weber on the butt
Just in case anyone is interested in some additional reading, here is an article from Sam Webb.
So just to make sure there is no confusion, my statements have never claimed a conspiracy, I only highlighted a poor business practice by the B1G. At the end of the day, they set themselves up for the officiating to get questioned because they allowed for there to be a perceived conflict of interest.
Not really. B1G policy dictated Harbaugh would be getting a $10k fine for what he said, so it was a given it was coming. Sometimes precedent be damned though and you have to say it. He didn't say anything mean, and what he said is right. Not specifically about the spot, that is about a 50/50 call, but the fact that the officiating was horrible and lopsided. It isn't about missed calls and more about inconsistency in how they called the game.
The B1G also didn't do itself any favors by letting two refs from Ohio call the game that are self described lifetime Buckeye fans. That gives a big appearance of a conflict of interest, and then one of them was smacking buckeyes on the butt during the game telling them good job doesn't help that look any better.
The other part that even Urban Meyer will appreciate is that the CFP PR game just started. Urban Meyer is the first coach that started lobbying to get in the championship back when he was at Florida, so this probably comes out of that playbook. Harbaugh is trying to justify staying in the conversation and being one of the two B1G teams to get in the CFP of that were to happen considering Michigan is guaranteed to have beaten the eventual B1G champion since they beat both Wisconsin and Penn State. It might help to remind the CFP committee of that. It probably doesn't work, but it is worth a shot.
So are you saying you don't hold yourself to a higher bar than a Michigan fan? :) You are right though, they would probably also have a similar thread, and I would still think it is stupid.
But people still behave the same way here anyway. It isn't working. ;)
Being a member of this site for almost 5 years, I'm pretty sure if the Dalano Hill PI call was instead ruled uncatchable or if the Barrett spot was ruled short and tOSU lost, this board would be having an equal melt down. I never get the people that need post this type of stuff. Just be happy you guys won and let them have their moment.
I agree, I don't think he is going to seriously consider his Michigan offer.
I agree. I feel people don't understand that websites are like anyplace else. You are stepping into a community, and you need to respect it as such. A new person can't just come in and say what they want and think the community will listen or not think they have ulterior motives. In my opinion, if you come in using typical social norms, the 11W community is very accepting. However, if you come in thinking you can just say whatever you want because, well it's the Internet and that is what you do on the Internet. You won't be around long, and honestly, that is fair.
In all fairness, I've been consistently posting on here for over 4 years. All the other guys are riding my coat tails.
+1 for perfect response. I give it a 10.
Mercy in that game? You guys scored 14 points in the 4th quarter, were still passing, the last touchdown drive Meyer decided to go for it on 4th down to extend the drive, ultimately scored, and then also tried to punch in a third touchdown afterwards with starters still in with just over 2 minutes left in a game that was well decided. Zeke was given a 4th down carry to try to put it in again. Yeah, I don't think mercy was afforded in that game nor should it have been. I'm fine with it, but apparently Harbaugh wanting to get a first down to be able run the clock out makes him Satan.
Isn't it an offenses job to get a first down? It isn't like he was trying to score, he was just trying to get a first down to run out the clock. Why would any team not want that? Do you really want to put your defenders back out there to play additional actual plays where somebody could get hurt? No. I'm not sure why this is an asshole move.
As for the spot call, it was a terrible spot and he challenged the spot. It was clear that the ref spotted it incorrectly. Harbaugh is playing the long game by complaining about it. If it happens again and he challenges a bad spot, they are more likely to respot it if they should. If the way the rule is currently written won't let them respot in that situation, then maybe it gets rewritten in the future. He isn't complaining just to be an asshat, he is complaining to potentially influence a change. Much like Meyer was when he got slapped in the face and he complained about it.
Those are a whole lot of excuses surrounding common opponents, are you sure you aren't a Michigan fan? I thought we were the only fan base that was allowed to do that?
It is ok to acknowledge that Michigan has looked solid this year without drawing comparisons. They still need to prove their mettle in The Game though. Respect is earned on the field.
In all fairness to Collins in that game, he was playing injured. Granted Cardale is a big dude, so it might have still played out the same even if he were healthy.
Alright, I guess that means I need to step up my 11W game since you didn't mention this site. I don't want you to feeling you are missing out here. Congratulations! You just earned yourself a new 11W Michigan stalker. ;)
It isn't just a tOSU thing, I think it has become an area of emphasis this year. I've seen a larger number of warnings and calls in the Michigan games as well.