Does anyone have any ideas of why Stoneburner has not been utilized to the extent we thought so far this year? I know he has a few touchdowns, but personally I thought he would be the primary short route receiver in this offense. Is Urban saving some of this for conference play? Did he used to open up a lot more of the offense during conference play when he was at Florida?
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I think there have been plenty of times where Stonburner could of been utilized but Braxton didn't get to him in the progressions. Like Braxton has locked in on one guy or he makes a wrong read etc. I think as the offense matures this season we'll see Stoneburner get the ball more, but I don't really think it's that Meyer is holding back that for conference play. I think it has more to do with Braxton than anything else.
He's been a pretty key blocker in several long runs. I'd like to see hm catch more, of course, but people always forget that many long runs become long runs because of WR blocking. Stoney has been impressive when he's been the guy that needed to make that block. Stoney blocking a CB is a mismatch that greatly favors OSU- its one of the reasons UFM moved him from TE to WR. Get him on a corner instead of a safety for an offense that is mostly predicated on the run.
Same story every year..it's the myth of Stoney. I almost knew it would be to good to be true that he'd be this pass catching machine like "Aaron Hernandez"
Waiting for someone to post "Well Aaron only caught x many passes at Florida"...
Run_Fido's favorite word is strawman.
First, I think Stoney needs to see the ball more. He's a mismatch just based on size alone. Especially during times the offense is struggling to find consistency, it would be nice to see him as a primary threat for a quick 6-7 yard play.
With that said, I think Stoneburner's ability has been overstated, to a degree. Everyone wants to talk about him playing the "Aaron Hernandez" role, or really acting as a dynamic player in this offense. I just don't think he has that in him right now. Hernandez was/is a tremendous athlete. Jake just doesn't have that "wiggle" to him to make plays in space. Has he ever made someone miss? Has he ever really run through a tackle? He seems to me to be a guy that can catch the ball and pick up yards, but he's not a big play waiting to happen or anything.
I think the changing back and forth from WR to TE back to WR has hurt Jake and his athleticism. He had to really bulk up to play TE, and it looks like he lost any of that "wiggle" that he may have had. But still, it would be nice to see him get more opportunities because he can really hurt a defense.
"What we do in life echoes in eternity"
I'm thinking we've been pretty vanilla so far in our offensive gameplan. I feel like when we've been down or had our backs against the wall, we've opened things up a little bit. Any thoughts on what % of the playbook we've actually used?
Stoney's definitely been open though, I think we see him getting more touches in the weeks to come.
Greg Jennings "I put my team on my back"
That goes back to Braxton's lack of ability to see the whole field.
Run_Fido's favorite word is strawman.
The playbook will stay vanilla until this offense can properly execute vanilla. Maybe we will get a slight chocolate swirl mixed in with the vanilla against Sparty. My impression is that Brax is looking for Philly a lot, and Stoney may not be the first progression read most of the time, so less opportunities for catches. Hope that changes Saturday.... Lay some right over the middle to the TE when Sparty loads the box....
I agree with a lot of this. I didn't mean to imply I thought Stoneburner would be Aaron Hernandez... He is definitely not the athelete Hernandez is, but from a matchup perspective he is probably our best asset. Because of this I expected him to get the ball more. I didn't really think that it might just be Braxton not looking for him. But I do feel like Braxton sometimes all but makes up his mind before the snap on some passing plays, I just don't get why he rarely picks Stoneburner before the play.
I believe that Stoney is playing a position that neither he, nor Braxton, nor the coaching staff have developed or understand the role of at the moment. Correct me if I'm wrong, but he's more of a hybrid WR, H-back in the offense, right? The role of the traditional WRs is clear as well as, importantly, this role was present in the past offense - meaning an extra year of experience in looking for/playing this position. Stoney's position did not exist in previous years and I think it's an evolving role. I think it's obvious that the team is still developing the base offense and so when the base offense runs like a well oiled machine, then I see the staff making their first priority developing Stoney's position and role on offense. I wouldn't sound the alarm on Stoney's production right now, but I would sound the alarm on offensive execution and fundamentals.
I think your last couple of sentences BCarp kind of sum up my expectation of what the offense was going to be this year. Braxton needs to fully grasp the offense so he doesn't have to think so much he just reacts. Right now it's too much to process. Once he fully grasps the offense and the game slows down for him, he'll be able to make all the reads and check downs, and then you see this offense really hum.
There is going to be a drive in a game where it all just clicks, it'll be like Braxton had an Epiphany and things will just start running smooth all the time. Until then, we'll have some frustrating times, and a guy like Stoney may not get fully utilized.
Stoney would be a better receiver as a TE because he would be covered more by LB which he could outrun. Flexed out he is more often covered by a faster DB or safety which is harder for him to get open. However flexed out he is a hell of a blocker and helps our run game immensely
If you remember, Stoney was suspended all summer. Could it be they just don't have the comfort level together yet?
You can kill a fly with your slipper or a cannon. Either way, the fly dies. -Ramzy
When I said this before the season started people called me crazy and said he's runs a sub 4.5 so he can out run anyone. Glad someone else see's it this way.
Run_Fido's favorite word is strawman.
Every wide receiver runs a 4.4-4.5 in college. Magically all but a handful turn into 4.6-4.7 at the combine. I never really dug moving Stoneburner to WR, but really he seems be playing the same role as he did at TE just split out wide more. He makes a lot of terrific downfield blocks.
Word on the street is Stoney's balls are too big and he just can't get open like he used to. Don't hate the player...
Braxton is missing him during his reads. It appears to me that he's targeting the wide outs and stares them down (which I hope he's working on it this week in practice). It seems the RB or TE are a last resort for Braxton and I can't figure it out. I've seen Stoney, H-bomb, and Vannett wide open over the middle and most times aren't even being checked by the DE's or LB's. I'm not sure what the problem is with getting Braxton to see this but he is young. He'll get better at all phases of being a QB by next year. IMO he could be like Troy Smith and will get better as he sees more action. Look out for his Jr. or Sr. years folks...not going to say it, but you know what I mean...
"There's nothing that cleanses your soul like getting the hell kicked out of you."
"I love football. I think it is most wonderful game in world and I despise to lose."
Woody Hayes 1913 - 1987
I think the vanilla icecream is spot on. It's going to be basics until the offense gets it. I really think we're going to see some new things on Saturday, and hopefully Stoneburner being in the mix is one of them. Chocolate swirl, eh...maybe.
An angry fan...rooting for an angry team...led by angry coaches
I agree with the posts that say we have just been vanilla thus far. Urban has said recently that this team has the chance to be really good. He must know something that we (I) don't. I'm hoping our offense is ready to explode now that the B1G schedule is upon us.
including this year, Stoneburner has 44 career catches for 537 yards (12.2 yds/catch) with 12 TDs.
every year in August we hear that it will be Jake's breakout year. He has averaged 12 catches for 150 yards and 3 TDs his first 3 years. So his 7 catches for 92 yards and 3 TDs, so far this year, have been above average.
Based on his average production, hard to see why many were expecting Hernandez type numbers. Hernandez is a stud. Just because Urban is our coach, doesn't mean all our future TE's will be like Hernandez. I'm sure Urban would like all of them to be, but what were Bowling Green and Utah's TE's like under Urban?
He might make an NFL team and be a fine Pro, but his talent and pass catching oppurtunities have not come together as one. I don't know why, but I honestly don't watch him when he plays, enough to know. I follow the ball, when OSU is on offense, so I can't say if Braxton isn't finding him and he's wide-open.
He is consistently one of the most overated players....The legend of Stoneburner...bbbut he played wr in high school! bbbbut he still runs a 4.5! bbbbut he is a mismatch nightmare!
@Buckeye76 I couldn't agree more. OSU says Braxton is 6'2'', but I saw him on campus the other day and he is barely 6'. It is probably the main reason he isn't seeing Stoneburner since the coaches have Stoney running short routes and he gets blocked out by the Linemen half the time. This is why I prefer to have a QB around the 6'4'' or 6'5'' range.
Buckeye Nuthouse Member 2011-13 season
Block "O" 2012 season
Funny you say that because I always thought Braxton looked shorter than 6'2" as well. I guess we'll find out for real at the 2015 NFL combine...
Run_Fido's favorite word is strawman.
Barely 6'? I've run into the guy a couple times and I'd say 6'2" is a pretty good estimate.
I look eye to eye with Braxton and I'm a hair under 6'2". I'd say about 6'1 1/2"
Sorry Urban, Woody is still my favorite
So B.Miller can't see the 6'6 TE, because he is too short??? Ohhh, ok. Stoneburner needs to be made as the primary read, if that is the case then I'm sure he'd catch more passes, no B.Miller hasn't gotten to the point where he is able to go through all his reads just yet, which I'm sure plays a role in Stoney not getting the ball more then him simply not being able to see him.
Miller gets through 1 or 2 reads then gets panicky with his feet, hence the bad passes too the 2nd 3rd or 4th reciever
Sorry Urban, Woody is still my favorite
Miller was said to be a shade under 6'2''. Something like 6'1.75''. Height doesn't matter anymore. Just ask RG3, Wilson and Brees.
I think Brown is the primary read on most plays. On designed plays were Braxton goes to his primary, it usually is Philly.
Braxton is not too short to see Stoney! Braxton just isn't having enough time to reach his 3rd progression on obvious passing downs. I really think the offensive line is much better at run blocking than pass blocking. Sometimes Braxton drops back and has only enough time to get 1 or 2 reads in before he has to make a move. Now he probably is taking a bit longer than should on those reads but he is learning. It's all a work in progress. Stoney is just in a crappy situation. Went from a very underutilized position, to a system that barely threw the ball (last year) and now to a system that takes time to get down. I think he is very talented and could succeed in the NFL (probably won't be drafted very high).
Marcus Baugh will be a different story. He will have the time to develop into the role we all envisioned Stoney. He will be a major passing weapon.
Braxton is no by any means 6'2''. He might be 6'1 but when you have linemen that are 3-4 inches taller, or more, it gets hard to see. Especially since they keep having Stoneburner do inside short routes. There might be a chance to see him if there was a big hole and good blocking so Braxton could step into it but that hasn't happened much this year. Why else would they constantly have him roll out on, what seems like, 90% of his passes. Yes, he is dangerous in space but when they tell him not to run then he can't be dangerous. We are so obsessed with the potential that Braxton has that we overlook his personal flaws, some of which he can't help. Yes, there have been a few QB's to succeed in the NFL that are shorter than 6'2''. However, they are definitely in the minority and the exception to the rule. I see Braxton being good in college but unless he can become a way better passer he will not be playing on Sundays.
Buckeye Nuthouse Member 2011-13 season
Block "O" 2012 season
LUCKYDAWG, I'm just under 6'2" and confirm he is my height, if not a bit taller. 100% fact.
Also, Corey Linsley, his center is not much taller than I am either. However, your point about the line is definitely true at the tackle and guard spots. Those guys are monsters.
Can we relax on Braxton's passing abilities a little bit? The kid has show flashes. Right now, he's basically starting his second season. Remember, he didn't get much time the first 3 games of last year so he really has only started a full season to this point. Not only that, but he has shown improvement in all aspects of his game. I remember watching TP pass and kept waiting for him to improve and improve and while he did, it was minimal. I also remember hearing that TP wasn't given more than 2 MAYBE 3 reads until his Junior year. I imagine Braxton is the same way right now, and that is why he isn't hitting these open tight ends.
Don't give up... Don't ever give up.
Braxtons def not 6'..I'd put my money on 6'1-6'2". Hes tall ENOUGH I think to not have his height be a real problem for him when breaking down his flaws.
Run_Fido's favorite word is strawman.
Yeah, Braxton's size has nothing to do with his struggles. Ironically, his footwork, which allows him to do ridiculously stupid things in the run game is the same thing that makes him look like a bambi when he tries to throw the ball. He does look a lot more improved from last year, so let's hope he continues to learn and fix his mechanics because talent or size will never be an issue.
Don't give up... Don't ever give up.