Eleven Warriors

!00% this is leaked now by a team that wants him to drop past the Browns or by an agent of a player that wants to go to the Browns like Tannehill.  He took it 5 weeks ago.  If they were releasing it just to make fun of his woeful score it would have happened a while ago.  Someone is trying to shake up what happens with the 4th pick.

it was on ESPN, Bill Polian the colts old GM said he wonderlic has almost nothing to do with how they judge guys, he said it is just something else they can look at. I never played football, but at this point i think Football smarts are much different then books smarts.

@ThirdLeg - if he has a learning disability, how does he have the grades to play football.  He has to find a way to get the grades somehow.  I've taken the wonderlic, and let me tell you that that test is NOT HARD.  And by that I mean it's really easy. 

Here's one for you...einstein also had a learning disability. Id say he was pretty smart right? Makes me angry when people equate learning disabilities with being dumb. As a person who not only has a learning disability but has a parent who was an LD teacher for 30 years I take offense to comments like that. If you don't understand learning disabilities don't comment on them. We aren't stupid, we just learn differently than most people.

@thirdleg

Precisely the point I was trying to get at in my first post.

I'm not going to aruge with you, but those questions are basic elementary math questions (and of course other questions).  However he learned to do that for 15 years should've scored him more than a 4.  That's all I'm saying.  I'm not saying that learning disabilities are easy to cope with, but 4 is insanely low.

Sample questions

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/closer/020228test.html

I could see some players not giving 2-sh!ts what they get on a written test.  A player like this knows he's going in the top 10.  Maybe he figures he's out of school, so no more tests.  He goes into the wonderlic with hat cocked/feet on desk.....puts his name at the top of the paper and thinks.... I'm a baller, everyone knows it, I do my thing on the field..... f this test. 

I see the above scenario more realistic than dude going in there, racking his skull, then being embarrassed, because of what some Ohio State fans think of his score.

Look you guys can say im insenstive to a learning disability. However, have you guys taken the time to read the wonderlic? It is extremely easy. Furthermore, this guy is a college graduate he should be able to comprehend basic math. Im sure all of you clamoring to the defense of a learning disability can comprehend basic math. He probably didnt care about the test, also while in college and highschool I'll bet you he had people do his work for him.

SIR RICKITHDA3RD - " Im sure all of you clamoring to the defense of a learning disability can comprehend basic math."  Yes, because we don't have one. 

well i know people with learning disabilities that

A. comprehend basic math

B. would score much higher than a 4

Dude's gonna be making more money in a year than most of us will see in our lifetimes. I doubt he cares if people know what he scored.

I know Claiborne is not a QB, but I found this stuff interesting:

Dan Marino scored a 16 (or 15 depending on where you look), which is considered low for QB's. I think most people think Marino is one of the greatest QB's in NFL history (albeit w/o an elusive Super Bowl ring).

Vince Young is considered by many to be an NFL bust, and took the test twice, the first time scoring in the single digits, before getting a 14 the second time. And speaking of NFL busts, Jeff George supposedly scored a 10, while Ryan 'bust is my middle name' Leaf scored a 27.

And our beloved and/or hated Terrelle Pryor took the test twice, scoring a 7 the first time and supposedly a 21 on his second attempt. And one of Pryor's Raider teammates, one large and seemingly often inebriated kicker Sebastian Janikowski scored a 9.

The average score on the test by NFL prospects is a 19, while QB's generally score in the 20's. The lowest score on record for a QB in the last 10 years supposedly was Chris Leak from Florida (I would love to forget that guy, 2007 Championship and all) who scored an 8. 

Claiborne's 4 is the lowest known score on the test for an NFL prospect, and learning disability or not, I don't even know why they give the test, clearly the scores have little bearing on how the players fare in the league.

Hail- Mallett got a 26

http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport/status/48375070418157568

Also, interestingly from what I've read Tim Tebow scored a 22. 

@Tenn

Hmm, I wonder if it was a retake.  I wouldn't swear to it, but I thought he got a much lower score.  Either way, not a big deal.  I'd trade my superior test score for their superior paycheck.  Alas.

Hawk earned one of those stars with only his hair.

Yeah, I care this much about a Wonderlic test....(  ). I saw Mo C play football as did the GM's who are thinking of drafting him. Thinking less of him because of this test is stupid.

Bucksfan-standarized test. Awful or not it matters not. Either you can play or not. Mo C can.

Pretty sure TP got a 7, and was All-Academic Big Ten...........so.............

Maestro, TP did get a 7 when he first took the test. Then he took it again and supposedly got a 21. 

I read that eventhough they allow players to retake the test, if the score is higher the second time but close to the first score, NFL teams will split the difference and go with your average for the two. Or, if your second score is significantly higher the second time, they do suspect that you were prepped for it OR that you cheated in one way or another. In some cases they have even thrown out a person's score if foul play is suspected and go with the first score.

Why's that Junior? What in his results makes you think one has anything to do with the other. Ever think that MAYBE he said "Screw it, I'm top 5 anyway" and just went through the motions? No no no, can't be that. He must be dumb because the test says he is so LSU clearly cheats-we need to look into them.

Real Proud....

Eye test. Eye Test. eYe tEsT. Does a player pass it? That is what matters. Not the combine. Not the pro day. Sure as hell not the Wonderlic.

Frank Gore got a 5.

Mike Mamula got a 49.

Alex Smith got a 40.

Ray Lewis got a 13.

Donnovan McNabb got a 14.

Tom Brady got a 33.

THIS TEST DOES NOT MATTER. IT LITERALLY MEANS NOTHING. HIGH OR LOW. GOOD OR BAD.

Yes, that was caps.

To better exhibit his disregard for these employers and their stupid tests, he should have jogged his 40.

False Junior. The test has nothing to do with one's accumen on a football field. Great players (Ray Lewis) have had bad scores while busts (Mike Mamula) have killed that test. Running his 40 is part and parcel to his ability to perform on the field. Again, you aren't actually making a correlation between his test score and why he shouldn't have been allowed to graduate.

I hope you don't have a lighter on you. It might light up all those straws you grapsed at....

What's making this so hard to understand is your perceived correlation between Wonderlic test and College degree and how you haven't explained how one has anything to do with the other. Claiborne majored in the ever elusive "General Studies" program at LSU. According to LSU's website, the General Studies degree is a combination of three minors...

Health Sciences—Biological Sciences, Psychology, Sports Studies

·  Studies in Organizations— Business Administration,                   Communication Studies, Sociology

·  Leadership and Society—History, Leadership Development, and Political Science

·  Writing and Performing Arts—English, Film and Media Arts, Theater

·  Interdisciplinary Studies—Three minors as approved by the Director of the General Studies program

So as the name indicates-you sort of dabble in a little bit of this and a little bit of that. Is it not entirely conceivable to think that the skills one needs to acquire a degree in the "General Studies" program don't necessarily coincide with those that make one a Wonderlic test savant? Or is it just easier to assume a kid from LSU is dumb and LSU greased him through to get a degree? I'm not saying athletes have to be brain surgeons and I'm sure schools make things easy on some kids academically but to immediately make the leap from Bad Wonderlic=Couldn't have graduated on his own is presumptuous.

I like to read law books and legal briefs in my spare time, so pardon me if this is a bad analogy, but I can't help but to think that if Claiborn comitted murder, a good defense attorney would at least try to use his Wonderlic score as proof that he's not competent to stand trial (many competency evaluations utilize both a test of standard intelligence - an IQ test - as well as a a general psych evaluation).

100% agree with Junior. That test is ultron easy and there has to be a reason this happened. Even if it is the kid just didnt give a f*ck

@brewster

Why does it measure nothing (forgive me if you already answered that, I haven't read previous posts)?  

I would say there is a big difference between the test measuring nothing and the measurement being useful to NFL teams.

My son is a senior who will be attending college in the fall.  Most of the schools he applied to did not require SAT or ACT scores. They wanted HS cumulative GPA and he had to write an essay. I asked his guidance counselor why that was and she said it was because some schools believe that those tests do not give an accurate view of their academic ability. Some kids just aren't good at taking tests while their GPA's are very good. What aced my son getting into the school he wanted was his essay, his letters of recommendation and his interview. His SAT scores were just OK.

The only school that I applied to that didn't require an ACT/SAT score was Wake Forest. The other schools (UNC,NCSU,OSU,UCLA) all required scores. I did notice that some schools were starting to do this when I was applying last year. 

At some point, we have to stop offering up excuses. Not being a "good test taker" might be able to explain away a score between 8-12, but have you seen some of the questions on the test? A score of 4 is completely unacceptable if this guy was actually trying.

I've seen it happen with friends of mine where they go into a job interview and then they're blindsided when they get there and told that the first thing they have to do is take the Wonderlic. Some companies do this on purpose. They want to see how well you can do without preparing. But in Claiborne's case, he knew he would have to take the Wonderlic. He had months to prepare. There's simply no excuse.

So even though some of the best GM's in the NFL have said openly that this test doesn't do much for them, Claiborne should somehow care about this test. There are plenty of excuses. Its a stupid test. Anyone, player or otherwise, who takes it seriously is wasting their time.

What about this test is unacceptable? Do you no longer want Claiborne on your favorite team because of this? Hell, I hope 18 teams take this test seriously. I'd be elated if he fell to my beloved Bears.

IMO dumb people got all up in arms defending someone who is supposedly a college graduate recieiving 8% on a easy test.

@Brewster

I certainly agree that the Wonderlic has no bearing on one's ability to succeed in the NFL. (I'm assuming it was intended for quarterbacks, as they need to have a mental grasp of the whole field, but didn't want to be discriminitive and thus applied it to all players.  Just a guess though.)  However, I disagree that it does not have any correlation with ability to graduate college.  The Wonderlic is an intelligence/cognitive ability test, right?  Of course, there are many other factors that play into one's ability to graduate, but I don't see how you can say that intelligence/cognitive ability isn't one of them.

Jr.

I can assure you that my son did not draw a turtle in order to get accepted to the schools I listed.

There has to be a reason for the test or it would not have been around for so long.

Not all NFL teams, but several NFL teams, have very complicated offensive and deffensive playbooks and I would have to believe that someone with a learnning disability would have a problem learning the playbook in a timely manner if at all. So a team with a complicated playbook could use the Wonderlic test to find players that fit there needs and im sure there are other meaningful uses for the test.

@PAM with all due respect,

art schools shouldn't be included in this conversation due to their vast difference with your typical university, which is the scope of this conversation.

Secondly, suddenly I doubt the accuracy of any of your statements, because Bryn Mawr is an all girls school, and your son is, I assume, a male.

I think you can understand my skepticism when you named a school that is clearly not applicable to your son...

But in all, you named 3 art schools, which do not follow the traditional application process. Other than that you named to two schools that don't require ACT/SAT, and one that does...

This is, if you look at many schools, not typical, but the point is, whether they require the test scores or not, colleges look at them as a possible indicator or college preparedness, as is what Junior was implying, I believe.

His exact comment:

"Why do universities require an ACT or SAT score? Somebody must think those scores can help determine one's ability to be successful in class."

Not talking about being dumb, but being prepared, as I stated. My point is, schools are trending away from standardized tests like you think they are, and the general trend is that someone with a low ACT score lacks that basic foundation of intelligence that high scorers have, simply because of the modules that are integrated with the standards.

Xtreme,

I would like to point to arguably the greatest defensive football player the NFL has ever seen to undo that theory. Ray Lewis is the most instinctive and intelligent football player that has ever tackled someone for a living. He scored a 13 on the Wonderlic. Don't sell your statement short either-EVERY team in the NFL has very complex offensive and defensive schemes. Things for rookies will be harder than anything they've ever encountered before. The language in a new playbook requires study by itself.

Another thing you might be doing is weighting the test too much (as most are). When teams decide what draft pick they make, especially at 3 through 8 where I fully expect Mo C to find himself, they will have interviewed him, talked to coaches, rival players, etc. They are going to make a large investment in this kid so they'll have an idea before Godell announces his name what sort of dude they are getting. They'll see his 40, his agility drills, bench numbers, and individual work outs so they'll have his physical traits scouted pretty well. They will also dig into the dude's psyche before they pick him. NFL teams don't care if he can take this test-but they generally know how much info he can digest before he's on their roster. This test doesn't measure his ability to digest a defensive scheme (one that has as many as 9 different coaches helping him with).