PHONE'S RINGING -- IT'S URBAN ON THE LINE
How in the world are the able to do this so quickly? Are they just taking the Freeh report as their investigation? They haven't even announced any violations, so how could they announce sanctions? All seems very strange... we'll see what happens.
There seems to be some- unconfirmed- information that this is an agreement between the NCAA and Penn State. Something like a plea-bargin, perhaps.
Beau Bishop has assumed that PSU and the NCAA have come to an agreement, and that the punishment was initiated by PSU. This would make sense because the NCAA has not had time to come to this decision.
that part is certainly unprecedented, we imposed some sanctions on ourselves, but the NCAA still spent several months finishing their investigation and disagreed with our sanctions and added more... very strange is all I am saying.
I was thinking the same thing. But this disciplinary action has to be more than the death penalty IMO.
Well, don't forget, we committted NCAA violations. Penn State... well, there's no bylaw against raping children. If Penn State wanted to fight sanctions, that could get really bloody, politics-wise. This way, the NCAA gets to look hard-core, Penn State puts the mess behind them, and the mob get appeased. A quick resolution works well for all.
Agree. So it looks like there will be no DP. Maybe something like two bowls banned and reduced schollies.
I see your point. But, the NCAA does have veritable carte blanche power, here:
'Articles 2.4 and 10.1 of the NCAA constitution command ethical conduct on behalf of coaches and others associated with athletic programs, and 2.4 expansively states, "These values should be manifest not only in athletics participation, but also in the broad spectrum of activities affecting the athletics program."'
"Unprecedented" all the way around: crimes, cover-up, magnitude and swiftness of NCAA's response - which - was indicated by Mark Emmert to Tavis Smiley on PBS, last week.
So, unprecedented is still open to interpretation - till tomorrow, 9 A.M.
ESPN has proven itself worthy of abject ridicule, throughout this awful affair - dating back to its immature, ignprance of the story. Since Freeh's report, ESPN has been driving the hell out of the notion the "death penalty" was unlikely. Protecting a portion of its interests via its clout as the "Worldwide Leader" in editorializing the story.
However, Joe Schad on his end of the toss, this morning, implied his source told him the NCAA penalties would be tantamount to the "death penalty" - a death penalty without the name - fitting and severe.
Yep, that's it.
And you thought Luke Fickel was in a no win situation? Hate State Penn, but man you have to feel for O'brien or is it O'brian?
There are winners and there are losers, and then there are "THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY"
I have no sympathy for someone dumb enough to take on the mess he did. It was only ever going to get worse back when he hopped on board.
He did somewhat know what he was getting into, but I'm not sure anybody knew just how severe the sanctions would be. I do kind of give it up for him for taking on this situation that most coaching candidates out there would not take on.
Herbstreit thinks PSU could see a TV ban. So we can't watch OSU/PSU in late October if that happens, right? How would that work?
Class of 2010.
BRING THE PAIN
Ive heard TV ban...that would punish 12 fanbases over X amount of years...i hope this does not happen...
According to talking heads the penalties will be considered as bad or worse than the death penalty, which will not be enacted. The fact that a one year death penalty may be easier than loss of many schollies, bowl bans and such for several years.
DiNardo just said on Big 10 Network that hed be fine with Penn State punishing itself because "its their institution" and then added that he wouldnt be ok with the NCAA issuing "random overreactions"... this guy is an absolute moron... hes said the NCAA is being fair to Penn State...how has the Big 10 Network not replaced this guy with someone with a brain?
Anything less than shutting this program down for a few years is going soft.
"You win with people." - Woody Hayes
Delany's next statement will be interesting.
It's possible the B1G is tipping its hand, with its coverage (as I write this) of the dismantling of the statuary, formerly attached to Beaver Stadium and the impending NCAA announcement.
Read on a PSU site this morning after NCAA meeting scheduled for Monday something interesting. It came from someone saying they had knowledge that they will receive a two year suspension of the football program. Guy presented it maturely and said he never wanted to be "that guy" and seemed to want to stop the rambling assumptions of all the PSU fans on the site. Sorry cannot find where it came from as I have read so much this morning. And I realize it is the internet and anyone can claim anything. Take it however you would like.
Maybe this is what you read, on BSD:
"This is where I share a 3-day old rumor...
I heard from a groomsman in my wedding. His brother works for the NCAA as a PR guy. Anyway, I got a text from him on Thursday about what my friend had been told by his brother (I know, I know…my sourcing isn’t so credible, right?). Anyway, I snidely dismissed it right away as ridiculous and said there was no way. My friend just sort of said don’t shoot the messenger. Now, with this “unprecedented” talk, I’m nervous for the first time.
The punishment according to his brother: two year suspension of program with all players being granted full release with immediate eligibility (which seemed most strange to me since, you know, practice starts in like 2 weeks). Anyway, I’ve never been “that guy” but figured I’d share this…even though I still not necessarily believe it.
by vonnegutnaked2 on Jul 22, 2012 9:41 AM EDT via mobile up reply"
Yes sir that would be it. Knew I wasn't dreaming it. Everyone knows that thirdhand gossip from any wedding is good as gold........right. Don't think many would be willing to go to that extent of explanation if it was a complete farce. We will know at 9 am tomorrow.
The North remembers.
Does anyone know how a TV ban would work? Would games not be televised period, or just not in the PSU area?
4-6 seconds from point A to point B and when you get to point B, be pissed off
If psu gets a tv ban i hope they just get kicked out of the B1G. I dont want to have to miss a game every year for the next few years just because psu cant be on tv.
A TV ban in a post-CFA world is unlikely. Besides, two schools are being punished, for the transgressions of one. That's unjust.
However, making Penn State play all of its games on the road in 2013 or 2013/2014 might be deemed a suitable alternative. That's what the NCAA did - in part - to SMU.
Yet, the oft-quoted source said the upcoming penalties against Penn State are "unprecedented...that he/she had never seen anything, like it."
My guess is, Penn State will suffer the ignominous fate of playing without scholarships, for some time. I suspect there'll be a post-season ban, too. But, fielding teams without scholarship athletes practically assures no post-season bowl appearences.
Like Joe Schad said, 'the penalties could include a "significant" loss of scholarships and bowl ineligibility for several years. A source told Schad that the penalties are thought to be so crippling that "that the death penalty may have been preferable."'
@brewstersmillions that mushroom cloud looks like a clown
Wish you hadn't pointed that out because now I find nuclear explosions hilarious.
HAHAHA I think it is man. Good lookin out dude.
I think PSU is just trying to get it over with. I think the BOT is desperate for people to stop talking about the Sandusky situation in present tense. A LOA, an answer, an investigation, all prolong media attention and keeps the situation in the headlines. Trust me, they want this thing over and done ASAP.
Sandusky trial over. JoPa scrubbed. NCAA sanctions in place. Only place to go from there is forward. No sense in prolonging the inevitable.
PSU is on board with whatever is coming down for sure. The quicker they start to rebuild, the better. Given how embedded the football program is in the scandal, I would not be surprised to see them completely sacrifice a season to create enough space for a legitimate fresh start. And huge money--settlement agreements for the victims and charitable contributions of considerable amounts. Bowl bans? TV bans? I dont know, but whatever it is, no doubt they helped craft it in some way.
PSU wants this thing over. NCAA wants to flex some muscle to fix their perceived 'weak' penalties against us, and arguably North Carolina. I just cant imagine the NCAA would move forward this quickly unless they knew they could do it without protest. And of course, the NCAA gets something out if it too.
I guess we'll see tomorrow at 9am. I have to be honest, as a college football fan I am just ready to put the whole situation behind the collective. It was disgusting and shocking and heartbreaking and exhausting for ALL or us. Prayers for the victims continue, but I sincerely hope we are coming close to the ending the final chapter in this tragedy.
Buckeye born and bred. Buckeye til I'm dead.
Good point about the NCAA wanting to "flex some muscle to fix their perceived 'weak' penalties against . . . UNC." To extend your point further, the corrupt NCAA clownshow is more generally trying to shore up its own internal weakenesses by maintaining public/university perception of its power.
The NCAA's power was first built on convincing others that the NCAA was far more powerful than it really was. I suspect that the NCAA has been seriously concerned of late by all the ridicule its been getting. The more that the NCAA is perceived as being a paper tiger, a joke, illegitimate, the more vulnerable to possible reorganization it becomes.
What better way to flex its faux-muscles than by making a big public example out of a target that's almost universally despised right now, and which is only too willing to assist in punishing itself? If anyone criticizes the NCAA clownshow, it sounds like they're trying to defend the indefensible - PSU - rather than pointing out what a joke is the NCAA.
Then, the NCAA can go back to spending 7-8 years "investigating" Miami FL and looking the other way when Auburn outbids Bama for the #1 LB recruit.
I think the NCAA sees an opportunity - absolutely. It transforms from laughable and weak to virtually omnipotent, overnight.
Emmert could argue he and his organization had no choice but to be harsh, in light of the lack of institutional control and its atrocious and criminal results. He could even say society demands it. Furthermore, a court of law has underwritten any actions the NCAA will take against Penn State, in finding Jerry Sandusky guilty of these crimes.
But, I fear a beast has been unleashed. Woe unto Miami and any future transgressors...
The NCAA has to levy something outrageous. If it were anything seen before, the inevitable comparison will be made. Unprecedented, smeshecedented. What else could it be?
I keep reading that the penalties will be "unique, like nothing else from the NCAA". I wonder if it could be something that I've heard floated that State Penn should donate some or all procedes from football to charities associated with child abuse?
2:45pm update to the CNN article says no death penalty. It also says the school probably would have preferred a one year suspension because the penaties coming are rough.
@schadjoe this morning: What is unprecedented is the process through which PSU punishment handed out, not necessarily the penalties
still questions about the comments regarding the penalties being worse than a suspension...
Exactly. The normal process was circumvented for what is being described as a "presidential sanction?" Essentially the President is mimicking baseball commissioners by "acting in the best interests" of college athletics. Evidently, he has to have the approval of the D1 board of directors, which he seems to have.
A very slippery slope, with this precedent being set. I am not saying PSU doesn't deserve whatever they get. But I would rather that the process was allowed to play out, especially with the possibility of a whole bunch of other infractions coming to roost for "one of only two D1 institutions who have never been investigated or sanctioned for any major NCAA infractions."
I'm not so worried about a slipper slope here. If that were the case, then any future uses of this precedent would have to be compared with this one and there is no way that will fly with schools, fans, or the media. If the situation were say, similar to Miami's violations, then there would definitely be a slipper slope.
I'm with you, Setman, as far as this needing to be treated with the traditional process. The more I think about it, the more I don't like it. Was Paterno determining how football players were disciplined for crimes and breaking student rules? That needs to be determined. PSU shouldnt get a free pass on that. I'm glad they are being swift, but this just doesn't seem right.
Why does PSU get different, and arguably preferential, treatment in this case? This is one of the biggest problems with NCAA, they treat schools differently.
Like many other NCAA programs, PSU received a letter requesting information to determine the need for an investigation. Specifically, the letter points out the NCAA's concern that articles 2.1, 6.01, 6.4 and 2.4 of its Constitution and Bylaws 10.1, 11.1, and 19.01 may have been violated. Has PSU followed those rules or not? If they want to self impose some punishments, fine. But they should still be investigated.
This is all speculation at this point, and it will all be over in less than 24 hours. However, I just don't trust CBS, CNN, and all others trying to break this news about the severity of the penalty because two things don't add up. In fact, they seem to be in contradiction to me.
1. (This could be incorrect but...) It seems as though PSU must have agreed to the penalties with the NCAA, given the timeline.
2. The penalties are so severe the school would have preferred the death penalty.
It seems very unlikely that both of those things are true. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that CBS, CNN, ESPN, etc. have something wrong.
BIGEAST15108 wrote: Recently posted:
So, I have a fairly reliable friend (and save the comments) that has told me that they are looking at a 5 year bowl ban w/ complete loss of scholarsips over that period. No current players will lose scholarships just none available after this years incoming class. They will also be stripped of their Nike sponsorship.
This was posted on the PSU audibles board. I doubt it is this bad but this would certainly be "unprecedented."
If that's the case, a high percentage of PSU's 2013 recruiting class would likely decommit and PSU would have to replace them with very marginal players, so it would in effect be loss of schollies over 6 years. The program would become a bad 1AA team, basically.
At that point, the Big Ten probably should kick them out of the conference. When the big outcry ensued, the Big Ten should announce publicly that "Penn State was effectively removed from the Big Ten by the NCAA penalties. Once the NCAA made its decision, we had no other reasonable choice."
Yes, the Big Ten is first and foremost an academic conference, but fball (and to a lesser degree, bball) pays for all the revenue-negative sports that big academic institutions carry. When the Big Ten decided to invite a 12th team, they invited Nebraska (no offense Cornhuskers), not Pittsburgh or Wake Forest.
As for what Delany and Co. is/are thinking, the BTN's all-day loop of its morning report of this story (which presented better camera angles of the take-down of Paterno's statue than the other news outlets) may become the intro, for a future documentary on Penn State's departure from the B1G.
Simply put, anything equal or less of a punishment than Ohio State's penalty for tattoos would be a joke and an insult to Ohio State University.
The NCAA must hand down heavy penalties, such as: 5 years of not playing in the Big 10's championship game followed by a 5-year bowl ban, loss of 30+ scholarships over 3 or 4 years, 10 years probation, 2 years off TV, etc. And that comes after the entire program being closed down for the 2013 season. The players on that roster can be told they can leave to go to another D-I school without losing a year of playing time. Football then resumes in 2014 in Unhappy Valley. The Nit Lion fans can blame the disintegration of their program on JoePa, the school prez, the A.D. who was JoePa’s lap puppy and coffee server, and the other vice-president who covered up the scandal with them. For added measure to blast Paterno, the football program should have to forfeit every one of JoePa’s wins after the 1999 season. The Tressel tattoo and memorabilia for sale scandal at Ohio State pales in overall comparison and magnitude to the decade of shameful criminal behavior going on at Penn State…in the lockerroom on campus with young boys being raped, Sandusky’s basement and in the school president’s and athletic director’s offices. The university was morally bankrupt for a long time and it's pay-up time for Penn State U.
You'll love this, copied from BSD:
One year bowl ban, loss of 4 scholarships, 3 year probation. The same penalty handed down to OSU. Not going to happen, but living in Ohio, sure would be funny to hear it from some OSU fans."
by PSU_TPS on Jul 22, 2012 10:42 AM EDT reply
Here's more, copied from BSD. Interesting back-and-forth regarding how some Penn State fans view the B1G, their team's place therein and certain longtime members of same:
"Don't understand the Big Ten hate
It’s easily the best place for PSU
Black Shoe Diaries
by Kyle_Martin on Jul 22, 2012 1:57 PM EDT up reply 2 recs
The hate is because PSU has always been an outsider to the other members
Despite that we rank in the upper quarter of the Big ten both in athletics and academics, the other schools have often looked down on us. I think this was compounded by Nebraska receiving a warm welcome.
Financially and academically, the big is by far the best place to be. But the feeling of being unwanted doesn’t sit well with some people.
by ppfcpp on Jul 22, 2012 2:03 PM EDT up reply
Our entry to the Big Ten was met with crying, bitching, and bellyaching. With the exception of 1994, it’s a shame we weren’t in the Big Ten 20 years earlier when we could have 63-14ed everybody.
Our conference brethern voting Nebraska #1 in 1994 because we dared to beat The Fuckeyes 63-14, and two weeks later win in The Out House on our first trip there.
Nebraska was welcomed with open arms.
Countless, COUNTLESS games where we were fucked by the officials to the point of losing games.
by Ab4PSU on Jul 22, 2012 2:10 PM EDT up reply
the transition could have been better
but that’s in the past. If you want to be stupid and suggest we shoot ourselves in the foot by leaving the Big Ten, that’s your prerogative, but the grass is not greener on the other side.
by Kyle_Martin on Jul 22, 2012 3:09 PM EDT up reply
I have never felt that way
Outside of Michigan and OSU, but they think they’re god’s gift to humanity. I’ve met a lot of Minnesota alum (I myself am a Minnesota alum as well) Iowa alum and Wisconsin alum and I never heard anything but positive things about PSU from them. People are holding two decade long grudges that really have no basis in reality.
by Kyle_Martin on Jul 22, 2012 3:08 PM EDT up reply"
Ab4PSU also had this enlightening comment:
F--k the Big Ten.
Then we join the Big East, get through the bowl ban period, go back to whipping the Big Ten’s ass in bowl games.
Just like the good old days.
And with no Big Ten conference and Big Ten referees to f--k us, the beatdowns can all be 63-14.
by Ab4PSU on Jul 22, 2012 1:16 PM EDT up reply
U mad bro?
I've been lurking at BSD as well. They certainly know how to get you to not feel sorry for them.
The differences in the fan bases of Nebraska and Penn State are also interesting. I'll just leave it at that because it speaks for itself.
Penn State fans have long been among my least favorite on the planet. After their reaction to this debacle and after going to their message boards out of curiosity and reading what they truly believe, they've vaulted directly to the top. They're seriously convinced that we're all just jealous and everyone in the world is just hating on them because they're just jealous and this is all a big conspiracy and the Freeh report isn't credible and it's biased.
I know their fans are terrible, but many people accross the nation think we are one of the worst fan bases of all. I know people who hate us more because we got Urban Meyer. They know we won't go away. lol
Dustin Fox was our leading tackler as a corner.... because his guy always caught the ball.
I may be in the minority, but I have a hard time believing the NCAA will completely destroy such a major program with such a large fanbase. I guess I mean I can't see Beaver Stadium not jampacked with fans every saturday, and I have a harder time seeing the NCAA lose money over the deal.
I try to imagine this happening here, and what would happen. I can't picture our fans rolling over and letting our proud history be destroyed because the actions of a few corrupt individuals. I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't want to see Penn State destroyed. We have enough cupcakes in our conference, and I don't think the ones this hurts the most deserve the punishment.
Maybe we could have our first public execution via stoning in Happy Valley. Channeling my inner George Carlin here, but imagine the money you could generate on ticket sales to a Jerry Sandusky public stoning??? Donate all the earnings to charity, and the victims affected. Imagiine the money it would rake in on public TV? Imagine how many pedophiles would re-evalute their actions aftr watching this on TV? Hell I'd take a vacation day to watch, and if the price was right, may make a 10 hour drive.
The problem is one of the guys that needs to be stoned is already dead.
good job by the ncaa on this dont let this last over the next year etc the old dead guy was not a saint look at the time table 2000 2001 seasons they were down losing records and if he let this out the board would have been able to shit can him right then. he let it slip under the radar so tear the statue down etc hit them with big sanctions hope the school and fan base enjoy what their smugness gets them monday 0900
p.s. miami alabama and auburn your time will come as well
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