Dohrmann and Evans SI Piece

Maestro's picture
September 10, 2013 at 1:28p

Perhaps I am too close to the situation to give an objective opinion on the matter, but I am going to give it anyhow.  My wife's family all went to Oklahoma State and my FIL played football there.  To say they bleed orange is certainly an understatement.  I have attended numerous Okie State football and basketball games and my in-laws are very supportive of the athletic department as O Club Members since I have known them for the past 13 years.  So I am certainly emotionally invested in what is going down this week.

That being said I have to say that what I have read so far is really not a big surprise.  I seriously doubt that any major college football program in the country doesn't have stories of stuffed envelopes, cash-handshakes, and out of control boosters.  Those stories have existed for as long as I can remember caring about college football.  Of course, there is more to come from Evans and Dohrmann.  Academic fraud, you don't say!!  College kids having sex, stop the presses!!  

Sure as a Buckeye fan I am a little touchy when I hear the name George Dohrmann, but I don't think that completely prevents me from looking at the "evidence" he has presented with a grain of salt.  The more I think about it the more I ask myself why?  What is his motivation for continuing down the path of Wannabe-Woodward & Bernstein?  ​Yes, we all know he won a Pulitzer and I suppose he wants to taste that nectar again, but give me a break with this crap.  10 months in Stillwater to come up with a handful of guys who allege things that we all know exist in more college football programs than we might care to believe.

I will pay attention to the rest of the articles with my eyebrow raised, and I will continue to support my wife's family by attending the KU-OSU game on November 9 this season, and some hoops games this winter, and a football game next season.  College sports are wildly entertaining and I will continue to attend as many events as my pocketbook allows for as long as I can drag my body into a stadium.  George Dohrmann can frankly go fuck himself. 

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Hovenaut's picture

There's a touch of shadiness about....and it's not just the "off field/season business" among major college football programs.

SI feasts again on drama....more or less, depending on individual opinion.

Do I think something is going/went on in Stillwater? Sure, maybe.

(More importantly to me) Do I care? No, it doesn't affect the program I'm interested in. I find it amusing Miles is connected (allegedly), but other than that I'm glad Ohio State can focus on what they need to do...without distraction.

We know how this song and dance will go (start warming up, NCAA).

Nice post Maestro.....btw how was your 2004 Alamo Bowl experience?

Maestro's picture

I took the high road for the most part, they certainly know that I look down my nose at their version of OSU.  One of the first times I met my FIL I told him, "My Dad went to OSU.  The real OSU."  Yes, I am a dick on occasion.

vacuuming sucks

Hovenaut's picture

Right on.

Reason I asked is that my FIL is a Penn State alum, he was crushed through the scandal and is still sorting through it all. Had to hold in my annual pick six celebration last year, and he's pretty much resigned to the fact his Nits aren't likely to test the Buckeyes in the foreseeable future.

And I spent some years in Pennsylvania, and crossed paths with some real @sshat PSU me withholding my utter hatred for the majority of that fanbase is no small task.

I had to come to Maryland and get married to find a Nit fan I respect.

Baroclinicity's picture

In my field of work, I'm surrounded by Penn Staters.  Makes me want to cut myself.  They let me have it during 2011, and while I wanted to throw it back at them, I didn't.  for the most part.

When you're holding a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

THE_JUICE's picture

From what I've gathered on Evans, he seems to be of the same mold as Mike Bianchi and Matt Hayes.  He likes to troll Oklahoma State and Texas every now and then.
Their journalistic research is similar to what came out about Urban last year when certain Florida flunkie players called our Urban Meyer and his staff for showing favoritism to the star players (as if that would NEVER happen).
SI also mentioned that most allegations were denied by the players in question, which is to be expected as well.  Basically it's just one man's word against another in what appears to me to be a smear campaign against Oklahoma State.
Some of the allegations are things I'm sure happen at just about every program to one degree or another.  I do like that Les Miles' name is attached to some things, but I doubt anything will happen to him.
Altogether, the Ohio State fan in me is just glad that we're not the OSU in the news right now, but I feel kind of sorry for the other OSU crowd and the NCAA attention.

Maestro's picture

I don't mind seeing Miles dragged in either, and I don't think you would find many in Stillwater who would be upset by it either.
I agree with your assessment.  Someone said it on another thread and they were right on.  Unless there is video of money being exchanged or some sort of a paper trail this is just more of the same he said-he said that we have all heard on numerous occasions.  SI has now just found a "new" way to package it by releasing it on multiple days.  Whoopdie freaking do.
If something comes out that involves the coaching staff and female students/escorts/etc or professors being forced to give certain grades I don't think we will be reading about anything that we haven't heard before.  Yet a fan base has to wait on pins and needles all week while Dohrmann and Evans stroke each other off.

vacuuming sucks

biggy84's picture

Requirement for Mrs Maestro that she be any OSU alum?  =)

Maestro's picture

Actually she was the rebel and went to Kansas. As long as she didn't go to Oklahoma her Dad was okay with her branching out.

vacuuming sucks

biggy84's picture

A union of two different OSU families. As long as everyone says, "go OSU" everyone is happy!

BuckeyeMark's picture

I haven't read the piece but my question would be "Is there any corroborating evidence of any kind?"  Or have we come to the place where anybody can just make random charges about any school and someone prints it or airs it (I'm looking at you ESecPN)?  
I realize SI isn't a court of law but if they can't show something - anything - that proves the story then shouldn't they hold it till they can get something?  
The Manziel story is a good case in point: EsecPN never had ANYTHING to prove their allegations, but they didn't mind smearing him anyway.  Do I believe Manziel is innocent?  No, I don't, but it sure isn't fair that someone can brag a national megaphone and shout charges out across the world that you'll never be able to answer ... and they don't have to prove one thing.  That's just not right.

GoBucksToledo's picture

Just yellow journalism, sensationalism if you ask me.  Have to sell magazines/click-throughs and who will argue that college football and scandals aren't draws, particularly when they include The Hat.
Given that these events occurred in the early 2000s, not much anyone, including the NCAA, can or wants to do about it.  Just a bunch of tsk, tsking. 
Now OU or some other conference teams may want something done about this but that would only be schadenfreude.

CptBuckeye24's picture

These things go on everywhere.  It just proves that the NCAA needs reform.  Whether or not it has merit or factual basis is unknown.  A lot of coaches are dirty, the pressure to succeed on the field and recruiting is very high and drives many to bend the rules. 
Boosters just provide the funds or resources.  They are runners within the program.  It is shady business that goes on behind the scenes.

bedheadjc's picture

Why? Why should these things not be exposed? And if it goes on at other institutions (almost certainly, UNC for one) how is that a reason to NOT expose what goes on at OkSU?
It's a good story and it can only help to improve the sport and the NCAA as a whole. Assuming the NCAA does anything about the allegations. If it even can.
Why not write the story? The press exists for a reason, and that reason is not the daily horoscope, nor the weather forecasts, nor the obituaries. Scandal sells, yes. But the press' role as watchdog and investigator easily outweighs its value as an enterprise. No matter how undervalued, or limited (through many means, political or otherwise) that role is in recent history.
I have a grudge against Dohrmann for the obvious reason. I do not begrudge what he does or why.

Maestro's picture

A five day expose that contains nothing we haven't heard countless times before with no evidence beyond hearsay.  We'll have to disagree about what constitutes "a good story".

vacuuming sucks

bedheadjc's picture

Agreed. But since when does a direct first person account equal hearsay? There are too many players admitting that they themselves were involved in the money side of things to be ignored. You might not want to hear stuff like this but it is important if anything is to change. As many writers seem to be pointing out this story, and others like it, could directly lead to players be paid with proper oversight and rules.
I agree it's nothing new. I do think hearing about it is important.

Maestro's picture

You really think the NCAA has the ability to oversee the payment of players?  You have more faith in them than I do.  The primary source of the alleged payments was through the NCAA's approved per diem program.  

vacuuming sucks

bedheadjc's picture

I have zero faith in the NCAA at this point.
How are the payments "alleged"? You have multiple players saying "I took this money". What motivation does an ex-player, multiple ex-players, have in lying bout this ? Other than in service of the truth? They have nothing to gain by lying. All they gain is a clear conscience.
And the "primary source" of payments was the per diem?

"Bonuses were delivered in a variety of ways, multiple players told SI. Sometimes players got extra money in their per diem envelopes...."

The majority of the anecdotes about pay do not involve delivery through the per diem system.
I do see your point about this system though, how the NCAA has no method for monitoring "extra funds" distributed through it. What does CFB do going forward, or what do the member institutions do about the NCAA and its lack of compelling force? I have no idea.

btalbert25's picture

The funny thing about the Dorhman piece on Ohio State is, everyone laughs and rolls their eyes about the rigged raffles part of the story, but no one person has ever given a shred of evidence to debunk that myth either.  I get that as the journalist he was supposed to give a source, but why?  Charles Robinson had a source who wouldn't wanted to remain annonymous and we took his words seriously.  He even went so far to say if that source would have gone on record with the information he had, Ohio State would have really been drilled.  
So, yeah people laugh at it and call the work garbage, but no one ever has proved his statements wrong or even come up with a source who said it was bullshit.  

Maestro's picture

I think the biggest bash on Dohrmann was the amount of time he spent in Columbus to "uncover" something that seems pretty trivial.

vacuuming sucks

Jeeves's picture

The problem there is that Doehrman made the claim. It is up to him to prove it happened. It isn't up to his detractors to disprove his unsubstantiated claim.

Ramzy Nasrallah's picture

everyone laughs and rolls their eyes about the rigged raffles part of the story, but no one person has ever given a shred of evidence to debunk that myth either.

This is a pretty amazing statement.

There is no evidence that Tressel rigged a football camp raffle during Reagan's first presidential term. The burden of proof is on proving it happened, not that it didn't happen.

Dohrmann's source for this - literally the only new piece of information in his story - is such a colossal pussy that he stayed anonymous 30 years later. It's a camp raffle. You're not going to go on the record 30 years later? This was emblematic of how desperate Dohrmann was for something sensational, since every other piece of information was recycled from the ESPN "Ghosts of Youngstown" piece that was several years old. The only new thing was the raffle.

And you don't prove it didn't happen. You have to prove it did. And that's impossible.

gobucks96's picture

After hearing all the defense of Okalahoma State the past few days, OSU needs to petition to get thier scholarships back.. This is BS...