Ohio State sucks. They play in a crappy conference and are terrible.

AngryWoody's picture
November 25, 2013 at 12:04p

The Big Ten BLOWS. Ohio State hasn't beaten ANYONE. The Buckeyes schedule will keep the out of the BCS championship....blah blah blah blah. I know we've all heard it ten thousand and one times. We all know it's not true, but we haven't been able to put together why. The point of this post is to take a no BS look at the facts and disprove the two biggest media myths face our Buckeyes.

Myth 1: The Big ten blows

You hear it all the time about how AMAZINGLY BAD the Big Ten is. This narrative even lead everyone's favorite Mr. Finebaum to ask "Does the Big Ten even play football anymore!?!?" on college game day. THE BIG TEN IS SO BAD THAT A TEAM CAN WIN EVERY GAME FOR TWO YEARS STRAIGHT AND NOT EVEN BE CONSIDERED FOR A TITLE GAME! The truth is that the Big Ten is actually pretty damn good. Let's take a look at the facts.

Comparing OOC Records:

  SEC PAC-12 Big Ten ACC Big-12 American VS BCS Overall/%
SEC    - 1-1 1-0 2-2 2-1 2-2 8-6/57%
PAC-12 1-1      - 3-2 2-0 0-0 0-0 6-3/66%
Big Ten 0-1 2-3        - 2-0 1-0 3-2 8-6/57%
ACC 2-2 0-2 0-2     - 1-0 3-0 5-4/55%
Big-12 1-2 0-0 0-1 0-1      - 2-0 3-3/50%
American 2-2 0-0 2-3 0-3 0-2          - 4-10/29%

Computer Rankings of BCS Conferences:

  Sagarin Dr. Wolf Colley Billingsly Anderson Average RANK
SEC 2 1 1 1 1 1.2 1
ACC 5 5 4 5 4 4.6 5
Big Ten 4 3 3 4 3 3.4 3
PAC-12 1 2 2 3 2 2 2
Big-12 3 4 5 2 5 3.8 4
American 6 6 6 6 6 6 6


See!?!? Don't you see how bad the Big Ten is! They're tied for second in win percentage against BCS foes and their average computer ranking is 3rd!!! How awful! No one from that conference could ever win a BCS Championship! Nick Saban had a turkey sandwhich for lunch!

Take a look at Florida State's conference. They are 55% against the BCS (which is worse than the Big Ten) and ranked 5th overall (once again, worse than the Big Ten) and yet I never hear them disqualified for their conference even though it is worse. Sorry for using logic and numbers and facts and reason and stuff...Apparantley Paul Finebaum being a homer trumps all of that.

Myth 2: Ohio State's Weak schedule disqualifies them from the bcs title game

Ohio State hasn't played anyone. Their Schedule is full of cupcakes and they don't deserve to play with the big dogs because all they want to do is play FCS teams.

Comparing SOS of the BCS Unbeatens

  Sagarin Massey Colley Billingsley Anderson Average
Alabama 55 28 84 61 56 57
Florida State 76 43 73 67 59 64
Ohio State 67 55 87 82 61 70

As you can see Ohio State is a whole 6 spots behind Florida State! Don't those six spots(out of 120) make it so clear how much of a murders row Florida State has played compared to Ohio State!?

So our SOS aren't really all that far from FSU when you look at the numbers, but look what we have coming up compared to what they have.

- OSU has 15 (per sagarin) Michigan State and number 46 Michigan

- FSU has number 40 Duke and number 50 Florida

With Wisconsin climbing up the rankings and our game against Michigan State, there is no question: When it's all said and done we will have a HARDER SOS than FSU. How about that! Just don't let ESPN know...

Conclusion: Ohio state sucks

When you look at the facts, you can see how terribad OSU is. Florida State is much more deserving than them without question. Even though Ohio State plays in a better conference and has won every game for two years straight with the nation's longest win streak against what will turn out to be a better schedule than FSU and has one of the best coaches in the nation there is no way in hell they will ever deserve any consideration for jumping anyone or playing in the BCS game. Ohio State is terrible and hasn't played anyone.

- Somehow this line of thinking seems to be the consensus amongst the media when it's in no was supported by facts. The truth is that Ohio State's toughest opponent isn't another team. It's the narrative.


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Buckeye419er's picture

I don't believe any of this.. you're a liar..  

There can be only one

bassplayer7770's picture

Yeah, it's funny when the media talks about us "escaping" Illinois and things like that.  When FSU played friggin' Idaho, they didn't say a word about how poor the competition was.

Buckeye419er's picture

That's because the media is giving FSU and the rapist a proverbial BJ and they don't want to take the walk of shame

There can be only one

You can't spell chump without UM's picture

Also when they beat Boston College by 14, I didn't hear about how FSU escaped Boston College.

Brady Hoke ate my comment

AkronBuckeye13's picture

That was a gutsy come-from-behind win.

buckeyeEddie27's picture

"'Bama Eviscerates Chattanooga 49-0, Continue to ROLL."
[switch 'Bama for OSU]
"Buckeyes Win, But Don't Break 50, Was It Enough?"

I know there's a game Saturday, and my ass will be there.

Joeyfbank's picture

OSU still can't escape those back to back BCS tilts loses, and the blowout at USC. Also The B1G poor Rose bowl record isn't helping either. JUST WIN AND ALL THIS WILL GO AWAY. 


AngryWoody's picture

So a BCS title and more BCS wins than any other team doesn't count as winning. More recently a Rose Bowl win followed by a Sugar Bowl win over the SEC runner up, the Fickell year, followed by the longest win streak in the nation doesn't count as winning? Because as far as I can tell, outside of the Fickell year, all we've done is win. How long will what happened six or seven years ago with all different players and a different coach be held against us? Forever apparently, because we've won a lot. Besides, it's not these players job to somehow have to repent for a few games that happened before a lot of them were even in high school.

Our Honor Defend!

BuckeyeQ6's picture

The Rose and Sugar Bowls should count, and do for people who are paying attention, but we are still paying for getting pants by Florida.  It's not fair because it happened 7 years ago, but it started the narrative that Ohio State/the Big Ten can't win big games.  People still look at us like we looked at Baylor: "Ok, you've haven't lost but who have you played?"  People haven't seen Urban's Buckeyes play a top 5 team yet and no one really knows how they'll fair (including us--we may be confident, but we'll have seeds of doubt until we see how we play).  It's tough to compare teams and predict outcomes (see Oklahoma St. vs. Baylor being a blow out and Oregon getting killed by Arizona and Stanford).
Bottom Line: People will forget about the Florida game after we win a title game, or possibly if we dominate a great team (e.g. winning convincingly over Stanford).  Until then, people will continue to bring it up.

Run_Fido_Run's picture

I don't know. I see these types of Stockholm Syndrome rationalizations a lot within fields that are driven by ideological thinking/conflict.
"It's our fault that we did A, B, and C in the past. If we can only show the other side that we've fixed A, B. and C, they'll not hate as much anymore and might even respect us and we can start to persuade them that . . ." Step 1: Efforts to "fix" A, B. C.
"Hmmmm . . . now they're telling us that we can't be taken seriously because of D, E, and F. Well, D, E, and F are our fault, we must admit. Let's fix those . . ."
"They still hate us and tell us we're dangerously wrong because of G, H, I - other things that are also our fault. We better fix those."
Brother, the haters will keep moving the goalposts every time . . . Ask yourself why other non-SEC past failures from Oregon, Oklahoma, V Tech, K State, ND, Georgia are so much more easily forgotten?

Chief B1G Dump's picture

In reality, those failures are probably not forgotten. I bet each one of those schools has a site similar to this (obviously not as good). And on that site there are thousands of people scouring the depths of the internet for haters...posting every mention of their respective school...posting a new thread everytime someone says something good/bad/otherwise.
I just dont give a shit about any of them so I only pay attention when its Buckeye related.

But I do agree with your post. Who gives a shit. Keep on keepin on. Love us or hate us...we fuggin matter. We move the meter. Go Bucks! Beat MichAGAIN.

hansman's picture

This _ay be true to so_e extent, but we see_ to end up carrying the hate flag for ourselves as well as those other schools _entioned the _ajority of the ti_e. Apparently (though co_pletely unfair), that is what we _ust put up with for being the _ost visible na_e brand with the biggest fan base out there, the tea_s with the _ost BCS wins, and the biggest threat to disrupting the current narative.

Jeeves's picture

It's bad enough hearing these myths from the national media but even the local yappers have been repeating it ad nauseam all season long (one fellow in particular gets my goad every afternoon just after cowherd.)

Ethos's picture

Actually you are wrong on one point, Nick Saban doesn't eat Turkey sandwiches, because he is death, and death doesn't eat.

"I spent 90 percent of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted." - George Best

RunningFree's picture

I love your breakdown of Myth 1.  I've had many a Facebook debate lately (because arguing on the internet is FUN!) about how the B1G isn't as weak as everyone says it is.  The SEC has come back to earth (after being it's "amazing" self), the PAC 12 is solid, and the ACC is just... okay.  Meanwhile the B1G has been picking up steam during the course of the season, and the numbers are proving it!
Now let's all win our bowl games and open some eyes finally.  Media trolls will always have something negative to say, but it's the average uneducated fan that's really starting to drag down our national perception...

CALPOPPY's picture

Dang, Brawndo's got electrolites. It's what plants crave.
Upvote for that, AngryWoody.
Thanks for the brief respite from a maddening morning.

I'm a hurtin' buckaroo.

Baroclinicity's picture

I hate to be Debbie-downer here, but here goes:
In MYTH 1 - comparing the OOC records, this is so misleading.  I posted the following in a thread a while back that, but it illustrates why the B1G is still perceived to stink, regardless of numbers.
Here is what our conference has done in OOC games that mattered:
PSU- lost to UCF
UW- lost to ASU
Iowa- lost to NIU
Illinois- lost to Washington
Purdue- lost to UC, ND, NIU
IU- lost to Navy, Missouri
UM- beat ND
MSU- lost to ND
Nebraska- lost to UCLA
Minnesota- no losses OOC
Northwestern- no losses OOC
These losses were all to the absolute best competition we have faced OOC.  1 win in there.  Yes, Wisconsin got hosed against Arizona State, but in the end, they lost.  Northern Illinois has owned us.  Statement games against UCLA and Washington (and Mizzou in retrospect) were lost.  Yes, UCF is good, but Penn State should be capable of knocking them off at home.
Our best wins OOC?  Cal twice, Wyoming, San Jose State, Syracuse a couple times, and the aforementioned ND, although we were 1-2 against them total.  I've ignored the San Diego States, South Dakota States, UNLVs, South Floridas etc.
Now, to be fair, SDSU looks like they might be decent after a terrible start and losing to E. Illinois.

When you're holding a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

AngryWoody's picture

Dude wake up. The Big Ten is not that bad. It's just not. We're doing well in the computers and they take into account SOS and strength of victory and all of that, and we're in the middle of the pack(but I guess you know better than them). We're winning games. Ohio State alone has more BCS wins than the entire ACC combined and the ACC gets more respect than us.
What's big 12s best win? Oklahoma over ND. Other than that in their big games they lost to Iowa, Ole Miss, BYU, Maryland and LSU. They performed a ton worse than us and I don't hear everyone hating on them.
You don't seem to understand. There is no amount of winning the big ten can do to change these peoples minds. They hate us. It's the simple truth. But you sit there and make up excuses. If Penn State beat UCF do you think they would be calling UCF a good team? No they would say they suck. If NIU lost to Purdue or Iowa what would they say about NIU? "Well they suck". Don't you see? If we lose to a team it's because we suck. If we beat them then that means they suck. No matter what, we suck. If OSU ends the season with a higher SOS than FSU, they still didn't play anyone in the minds of the pundits. Why? Because they're in the Big Ten so they can't be good.
Look at the facts. The numbers do not lie. The Big Ten is not all that bad.

Our Honor Defend!

Baroclinicity's picture

Pump the brakes.
I merely called out the misleading nature of posting winning % of OOC in the power conferences.  2-3 in the Pac-12... well, great.  They were both against Cal, who won 1 friggin' game all year.  Numbers can, and do, lie. 
Look at the facts?  I posted facts.  We beat a lot of bad OOC teams, and lost to all of them that could have at least helped our perception as a conference, except the UM win over ND.  ALL of them except one.  That is a fact.  Look at the teams we lost to.  And no one is propping up the Big XII, so that argument really doesn't do much here.  You're argument is that we're not the worst conference and that we're middle of the road.  Whoop-de-doo.
While we're on perception, note in my post I talk about this is how the B1G is perceived, not how I feel about the conference personally.  I agree that we're not that bad.  You chose to take the post out of context.  Full disclosure, on the thread I stole my own post from, I was quite a bit more down on the B1G before Wisconsin and MSU really emerged.  That was a few weeks ago.  Then again, Northwestern and Michigan have taken a big fat shit on themselves so it may only be a wash, really.
And yes, I do understand.  I fully understand that when UCF took SC to the wire, they were extremely tough, but if PSU beat them they would be not-so-great.  But the fact is, we're not going to get our respect back until Ohio State (or someone else in the B1G) wins it all.  No amount of mediocre OOC play and winning the bowl games that are the 7s and 8s will make up for it at this point unless we win the 10, the National Championship, preferably against an SEC team.  It's that simple.  The rest of this is filler crap.
I think we're as good as the ACC and Big XII.  I think the Pac 12 is a bit deeper.  The SEC continues to rule, because they win the biggest games, all of the time, despite the occasional egg like Florida last week.

When you're holding a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

Josh P's picture

I 100% agree with this.  The numbers don't matter.  Do we really think that ESPN isn't aware of OSUs SOS or the B10 compared to other conferences?  (Well, they actually may not be aware of it, but it's more likely they're just ignoring it) The fact is, FSU went to Clemson and whooped one of the better teams in the country.  Bama beat LSU and A&M, and while both those wins are comparable to Wisconsin, there's 2 of them and only 1 win vs Wisconsin.  Also, if Bama wins out, they'll do so by finishing against a top 5 Auburn team and likely a top 5 Mizzou squad in the SECCG.  The numbers don't matter.  The fact is, we haven't beaten anyone that ESPN wants to see us beat, and until we do so the negative perception will hang around.  We've got a big shot to make a statement against a damn good MSU team in a week and a half, and hopefully an even bigger shot in a bowl game.  OSU can just keep winning, because if this season doesn't end at 14-0, sadly this win streak will be remembered as a fluke outside Columbus. Another thing, I personally want Bama.  I don't want to see them fall in the next couple weeks leading to a matchup with FSU. Something tells me that if we sneak into the NCG game and beat FSU, people will say "oh but they didn't beat Bama, or an SEC school" All OSU fans should want the same, bring on TTUN, bring on Sparty, and bring on Alabama.  

Run_Fido_Run's picture

I have to agree with AngryWoody here.
I don't think any of us are saying that the Big Ten is good as the SEC or P12 this year, but the Big Ten is as good, if not better than, the ACC and B12. Well, if you go down the list for those conferences, I think you'll see a similar pattern as what you listed for the Big Ten. The entire 2013 ACC edifice, as far as I can tell, was built on Clemson over UGA in week 1. The B12 edifice was built on Baylor putting up video game numbers against inferior competition. We don't ask for the Big Ten to be considered an elite conference; we merely ask for perspective.
The haters aren't interested in putting the Big Ten in proper perspective. Let's not help promote their narratives.

hansman's picture

Exactly...and THAT is the proble_. It isn't that all of us think the BIG is really, really great or the best conference. It is the narrative that the BIG is far, far and away the worst and the SEC is far, far and away the best when the facts support neither. I get that nu_bers can be deceiving (as was _entioned when separating the BIG's _arquee _atchups in a post above), but so can rankings and continued bias. Notice how the BIG always gets dragged through the dirt, but the SEC (or any other BCS conference for that _atter) never has to answer for losses or gets to use injuries (or whatever else) as an excuse. What about a seven loss Florida losing to an FCS team or a four loss Georgia? Two _ore of their _ost hyped tea_s (LSU and A&_) have three losses each. Is there so_ething here we are supposed to be seeing that i_presses us _ore and proves the narrative that the SEC is far superior and number #1 and the BIG is far worse and bringing up the rear? _aybe it is a for_er BIG 12 middle of the pack tea_ do_inating for the second straight year while Nebraska hasn't been able to hack it in the BIG?

ABrown07's picture

"So what's behind such a radical shift in fortune, such a statistical improbability?
It certainly isn't on-field performance. Judging by inter-conference records -- that is to say actual games as opposed to media guesswork and bestowed rankings -- the SEC plays other BCS conferences about equally. Witness the record since the start of the BCS era in 1998:

SEC vs. PAC-12 regular season: 10-12
SEC vs. PAC-12 bowl games: 1-0
SEC vs. Big 12 regular season: 6-10
SEC vs. Big 12 bowl games: 21-8
SEC vs. ACC regular season: 42-36
SEC vs. ACC bowl games: 16-9
SEC vs. Big 10 regular season: 7-4
SEC vs. Big 10 bowl games: 19-19
SEC vs. Big East regular season: 16-15
SEC vs. Big East bowl game: 3-8
The record is clear. In head-to-head match-ups against other major conferences, the SEC has either a combined losing record or one that's generally only a little better than even."
From: "Why SEC Isn't As Great In Football As You Think" by Chuck Thompson 8/13/2012

I don't like nice people. I like tough, honest people.

-Woody Hayes

Urban Nation Army's picture

Entertainment and Sports Propaganda Network

Bet you can't say "Bert Bielma is a bumbling buffoon" five times fast.

Buckeye1996's picture

The irony of all irony is that Coach Meyer started the negative perception of both the buckeyes and the B1G by dismantling us in the 07 NCG. And now he will ultimately end it!

txbucknut's picture

This is simply a matter of contracts and money. ESPN has a contract with SEC, Big 12, ACC, and even the lowly AAC. So virtually every other CFB conference except the BIG because of the BIG network. For those reasons, of course ESPN is going to talk about these other teams from the conferences that they represent and stand to profit more from, then Ohio State or any other BIG team. And it is as clear as day when their analyst are on air. On the lates BCS countdown show this past Sunday, tweedle dee and tweedle dumb (aka Palmer and Pollack) were talking about how excited they were for rivalries weekend and started naming off all of the rivalry games they were excited to see...well guess which one they didn't mention?? Only arguably the biggest rivalry game in history!! THE GAME. I has nothing to do with why TTUN isn't ranked either, because they definitely mentioned FSU-FL. Also Mike Belotti former Oregon coach/AD0-now ESPN analyst, was very high on the Buckeyes early on in the season. Now, even though the Buckeyes are even better now then they were back then, his tone is noticeably different on the Buckeyes..as if he has no choice but to talk the team down. He even went as far as to say they are the most likely team to get upset in their rivalry game...despite the fact that Alabama is playing the no 4 ranked team in the country away from home. This is all about business so as long as Ohio State is a part of the BIG, no matter how good the BIG gets in the coming years, do not expect any of this to change, because it wont. 

Scarlet_Lutefisk's picture

The B1G has a 10 year media deal with ESPN worth $1 Billion.

Rjpfish2's picture

Great post. Facts rule!

Haybucks's picture

Some of the teams in the B1G are crappy.  

If the world comes to an end, I want to be in Cincinnati. Everything comes there ten years later. -  Mark Twain


45has2's picture

Let's just say the B1G sucks. The Ohio State Buckeyes have not lost to a B1G team in 2 years. So, what's your point?

"I don't like nice people. I like tough, honest people." -W.W. Hayes

AngryWoody's picture

I was being sarcastic. Read what I wrote.

Our Honor Defend!