Michigan Upsets Sparty

January 26, 2014 at 12:39a    by Johnny Ginter    
44 Comments
Yeah you keep smiling, smiley

The Wolverines did what Ohio State couldn't do, as they upended Michigan State at home tonight.

Sparty might've been missing some of their best players, as Payne and Dawson are both still out with injuries, but any win in East Lansing is a good one and it looks as if John Beilein has his team playing at an incredibly high level even without Mitch McGary.

Nik Stauskas had another excellent game, and it's going to be veerryyy interesting to see how Ohio State and Michigan end up matching up once the two teams collide at the Schott in February.


44 Comments

Comments

Deadly Nuts's picture

Funny that everything is coming together for them since McGary is out.

Fuck m*ch*gan! That is all.

Buckeyevstheworld's picture

Not all that impressive with no Payne or Dawson.

"YOLO" = I'm about to do something extremely ignorant/stupid & I need an excuse to do it.

NoVA Buckeye's picture

Not all that impressive with no Payne or Dawson.

Fixed.

The offseason begins when your season ends. Even then there are no days off.

Hello_Heisman's picture

Ok I guess.  Not sure why MSU gets a pass for having no Payne/Dawson but Michigan doesn't get similar recognition from you for having no McGary.  Even if you want to discount this win, Michigan still won games against Iowa and at Wisconsin the two games prior. So you're telling me you're not the slightest bit impressed with a Big 10 team going 3-0 against that gauntlet when 2 of those 3 games were on the road?  I still think last year's Michigan team was better/more talented but I'm impressed with what I've seen from these guys over the last 6 weeks.  They're probably no more than a Sweet 16/Elite 8 team at best, but they play well together and clearly aren't intimidated by hostile road environments.

60% of the time it works.....every time

blueinsconsin's picture

You do realize Michigan is missing McGary (pre season AP All American) right?

Not here to troll...Go Blue

Buckeyevstheworld's picture

I had forgotten McGary> Dawson and Payne. :/

"YOLO" = I'm about to do something extremely ignorant/stupid & I need an excuse to do it.

Buckeye Chuck's picture

The revival of the Michigan program coinciding with the Buckeyes' worst season in several years basically couldn't have come at a worse time. When you consider that they are doing this with a key starter injured, with two players having left early for the NBA, and with a younger core than the Buckeyes have ... let's just say I have some concerns about recent trends. 
And it doesn't help that Beilein has been recruiting better in Franklin County lately than we have.

The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.

M Man's picture

In this stretch, we have gotten very good play from Nik Stauskas of course.  And extremely valuable play from Jordan Morgan and Jon Horford sharing minutes at center.
We've gotten good -- not great -- play from Glenn Robinson III.  When and if he starts to turn it on, Michigan can get that much better.
But since you mentioned Beilein's recruiting Franklin County, it is worth noting that our biggest leap forward mid-season has been with Caris LeVert from Pickerington Central's class of 2012.  He has really stepped up.  Defense; distributing the ball; shooting.  In the absence of All-American-type play from GRIII, it has been LeVert who has been a difference-maker.

Deadly Nuts's picture

Funny thing is that we still have a better record than them....

Fuck m*ch*gan! That is all.

M Man's picture

16-4 (OSU), versus 15-4 (M).  It would be easy to jump to conclusions.  Still;
OSU losses, all in the last month:

  • @MSU (no shame in that game)
  • home versus Iowa (a good Iowa team)
  • @Minnesota (ditto)
  • @Nebraska (hunh?)

Michigan losses, none in the last month:

  • @Iowa State (another good Iowa team!)
  • UNCC in Puerto Rico (too many mojitos!)
  • @Duke (*_*)
  • home versus Number 1-ranked Arizona

Sparty is 18-2.  But we won.  The rematch, which should be terrific, is in a sold-out++ Crisler Arena on Sunday, Feb 23.
One thing I like about Michigan right now is how many bodies John Beilein is getting into the mix.  It wouldn't cripple Michigan if either Horford or Morgan gets into a spot of foul trouble.  And in the crushing physical pressure of the B1G Tourney, we'll be able to go deep with 8 or 9 regular players.  Robinson, Stauskas, Morgan, Horford, LeVert, Albrecht, Irvin, Walton, and even Max Beilfeldt to come off the bench to play defense and grab rebounds.

Deadly Nuts's picture

I know. I was just joking. lol

Fuck m*ch*gan! That is all.

Buckeyebrowny919's picture

7 and fucking 0.....unreal

To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice the gift - Steve Prefontaine

BROSEPH's picture

About a month ago, following Michigan's loss to Arizona (and their 3rd or 4th of the year), I stated that they are a damn good team that could beat anyone in the country.  And that they would be dangerous come tourney time, and I was downvoted heavily for it. 
  They are a very balanced team, much more so than the Buckeyes.  A great point guard on that team would make them a legit national title contender. 
On a side note, the B1G is really good at basketball.

thePhilipJFry's picture

On a side note, the B1G is really good at basketball.

The Big Ten is vastly overrated in basketball this season.  The best team in the conference lost to Kenpom's 154th ranked team.  And Charlotte shot 39% from the floor with just 8 free throw attempts and 17 turnovers while beating the best team in the B1G (translation, they didn't have to play very well to win).  Michigan shot lights out against Arizona, started the game before noon Tucson time, had their all America forward that is now most likely out for the season, and still lost the game at home because Michigan can't be bothered to box out and get a defensive rebound.  Wisconsin can't play defense, Iowa can't close out a game against good competition, and MSU can't get healthy.  Bet against the B1G in your office pools and you will do well.
 

InvertMyVeer's picture

'Don't look now, but Beilein has the Wolverines playing like contenders' 

Got it, not looking.

Football is complicated...

Hello_Heisman's picture

Sneaky statistic for you:  Michigan is now 5-2 in their last 7 games vs MSU in b-ball.  I never thought that I would see that kind of success vs Izzo after Michigan's program fell off the map from 99-07.

60% of the time it works.....every time

Oyster's picture

What is the football record in the last seven games?
BUUUWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
 
I also countered the unnecessary DV you got from somebody.

Hello_Heisman's picture

What is this "football" sport that you speak of?  I've never heard of it.

60% of the time it works.....every time

Oyster's picture

Why don't you ask your 'Little Brother', he knows how it's played.

Hello_Heisman's picture

I'd love to, if only I could find him.  He's been out of the house for the last few weeks and has gone MIA.  He said something about "laying in the weeds" right before he left and I haven't seen or heard from him since.

60% of the time it works.....every time

NoVA Buckeye's picture

Then what is this Heisman in your user name?

The offseason begins when your season ends. Even then there are no days off.

Hello_Heisman's picture

It's in honor of my cousin, John. Really good dude, wanted to give him some props.

60% of the time it works.....every time

New alum's picture

Touché. At the same time Beilein has made UM basketball relevant again, Dantonio has lifted MSU football to levels not experienced since the 50s through mid-60s. Odd turn of events. 

Hello_Heisman's picture

I was thinking about that during the game last night as well.  Also kind of bizarre how Michigan found a good coach from West Virginia who could succeed at Michigan after all - just not in football.  

60% of the time it works.....every time

Oyster's picture

Blame Carr and your boosters for running RR out of town, and a bit on Brandon and his ego.  I do find it ironic that ttun fans back hoke and claim that it is common knowledge that a coach needs at least 4 or 5 years to get a program running.  Why wasn't that the sentiment with RR?

Hello_Heisman's picture

Can't speak for the whole fan base but here's my take on why I lost patience with RR sooner than I did with Hoke:
 
1.  The overall record in Big 10 play under RR was atrocious and barely improved over 3 years.  RR's Big 10 record after 3 years was 6-18 with his best record being 3-5 in 2010.  By comparison, Hoke's is 15-9 with his worst record being equal to RR's best of 3-5.
2.  Way too many blowout losses under RR compared to Hoke.  I understand that Michigan's season was a disaster in 2013 but prior to the bowl game, Michigan had a legit chance to win every game they lost except the MSU game.  In Hoke's 3 years, Michigan has lost exactly 5 games by 10 or more points, including 2 this past year.  Under RR, that number was 15, and the trend was not improving (5 in 2008, 4 in 2009, 6 in 2010)
3.  Combined 0-6 record vs OSU and MSU for RR vs 2-4 for Hoke.  Under RR, Michigan scored a total of 3 touchdowns over the 3 games vs OSU and lost every game by double digits.  2 of RR's 3 losses to MSU were also by double digits.  Hoke bought himself some more time by breaking long losing streaks against each rival and continuing to play OSU tough even in defeat.  
4.  Two horrible second half of the season collapses by RR's teams in 2009 and 2010 that were even worse than what took place in 2013.  Having said that, the collapse under Hoke (punctuated by the beat down in East Lansing) clearly made Hoke's seat warm whereas prior to that he was considered untouchable.  A follow up performance in 2014 may well result in the same ending for Hoke as it did for RR.
5.  Even though I don't blame RR for this, it's clear for whatever reason that the Michigan family/boosters/alumni did not fully support him and that this was impacting the national perception of the team and recruiting.  Hoke, despite his many faults has not triggered the same divisiveness to date, creating the perception of a more stable program.
6.  Attrition - on the program stability front, player attrition was far far worse under RR than under Hoke.  While RR recruited pretty good talent, he couldn't keep his classes together for various reasons.  This absolutely killed the depth chart and put a number of true freshmen on the field during RR's tenure before they were anywhere near ready to play.  Under Hoke, the attrition factor has diminished significantly the last 2 years.
7.  The defense was bad under RR and it got progressively worse.  Michigan fielded the worst defense in school history in 2009 and somehow managed to get even worse in 2010.  Part of it was the attrition issues noted above but another big part of it was RR just sucking as a coach when it came to defense, yet still forcing his coordinators to run a 3-3-5 that was not suited to work in Big 10 play.   While the defense has not become elite under Hoke, it's generally been adequate against most opponents, to the point where Michigan doesn't need to score 30 plus every week in order to win.
8.  The recruiting under Hoke has been better than under RR, and most of Hoke's big recruiting classes are still underclassmen who have not yet left the program.  As a result, there's  actually some legitimate depth and talent being built up that can sustain the program for a couple years into the future if wholesale changes aren't made.  If RR at least had built up some stability on the roster front with more layers of talent who actually stayed with the program, I may have been inclined to give him another year or two to figure things out.  But under RR, the present was terrible and the future didn't look very promising either.
 
That being said, I am losing patience with Hoke because it looks like the team was not well coached this past year.  I thought there were some good strides made in 2011 and 2012, but 2013 was a BIG step backwards in terms of both on the field production and player development.  Another season like that and I will be actively calling for Hoke's head just like I did for RR's.

60% of the time it works.....every time

Oyster's picture

How do you account for the fact that the best season hoke had was basically with an RR team, and since he has been putting his recruits in he has regressed?  Is that not a concern?  I know I would be asking questions.  And it's not just on Borges either, the defense has a few qestionu marks also, although I probably shouldn't talk when you consider what OSU has been putting on the field ; )

Hello_Heisman's picture

It's definitely a concern, though I put more emphasis on the decline in record in 2013 than I do 2012.  Both the 2011 and 2012 teams were pretty similar, only the 2011 team had a much more favorable schedule which was easily worth a couple extra wins compared to 2012.  2013 had a pretty manageable schedule, so 7-6 makes no sense to me and is clearly a concern.  I strongly believe that RR as coach would not have gotten the 2011 outfit to 11-2 though, because the team wouldn't have been very good defensively with RR at the helm. 
Defense was very shaky in the latter half of 2013 for sure.  My concerns about this coaching staff aren't just about Hoke or Borges, but the entire crew.  But I'm willing to be a little more patient than I was with RR because they've at least had some success at Michigan thus far.  Again, if 2014 is a repeat of 2013 then there's clearly a significant negative trend that can no longer be explained away.  If that happens, I'll be fully in favor of firing Hoke and starting over.

60% of the time it works.....every time

M Man's picture

This is all true; it is also in 20/20 hindisght.
HH has left out the one true outrage of the Rodriguez years; the malicious (there's no other adjective for it) hit-job (there's no other noun for it) on the program by Michael Rosenberg and Mark Snyder of the Detroit Free Press, for reasons that remain as mysterious and as suspicious as ever.
The story led directly (and intentionally!) to an NCAA investigation.  The NCAA investigation was crippling in terms of time, attention, and general damage most particularly recruiting.
Lots of influential supporters of the Michigan Athletic Department said that they could easily have tolerated some tough years as we transitioned to Rodriguez's spread offense (which happened mostly on schedule) but many of them said that they could never tolerate even an appearance of a dirty program.  Rosenberg deliberately chose to hit the program in its most vulnerable spot; respectability.  His story was almost all manufactured.  But it was devastating in its effectiveness, in poisoning the Rodriguez tenure forever. 

Hello_Heisman's picture

M Man - that's very true, but it had no bearing on why I turned on RR. I knew that piece was a smear job so I just chose to ignore it. I think the bigger problem was the extent to which it contributed to the divisiveness among the boosters and alumni.

60% of the time it works.....every time

New alum's picture

I agree. Beilein is a heck of a coach. I thought he was terrific at WVU, and the turnaround he has engineered at UM has been remarkable.

Knarcisi's picture

Ooh, I'm real scared. 

mr.green's picture

Don't give a damn. 

BamaBuckeye144's picture

Nice win. Too bad you're still scUM.

OH-IO!

allbucksallthetime's picture

Bellein is a terrific coach and scUM is a very skilled team.  Regardless of who played or not for MSU, winning in the Breslin Center is never easy, so that win last night is a big one for scUM.  
The B1G race is starting to take shape though there are many land mines in the road ahead for anyone to be very comfortable.  It will be fun seeing how this all plays out though, from Sparty's perspective, and having the 2 big kids out right now may well work to their advantage come tournament time.  Go Bucks!     

Scotts_MI_Buck's picture

There's something about the #3 ranking: tOSU had a 4-game skid once ranked #3, wisky had a 3-game skid, and now msu has at least 1 loss....watch out Nova!

ScarletNGrey01's picture


 

The will to win is not as important as the will to prepare to win. -- Woody Hayes

Deadly Nuts's picture

Is that Gary Harris?

Fuck m*ch*gan! That is all.

sivaDavis's picture

Blue, Heisman and MMan, I love all three of ya, but damn I've had my UM fix for the day. I found this site that would happily accept this ongoing convo though. Looks kind of prehistoric but seems to get the job done...
 
http://mgoblog.com

"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes

Hello_Heisman's picture

Mgoblog?  Never heard of it.  Does the site cover that "football" sport that some earlier posters mentioned?

60% of the time it works.....every time

sivaDavis's picture

They seem to be talking about this "basket-ball" sport. Never heard of it....
*Goes and weeps in the nearest corner*

"I've had smarter people around me all my life, but I haven't run into one yet that can outwork me. And if they can't outwork you, then smarts aren't going to do them much good." - Woody Hayes

M Man's picture

All ur Pickeringtons are belong to us.