AP Voters Talk Ohio State Title Odds

By Kyle Rowland on November 29, 2012 at 10:00a
193 Comments

It’s been 38 years since a team on probation won the national championship. And that streak appears well on its way to stretching to 39 years, according to several Associated Press voters Eleven Warriors spoke to. 

Urban Meyer's chances of winning title No. 3 are slim.

Most seasons, an undefeated record would ensure being included in the national championship discussion. Ohio State’s past history is proof. Saturday’s win over Michigan marked just the sixth perfect season in program history – 2012 joins 2002, 1968, 1954, 1944 and 1916. In three of those seasons – ’02, ’68 and ’54 – the Buckeyes won the national championship.

With only one other unbeaten team – No. 1 Notre Dame – their chances would be appear to be increased. But the Buckeyes, ranked fourth in the AP poll, aren’t even in the same stratosphere.

Notre Dame will play either one-loss Alabama or one-loss Georgia in the national championship game. And should Notre Dame lose, Alabama or Georgia is a near lock at claiming the AP title despite Ohio State’s unblemished record.

“Whoever wins the national title game is going to have a win that’s too impressive to ignore,” Mike Hlas, sports columnist at the Cedar Rapids Gazette, said.

“(Ohio State’s) schedule isn’t strong enough to warrant (a national championship). In a different year, yes. But they haven’t beaten a team that’s in the top 10. I thought they played a very weak non-conference schedule. The number of escapes they had probably didn’t help either.”

Hlas had Ohio State slotted No. 2 on his ballot, but dropped the Buckeyes to fifth, even after a win over then-No. 20 Michigan.

“Saturday, my eyeball test told me they’re not Alabama,” he said. “They’re probably not one of the five best SEC teams.” 

There have been four split national championships since 1990, with the last coming in 2003. LSU claimed the coaches’ poll and USC was voted No. 1 by the AP. Each team suffered one loss during the season, but the Trojans were shut out of the BCS championship game despite being the top-ranked team in both polls. LSU beat Oklahoma in the Sugar Bowl, designated as the championship game, and automatically won the crystal football awarded by the coaches.

The group of coaches who vote in the coaches’ poll are contractually obligated to vote for the winner of the BCS championship game No. 1 on their final ballots. In 2003, however, three coaches voted for USC.

Following the 2003 season, the AP removed its poll from the BCS formula.

In 2004, Auburn was shut out of the national championship game after an undefeated season in the vaunted SEC. USC and Oklahoma, also both undefeated, played for the national championship. But a 55-19 USC win avoided another split title.

That same season a young Ohio-born head coach was busy performing a college football miracle thousands of miles from home. In Salt Lake City, Urban Meyer, in his second season guiding the Utah Utes, led his unheralded Mountain West bunch to a 13-0 record with wins over Texas A&M and Arizona in the regular season and Pittsburgh in the Fiesta Bowl.

Barry Switzer's Sooners navigated probation with ease.

Still, a weak schedule – and USC’s impressive play – was Utah’s downfall. The Mountain West was still years away from earning respect.

The 1974 Oklahoma Sooners were the last – and only – team to win the title while on probation. Voters certainly had no issues placing the Sooners first considering they were preseason No. 1. But the 1993 Auburn Tigers experienced strong pushback when they completed an unbeaten season while on probation after years of rampant cheating. Auburn was No. 4 in the final poll. Whether there’s a built-in vendetta against the Buckeyes or not remains murky.

Ohio State’s bowl ban hasn’t swayed Hlas and Cecil Hurt’s voting philosophies. But they believe overall, it has had a cumulative effect on the 60 poll voters.

“I think there has been (bias) in the polling all year,” Hlas said. “In any normal year, if Ohio State was unbeaten, it would be ranked higher than it’s been.”

“If you’re not going to vote for them because of the probation, you have to start at the first of the year and not put them in the top 25,” Hurt, an AP poll voter and Tuscaloosa News sports editor, said. "You’re just playing a silly game if you say you’re not going to vote them high because they’re on probation.

“But what the probation does do is prevent them from having postseason opportunities to move up. You can’t just assume they’d win their two extra games because they won their first 12.”

Oklahoma played in a competitive Big Eight Conference in ’74, defeating the No. 17 and 6 teams in the country.

Ohio State was only ranked 18th when the season started and stumbled against inferior non-conference teams, winning by close margins. Another roadblock was the weak Big Ten. Ohio State beat three ranked teams, but none were ranked higher than 20th at the time the Buckeyes won.

That hasn’t stopped Meyer from espousing the belief in his team.

“I really believe we can play with any team in the country,” he said. “That’s all I can tell you.” 

The Sooners could too, running roughshod over the competition and scoring 43 points per game.

“I don’t think it’s a vintage year in the Big Ten,” Hurt said. “It’s a great accomplishment to go undefeated, but I don’t think it’s the best year the Big Ten has had.

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”

But blowouts and wins over marquee opponents weren’t the only factor in Oklahoma securing the top spot. The Sooners also were the lone undefeated team after Alabama lost to Notre Dame in the Orange Bowl.

An Irish loss this season would mean the Buckeyes are the only undefeated team. But the days of being undefeated signaling superiority have long since passed. Or have they?

“Notre Dame is a unanimous No. 1, and it’s because they’re undefeated,” Hurt said. “I don’t think there’s any question about that. I don’t think all 60 voters think that on a neutral field Notre Dame could beat Florida, Georgia or Alabama.”

Is Ohio State more deserving than Georgia? 

So, in what scenario could Ohio State end up No. 1? Well, if you’re Chadd Cripe, the Boise State beat writer for the Idaho Statesman, there is none.

“If Notre Dame wins, Ohio State shouldn't get any No. 1 votes,” said Cripe, who voted the Buckeyes fifth on his latest ballot. “The Irish would have wins over the SEC champion, likely the Pac-12 champion (Stanford) and likely the Big 12 runner-up (Oklahoma).”

Not many would argue if it plays out that way. Notre Dame, while it hasn’t won impressively every week, did still win all of its games and would add another high-level victory to its resume were it to win in Miami.

But Ohio State fans would find it tough to swallow if another SEC team was crowned champion, especially if that team has a loss. Cripe, however, says Alabama’s win over Notre Dame, LSU and Georgia or Georgia’s wins over Notre Dame, Alabama and Florida are too much to ignore.

“Ohio State can't compete with that,” he said. “While the contrarian in me might be tempted to vote for a split title, the Buckeyes' resume isn't strong enough to support going that direction.”

Should that second situation play out, though, Hurt believes the Buckeyes could garner some first-place votes, just probably not enough to win the national championship.

“We’ll see what happens in the bowl games,” Hurt said. “I’m not going to say it’s absolutely impossible. If Alabama-Georgia isn’t a particularly good game and one of them beats Notre Dame in another not particularly good game, you reevaluate. But right now it would be hard for me to say Ohio State is better than those teams.”

Buckeye Nation’s best hope is for Georgia to win two sloppy games. The Bulldogs’ 35-7 loss to South Carolina is the elephant in the room, not Alabama’s mascot. 

While strength of schedule didn’t help Ohio State’s matters, if it were eligible for the postseason, it would have two games left to impress voters. And if it won the first – the Big Ten Championship Game versus Nebraska – it would likely be playing Notre Dame for the national championship.

“It’s unfortunate they don’t get a chance to play those games,” Hurt said.

“If you aren’t playing (the week of the championship game), you really get lost in all the hype and hours and hours of ESPN coverage. It all goes to the teams that are playing. It’s everyone saying, this game is for the national championship. It’s like being a third-party presidential candidate.”

But the Buckeyes’ fate was known before the season, and the coaches and team has been resigned to that.

“If everything falls into place and we’re AP national champions that’s great,” senior right tackle Reid Fragel said. “That’s icing on the cake.”

193 Comments

Comments

Denny's picture

Completely tangential, but: holy crap, Barry Switzer might be Gene Chizik's dad

Taquitos.

hodge's picture

You mean because of their shared facial expressions, or mutual penchant for moral ambiguity?

Denny's picture

Yais.

Taquitos.

sharkvsghost's picture

could make for the greatest Maury episode ever.

swing hard in case you hit it.

Ahh Saturday's picture

“Saturday, my eyeball test told me they’re not Alabama,” he said. “They’re probably not one of the five best SEC teams.”

 
Apparently Hlas's "eyeball test" involves plucking his eyeball from his head, shoving it up his a** and then casting an AP vote.

MediBuck's picture

Hlas needs to open his grammar textbook again:
Of course OSU isn't one of the five best SEC teams--we're in the BIG TEN. You're missing a prepositon there, buddy.
*pauses for Ramzy bring down Nowledge mockery*

Also, that clown is seriously trippin on that comment:

  • First, the computers buy us out. I won't rehash the article, but OSU's SOS is somewhere in the high 50s, as compared to the top SEC teams in the low 40s-high 50s as well. Unlike these other teams, we actually went undefeated.
  • Next, if you condemn us for close games against bad nonconference matchups, I think Louisianna Lafayette, Bowling Green, and Towson would like a word with you. All these teams were either leading at the half or a final trick play away from upsetting the likes of Florida and South Carolina.
  • Weak in-conference foes and close survivals? Seriously? Did I not witness UGA going to the wire and needing two INTs to beat Tennessee 51-44 (1-7 SEC) at the end of the 4th? How about following that up with a 29-24 scare against (2-10, 0-8 SEC) Kentucky? And Florida needing 4 INTs from Mizzou (4-7, 2-6 SEC) to scrape by 14-7? SC certainly didn't help its case either, going 17-13 against Vandy and again 38-35 vs. that dumpster fire in Knoxville. Which brings us to LSU. Les Miles, you devil. How did you get an extension and a RAISE after flailing 12-10 against Auburn (3-9, 0-8 SEC), slithering past Ole Miss 41-35 (6-6, 3-5 SEC), and somehow needing John L. Smith's spectacularly poor playcalling and a fake punt to survive Arkansas (4-8, 2-6 SEC) 20-13?

Good to know the status quo is alive as the sun is still shining, cows still eat grass, and the media is still fellating the SEC on a daily basis.

"There is a force that makes us all brothers, no one goes his way alone." --Woody Hayes

BuckGuy003's picture

Incredible comment haha. I think we would take Florida and possibly Georgia best of 5. We're not fundamentally sound enough take bama and probably LSU

Optimistic Buckeye Pessimist's picture

So I guess there's no way to make these guys realize that the top teams in the country didn't really play much better teams... (save UF and  ND).  Certainly, OSU is no UGA because OSU didn't get their ass kicked by South Carolina.

clogan1032's picture

Alabama, UGA, and Ohio State have very similar strength of schedules.  I think it was the tune of 45, 47, 52.  Something close to that.  Let's not act like the top SEC is world beaters this year.  Media is so ridiculous at times.  I think OSU would do well against Bama or UGA, maybe not win, but would be competitive. 

Hoody Wayes's picture

Correct.
So, UGA wins a controversial game against Alabama, 99% of America thinks UGA lost.
Then, UGA wins the BCS Championship Game. Again, controversially.
Buckeyes crowned AP Champion, in protest.
 

DallasTheologian's picture

S-E-C, S-E-C, S-E-C. 
Gag me with a spoon.

yrro's picture

Really. Alabama and Notre Dame have a legit claim to a tougher schedule. Florida and Georgia have no better argument than ours.

bhardy22132's picture

Florida def. does. Florida played a tougher schedule than Bama so im not sure where you are getting that from. The two common opponents that they share, UF beat BOTH not just one of them. But UF had a tougher schedule than Bama.

brglr14's picture

i really thought being 11-1 or 12-0 as we are would bother me more when the season was over. because myself like alot of you thought this team could this just based on talent and getting back some focus and direction from a good coach and staff. but it hasnt bothered me that theres nothing left for this season becasue it really was so great. what a great way for those fantastic seniors to go and some juniors if they choose and what a way to start a new era of ohio state football. we're not naive here and either is the rest of the country to know that the future here has a huge upside. heck i think thats why some of the venom towards us now by some media and other fan bases is as ramped up as it is. they know whats coming. the perfect coach for the perfect place.

I dont know karate but i do know crazy and i'm not afraid to use it.
                           

hodge's picture

“Notre Dame is a unanimous No. 1, and it’s because they’re undefeated,” Hurt said. “I don’t think there’s any question about that. I don’t think all 60 voters think that on a neutral field Notre Dame could beat Florida, Georgia or Alabama.”

^ My sentiments exactly.  If we were bowl-eligible and beat 'Brasky again, we'd be playing ND in Miami.  I gotta say, though; it would be a pretty hollow championship (though quite the satisyfing defeat).  We'd have simply avoided the SEC en route to the title, rather than plowing over them.  I love that college football rewards perfection, though; because it lends the very reason that its mantra, "Every Game Matters", rings so true.  Ohio State is perfect, and no one can take that away.  But, we don't deserve the AP title--even if we do deserve a chance to prove ourselves on the field against ND.  
Our perfection says that we should be number two, and playing for number one.  We're not going to, though; and a (most likely) better team will be playing ND for that chance.  If they win, they deserve their ranking.  The truth is, I couldn't care less.  This has been one of the best college football seasons of my life (ranking up there with '02 and '05), and I wouldn't trade that for anything--including that AP Title.

lippertini's picture

Totally agree with everything you say here, but really posting to thank you for adding the "n't" to "couldn't care less".  Few things in language bug me more than when people don't say that!  It's like...Oh you COULD care less?  So you care some then.  What are you telling me!?
The other is when people say "nuclear" as nu-qu-lar.  You don't pronounce "clear" as qu-lar do you?  Ugh.
Anyway...thanks.

Earle's picture

So what you are saying is that you could care less about proper usage and proncunciation?

avail31678's picture

Umm...Homer Simpson calls it "nu-qu-ler," and he works at a nuclear power plant, so he must know how to say it....  ;-)
I too hate when people say "I could care less."

Maestro's picture

Irregardless of what anyone says I could care less about the pronunciation of nuclear.

vacuuming sucks

Oyster's picture

I could care less how people pronounce it either, but I hate it when people use Irregardless.

Earle's picture

and random Capitalization. ; )

Oyster's picture

That was to provide Emphasis!

juventas's picture

Emphasis or emphasis?

Earle's picture

What?  Are you're italics broke?

cronimi's picture

*your*
(I don't know if you meant the mistake or not, but it still is like nails on a chalkboard to me.)

Earle's picture

Intentional, as is "broke" instead of "broken", in the spirit of the thread...

Nutbuck1959's picture

I do that a lot because I'm such a poor typist, not because I can't spell,etc.

hodge's picture

Well played, Maestro.  Though, I have do say I died a little reading your first word.
Though I know your intent was in jest, I must admit, "irregardless" is my personal rage-inducing English mistake.  I can deal with about anything else, but "irregardless" just drives me up a wall.  The "word" is just an orgy; a prefix and suffix that do the same thing?  Without having no regards?  Therefore you do have regards?  SAY WHAA?
\End rant

Boxley's picture

C,mon Hodge, don't tell me you didn't catch the intentional irony of Maestro starting off with "Irregardless"?

"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done." President T. Roosevelt

hodge's picture

No, I did.  That's why I said "I know your intent was in jest", I just wanted to rant about it.  'Cause I'm a nerd.

Boxley's picture

Well irregardless of your nerdiness, I like your postings.
Only on 11W are there literary and verbiage battles. I love this site!
I wrote to a gentlemen on another site that his ranting predictions on the basketball bucks season, would either make him a idiot savant or just the former versus the latter. He thanked me!
I think I was the only one that got it, so either I am the former, or mayhaps my humor was too dry. 

"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done." President T. Roosevelt

Denny's picture

Yes but did you know if their intent was in finite jest?*
*Footnote joke

Taquitos.

brylee's picture

yes...we all could!

CowCat's picture

I REALLY LOVE WHEN PEOPLE USE ALL-CAPS FOR EMPHASIS.
And. When. They. Use. Periods. After. Every. Farkin. Word.
 

"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer

avail31678's picture

Uh-oh.  All these posters - their all going to be over they're in the doghouse with only there bad grammar to comfort them!
Their are to many posts with bad grammar in them!
I should of quit while I was ahead...irregardless of were this is going. 

Crimson's picture

Wow, I just want to punch you in the face.  You get a +1.

cinserious's picture

But, but George Bush pronounces it nu-QU-lar!

Gone ham, be back soon...

BuckGuy003's picture

Agreed!!! I read it fast an thought he blew it haha

CALPOPPY's picture

People saying nucular is more of a dyslexia thing (word recall, mouth-saying-something-different-than-the-brain-thinking thing). I can let it slide.

I'm a hurtin' buckaroo.

45OH4IO's picture

Totally agree. The SEC circle jerk isn't going to go away until they get beaten in their bowl games. A championship will be hollow unless it involves spanking those teams back into the swamps. I was really looking forward to seeing K State or Oregon do just that this year, but they both had disappointing losses and now here we are.
The upshot is that I believe (and think most Buckeye homers do) that within two years or so, tOSU will have the talent to do just that.
Also, if a Notre Dame that barely beat Pitt and had a few questionable wins beats Bama or Georgia, that is a great start to exposing the man behind the curtain. I know the Spin Machine will try to play the SEC + Notre Dame is the class angle, but that opens the door.
Bottom line is that tOSU needs the B1G to get stronger and get into their stronger strength of OOC schedule, which is getting closer and closer. Plus they need to blow some people out. Do some throat stomping or curb stomping or curb-throat stomping. Style points always help!

jthiel09's picture

If the AP would vote us for the National Title there would be Buckeye bashing and angry media / fans all over the place, if we don't get the AP National Title there is still going to be Buckeye bashing and angry media / fans all over the place. 
Great year no matter where we rank in the end.

JT

Boxley's picture

Yes, that would be great, wouldn't it?
Pissing off other teams fans, and the media, yummy!

"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done." President T. Roosevelt

penult's picture

Not one of the 5 best SEC teams? Did you see Florida's game against Lousiana Lafayette?  Nearly every SEC team had a game like that against a Sun Belt or lesser team.  And he wants to talk about Ohio State's narrow wins against FBS and BCS teams? Come on. Lost a TON of respect for Mike Hlas with those comments. Actually, all respect. Screw that guy. Hope he has to cover shitty Iowa teams for the rest of his life.

btalbert25's picture

I could see Ohio State losing to Florida, Bama, Georgia, LSU, South Carolina, and Texas A&M though.  I could see them winning too.  Look at all those teams losses, they came against very good teams, and with the exception of Georgia's loss to South Carolina, they were all prett close games.  I don't look at the body of work and compare the teams when they were at their worst.  I look at the matchup and say, if this team was at their best and the Buckeyes were at their best, who would win?  So, yes everyone saw Florida struggle against Lafayette, but they also saw Florida beat FSU, A&M, LSU, and South Carolina.

penult's picture

That's the problem exactly. South Carolina and LSU are not the great teams the media says they are. LSU is based solely on preseason rankings, and South Carolina is pre season rankings plus a home win over a Georgia team who has beat nobody except Florida. I'm not convinced that Florida is that great either. Yes, they are more deserving than Georgia and maybe even Alabama, but they couldn't prove it on the field as they lost to Georgia. Perhaps you didn't read the article I was responding to because your point fails to take into account the only reason I brought up Florida's game against Lafayette was in response to the comments made about Ohio State's close wins.

penult's picture

And I could not see Ohio State losing to South Carolina at home, but I can see how people who blindly believe the media hype rather than what they see when they watch games could see it otherwise.

btalbert25's picture

If Alabama were to end up winning it all again, they will have beat LSU, Georgia, and Notre Dame.  That will be a pretty impressive slate.  Georgia will have beat Florida, Bama, and Notre Dame, again, those are 3 wins better than any of Ohio State's wins.  I'm not diminishing what the BUckeyes did this year, it was absolutely incredible and I love this team, but no way have they been impressive enough to warrant a split national title. 
In order for them to have ever been a serious contender for the AP title this year, with as bad as their schedule has been, they would of had to beat everyone by 2 or 3 TD's all year, and even then it may have not been enough.  When t hey played the bad teams, they would of needed to blast those bad teams too.
I don't think Bama, Georgia, or Notre Dame are necessarily invincible or anything but any of those 3 teams, by the time they get to the national title game and win it, will have more impressive resumes than the Buckeyes did this year. 

Optimistic Buckeye Pessimist's picture

While I agree with you in the end, that's not the point.  In the present, Bama has a wins against LSU and UM in the AP top 25.  UGA has wins against UF.  OSU has wins against UM and NEB.  OSU has no losses, whereas the other two teams do.  So in the present moment, OSU does not look all that different than Bama or UGA.

btalbert25's picture

Well and I think that's where probation comes in.  In the present, if Ohio State were eligible, they probably are number 2 and no questions asked.  A lot of the voters can now use the weak schedule as a reason for not voting them top 2 and not look ignorant by saying they won't vote for a team on probation. 

Brutus Forever's picture

I agree.

"I learned to dislike Michigan at a very young age.” – Urban F. Meyer

Optimistic Buckeye Pessimist's picture

Yes, but we're still not even #2 in the AP poll.  That's the problem.  

AirForceNUT's picture

“Saturday, my eyeball test told me they’re not Alabama,” he said. “They’re probably not one of the five best SEC teams.”
 
^ This sickens me, yes we probably wouldn't beat Alabama, or Florida but Georgia has beaten only 2 FBS teams with a winning record.. Why does that make them so good..

Ahh Saturday's picture

I concede nothing to any SEC team, especially not in a bowl game where this team would have another month of practice, another month to get healthy.  We lost to Florida in last year's bowl game, but how much better are the Gator's this season, and how much better are the Buckeyes?  Could we lose?  Sure, but we could win just as easily.  Alabama lost to TAMU, they have already shown they can be beat.  Why assume that the Buckeyes can't beat them?  What are the other SEC teams that are "probably" better than OSU?  LSU? Please.  If you want to talk about struggling against lesser teams, LSU has done it all year long, and managed to lose twice along the way.  USCe?  Also two losses, but they did beat UGA 35-7 which is a great win considering UGA is --somehow-- the #3 team in the country, after all their only loss was to USCe.
Urban Meyer said after the michigan game that these Buckeyes could play with anyone in the country right now, and I'll take him at his word.  OSU is taking its medicine right now, and unfortunately we won't be able to settle any of this on the field.  I'm not arguing that we should be given an AP title, but there's no team in the country that any fan of the Buckeyes should assume a loss against.

LadyBuck's picture

OSU is taking its medicine right now...

Strong points, all of them, and I can see your point. However, I think you mean OSU is a machine, not medicine. Granted, I would love to give the SEC a taste of their own medicine.

buckeye76BHop's picture

I'm not trying to sound like a know-it-all, but OSU will not pass a one loss SEC team with a 12-1 record.  If OSU had been in the B1G championship game and beat Neb twice...then you have a case (Neb was 21st first time OSU played them and would have been 12th this weekend).  Now...OSU has no case and the '74 OU team did not have more convincing wins over better teams (just look at the records of the teams OU played...looks like the Big 8 was just as week as the B1G this year).  Which it won't matter anyhow because the AP is not going to vote OSU in over an SEC team or over ND IF they win, as you can read in Kyle's article.  
 Like I said before on another thread...a 13-0 OSU team, obviously not on probation, plays a 12-0 ND for the NC.  However...it's all a pipe dream now.  Time to look forward to Feb 1st 2013,  4/13/13, and 8/31/13 IMHO.  The AP Championship for 2012 will not happen...no matter who wins on Jan. 7th and in other games...just won't happen folks as much as we want it to or feel OSU deserves it.  

"There's nothing that cleanses your soul like getting the hell kicked out of you."
"I love football. I think it is most wonderful game in world and I despise to lose."
Woody Hayes 1913 - 1987 

WezBuck28's picture

That's ok.. Let them say what they want now about Ohio state.. It's gonna come back and bite them all in the ass real soon..

buckeye76BHop's picture

Starting 8/31/13...indeed it will Amen Wez.

"There's nothing that cleanses your soul like getting the hell kicked out of you."
"I love football. I think it is most wonderful game in world and I despise to lose."
Woody Hayes 1913 - 1987 

Grant Edgell's picture

"If you’re not going to vote for them because of the probation, you have to start at the first of the year and not put them in the top 25,” Hurt, an AP poll voter and Tuscaloosa News sports editor, said. "You’re just playing a silly game if you say you’re not going to vote them high because they’re on probation."

Hadn't yet seen a voter say this out loud since the sketchy shuffling of the Buckeyes on some ballots started a few weeks back (many have voted them low all season, but some watched OSU win and dropped them multiple spots that week anyway). I'm glad to see this quote in print, but that amounts to crap for actual consolation.
"Silly game" is spot on.

juventas's picture

The first guy was from Cedar Rapids; what's Cedar Rapids?

Maestro's picture

Not one of the top 5 SEC teams?  That is just utterly absurd.

vacuuming sucks

Grant Edgell's picture

What a joke.
Alabama (11-1, defending champs, beaten by a not-top-five SEC team at home)
[Y U NOT PUT BUCKEYE HERE?]
LSU (10-2, losses @ Florida and home Alabama)
[OR HERE!]
Florida (lost to a Georgia team that a week earlier beat Kentucky by only 5)
[OR HERE!]
Georgia (11-1, beaten by four TD by SCar).
[NO POISENOUS NUTS ALLOWED]
South Carolina (10-2, beaten in back to back weeks by a combined 67-32)
[COLUMBUS, OH: NORTH THREE SPOTS]

IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

So according to the AP voters' logic, Ohio State on probation didnt play a good enough schedule to warrant a No. 1 ranking and AP National Championship YET if there was no bowl ban and undefeated OSU beat ND for the national title it would magically be the No. 1 AP team? Or are they saying even if OSU beat ND and won the national title they wouldn't be the No. 1 ranked team and 1-loss Alabama or Georgia would leapfrog them because of strength of schedule? Why don't they just come out and say "We are penalizing OSU because of the probation and not because of how weak we mistakingly perceive them to be?"
Once again, like the NCAA, the AP voters show their hipocrisy and blatant ignorance of all things common sensical. This is a prime example why all the human polls need to be taken out of the equation for deciding who plays for the national championship, now and for the coming playoff. Otherwise those idiots will just have a 4-team SEC playoff every year like we all know they want to do.

"Sherman ran an option play right through the south" - Greatest Civil War analogy EVER.

gwalther's picture

Winning two more games, on two neutral sites, and beating a ND team that ran the table with a solid strength of schedule, does not equal "magic." I think the AP voter made some solid points.

Class of 2008

IBLEEDSCARLETANDGRAY's picture

One of those 2 wins would be against 14th ranked Nebraska in the B1G title game. According to the what the AP voters are saying, another win over a up-teenth ranked team wouldn't help the Buckeyes one iota. In fact it would hurt them. We all know the AP voters would then say "Nebraska is too weak an opponent" Then we go and beat ND and their argument is "That was only 1 win over a Top 5 team, Alabama/Georgia had 3 or 4" They'd be contradicting themselves if they voted OSU No. 1 after a win over ND hence why I think thats why they won't win the AP title now.

"Sherman ran an option play right through the south" - Greatest Civil War analogy EVER.

d5k's picture

Yes, but the point is they are selectively using their eye test.  His eyes say Alabama is the best team yet ND is #1 overall because they are undefeated against a good schedule.  At this point, if OSU wasn't postseason ineligible you couldn't tell me that the voters wouldn't by default put us at a near-unanimous #2 in the country.  Undefeated Cincinnati was #3 above the Florida Tebows in his senior year because Florida had 1 loss to the #1 team in the country!!!!  I think I recall that Florida team beating Cincinnati by approximately a million points in the Sugar Bowl.
The annual debate has always been "Do you put 1-loss SEC over undefeated Boise State?".  Yet magically since we are sanctioned they can use more refined logic to put 1-loss SEC over an undefeated B1G team which is at worst still the 4th best conference despite a down year.  We are not in the Mountain West or even in the Big East.  I think we probably are somewhere in the 5-10 range if you had a good enough way to quantify who the best teams are.  But we have achieved enough with our undefeated resume that in a typical year we would be near unanimously top 2 in the polls which would be enough to be top 2 in the BCS.
The polls have always been about 'who has accomplished the most?', yet now they can selectively change the question to be 'who do you think is the best team on the field?'.

BeijingBucks's picture

Take all the perceived slights from this off season... let let slide under your skin like a splinter... fester... cause anger... require restitution!
And voila! We have an angry, hungry football team that will not be satisfied til they put all the naysayers to rest.
sure beats having a complacency problem, no?

 

 

None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. ~ John Milton

gwalther's picture

While the SEC is down this year, the Boise guy's logic is pretty airtight. If I were an outsider, I probably wouldn't give it to OSU this year either.

Class of 2008

btalbert25's picture

I actually don't think the SEC is down at all.  Maybe they don't have that elite team at the top like the last few years, but this is one year that I actually believe that the depth of that conference is really impressive.  I think their top 6 would compete and be toward the top in any conference.  Florida and South Carolina just handed it to the 2 best in the ACC and they were the 2nd and 3rd best teams in the east.

Run_Fido_Run's picture

The SEC is slightly down at the top (Bama, LSU) and definitely down the bottom (Tenn, Auburn, Kentucky, Mizz). They're up in the second-tier (UGA, FLA, Tex AM). Vandy is better. Other teams are treading water (S. Caro, Miss St, Ole Miss).
Overall, the SEC is about as good as last year, but we're told that the only thing that counts is the BCS championship. Well, the UGA/Bama winner will not be as good as Bama/LSU 2011. Will they have enough to handle ND? Probably, but we'll see.
The key difference this year, though, is that another conference can legitimately lay a claim to being top dog - the Pac 12. We'll see that play out in bowl season.

gwalther's picture

List of shit teams from the SEC: Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Kentucky, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Missouri. 
OMG- the mighty SEC! Lol. Look at Georgia's schedule and tell me we couldn't either have a 12-0 record or an 11-1 record with it. And in that 1, they got absolutely housed.

Class of 2008

juventas's picture

Not even a top 5 SEC team........lol STFU

Buckeyejason's picture

That doesn't seem to far fetched
1.Alabama
2. Georgia 
3. Florida
4. LSU
5. Texas A&M/South Carolina.
I can't confidently say we'd beat these teams.

BUCKEYES BABY!

gwalther's picture

We can play with every one of those teams. The lines on most of those games should be damn near even if they were played at a truly neutral site.

Class of 2008

juventas's picture

Alabama is the only team that gets the benefit of the doubt. The other teams, not so much.

USMC11917's picture

Alabama Because of their rush defense and Texas A+M because of their Spread (Ish) offense are the only two I don't see us matching up well against. I still think we could compete without a blowout against any of them. LSU/Florida/SC are winnable games if the defense plays like it should. A+M is not the same team in the second half of this season as they were to start.

Alhan's picture

I can't confidently say we wouldn't beat these teams.

You can kill a fly with your slipper or a cannon. Either way, the fly dies. -Ramzy

Optimistic Buckeye Pessimist's picture

We played pretty even with the same UF team last year.

Buckeyejason's picture

BTAlbert makes some great points. Everyone wants to point to one game where a top 5 team struggled when the Buckeyes struggled with 7-8 teams on its schedule..including one of the worst teams in the country UAB. If we beat a USC, Texas, or even a Arizona type team in non conference i would have more fuel to defend OSU..but they didn't. Also if the Big Ten was very strong this year I would also be saying we deserve an AP title. 
We didn't win the beauty contest this year. BRING ON THE PLAYOFFS!!!!!

BUCKEYES BABY!

Maestro's picture

I fail to see the relevance of the UAB game at this point.  It was a win in September.

vacuuming sucks

Buckeyejason's picture

The Buckeye blinders make it hard for you to see points eh? 

BUCKEYES BABY!

Run_Fido_Run's picture

BuckeyeJason analyzes the world with perfect clarity. From his arm chair, he has 20/20 football vision. Whereas homers like me are blinded by biases and preconceptions, BuckeyeJason is empowered by a mystical level of pure objectivity.   

Buckeyejason's picture

Now you're gettin it! Right on point. 

BUCKEYES BABY!

Boxley's picture

Unfortunately, apparently, you, are not. :)

"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done." President T. Roosevelt

Buckeyejason's picture

What am I not getting Boxley? 

BUCKEYES BABY!

AirForceNUT's picture

Why so pessimistic?

btalbert25's picture

And that's the problem with this system.  People hate the system yet everyone complains about a playoff and how the season won't mean anything.  The only way to know who would beat who is to let them duke it out IN A PLAYOFF.
The line may be close in every game with Ohio State and the top 6 of the SEC, but I'm not overly confident that we go in and win those games.  We couldn't get away with the slow starts this team has had, and Braxton not throwing well.  It took a damn near perfect game by Manziel for A&M to beat Bama, and it almost still wasn't enough.  We would need to see the very best Braxton Miller has played to beat Bama.  I honestly think the team that would give us the most trouble is A&M though.  I think Florida, Georgia, LSU, and South Carolina we'd have a pretty good shot overall.

Run_Fido_Run's picture

The reason Urbz said at the end of the season that this Buckeyes team could play with anyone was that - after struggling for much of the season - the defense had finally begun to round into shape at the end of the year. 
I agree that Texas A&M has a dynamite offense, but they're 53rd in total defense against a rather pedestrian slate of offenses. And that defense has not appeared to improve during the course of the season. If A&M plays Michigan in the bowl game, look for a shoot-out.
No question in my mind, this Buckeyes team is better than LSU. 
I'd probably have to give an edge to Bama, UGA, or FLA against Ohio State, but any of those matchups would be interesting.

BeijingBucks's picture

FLA would be veeeeery interesting for obvious reasons *cough* cupboard bare *cough*

 

 

None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. ~ John Milton

Buckeyejason's picture

as a dynamite offense, but they're 53rd in total defense

And ours was one of the worst in The BIG 10.

BUCKEYES BABY!

Run_Fido_Run's picture

FEI Defensive ratings:

Michigan State 4
Nebraska 15
Wisconsin 16
Ohio State 17
Penn State 19
Michigan 23
Northwestern 43
Minnesota 55
Illinois 56
Purdue 58
Iowa 59
Indiana 108

btalbert25's picture

I was one up until last week who thought there's now way all these SEC teams should be ranked in the top 10.  Clemson and FSU are damn good and should be there.  Nebraska and Stanford have a case too.  Then Clemson and FSU got beat down last week and I thought wow, those were 2 pretty good teams.
Seeing how Nebraska has played this year, I don't think they are as good as any of the 1 or 2 loss SEC teams.  I'm a believer that they have 6 really good teams.  I think you could put virtually any of those 6 in any other conference and they would be top 2 or 3 in all of them. 
Before last week, I didn't really believe it, but I'm sold, they have 6 of the best teams in America in that conference.  I'm well aware of struggles against inferior teams and only playing 2 ranked teams etc, but in my opinion those 6 teams can play in any conference with anyone.  Sure they'd lose.  Oregon would be able to beat all 6, and could also lose to all 6.  We could beat all 6, but also lose to all 6.  Outside of K-State there's no one in the Big 12 who would hang with them.  In the B1G we are it.  Big East no one would.  ACC, well the worst of those 6 just housed the 2nd beast ACC team.  I don't think it's wrong to admit that they are really good, fact is,  you have to put up or shut up and no one in the nation is "putting up".  I do Think Stanfor is really good and has been overlooked.  I mean they almost beat Notre Dame, and beat Oregon, but then again they lost to Washington so, meh.

MediBuck's picture

I feel like the Pac-12 never gets the respect it deserves. Programs got really unlucky this year.

At the top:

  • Oregon-- Elite offense (#2 scoring), excellent defense (#27 scoring). Had run through the entire Pac-12 schedule like butter except a better-prepared, well game-planned Stanford team snuck up on them while half their starting defense was injured. They were a missed FG away from a BCS title shot.
  • Stanford-- Hard-nosed power offense, elite defense (#11 scoring, #1 rushing). People underestimate the Cardinal because they struggled early on due to an O-line with only 1 returning starter and pathetic QB Josh Nunes. Even with him, the Tree pulled out wins against #2 USC and #24 Arizona. Hell, they were two blown calls (worst officiating of the year per Mike Pereira, former VP of NFL officiating) from upsetting #1 ND in South Bend! Once Coach Shaw brought in Freshman QB Kevin Hogan, the train's been unstoppable and they've collected the pelts of #11 Oregon State, #2 Oregon, #17 UCLA, and soon-to-be #16 UCLA again since the swap en route to a Rose Bowl. Source: I'm a season ticket-holder.
  • UCLA-- Don't let the record fool you. Losing twice to Stanford is no shame, and Oregon State is sneaky good this year. They also beat presumed B1G champion Nebraska. Brett Hudley and James Franklin are picture-perfect fof Noel Mazzone's freak spread attack.
  • Oregon State-- Their only losses were to Oregon and Stanford, and they blew out BYU away in Provo with a freshman starting QB and beat eventual Leaders division (fake) champion Wisconsin to the tune of holding Montee Ball to 35 yards rushing.

Honorable mentions to Arizona for blowing out #18 Oklahoma State with a new HC, coaching staff, QB, RB, and O-line; Arizona State for doing largely the same; and USC for having an all-NFL roster and somehow squandering it all away with the same roster that went 10-2, beat Oregon in Eugene, and finished #2 in the AP poll.

"There is a force that makes us all brothers, no one goes his way alone." --Woody Hayes

Buckeyejason's picture

This team is too sloppy, undiciplined, and not physical enough to get through those 5-6 S.E.C teams..that's the painful truth. Braxton is like Jeckel and Hyde behind center, and running backwards in circles won't go well against LSU, Bama, and Florida. Not showing up in the 1st quarter's also doesn't help their cause 

BUCKEYES BABY!

Maestro's picture

But the top half of the SEC is without faults.

vacuuming sucks

buckeyenut10's picture

You do realize that 99% of LSU and Florida's offense revolves around the run game, right? Guess what OSU's defense is best at stopping?
I'm not saying we would for sure beat those teams, but those games would more than likely come down to which team's QB could make a bigger/more big plays because all of those teams play superb defense. Are you telling me that Florida and LSU have a more dynamic QB than us, too?

bhardy22132's picture

You do have a point there. Both of those teams do rely very heavily on the run. LSU and UF are not good passing teams by any means and in UF's case its not because Driskel is a bad QB its because he doesnt have a good WR to throw the ball too as of right now. The only thing that would worry me about UF's run game is when they bounce to the outside. We could stop it dont get me wrong but it would give us fits. But yes UF and LSU would be winnable games this year.

buckeyenut10's picture

Exactly.
Both UF and LSU have their own unique issues at when it comes to their passing offense that force them to rely HEAVILY on the run (see OSU most of this season). In this way, LSU, UF, and OSU are very similar. If the ground game isn't going for them, there's a good chance they'll lose the game. They also all play great defense (particularly against the run). So when you take all of that into account you get a formula for a grinding, running game. All 3 would try to run the ball. With the exception of maybe Florida's ability to bounce outside, all 3 teams would struggle against the opposing defense. So it would come down to QB play. And again I ask, which QB is more likly to make a play?
 
It bothers me when people say that UF and LSU are worlds better than OSU when our defenses are similar (slight edge to SEC) but our offense outshines both (slight edge to OSU). Would our offensive advantage give us enough of an advantage to overcome their defensive advantage? I have no idea; you'd have to play the game to find out.
 

bhardy22132's picture

IF our WR's could play like they did last week then we would be a handful for those defenses. IMO it comes down to whether Brown/Smith/Stoney catch the ball. They do that and its a very long day for those teams who would struggle with Browns burners in the first place not to mention that Smith can burn his guy pretty good too. after that you add in the stout running of Hyde and worrying about Braxton taking off then ya you have fits. 
The big key would be for our offense to be able to get trough the adjustments UF would make for the second half because the second half is when UF seems to put it all together on that side of the ball but even then you can look at the fact that you still have to deal with Braxton and Hyde at minimum. 

BoFuquel's picture

The playoff format is going to be much worse.Just wait and see.Being a Buckeye is enjoying a little to endure a lot.Grab uself some Urb go off to a SECuleded place and enjoy for a short season.It won't last long.The national media is starting to stir things up aroud here,and you know what happens when C-BUS gets stirredGO BUCKS!

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

kevinfrenchfry's picture

informative piece but i wish we could move on from this point with the ap national title crap, its not going to happen so why poke at the story anymore, 12-0 is sweet bottom line, but we have years of urbtopia ahead and to me as a buckeye fan my main hope for this team (and what every fans main hope should be) is a national title victory over an sec team, not oregon, not notre dame (even though that game would make a ton of money), S-E-C, and while i hate the SEC, i hope uga or bama beats nd because after that ohio state HAS to be the prime contender to dethrone the sec in 2013. when you think about it the preseason top 3 will obv be something like
1 bama, 2 osu, 3 uga, a and m, florida

juventas's picture

Will Muschamp looks like the Bob's Big Boy cartoon statue.

Arizona_Buckeye's picture

There is no way in hell we win anything this year - this is the year writers/voters can get away with hammering the Buckeyes!  We win two sloppy games and fall two spots both times!  We have a bye week, and we fall one spot.  This was a throw away season so I don't see a point in wondering what if this, what if that... We won every single game and capped it off with beating AACC!  Now, Urban and staff are out picking up prime time recruits to start building an OSU monster!  I'm good with that!

The best thing about Pastafarianism? It is not only acceptable, but advisable, to be heavily sauced

gobucks5413's picture

next years schedule worries me a lot...the only thing we have going for us is being 12-0 this year and having at least a little bit of respect. We better get ready to bring the hammer to folks next year....no more squeakers against Indiana...it will also help that we start top 5 as well

tennbuckeye19's picture

Next year's schedule blows goats. 

Arizona_Buckeye's picture

I suspect that we will start destroying quite a few teams next year since.  Towards the end of the year you could tell that the players and coaches were starting to settle in and find their groove.  With that growth comes progression and that can only lead to great things!!

The best thing about Pastafarianism? It is not only acceptable, but advisable, to be heavily sauced

Alhan's picture

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”

Hooray for the transitive property of college football!

You can kill a fly with your slipper or a cannon. Either way, the fly dies. -Ramzy

timdogdad's picture

if bama wins vs nd and we are the only team that is undefeated, then that should merit a split championship  

juventas's picture

In theory, that's a great point. But until Ohio State beats the top SEC team in a bowl (or wherever), we won't get the benefit of the doubt from voters #justsayin

btalbert25's picture

It woudln't even take beating an SEC team, it would take beating more than Nebraska.  If this team played Notre Dame's schedule and was undefeated, the year would of looked GREAT and they would have a claim for the AP title.  We beat Nebraska and a 4 loss Michigan team, that's the reason for the lack of respect.  Those 2 games would of been enough if Ohio State had blown out teams like UAB, Cal, UCF, IU, and Purdue, as well as a bad MSU team this year.  I know their D is tough, but it was still a bad team.
12-0 is damn hard, and they deserve all the admiration in the world for that, but not an AP title.  If Notre Dame wins it makes it all pointless anyway, and I wouldn't be shocked to see Ohio State actually move up in the AP poll with a Notre Dame win.

bhardy22132's picture

Why are you assuming that Bama is going to be the team playing in the NC? They do not have an easy game against UGA and they are without their star WR for this one. Not trying to argue just kinda curious as to why you already have them locked into that spot?

Red Shirt Ensign's picture

It continues to make me mad that TSUN is still in the Top 25... why why why! 8-4... what a joke!
No respect, saying we couldn't beat the top 5 SEC Teams.... this homer shouldn't be allowed to vote at all!

"Statistics always remind me of a fellow who drowned in a river where the average depth was only three feet." - Coach Woody Hayes

 

Alhan's picture

They'd have to let another Mac/C-USA team into the top 25 if they drop any more perennial favorites out!

You can kill a fly with your slipper or a cannon. Either way, the fly dies. -Ramzy

Buckeyejason's picture

Sometimes I wonder if anyone else besides BTALBERT and a few others on here actually watch College football besides the Buckeyes..

BUCKEYES BABY!

Oyster's picture

Sportcenter and highlights during halftime of the OSU game is my guess.

tennbuckeye19's picture

Wait a second, there are other college football teams besides the Buckeyes? Surely not. 

penult's picture

I have at least 3 screens going all day from the first round of games until the last round.  BTALBERT is fine, but I often wonder about your comments.

Buckeyejason's picture

Wonder what exactly? 

BUCKEYES BABY!

AirForceNUT's picture

Why 95% of your comments are always negative towards your "favorite" team.

Buckeyejason's picture

Negative or not they're comments based upon what I have seen and believe. Would saying we should be #1 in the AP poll and we'd beat every team in the country satisfy you? I could say that but it wouldn't be what I believ and there's no point in just spewing optimistic opinions just to please the masses.
 

BUCKEYES BABY!

Run_Fido_Run's picture

If by watching college football (besides the Buckeyes), you mean examine, inspect, and truly appreciate the finer intracacies of the game . . . no, I wish I could do that. If only I had your football acumen. Will you teach me how to truly "watch" a college football game?
Because here's how I watch a college football game not involving the Buckeyes: I spend about half the time trying to put together just the right nacho, with the perfect blend of cheese, meat, jalepenos, sour cream, guacamole, olives, etc. Hell, I probably only actually "watch" about 1/4 of the live plays and even then I'm watching the game through my bottle-cap Buckeye blinders.

Oyster's picture

Correct me if I am wrong, but I sense some bitterness in your post?

Boxley's picture

Or just a little sauciness?

"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done." President T. Roosevelt

Run_Fido_Run's picture

Not bitterness - I'm just ribbing him, passive aggressively.
Bitterness is what I feel toward Tim Biakabatuka and that hot asian chick who vanished from my bed in the middle of the night.  

ArTbkward's picture

He was laying it on as thick as that nacho cheese would be on a January day.

We should strive to keep thy name, of fair repute and spotless fame...
(Also, I'm not a dude)

Buckeyejason's picture

Nah he's just "mad brah". He likes to go on his little rants from time to time because I don't say good things about this team in every post. This site is soo fucking boring when everyone says the same thing and agrees with one another on everything regarding OSU. God forbid I say Manzeil should win the heisman over Braxton or we aren't the best team in the country...I'm just a terrible fan! Just terrible! I only watch every game for the past 10 years, wear my Buckeye gear and spread the Buckeye gospel to people who don't know about the schools greatnessy. Sorry if I don't please all you homers with my posts.

BUCKEYES BABY!

Oyster's picture

Will you father my children?

Buckeyejason's picture

Sure..pay me child support and you got a deal.

BUCKEYES BABY!

Run_Fido_Run's picture

Way to martyr yourself, build a strawman, and change the subject all in one paragraph. We were making light of your crystal clear football vision, not questioning your fanhood. I know that you're a big Buckeye fan. I'm just not sure that I'm ready to hire you to run an NFL front office. 
[edit: btw, I have zero issue with Manziel for Heisman. I haven't looked closely enough at the individual stats of all the candidates, but Manziel seems to have a pretty good case. Also, you frequently make some excellent football insights, including some unpopular ones relating to Ohio State. I commend you in that respect].

Buckeyejason's picture

When did I ever say I was Bill Walsh or Mel Kiper? I give opinions just like everyone else.

BUCKEYES BABY!

Run_Fido_Run's picture

When did I ever say I was Bill Walsh or Mel Kiper? I give opinions just like everyone else.

You caught me building a little strawman of my own - good eye. Maybe your vision really is that acute.
To clarify, here's a typical chain-of-events:

  1. You make an "objective" comment that's unflattering toward Buckeye football. At this point, you're doing just fine. Many of your comments are quite insightful; and, when they're not, they're usually at least interesting. I might not agree with some/many your points, but I've rarely - if ever - made fun of and/or downvoted one of your initial critical insights. 
  2. Other commenters respond negatively to your initial comment, which begins to accumulate downvotes.
  3. You dismiss those who disagree with you - i.e., that they lack objectivity, understanding of the game, etc. At this point, your downvotes are deserved.
  4. You end with the non sequitur, "Don't question my fanhood!"

I actually agree with you - it's not as interesting when everyone agrees and partly for that reason I welcome your contrarian comments. But if you genuinely want robust discussions, maybe don't attempt to collapse the arguments into Rational Observer v. Irrational Homer as soon as anyone questions your opinions.

Buckeyejason's picture

Thanks for the compliments and constructive criticism. 

BUCKEYES BABY!

Denny's picture

I have watched one consecutive Ohio State football match so I think that proves definitively that I'm a truer fan than you are.

Taquitos.

Denny's picture

I'm using my AP vote to push your nachos into the Top 3.

Taquitos.

Arizona_Buckeye's picture

Only every freakin game on!!!

The best thing about Pastafarianism? It is not only acceptable, but advisable, to be heavily sauced

MediBuck's picture

I actually consider myself a fan of college football in general. As much as it seems heretical here, I owe allegiances to CFB teams other than Ohio State (Stanford, Nevada in particular) and find the strategic aspects of the sport what make it so fascinating. I'm addicted to Chris Brown's Smartfootball (smartfootball.com) and am OC for an intramural flag football team I've been on for half a decade now. Having roommates that are crazy about football also helps. You can ask any of my neighbors: I get up extra-early on Saturday mornings and don't stop watching until the last big Pac-12 game of the night is up. ACC, SEC, Big XII, Pac-12, even Mountain West--you name it, if it's a good game or even a strategically fascinating one (e.g. Nevada pistol offense vs. Hawaii Run 'n Shoot) I'll have a screen (I usually have a big-screen TV, laptop, and desktop streaming three games at a time) on it.

"There is a force that makes us all brothers, no one goes his way alone." --Woody Hayes

gobucks5413's picture

what are everyones thoughts on Roby/Hankins? I havent read anything yet pertaining to them staying or going. I'd say Hankins is probably more of a goner because hes consensus first round, while I haven't seen Roby anywhere in projections.....Also probably factors in for Hank that hes part of a stacked D line, where as Roby will be on the field every snap. Thoughts?
 

acBuckeye's picture

I agree that those two are the only players with a legit chance to leave early. I'd expect Roby to be back, but if he starts projecting as a Day 1 draftee, he may bolt. I think Big Hank is gone, unfortunately.

T4EHill's picture

Could we beat the top 5 SEC teams? It'll be hard but we have the fight to play with them for 60 mins. Half the SEC is BS anyway but oh well...We won't win the AP but I can guarantee that next year will be a different story when it comes to playing with the best

"There's nothing that cleanses your soul like getting the hell kicked out of you." Woody Hayes

CowCat's picture

AP voters:
12-0 is 12-0, and words will never hurt us.
Nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah.
/childish rant

"We get paid to score touchdowns, not kick field goals"
-- Urban Meyer

Jhesse17's picture

Not looking forward to the inevitable gloating from SEC fans after Notre Dame gets the shit get kicked out of them by Alabama/Georgia. Hell even the tOSU (the fifth best team in the country by my estimation) would kill Notre Dame.

acBuckeye's picture

As much as I hate to admit it, the Domers deserve to be in that game. And I have a hard time seeing them getting blown out by either Georgia or 'Bama. Their defense is for real, and it wouldn't shock me if they won.

bhardy22132's picture

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”
 
 
Those two games should have 0 basis on your vote being that Bama/scUM is not a rivalry game and ours is. This is usually a close game regardless. That would be like trying to find that as a reason to keep the buckeyes out if we were bowl eligible and won the BIG championship game  but sitting there using that as your SEC bias IMO.

J.Mo's picture

Ohio State could beat Florida (see Florida needing a blocked punt returned for a touchdown to beat a non-BCS team)
Ohio State could beat LSU (lost to Florida)
Ohio State could definitely beat South Carolina (come on, what's so special about SC?)
Ohio State could beat Georgia (see Georgia's beatdown delivered to them by South Carolina)
and our defense strength matches up well against 'Bama's offense strength.

BrewstersMillions's picture

Wait, what? It absolutley does not. Alabama has the most physical offensive line in the nation. I know they've looked human at times but Alabama would curb stomp OSU. LSU and Florida, maybe-as their offenses are just so awful, I think OSU could get an 8-10 point lead and maybe never look back. like an ugly 21-13 type final.
SC is a hot pile. OSU would walk all over them.
As for UGA, no thank you. First, their 'beatdown' at the hands of SC has no bearing on how OSU would play them but they could attack the edges of the defense with Jones and never give the ball to OSU with the stable of running backs they have.
 

4-6 seconds from point A to point B and when you get to point B, be pissed off

hodge's picture

^ This.
Outside the SEC, I'm pretty sure we could take Oregon now, as well.  I figured we'd get curb-stomped, but they cannot handle a stout d-line.  OSU-ND would be the highest rated national championship of all time (ND-USC was the highest rated game of the year, OSU-UM was 4th), and it would be a doozy of a game, as well.  I think the line would open at ND -2.5.

BrewstersMillions's picture

That would be a great game. Both teams weaknesses really rounded into form as the year went on, so you'd have a really good OSU against a really good ND D and a pretty good ND O against a pretty good OSU D.
That game would be an under play all day long.

4-6 seconds from point A to point B and when you get to point B, be pissed off

Buckeyejason's picture

Wait, what? It absolutley does not. Alabama has the most physical offensive line in the nation. I know they've looked human at times but Alabama would curb stomp OSU. LSU and Florida, maybe-as their offenses are just so awful, I think OSU could get an 8-10 point lead and maybe never look back. like an ugly 21-13 type final.
SC is a hot pile. OSU would walk all over them.
As for UGA, no thank you. First, their 'beatdown' at the hands of SC has no bearing on how OSU would play them but they could attack the edges of the defense with Jones and never give the ball to OSU with the stable of running backs they have.
 
HOW DARE YOU! HOW DARE YOU!!! 
If I were to write exactly what you posted I would've revived 5 downvotes. Funny how that works.

BUCKEYES BABY!

BrewstersMillions's picture

Right? And I'm a way bigger douche too.

4-6 seconds from point A to point B and when you get to point B, be pissed off

Buckeyejason's picture

Nah bro I'm KING DOUCHE around these parts!

BUCKEYES BABY!

tennbuckeye19's picture

It's not every day you stumble into a conversation with 2 dudes comparing their douchey-ness. 

Buckeyejason's picture

That's entertainment value there for ya..and for free!

BUCKEYES BABY!

btalbert25's picture

I absolutely agree the COULD beat any of these teams.  You could take any of those teams and compare them to Ohio State, Oregon, K-State, Stanford, and Notre Dame and make a case for all of them to come out with wins too.  I just think that the SEC has 6 teams that definitely do deserve to be in the top 10.
Is there more of a case for Bama or Georgia to be ranked ahead of the Buckeyes, Right now?  Not neccessarily, they both have a loss, and the only way you can really compare Ohio State to Bama is their common oponnent, which is not the way to compare how teams should be ranked but in the current system it does have to count for something unfortunately.  At the end of the day though, if either of those SEC teams win the BCS title, they should get the AP as well.  They would have just had better wins.  If the Buckeyes played 2 more games like the SEC champ will, my opinion would be different, but that's not a luxury we have this year.

cjkanski's picture

Not starting a fight, I just don't agree with you that the SEC has 6 of the top 10 teams. This article is from the pre-season, but with the way this season played out it rings true, at least for me it does.
http://www.thepostgame.com/commentary/201208/better-without-em-northern-...

CincyOSU's picture

Of course OSU "could" beat any of the teams you listed on any given Saturday. The argument here is what teams are better when both are playing at their best. So while OSU could most def beat anyone, if FL or Alabama or even GA were to bring their A game and OSU did the same...the edge would not be in our favor.

Buckeyebrowny919's picture

Saturday, my eyeball test told me they’re not Alabama,” he said. “They’re probably not one of the five best SEC teams.”

I'm going to give you a couple of minutes and then I want you to say that again without those balls in your mouth. One thing i learned this year is that we may not be the sexiest team, but i'll be damned that when it comes down to doing what is needed to get a win that we aren't among the best in the nation. I've watched plenty of other games this year, so don't feed me that "five best SEC teams" bullshit.

To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice the gift - Steve Prefontaine

brumon's picture

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”

 
My mom likes cookies. Hitler also liked cookies. Therefore my mom must be a nazi.

Alhan's picture

Heh, I'm not sure why anyone would take offense to this unless they just can't stand the words "Hitler" or "Nazi".

I thought your post was a great example why transitive logic is so flawed!

You can kill a fly with your slipper or a cannon. Either way, the fly dies. -Ramzy

jarheadbuckeyefan's picture

this gave me a good laugh

"The only meaningful statistic is number of games won."~ Woody Hayes

acBuckeye's picture

12-0 is freakin sweet. I thought at the beginning of the year we could do it, and I was right. However, griping about not getting an AP title is kinda pointless. It's pretty difficult to comprehend getting awarded a national title when you don't have to play another high quality opponent at a neutral site, while everyone else does. I know it happened with OU back in the day, but it sounds like that team went wire-to-wire #1. I also said to myself at the beginning of the season if we wanted a share of the national title, we'd have to go 12-0 and win every single game in dominant fashion. We didn't do the latter. So not having those two extra opportunities to show our stuff really does hurt us, and I think in this case it's merited.
Or, we could just be like Alabama in that if only one voter in the entire country votes us #1 at the end of the year, we claim that single #1 ranking as our 73rd national title in school history.

ArTbkward's picture

You know what would be the poetic ending for the SEC championship run would be, right?
Bama wins it this year and next year Ohio State beats Florida.

We should strive to keep thy name, of fair repute and spotless fame...
(Also, I'm not a dude)

AirForceNUT's picture

Just imagine what they would say if we beat Florida 41-14 next year!!  In a perfect world..

Ahh Saturday's picture

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”

Did he also see Alabama v TAMU?

CincyOSU's picture

I'm not sure what your point is here? He was comparing common opponents(not that I necessarily agree with that logic) so bringing up a loss to a tough in conference opponent makes little sense.

Ahh Saturday's picture

... and I saw Florida destroy S. Carolina who I saw destroy Georgia who I saw beat UF.  My point is that common opponents is meaningless.  What does mean something is that OSU didn't lose a game whereas Alabama did.

Buckeyejason's picture

They lost a last second game to a really good team with the best QB in the country..man they're just terrible. A&M is far better than Michigan.

BUCKEYES BABY!

Ahh Saturday's picture

 They lost . . .

Yep, yes they did.

Run_Fido_Run's picture

I like very spicy hot foods, but only up to a point. Like, if I'm in the mood, I'll order 18 out 20 heat level at a Thai restaurant, but I usually avoid the "tricked up" sauces that are labelled XXX hot!!!! On that note, here is a sauce that will make you pay the price later on that night:

Ouch!

johnblairgobucks's picture

I ate a ghost pepper late this summer, and it was hot!!!  I felt like I was going to upchuck for at least 30 minutes after consumption. 

BME_Buckeye's picture

Why is this still a topic of discussion? We are 12-0 and we're not winning the AP title! 

  • No wins over top 10 teams 
  • Not a strong OOC resume, even though when we schedule Cal they were rated higher and had a QB named Aaron Rogers. Didn't pan out to the game we expected. 
  • Currently number 4 in the AP Poll 
  • The max we can get to is 2 
  • We're not going to bowl game to warrant us being #1

I'm contempt with being undefeated. Let's show the world what we're all about next year! See ya next fall...

Look closely, because the closer you think you are, the less you will actually see.

 

BlueBayou's picture

“I saw Alabama-Michigan, which wasn’t close, and I saw Ohio State-Michigan, which was close.”
The comment above reminds me of a thread from the beginning of the year.  This forum was asked if people should/would be rooting for Michigan against Alabama.  Individual posters brought up this exact reason for why Buckeye fans should be rooting for Michigan, while others insisted that argument wasn't valid.  I'm just curious, has this changed anybody's mind concerning rooting for B1G teams during the nonconference slate, even if they are your main rival?
In the spirit of this question, I will be the first to answer.  I maintained at the beginning of the year that it is in my team's best interest for B1G teams to do well in nonconference games.  It would elate me to see all B1G teams go undefeated outside the conference.  My position is still the same, and I take this voter's comments as defense of my position.
I look forward to other's responses.

OSUBias's picture

Great question, doubt you'll get many honest answers though. This scenario is exactly why I always root for the conference when OSU isn't playing in a game. Better performances by our teams make us look better when we beat them. THe opposite is also true, as evidenced by this crap fest of a Big Ten season.
Though I must say, I'm going to have a harder time once the conference is diluted with Maryland and Rutgers maintaining my conference affinity. Since none of the schools have conference loyalty, why should we?

Slider...you stink

hodge's picture

My opinion hasn't changed, either.  I was pulling for you guys to beat 'Bama (because it would've looked better for us, and--in large--our ever-so-faint AP title hopes), the Big Ten needs a marquee victory to reverse its low perception.
That said, I did get a kick out of watching the debacle, nonetheless.  Though, I was kind of bummed that I didn't record it; it was just dying to be watched on fast forward with the Benny Hill "Yakety Sax" theme playing.

BlueBayou's picture

A logical argument may convince the brain but will never change the true nature of what is in your heart.  If you had not found pleasure in Michigan's misery during that game, despite pulling for them to win, I believe even I would be allowed to question your Buckeye allegience.  I expect a Buckeye to always enjoy a Michigan defeat.

Oyster's picture

I agree with one exception.  I get great joy watching ttun get beat and I pray that Appy St does it again.  Hopefully the team won't be high this time so they will understand the full impact of what just happened to them.
Sorry, but that is just the way I feel. 

BlueBayou's picture

No need to apologize, I only hope that the god I am praying to for victory is more powerful than yours.  Hopefully my team's aspirations for the season don't go up in smoke before, durring, and after that game.

timdogdad's picture

screw the AP   ohio state 2012 eleven warriors writers assoc national champions!   make up some shirts! 

brumon's picture

I like this. I would buy said shirt

Grant Edgell's picture

For what it's worth, I pulled a decade's worth of data last week and looked at the last ten years' worth of Week 13 AP rankings to see where undefeated teams fell - assuming they were ahead of all 1+ loss teams in each and every case (having forgetten about the BCS busters).
There were only six programs over the last decade to be undefeated when the Week 13 AP polls were released and NOT be ranked ahead of all teams with at least one loss: Boise State, Ball State, Utah, Hawaii, TCU and - now - Ohio State.
One of these things is not like the other.
Voters can claim "weak conference" all they want, but that's a cop-out and proven to be so by a decade's worth of polls - basically meaning all "power-conference" undefeateds, regardless of how sh*tty their conference may have been that year, were rewarded for being undefeated.

d5k's picture

This is exactly my point.  They can't suddenly transform themselves into something like the basketball tourney selection committee when for the past decades they have consistently ranked undefeated teams from BCS conferences higher than ALL 1-loss teams from BCS conferences BY DEFAULT.  You could also look at years when teams like Boise, TCU, and Cincinnati were ranked above HIGHLY deserving 1-loss teams such as the Tebow-led Florida team in 2010 who lost only to the eventual national champ Alabama.

d5k's picture

Check out the progression of the polls the last several weeks.  I had no problem being the lowest ranked undefeated team.  Apparently Alabama losing to A&M, and Georgia beating Auburn, Georgia Tech and Georgia Southern (IN NOVEMBER!!!!) led to Georgia jumping us, despite us winning @PSU, blowing out Illinois, @Wisc and at home to Michigan.  They gradually just kept stealing more and more votes each week despite beating crap teams while we beat teams you have to at least call decent to good on the road in tough environments.
Alabama has an argument although not by years of precedent in the polls.  Georgia categorically does not.  Their toughest out of conference game was 6-6 Georgia Tech (at least comparable to our weak OOC schedule) and they played the softest SEC schedule of any team in the conference, by playing 3-9 Auburn and 6-6 Ole Miss in the West division and playing Florida neutral and South Carolina on the road which they lost by 28.  Basically they played a 2 game season and went 1-1 with their win over a top 5 team but in the ugliest game of the year where Florida turned it over 6 times and they only won by 8 and getting destroyed by 28 in their only tough true road game.
Someone tell me how Georgia moved up in the polls in November with that schedule?  The only thing I can come up is transitive arguments with Florida beating good teams.  Basically Florida moved up and they had to rank the head-to-head winner with 1 loss ahead of them.  In other words, not using the criteria they claim to be using for OSU.

Buckeye Chuck's picture

I wonder what's changed since 1984, when BYU finished the season as the only undefeated team and was a unanimous #1, despite playing a WAC (and wack) schedule, and beating a 6-win Michigan team in its bowl game by a touchdown.
Is there ANY precedent for a team being the one and only unbeaten and not finishing first in the AP poll?

The most "loud mouth, disrespect" poster on 11W.

Hockey Buck's picture

But everyone LOVES nd and who have they beaten?  At wisconsin, At penn state and home to SCum are the the same to me as At oklahoma, At usc, home stanford.
The B1G is weak and sucks, but then the AP writers turn around and are giving nd all this credit, but conveniently forget that they beat 1/4 of OSU's schedule, same as our Buckeyes. Cannot have it both ways and the AP writers, I think there are 3, who rank OSU out of the top 10 have no excuse except to say they are purposely showing bias against OSU for what happened. 
Any positive or negative arguement that is made for nd holds same for OSU. To me, they are the exact same teams with some minor differences.  No legitimate justification to have them outside of the top 5.  Any top conference team, including that goes undefeated are better than the teams that have lost. Simple fact.  Go Bucks! Screw the biased AP writers.

Buckeyejason's picture

But everyone LOVES nd and who have they beaten?  At wisconsin, At penn state and home to SCum are the the same to me as At oklahoma, At usc, home stanford.

You're kidding me right? The talent level of those 3 teams that ND beat are WAY better than Wisconsin, Penn State and Michigan. .

BUCKEYES BABY!

nickma71's picture

Don't you love the double talk from haters (as bad as liberal politicians) that say ND played tough teams in the Big Ten, but OSU didn't because the Big Ten isn't any good.
Oh, you mean USC who is 7-5. Unless Little game Bob draws a cupcake, he will lose another bowl game. And if you watched that game, you know that OU had two TD's taken off the scoreboard. And they ran it in on them. It will be ugly when they go against a physical offense like Alabama. Think Wisconsin at their best.

“(Ohio State’s) schedule isn’t strong enough to warrant (a national championship). In a different year, yes. But they haven’t beaten a team that’s in the top 10. I thought they played a very weak non-conference schedule. The number of escapes they had probably didn’t help either.”

 

nickma71's picture

And I wouldn't vote OSU number one either. The defense has poor fundamentals, but did get better, until the first half of The Game.

Gratefulbuck's picture

I think the best chance the Buckeyes have of getting the AP title is for: 1) ND must lose 2) if the rest of the B1G teams do very well in their bowl games, especially heads-up with sec. But, thats a big if...