The Cat In The Hat Comes Back

By Johnny Ginter on October 21, 2011 at 12:43p
85 Comments
Hey kids!

Since Memorial Day, I think most Ohio state fans have had this image of their heads of Jim Tressel doing his best Sad Keanu impersonation: sitting on a park bench, staring off wistfully into space, trying to coax a random squirrel into eating a peanut out of his hand and then bailing at the last moment because he's afraid of getting rabies, sobbing intermittently.

You know, normal "I just lost my dream job and am never getting it back" stuff.

Of course, that's probably not the case. Tressel is a 58 year old man whose even keel personality means that he'll probably peacefully pass away during the middle of a Lawrence Welk marathon at the age of 116, so I kind of doubt there's been any theatrical vase smashing or tirades against the Illuminati for taking his job. Still though, how weird must it be for him to have to sit on the sidelines, so to speak, while the football program that he had defined for a decade flounders on the field of play?

Weirder still is probably watching other people try and define his legacy in the weeks and months after his firing, with the eventual conclusion at Ohio State's Lantern that "Jim Tressel has done more harm than good to Ohio State football."

Seriously, imagine Tressel sitting alone in his kitchen, wearing pajamas and his starched nightcap from the evening before, eating a danish and reading

People like to pretend that Tressel transformed OSU into the national power that it is, when in reality, he's leaving the football program in worse shape than it was in before he got here, and that's a clear sign of having done more harm than good.

How is that even a thing that exists in this universe? How do you even move on from something like that, where some people in the world actually believe something this dumb? Me? I'd curl up in the fetal position and hope that eventually the world would ignore me at some point, long enough for me to evolve into some kind of Gollum-esque creature (not that much of a stretch) that spends the rest of its' days scouring the globe for the NCAA Confirmation of Compliance sheet that I've convinced myself I mistakenly signed.

But Jim Tressel isn't me. And he didn't do that.

See, I'm interested in the process of transition, and what Jim Tressel has been up to in the interim. During his time as head coach, there was always speculation about him  potentially taking a head coaching job in the NFL, usually to the Browns. But that kind of talk never worried me, because like so many plastic dog noses on mostly naked fat men in December, it just didn't seem to fit.

I also can't imagine him ever being any sort of analyst or tv commentator, unless it was just an extended plot to get him within punching distance of Craig James. Stoic, taciturn guys rarely pan out on television, especially when they've spent the majority of their adult lives trying to be as completely uninteresting to the media as possible. Maybe the Cooking Network or something. "The Joys of Toast, with Jimmy T."

Ultimately, of course, Tressel did land a job, as a "replay consultant" with the Colts, and will start his new life this Sunday against New Orleans. I honestly don't know what the hell replay consulltant is even supposed to mean; hiring Tressel as a replay consultant is like hiring Warren Buffett to help you find a cheap couch (although seriously Mr. Buffett, if you're interested, I do need a couch). The title is of course BS, but maybe that's a good thing. For the past decade this guy has been defined by a title. Let Jim Tressel just be who he is, without blowhard writers define who he is or what he's done based on a few decisions in a nearly six decade long life.

Doing pretty good for himself.

Selfishly, I really hope he bucks the trend of former OSU coaches treating the program like an ex-US president does for his incumbent. If there's ever a time in a game where internally Tressel thinks "Man, I really wish they would've run some kind of inside rushing play named after the founder of Wendy's there," or "Wow that is a lot of Nickelback in the pregame music" I would encourage him to say it. Out loud. In public.

Thing is though, we all know that's not going to happen. Jim Tressel is who he is, and losing one little job won't change that. He'll take the criticism and the barbs and the jokes and still go on doing his sweet new job, hanging out at practice with his buds, helping East High School in Youngstown get a new football stadium, and doing pretty cool things like this:

Jim Tressel the Undefeated, inscrutable to the last.

85 Comments

Comments

joel121270's picture

In the words of the late Al Davis..."Just win baby" and the more he wins like this the more I think people that called for his head will see "WE ARE ALL HUMAN AND MAKE MISTAKES". What a travisty I say....Anyway, great read and BRILLIANT ending!

BucksfanXC's picture

I like Tressel as a person. I have met him and I know he's a nice guy. I will always appreciate the things he did for OSU and OSU football. I just wish for once, we could get a football coach that leaves a legacy that is not tainted by how they exit around scandal.

 "The Joys of Toast, with Jimmy T." would be something I would watch and get angry at Jim for not using flashy new fangled bread. "Urban Meyer would use brioche! At least give me multi-grain, sourdough, something!"

“Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect.”  - Woody

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

I just wish for once, we could get a football coach that leaves a legacy that is not tainted by how they exit around scandal.
 

"You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the enemy."

Is it Saturday Yet's picture

How is that even a thing that exists in this universe?

 

People want someone to blame/hate and can't stand not being as good as the SEC without being able to oversign.  So blame Tress because you know, he's the same thing as the devil. My gosh, he did an interview in a gay magazine, so that must mean he must be evil, right?  Logical and reasonable conclusion.  Thanks.  end srcsm

I'll admit I have a hard time watching people openly bash Tress.  If I told you how I really feel about those who bash Tress I'd get the banhammer.  I'm not forgiving him for making this BS (itty bitty) mistake, but personally look at this entire facade as him falling on the sword for so many, including those fans who openly bash him.  I'd make a military comparison about how those who serve allow those who bash the military the freedom to do so, but for some reason some on here dislike that.  

The media jumped on this like it was a Lindsy Lohan dating Casey Anthony rumor and completely blew it out of porportions and the school just put it all on Tress.  The only news outlet that even tried to peek into the truth was 11W.  The Dispatch, the Lantern, ESPN, Yahoo, all of them, only exploited the bad and made it seem worse to sell papers/get website hits.  And it worked like a charm.  Congrats media you still suck.

And no, I'm not over Tress being gone.  

Semper Fidelis 

 

Kalamazoo Steve's picture

+1.  I will never be over him leaving like he did.  He will always be someone that I respect and admire.  I cursed Dave and punts like the rest of us, but I never thought I could miss a man that I have never met like I miss JT.  I hope the Colts win out (since they already lost to the Bengals).

WMBuckeye's picture

The media jumped on this like it was a Lindsy Lohan dating Casey Anthony rumor and completely blew it out of porportions and the school just put it all on Tress. The only news outlet that even tried to peek into the truth was 11W. The Dispatch, the Lantern, ESPN, Yahoo, all of them, only exploited the bad and made it seem worse to sell papers/get website hits. And it worked like a charm. Congrats media you still suck.

And no, I'm not over Tress being gone.

Semper Fidelis

+1000..Hear, hear!!

Proud to be a Buckeye in SEC territory...Long Live the Vest!!
Class of 2003 OSU/ATI "Where the men are men, women are few and the sheep are scared.."

JLP36's picture

Amen

At least Gene Smith has his back. 

Reminder to all:  Don't get in front of Gene Smith when Gene Smith is looking to protect Gene Smith.

JLP36

Northbrook's picture

I'll always be a Tress fan.

Semper Fi

 

Joe Beale's picture

I'll admit I have a hard time watching people openly bash Tress.

In the overall scheme of things, I've not noticed a ton of 11W commenters bashing Tress, and I'm happy about that. Everyone has been frustrated at some point during this season, but on this forum fans have mostly kept it sane. But I'm with you when it comes to this article in "The Latrine" (as we used to call it when I was a student). The guy is trolling for cheap pub, and I have no respect.

I can't say "semper fi" because I served in the Army and not the Marines, but let me just say that I'm glad you're on our side.

WMBuckeye's picture

Leaving out the "fair weather fans" WE, yes I used we, as the Buckeye Nation need to stand together. Only we know how frustrating all of the hype against tOSU has been.

The military teaches us that through adversity we learn strength. All of the "whipping boy" action from the uneducated will feel our strength. It's just like the armed forces, we may not always see eye to eye but in the bar fight you know who's got your back! LoL

Proud to be a Buckeye in SEC territory...Long Live the Vest!!
Class of 2003 OSU/ATI "Where the men are men, women are few and the sheep are scared.."

theDuke's picture

i said the day he stepped down it was on gene smith. the day we forfeited 2010 season was on gene smith, the bowl game- well that's a funny one, that was on gene smith, the sugar bowl committee and the NCAA.  i personally think we have sacrificed entirely too much for this incident b/c of gene smith and his lack of knowledge when it comes to damage control. 

Tressel, to me, will always be the victim in this case. Not of his actions, but of the support (lack thereof) he received. 

theDuke

JLP36's picture

Gene Smith, in addition to forgetting about the 105 or so completely innocent parties that had their championship trophy taken from them by his fiat, forgot to leave anything for the NCAA to whip us with.  The NCAA is going to have to bring something, but good old Gene brought more down on us than they ever would have.  Anyone think that is what the NCAA will announce come punishment time?

JLP36

theDuke's picture

i think you are spot on JLP. NCAA is looking at us with one eyebrow up saying, "you really shouldn't have."

theDuke

Bucksfan's picture

Didn't receive any support?!  They first were just going to fine him.  The university never suspended him for those first five games - that was all on Tressel.  They technically didn't fire him, either, he stepped down.

The University stuck by him (or rather, inactively enforced the situation) more than any other university in the country would have done for a football coach in the same situation.  In retrospect, the day they found out he lied to the NCAA is the day he should have been fired.

Tressel is no victim.  Whether or not the rules that he broke or the rules the players broke are stupid and archaic is a debate for another day.  But Tressel has no one to blame but himself for everything that has happened.  The real victim is Ohio State, who throughout this mess looks like an institution that values football more than it values integrity...for that, Smith, Gee AND Tressel are all to blame.

I could easily argue that the kind of kids he recruited were of suspect character, and that he gave them the benefit of the doubt as adults far too much.  That may work with 90% of his players, but it failed with at least 3 high profile athletes across the last 10 years...and it finally cost him more than just shots at national championships.

NYC Buckeye's picture

My sophmore year was Tressel's first as Ohio State coach, I came from New York not growing up with Ohio State Football history, so Jim Tressel is my Woody Hayes...  As you mention, I  find it rather ignorant to define a man, who has done so much good in his life and others, by one signed form regarding knowledge about a free tattoo...  This is why George Dohrmann's article frustrated me so much... 

Jim Tressel is and always will be Ohio State Football to me... 

DamienJax's picture

You have to take anything the Lantern writes about Jim Tressel with a grain of salt. 

Why? Well, The Lantern is written by a bunch of 18-22 year olds believing they're actual journalists. These 18-22 year olds were not old enough to remember the John Cooper era and how much of a change occured when Jim Tressel took over.

They probably don't remember the 7-4 season, the loss to Michigan or any other hiccups along the way. Did we blame the poor performance on John Cooper leaving the program worse off? No, we blaimed the fact it was a rebuilding year. These children got spoiled with winning. They somehow expect that college dynasties continue forever without end. It's a fact, programs go through ups and downs, and right now we're going through our downs.

They need to quit bashing the man who did raise Ohio State's national profile. Yes, he tarnished the reputation with all the violations, but really? worse off than before? I doubt that. Before Tressel, we were the flashy team who always choked during the Michigan game. After him, we turned Michigan into the whipping boy.

We're a young team. We're not going to be in the duldrums forever. Ohio State has such a large national reputation because of Jim Tressel that our recruiting will still be strong for years to come. I hardly doubt we'll turn into the Notre Dame of football where people think we're such a great program yet recruit untalented players and pretend we're good.

The Lantern's "journalists" need to read history before writing sensationalist bull shit just to give away more free copies. This is why adults never listen to the youth when they make stupid claims without presenting good evidence. 

Whether you think Jim Tressel is a good man or not is irrelevant to how Ohio State's national pressence was defenitily improved after he arrived on campus.

Johnny Ginter's picture

ben axelrod wrote that particular article, and i promise you that he of all people should know better

Baroclinicity's picture

I don't know much about the field of journalism, but part of me wonders if journalists in general write articles they don't necessarily believe, but that will get them noticed - the shock value.  Writers at The Lantern  are on display for future jobs, and I would guess that articles that get them noticed are a positive in that sense, regardless of the subject.

Again, I don't know; it's just a rough theory that I can't back up or refute one way or another.

When you're holding a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

Menexenus's picture

I think you're right about this.  It's summed up in the saying, "There's no such thing as bad publicty."  Even if a so-called 'journalist' becomes well-known for being a d-bag, he/she has still become well-known.  For some 'journalists', becoming well-known/talked-about is better than languishing in obscurity, no matter what kinds of foul, obviously-wrong things you have to say to get there.

In my opinion, it goes hand-in-hand with our reality-TV culture, in which it is easier to become famous for doing something outrageous in front of a camera than it is to become famous by working hard and accomplishing something of real substance.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

The_Lurker's picture

I can tell you that as a former Lantern sports writer and sports editor, that kind of thing never once entered my head. But times (and journalism especially) have changed quite a bit since I graduated in 1996, so I can't speak to what a student journalist can and will do to be noticed in a shrinking print world. All I know is that no one with a decent memory of the post-Woody era (Earle, Cooper, Tress) can honestly say that Tressel did more harm than good. My God, I had to write about a quarterback controversy involving Kirk Herbstreit and Kent Graham. I know where this program has been and how many B1G titles it has blown. This writer shall henceforth be known to me as Axelwrong. 

3 Yards And A Cloud of Dust's picture

Mr. Alexrod's piece was a commentary, not a news story.

As a journalist and American - I respect Mr. Axelrod's right to express his views -- although I completely disagree with them.

Because it's a commentary and not a news piece, he chose to use a myopic view on the issue and disregard all the other facts to try and make his point.

As with most commentaries like this, I chose to hit the "ignore" button.

People who know Coach Tressell, or are aware of the entire scope of his work and activity while associated with The Ohio State University - know better.

Coach Tressell made a bad mistake and paid the price.

Time to move on down the field.  O-H!

 

joel121270's picture

Just curious as to what is commentary and what is a news story these days? To me, they are mostly one in the same anymore.

I have found with this site (albeit OSU biased) that they come out with the facts that are known to them. I stumble upon this site cuz Bucknuts did what they usually do. I was simply looking for Ramzy's writings and wow I can say that this site is awesome.

If I could afford, and some day I will, I will definitely donate to this site's cause.

krenzelmoni's picture

To quote Oscar Wilde, "the truth is rarely pure and never simple."

JT seems like a good man from a moralistic standpoint, but the plain fact is that he covered up information which would have kept his best players off the field for a number of games, knowingly fielded players who - under the rules - should have beeen ineligible for accepting impermissible benefits, lied about it, and left the program subject to forthcoming NCAA penalties that may or may not affect bowl appearances and recruiting (we'll see what happens).

It's too bad that this will be a major factor in his legacy - at least nationally - but it is what it is.

The portion of the Lantern's story quoted is subject to debate. Is OSU football in a better spot now than it was in 2001? Perhaps. Perhaps not. Is ten years of dominance worth the program being shamed nationally, a year's worth of torture, and forthcoming penalties? I don't know, but I'm not sure I'd be so quick to dismiss the comments as "something this dumb." At the very least, it's subject to debate.

Bucks43201's picture

I wouldn't even use that rag The Lantern as toilet paper, it's so low-quality. 

"You win with people." - Woody Hayes

BED's picture

It has never been worth even the cheap paper it's printed on.

The Ohio State University, College of Arts & Sciences, Class of 2006
The Ohio State University Moritz College of Law, Class of 2009

Buckeye in Illini country's picture

The Joys of Toast with Jim T.  That made me crack up.

Columbus to Pasadena: 35 hours.  We're on a road trip through the desert looking for strippers and cocaine... and Rose Bowl wins!

JLP36's picture

The most amazing thing about this whole Tressel story is that the media has completely missed the point. 

Tressel found out about Tat Gate from an attorney.  That attorney can (and should) be disbarred for disclosing information that he obtained from a criminal defendent client.  That attorney was a former player trying to help him get his guys away from a dangerous situation.  I am sure that he mentioned to Tressel that he preferred that he not get disbarred.

As soon as Tressel got the news he was screwed.  He could: 

1. protect his own self by having his group of star players suspended for selling their own stuff AND GET A FORMER PLAYER DISBARRED or

2.  Shut up, protect his former player and protect his guys while trying to solve the problems in house.

Obviously, he should have thrown his players on the NCAA because that is a very fair and reasonable body.  Maybe it would not have come out how he knew that there was a stash of autographs in a Tat parlor closet and his former player trying to do a good deed would not have been disbarred.  Never mind that the original message was that he had to get those guys away from the very dangerous criminal.

Of course, we have not heard this side of the story from CRISIS INTENSIFICATION EXPERT Gene Smith, the man whose job it is to protect the Ohio State Athletics brand that is worth hundreds of millions.  No, instead he dumped Tressel with timing that looked to be calculated for maximum negative effect.

Is Tressel a saint?  Probably not.

Is Ohio State football worse off for having him?  NO WAY

Is the University better off for having had him?  Take a tour of the main library sometime.

GENE SMITH MUST BE FIRED AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

 

JLP36

Maestro's picture

Excellent post.

Call me naive, but I think Tress truly was looking out for the best interest of his players, NCAA violations be damned. He knew he was screwed when he signed that piece of paper.

vacuuming sucks

JLP36's picture

You don't think the NCAA would have looked out for the best interests of the student athletes?  That is what they are there for (and to collect billions in tv contracts and licensing deals on the side).

JLP36

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

Like I've said before, there's also the issue of obstructing an on-going federal investigation. If he had outed Posey and Pryor, and the media found out why and the Federal Investigation was compromised, then make no mistake, the Feds would have had his ass. Those guys could give two shits less about your little NCAA rules. If that hypothetical situation had occured, I guarantee you we'd be reading columns on ESPiN with the headlines "Selfish: Tressel cares more about his job and himself than the rule of law".

This really was a no-win situation for Tressel.

JLP36's picture

And that we don't hear about.  I understand it from some of these morons in the media.  Most of them are out to dazzle the public with villians and victims.  Who wants to read about rising GPAs and graduation rates and visits to hospitals and donations by the million to build libraries.  That simply is not good press.

The athletic department, namely the Chief Crisis Intensifier / AD, has a job to protect the brand.  His route to do that was point out what we have here.  It is TRUE.  Instead, he threw Tressel to the wolves in a way that confirmed to the world every allegation and rumor AS ABSOLUTE FACT and completely destroyed Tressel's name AND DAMAGED THE UNIVERSITY.  That is inexcusable incompetence.

His taking the trophies away from the team (the vast majority of players are alleged to have done absolutely nothing wrong) illustrates a despicable lack of character.  If the NCAA is going to do it, make them do it.  The AD had no right to give those away given that he did nothing to earn them. 

JLP36

JozyMozy's picture

good work, Johnny. 

Menexenus's picture

Read the sig.  Respect the sig.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

spqr2008's picture

JLP36, don't forget that if Tressel sought out any information regarding the disclosure he received, he would have quickly found (as no on in the press apparently has) that it is a federal crime to obstruct a criminal investigation (I'm no lawyer, and I found the relevant statute, it's Title 18, Part One, Chapter 73, probably section 1512).  The minimum punishment in this chapter, is one year in prison.  So the question for me (Not a question Tressel ever asked himself, from all appearances) would be, "Does the Fifth Amendment allow me to void a contract?"  Because you would be incriminating yourself under one of several obstruction clauses by letting the whole world know about the investigation before it had concluded.  Now, you would probably lose your job as the head coach if the Feds decided to bring you up on felony charges, and by not interferring and getting the kids out of there right away, you risk them being involved in a drug trafficking case.  Frankly, I'm dissapointed Tressel has not sued the NCAA for unjust practices and lack of due process.  While they aren't a government organization, they would look really bad if you pointed out to them that the Fifth Amendment protects you from Self-Incrimination regardless of any contracts you may have signed.

Bucksfan's picture

Sorry, but that is a load of horseshit.  If there was a legal question as to infringing on a federal investigation, Tressel had an army of lawyers at his disposal, both personally and with the university who are employed for just these very reasons, to whom he could have sought counsel.  He was not sworn to secrecy under federal law.  In fact, by contacting Tressel the lawyer was disclosing information into the public domain!  Plus, it was not his lawyer nor a law enforcement officer, and he has no legal authority to inform Tressel that disclosing any information to a 3rd party would be obstruction of justice.

Tressel should have told a university lawyer with Gene Smith present at the very least.

spqr2008's picture

THEHUMBLE BUCKEYE

Exactly right.  This was a no-win scenario, especially because ESECPN needed someone to distract from the Cam Newton Case, and convenienetly, that someone also happened to be from a conference which had basically slapped them down a few years before by creating its own network.  The reason I would have liked to see Tressel sue the NCAA is simple.  I don't think its right that a contractual obligation not from the government should force you to either violate it or the law.  The NCAA is a "Non-Profit" that must follow the laws of the United States or risk losing its preferred tax exempt status.  Honestly, if Tressel weren't such a great guy, the NCAA would have had to run along home, rather than risk prolonged exposure to a civil rights trial.

Backup Placekick holder's picture

I have it from a good source he has a couple options for next year ...

One - being QB coach at the Colts

Two - some coaching capacity with Tampa Bay especially if the Debartlo family buys a controlling share.

 

 

Maestro's picture

Three - Return to OSU as head coach..........Menexenus and many others are holding out hope. I think it would be hilariously fantastic, but a show-cause is headed his way.

vacuuming sucks

Menexenus's picture

Yes.  Yes, I am.  Not only would it be best for OSU football, it would be justice (on many levels).

Real fans stay for Carmen.

JakeBuckeye's picture

Justice blah blah blah. Look, I loved and still love Tressel as much as the next day, but its time to move on. Tressel didn't get such a raw deal in life. He doesn't need "justice." We need to move on from Tressel as a fan base. When I say move on I do not mean forget Tressel, though. Tressel should still be held dearly to all of us, but he had to go. With that being said, Gene Smith needs to go as well.

Menexenus's picture

Once again, I am overcome by the power of my opponents' persuasive arguments.  Bravo!  You had me at "blah, blah, blah."

Real fans stay for Carmen.

JakeBuckeye's picture

Its more like when a person argues for racism. Racism is hardly ever argued against because what's the point? There is no point in arguing because there is so many obvious points against racism. Its a waste of time. Why would I want to argue with you on why we can't hire Tressel back? I don't, but let's start basic. This move would be 110% defiance against the NCAA. So far, Ohio State has played their cards right with the NCAA (or at least better than USC did.) USC didn't self report and a lot of dirt was uncovered by Yahoo! and the NCAA. Everything the NCAA knows about us is all stuff we've self reported. This is the complete opposite of defiance, and I truly believe we will be "rewarded", if you will, for this by the time the final decision comes from the NCAA. Hiring Tressel back would be the stupidest decision Gene Smith has made in his tenure at Ohio State (and hell, he's done/said some stupid stuff.) It would put our program back 100 more steps than it already is. Ohio State needs 100 steps forward right now, which starts with Gene Smith being relieved of his duties and the Tressel era (including Luke Fickell and most of the current staff) being put behind us after this year. Look guy, we had one of the best decades in Ohio State football history. It was a great time and it delivered memories that we will never forget. But everything good comes to end, and this era of excellence with Tressel has ended as well. Its time to move on, and I believe you're only making it harder on yourself by seeing these pipe dreams as a possible reality. Go Bucks, man.

Denny's picture

No, it really wouldn't be justice. It'd just be a great way to get severe NCAA sanctions.

Taquitos.

Menexenus's picture

If there's one thing I've learned about the NCAA, it is that they are willing to give just about anyone a second chance.  Tressel has provided a plausible explanation for why he was less than forth-coming in this instance.  His motivations were not nefarious.  If anyone is deserving of the kind of second chances that seem to be the NCAA's stock in trade, it is Jim Tressel.

Are you claiming that the NCAA will not permit Jim Tressel to coach college football ever again?  I think that would be unreasonably severe and certainly unwarranted by the circumstances.  If you agree that the NCAA will permit him to coach again, how can they reasonably dictate what teams he can and can't coach for?  It doesn't seem reasonable for the NCAA to say that Jim Tressel can coach again as long as it is not for the Ohio State University.  What would be the justification for such a specific ban?  Is the argument that Tressel wouild be more likely to commit future violations here than elsewhere?  That strains credibility.

In conclusion, if the NCAA isn't planning to ban Tressel for life, they also can't ban him from OSU.  If they can't ban him from OSU, why not re-hire him?  QED.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

Brutus's picture

I'm firmly in the re-hire Tressel if/when we ever can camp. I don't think it's a reality, but if it were possible, i'd welcome the opportunity. However, from what I heard, things did not go very well for him during the Committee on Infractions hearing on 8/12. The NCAA was complimentary of OSU's handling of this mess, but very harsh on JT. I think this is in keeping with OSU's strategy of painting this as actions of a few rather than an institutional problem. If we avoid additional major sactions, the NCAA will say that those most reponsible have already been punished. I happen to think this is the deal with Posey as well. Posey is getting hosed so that the NCAA can say that it dealt severely with the worst culprit. Meanwhile, OSU can maintain that Posey made his own mistakes and the program gets spared major sanctions. This is just a theory and if we end up with FTM or LOIC or a bowl ban, then I'm clearly wrong. Anyway, my point is that I think the NCAA will do as much as it can to make sure JT doesn't get to coach again for a while. I doubt that they have the balls for a lifetime ban or anything like that, but they are definitely going to try to puff out their chests and look like they are in control of the situation.

And speaking of Posey, the NCAA's treatment of him has me now thinking that not only did JT know exactly what he was doing when he didn't report the violations in the first place, but he was right to do so. The inequity that we've witnessed from the NCAA this season regarding punishments is absurd. Posey gets 10 games, while many many others get far less for much worse. I'll never know what went through JT's mind while all this happened, so I'll fill in the blanks myself. I think he didn't trust the NCAA to do the right thing if he reported the violations so he took matters in his own hands. He pulled them aside, told them to stop, and by all accounts, they did. I think he's done similar things many many times before as has every coach in every sport that understands the absurdity of the NCAA's archaic rules. How many times a year do we see players get suspended for a violation of team rules, but the coaches don't elaborate what rules were violated? And how likely is it that those violations wouldn't constitute some violation of NCAA rules as well, but it never gets that far because the NCAA doesn't find out about
it? I think this is part of the game that is played with the NCAA: make an effort to look like you're policing yourselves so we don't have to and we can quietly maintain the facade of enforcers while collecting our checks.

I think JT deserved to get fired for what he did. He lied to his employer, the lie had major consequences, so he deserved to get fired on basic principle. However, I think JT was also acting on basic principle trying to protect his players from the NCAA and I no longer fault him for that.

Menexenus's picture

I agree with pretty much everything you wrote.  So let's find out from the NCAA what the official length of Tressel's coaching ban is and rehire him at the end of its duration.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

Denny's picture

'If they can't ban him from OSU, why not re-hire him?'

Because in my opinion re-hiring Tressel a horrible idea. There are things in life that it's just best to be appreciative of, happy about, and moved on from.

If there's one thing I've learned about the NCAA, it is that the people who work cases w/r/t violations are likely bipolar, and have never learned a thing about the concept of consistency.

I said nothing about the NCAA banning Tressel from coaching at OSU after any sort of NCAA-wide suspension is up - you're putting a whole lot of words and making a whole lot of unnecessary arguments there.

In conclusion, that which was to be demonstrated shall be concluded.

Taquitos.

Menexenus's picture

Ok, but that's different from your previous argument.  Your previous argument was that rehiring Tressel would cause increased sanctions.  So I tried to show you that there's no reason to believe that.  Since your post was one sentence long, I had to try to fill in the details of how an argument like that might go.  If I did a poor job on your behalf, feel free to do a better job.

Now you are claiming that hiring Tressl is a "horrible idea" and that we need to "move on."  But this time you are providing no reasons.  So discussion over, I guess.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

Bucks's picture

While I can understand your desire to have Tressel still here or back, I'm unclear of where in the world you would believe the NCAA will be kind to him & not hit him with a severe show-cause. Their own summary letter on the hearing showed they pretty much accept sole blame on Tressel. He is absolutely going to receive it & there is a reason no schools retain a coach who has been hit with one, the penalties/restrictions they will have to abide by with that person on the staff. I think Denny was clear on that even if it was short.

Certainly you are correct that we won't know anything until the punishment(s) are handed out but along that logic, the NCAA could come back and say "We were wrong & withdraw any/all penalites." Not going to happen.

Yes, after JT's 4-6 year order, he could come back. He has made it clear he has no intention of being a JoePa & I sure as shitaki don't want one.

---

I miss JT absolutely & will continue to miss him, but he is gone. The only time he will be around in the future is matching the capacity that Bruce is.

Menexenus's picture

So it all comes down to what the NCAA penalty will be for Tressel.  Obviously, if it is 4-6 years as you predict, then I agree that it is time to move on.  But I honestly don't think it will be.  When you look at the sorts of violations that got coaches multiple year penalties, they don't look anything like what Tressel did or why he did it.  I refer you to TheHumbleBuckeye's post in this thread where he demonstrates that Tressel's actions are explained by a legitimate concern for the safety of his players and for the integrity of an ongoing FBI investigation.  Because of these things, I suspect that the penalty will be no more than one year.

But that's exactly what I have been saying:  let's see what the penalty is.  Why pre-judge the issue and just assume that Tressel can't come back?  If he can come back, then we owe it to him and to our team to at least consider him as a candidate if he wants the job back.  Of course, I have no information that he does.  But I do know that he still has a house in Upper Arlington...  And I know that he took what is essentially a part-time job in Indianapolis...

Real fans stay for Carmen.

William's picture

Why do we owe it to him? His actions are simple, he brushed aside information and kept it from the NCAA. Everyone needs to cut the crap on the Fed. Investigation, he was later emailed by Cicero that his players were not involved in drugs, at that point he should have told Gene Smith and the NCAA, but guess what, he didn't. He was a great coach for us, he is an extremely charitable person, but its time to move on. You're all acting like abused wives, your husband says he won't beat you again, so you take him back. I wonder what usually happens next....

Menexenus's picture

You're acting like someone who confuses bad analogies for good arguments.

We owe it to him because of how he fell on his sword for the good of the program.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

NC_Buckeye's picture

William sounds like one of the Tresselball haters who were calling for the coach's head after the Florida, LSU, USC, and Texas games. For these guys, I imagine Tress's screw-up was a godsend... they could finally get rid of the conservative playcalling. Nevermind the 5-3 BCS bowl record and seven Big Ten Conference championships.

William's picture

No, I wasn't tired of a ball control offense, that won us games. What I am tired of is the delusional people on here who think we should hire Tressel. Fell on the sword how? There are no emails linking Tressel and Smith folks. Tressel committed a major NCAA violation, no one else did. He's done, he's gone. Move on, he's not coming back, ever.

Denny's picture

I answered a question that you asked - didn't know I could only make one argument all of the time, or five-paragraph essays about 'reasons' behind arguments. In my mind this topic is pretty straightforward and all that's needed are concise statements.

You've clearly thought about this far more than I have. I think you're reading into my terse responses and conflating my words with things that others have said.

Taquitos.

theDuke's picture

yes, the rules are the rules.  but the SMEAR campaign by the media, i'm looking at you Herbstreit and bros, was purely about the BIG network. its called competition. if it weren't OSU, it would have been Wisky or MSU, whoever was the next best team in the BIG.

theDuke

JLP36's picture

Don't act like Cam Newton got off scot free.  Auburn suspended him the Tuesday of the SEC championship game and it took the NCAA damn near 20 minutes to reinstate him.  That 20 minutes must have been an absolute hell - nothing like the slap on the wrist that Tressel and the Buckeyes got.

Gene Smith should become head of the NCAA.  He is already great at handing out punishments!

JLP36

Hoody Wayes's picture

How about Lady Buckeyes...football?

Here's a template:

http://www.lflus.com/

BoFuquel's picture

Tress just looks awful in that blue shirt on Bleacher Report.Who'da thunk it.The 1% wins again.

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

awwwwwwop's picture

There seemingly is no obstruction of justice concern: "Therefore, the statute applies only to obstructive behavior that the defendant knows could impede an investigation into conduct that could constitute a federal crime at the time of its commission."  From some very brief research into the obstruction statute, it seems that you have to act with the intent to obstruct justice.  And Tress still could have told Archie that something was screwed up with the tattoos and they could have done their own investigation.  There was no need to expose the source of Tress' information.

"Who cares? Go Bucks." - Aaron Untch

Buckeye_Mafia's picture

Anyone who thinks, writes, or states Tressel did more damage than good to this program is not only severely retarded, but is also most likely a nazi...I would love to run into that douche-knob on the streets after reading that article. He's right behind Bollman in my "People I'd Forcefully Stuff a Nike in their Corn-hole" list.

Adolphus Washington is half grizzly bear and half dragon | Noah Spence kills quarterbacks, just to watch them die.

Denny's picture

Aw, we really should have started a 'who will use 'retarded, nazi, douche-knob, and cornhole in one post' contest.

Taquitos.

Hoody Wayes's picture

We must always make room for dissent. In a nation where "free speech" is taken for granted - and Constitutional - responding to an opinion with violent rhetoric is..."un-American."

 

William's picture

I don't think anyone has said that here. Many on this site need to realize that it is not the players actions that will lead to the harshest penalties, it will be Tressel's. He was the one when presented with the information brushed it aside. No one here has attacked Tressel as a person. Its well documented what he has done for the community, but that has nothing to do with his dismissing of information. Its ridiculous that people on this site give Pryor and co. more crap than Tressel. Their acts were minute and minor according to the NCAA, it was Tressel's that were major violations. He led OSU to success only rivaled by Woody Hayes. His time as a football coach at this university has passed, FOREVER folks. Its time to move on. 

OSUNeedles's picture

I used to be a nurse on the Heme/Onc floor at Children's Hospital. This was my only face to face experiences that I ever had with The Vest and about the only face to face time that I have ever had with any of the OSU football players. While some of the time that the team spent there was probably required, it doesn't change the fact that some of the players grew close with the patients on that floor. Relationships were built between college students who are remarkably selfish and self-centered (I know, I used to be a college student) and 8 year old children who were dying from cancer, and the players sacrificed time to be there (including the dreaded Terelle Pryor - he spent A LOT of time with a couple patients on weekends). 

While I recognize that all of us here are devout OSU football fans and I hate watching the program experience a down time, I can never forget the profound effect that visits from Tressel and the players had on some unbelievably special young people. I will always respect Tressel, and I will always respect OSU. I have a hunch that he has always respected OSU as well and has tremendous guilt for the way in which he left the program.

WMBuckeye's picture

Exactly why Tressel will be a legend at OSU and will always have respect from me. Thank you for sharing that story OSUNeedles. Oncology units are very stressful units and I am glad the players took the time to make the kids smile, even for a minute.

Proud to be a Buckeye in SEC territory...Long Live the Vest!!
Class of 2003 OSU/ATI "Where the men are men, women are few and the sheep are scared.."

bucknut3011's picture

Cool. Thanks for sharing. This is what the media overlooks.  These are still real people -- not villainous monsters.

BoFuquel's picture

Thanks Tress.

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

I encourage everyone to read the February 8th meeting with the NCAA. If you blame Tressel for this, you have not read it. It took me 4 1/2 hours to read the whole thing, but it is worth the read. Seriously, how many people actually read the whole thing? He made it quite obvious that he was afraid for the players safety. He did not even care about the NCAA rules. He was looking out for his players.

http://www.10tv.com/content/downloads/2011/07/22/Tresell_transcript_x001...

 

"But I’ve also had a player murdered. I have a player incarcerated. I have had a couple guys get sucked into the drug culture. I’ve had a player who served a ten-year suspension for obstruction of justice, you know? And those things, just like games, you remember the bad play in the game that cost you the game. You don’t remember the 77 good plays. And so,  I mean, I – you know, I was frightened."

And he stood by his actions... Check out this quote:

"If I fastforwarded to today, I think I have the answer to what I would do. I would go to the university legal counsel because it’s a federal issue. I wouldn’t go to the athletic department legal counsel. I wouldn’t go to the compliance office."

 

Those who are still criticizing Tressel need to read the whole damn thing. The issue Tressel faced was arguably unprecedented. I will not be surprised if the NCAA shows mercy on him.

Menexenus's picture

Thanks for this, HumbleBuckeye.

Real fans stay for Carmen.

Silver Shotgun's picture

I don't think Tress did more harm than good to this program (and even if he did, it won't be possible to reach that conclusion until more time passes).  However, I am surprised by the unwavering support he receives on these boards.  I'm not going to go on a rant, but he DID harm the program (even if that harm is outweighed by his positive contributions), and many of the people on here act like that isn't the case.  He gets far less blowback for the major issues that led to his firing than he got for Purdue Harbor.  It's ridiculous.

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

Once again, read his testimony to the NCAA and you'll understand. See my post just above this.

It's a solid 4 1/2 hour read if you ready it thoroughly. But it is very telling. After reading it, I completely understand where he was coming from.

You wanna know why the contents of this were never reported on by ESPiN and others after that transcript was released? It's because even they knew what he did was justified to some extent. Going forward, everyone in the NCAA now knows there is a precedent with how to deal with such matters. But Tressel's situation was something most coaches aren't trained for.

I will not be surprised in the least of OSU gets no further penalties and Tressel receives no show cause penalty.

- Read the testimony.

- Realize that Cicero probably corroborated everything Tressel said and probably threw in some criminal attorney legalese to turn the tables on the NCAA (that's what a good lawyer would do).

- Realize Sarniak is not some sort of shady figure and is - in the most real sense of the term - Terrelle Pryor's father.

- Realize that Dorkmann's "unnamed source" never went in front of the NCAA.

- Realize that there is a snippet in the testimony about the US Attorney being in contact with Tressel. It's only mentioned once (probably by accident). I will not be surprised if this means the Feds went to bat for Tress.

Unless the NCAA can prove Tressel's testimony is bogus somehow by poking a hole in the timeline of events or uncovering extra emails, they have absolutely nothing, and I firmly believe Tressel would have cause to sue the NCAA should they present him with a show-cause and/or present the University with additional penalties.

Denny's picture

- Realize that your calling somebody 'Dorkmann' renders moot any possibility of my taking your points seriously.

Taquitos.

TheHumbleBuckeye's picture

Geez... did someone pee in your Yuengling?

Denny's picture

Nope. And it was Sam Oktoberfest that I had last night, not D.G. Yuengling and Sons' product.

Just pointing out that namecalling very quickly undermines any and all valid points.

Taquitos.

joel121270's picture

I still believe to this day that there is more to this whole thing and Tressell is being made the sacrifiicail lamb on this. Someone (Smith) has no balls IMHO (Oh wait, he let Posey take the fall too..point made).

Brutus's picture

I'm not a supporter of Gene Smith in the least. I've been saying he should have been fired before Tressel for many months now. However, in his defense, his primary job is to protect the university first, and the entire football program second, not individual players/coaches. If we get out of this without any major sanctions, Gene Smith would have done his job and done it well. The price for no FTM or LOIC or a bowl ban may have been to throw JT and Posey under the bus. It sucks, but that's the game. If we still get hit with any of those things in addition to firing a coach, suspending several players for dozens of games, vacating an entire season, and enduring the humiliation and relentless scrutiny, then Gene Smith will go down as the worst AD in the history of ADs.

bucknut3011's picture

I keep thinking I'll wake up soon, and JT will be back...  Too bad, just, too bad.  He will be an icon of Ohio State football, and I will continue to use him as a role model for my son.  A great Buckeye, one who made a mistake and paid the consequences, but  a great Buckeye nonetheless.

RBuck's picture

You took my avatar!

"It's just another case of there you are". ~ Doc (1918-2012)

ysuosu1's picture

I went to ysu for 2 degrees and know many personally affiliated with Tressel from players to campus workers to alumni. I am just an acquaintance of his but I can truly say not one of those people that I have spoken to, believe he is without integrity.
Unless Coach himself tells me otherwise I will go to the grave believing that there is much more to this than we will ever know.
I can only go with my gut here which has been pretty accurate and that's how I feel. I hope tressel tells us in his next book in 10 or 15 years. I will try and read the ncaa hearing. I'm still not convinced that Tress didn't tell anyone.

I've been watching him for 25 seasons and I'm still devastated. I hope I move on but honestly, having trouble with that.

LP

BoFuquel's picture

YSUOSU1 + 1,000,000, Just following orders, and fell on his sword for the 1% crowd.

I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

btalbert25's picture

Tressel wouldn't take the job again anyway and the University certainly wouldn't offer it to him again.  This fiasco has cost the university a ton of money and their defense was that everything was Tressel's fault.  I'm not even sure he fell on the sword so much as the university knew it was the only way they could move on from this with as little damage as possible.